Fair pay to play act just signed in to law in CA.

[Guapo]

Two things will shake out:

1) P5/G5 bubble kids now tilt further to P5. Many bubble kids that choose a G5 program for playing time over competing offers from the P5 will now go with that P5 offer. Before the difference was playing time, now its playing time and money. Not all P5 schools will have the boosters/schemes to make this work, but many will after a few years. I would expect the depth at schools in the bottom of the P5 in particular to improve as playing for a loser like Rutgers and getting some cash will appeal to many vs playing time at App State.

2) G5 transfers literally cash in: Kids that shine with one or two good years at a G5 school will hit the transfer portal to not only step up the prestige, but now to collect a pay check. Boosters will have a field day cherry picking the G5's best. Anyone think Milton will still be at UCF under this system?

Modest Money: I think everyone might be over estimated the money. A lot of kids will pick one school over another for something as modest as a 10 to 30k cash subsidy. Yes, the cash wont come from the school, it will come from booster entity or individual. By example, UConn's $1MM lockers could have been used as 750k in lockers and a handful of modest one year subsidies to improve our odds in the transfer market this past off season.

App State probably has more boosters willing to spend money on the program than Rutgers does.

In fact, I’d turn that first argument on its head.

Schools like Southern Miss, UCF, Boise State etc etc have more people willing to spend more money than a school like Rutgers or BC does.

So I think it would actually help schools like that more than it hurts.

 

[Exit 4]

And, there doesn't seem to be any Title IX problems about equal pay.

Title IX implications? A very very interesting question. Probably handled by walking the line that this is not university compensation, but alumni/booster/commercial market activity which is not directly controlled by the university. Nevertheless some lawyer is already stewing about the possibilities.

 

[UConnTrumbull]

I think there needs to be options. For instance, if you agree to be compensated then you should also have to pay tuition/room and board. Only the ELITE athletes would accept that trade off.

 

[Exit 4]

App State probably has more boosters willing to spend money on the program than Rutgers does.

In fact, I’d turn that first argument on its head.

Schools like Southern Miss, UCF, Boise State etc etc have more people willing to spend more money than a school like Rutgers or BC does

Maybe. Any school with a Tilman Fertitta will be able to play in this new landscape. There will be some G5 schools that can successfully buy their survival. Some. However its going to require very deep financial capability and an uncanny ability to find good hidden talent as Temple has had finding good coaches...because that talent will be going upstream over and over again in this market, especially if its legitimately good.

I think a lot of G5 schools have the boosters to play this game on the extreme fringes, but not at the level and scale you will need to have sustained success.

 

[UConnJim]

App State probably has more boosters willing to spend money on the program than Rutgers does.

In fact, I’d turn that first argument on its head.

Schools like Southern Miss, UCF, Boise State etc etc have more people willing to spend more money than a school like Rutgers or BC does.

So I think it would actually help schools like that more than it hurts.

Agree. The top P5 programs that want to remain top programs will continue to be top programs as the boosters will pay and the schools that want to either get into or return to the top will have boosters trying to pay more. Look at a school like Tennessee. Don't you think the boosters would pay top dollars to football players to turn around their fortunes? Same with Nebraska.

The lower tier P5 programs would be vulnerable as the G5s with deep pocketed boosters could pay more and become more relevant.

End of the day, schools will have to decide if they want to participate in pay to play. I think some schools will opt out. It has happened in the past.

 

[Exit 4]

Schools like Southern Miss, UCF, Boise State etc etc have more people willing to spend more money than a school like Rutgers or BC does.

And where does that put us? Squarely well outside. I dont see us have any $$ for this new world. Hard to see that 15 years from now about 1/3rd 130 D1 schools decide to walk it back to FCS.

 

[Guapo]

Agree. The top P5 programs that want to remain top programs will continue to be top programs as the boosters will pay and the schools that want to either get into or return to the top will have boosters trying to pay more. Look at a school like Tennessee. Don't you think the boosters would pay top dollars to football players to turn around their fortunes? Same with Nebraska.

The lower tier P5 programs would be vulnerable as the G5s with deep pocketed boosters could pay more and become more relevant.

End of the day, schools will have to decide if they want to participate in pay to play. I think some schools will opt out. It has happened in the past.

I just don’t think it’ll turn into pay to play as your describing.

It’ll be the same amount of money that flowing into the programs now, it’ll just be that, instead of building lazy rivers and waterfalls in locker rooms, that money will go to paying a player to appear in a car commercial.

Let’s also not forgot that this is happening in the context of the real world. These boosters are not all T Boone Pickens. They have businesses to run and thus they have business partners and they have families and, in some cases, shareholders to answer to.

It’s not like they can just increase the amount they’re spending on these programs exponentially just because it’ll be legal.

 

[Exit 4]

I just don’t think it’ll turn into pay to play as your describing.

It’ll be the same amount of money that flowing into the programs now, it’ll just be that, instead of building lazy rivers and waterfalls in locker rooms, that money will go to paying a player to appear in a car commercial.

Let’s also not forgot that this is happening in the context of the real world. These boosters are not all T Boone Pickens. They have businesses to run and thus they have business partners and they have families and, in some cases, shareholders to answer to.

It’s not like they can just increase the amount they’re spending on these programs exponentially just because it’ll be legal.

I think that is really naive. A lot of privately held family companies out there with a lot of leeway. If a booster really wants it, with the right coach they could built a 7 win team within the G5. And if you are a fan of a program without significant boosters (UConn? perhaps all of the MAC schools?) you really lose your incentive to care knowing full well App St or Houston bought their team with cash (whether its large or small....they spent more).

Kind of like MLB, except in the MLB the dudes on Tampa Bay can't leave for the Yankees after one good year, instead they have to fulfill their 5year min service time to unlock free agency vs immediate free agency in FBS.

Dont get me wrong, I'm all for it. Let it rip. Open pandora's box.

 

[Irishfan]

You know there are only so many roster spots, right?

Nonetheless, if you have to resort to extreme hypotheticals to say this is bad, you’ve lost the argument.

I think this law is going to manifest itself much more along the lines of a Bama player doing a local commercial for a Tuscaloosa used car dealership or being paid to show up at some booster’s kid’s birthday party to sign autographs.

In what way was this extreme. Why would you suspect this will limit itself to players doing commercials. Much more likely that it is a transparent effort to make giving hundred of thousands of dollars to top recruits a common practice for big money boosters. Imagine the bidding war for five star recruits between Michigan and Ohio State. Or LSU and Alabama. Take a photo of a five star athlete in a Bama Jersey, and as soon as he enrolls you give him $100,000 for the picture. Simply paying him for his likeness. Why show up for a kids birthday when Phil Knight is willing to pay millions to support the school.

 

[Guapo]

I think that is really naive. A lot of privately held family companies out there with a lot of leeway. If a booster really wants it, with the right coach they could built a 7 win team within the G5. And if you are a fan of a program without significant boosters (UConn? perhaps all of the MAC schools?) you really lose your incentive to care knowing full well App St or Houston bought their team with cash (whether its large or small....they spent more).

Kind of like MLB, except in the MLB the dudes on Tampa Bay can't leave for the Yankees after one good year, instead they have to fulfill their 5year min service time to unlock free agency vs immediate free agency in FBS.

Dont get me wrong, I'm all for it. Let it rip. Open pandora's box.

I think you’re the naive one if you think this stuff isn’t already happening

 

[UConnJim]

I think that is really naive. A lot of privately held family companies out there with a lot of leeway. If a booster really wants it, with the right coach they could built a 7 win team within the G5. And if you are a fan of a program without significant boosters (UConn? perhaps all of the MAC schools?) you really lose your incentive to care knowing full well App St or Houston bought their team with cash (whether its large or small....they spent more).

Kind of like MLB, except in the MLB the dudes on Tampa Bay can't leave for the Yankees after one good year, instead they have to fulfill their 5year min service time to unlock free agency vs immediate free agency in FBS.

Dont get me wrong, I'm all for it. Let it rip. Open pandora's box.

There are many wealthy people out there who can spend without any worries.

As for UConn, there are wealthy people out there with ties to UConn who are untapped. Why haven't they been tapped? UConn is still figuring out how to do it. Other schools I am associated with know how to raise money and eventually, I hope, UConn figures it out.

 

[Exit 4]

I think you’re the naive one if you think this stuff isn’t already happening

What is happening today is nothing compared to what is about to happen.

The bagman of yesterday was able to keep prices down in an opaque market. The public auctions we are about to have will boost prices significantly.

 

[Exit 4]

As for UConn, there are wealthy people out there with ties to UConn who are untapped. Why haven't they been tapped? UConn is still figuring out how to do it. Other schools I am associated with know how to raise money and eventually, I hope, UConn figures it out.

Here come the arrows... I don't think UConn has the power alumni base you really need to play this game. Plus, our alumni are exhausted trying to support powerhouse programs in MBB, WBB and the upstart hockey program. We are stretched.

Some donors will be asked to shore up player $ for all four sports.

 

[Guapo]

In what way was this extreme. Why would you suspect this will limit itself to players doing commercials. Much more likely that it is a transparent effort to make giving hundred of thousands of dollars to top recruits a common practice for big money boosters. Imagine the bidding war for five star recruits between Michigan and Ohio State. Or LSU and Alabama. Take a photo of a five star athlete in a Bama Jersey, and as soon as he enrolls you give him $100,000 for the picture. Simply paying him for his likeness. Why show up for a kids birthday when Phil Knight is willing to pay millions to support the school.

Lol a) I love that you never include Notre Dame in these examples and b) I’m pretty deeply involved in southern football culture and, while this stuff absolutely goes on, it’s not nearly as extravagant (for lack of a better term) as many of you seem to imagine it to be.

It’s a lot of the stereotypical car dealership owner, small businessmen, lawyer-types etc.

They don’t exactly have hundreds of thousands of dollars laying around to throw at every single recruit every single year for a signed photo. Maybe for a Cam Newtown or other generational talent...

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

Any student at any University can sign any endorsement deal or sell their likeness, etc. Whether they're a video game streamer or a magician or a comedian.

But not athletes. All that money has to go directly to the NCAA.

The cartel will be broken up.

 

[Guapo]

Any student at any University can sign any endorsement deal or sell their likeness, etc. Whether they're a video game streamer or a magician or a comedian.

But not athletes. All that money has to go directly to the NCAA.

The cartel will be broken up.

I would’ve happily endorsed any product as a history major at UConn

 

[CL82]

All that money has to go directly to the NCAA.

For the sale of player likenesses?

 

[UConnJim]

Here come the arrows... I don't think UConn has the power alumni base you really need to play this game. Plus, our alumni are exhausted trying to support powerhouse programs in MBB, WBB and the upstart hockey program. We are stretched.

Some donors will be asked to shore up player $ for all four sports.

UConn has the potential donors. They just don't know how to identify donors, build relationships, and get people to donate money. Why? Raising money was never the priority at UConn and they really just started becoming professional money raisers in the past 5 years, but they have a lot to learn.

 

[huskymedic]

UConn has the potential donors. They just don't know how to identify donors, build relationships, and get people to donate money. Why? Raising money was never the priority at UConn and they really just started becoming professional money raisers in the past 5 years, but they have a lot to learn.

Cultivating (just hope the donations cover the expenses over due time )

 

[Exit 4]

@UConnJim

While not a direct corollary to giving ability going forward, nor is it necessarily indicative of just how a school might fudge their programs to create sponsorships for student athletes; its still worth noting that the UConn endowment fund was only $447MM in 2008. Below a someone's schedule of the P5 schools which are much higher.

Looks like we'll be finding out in a few short years if we really do have some donors...at the depth its going to take to compete with other schools.

 

[Carnac]

So could a UCLA booster pay a top athlete $100,000 for a picture of him in a UCLA Jersey. As long as he agrees to play football there? Could be the start to a big recruiting war between USC, UCLA and Stanford boosters.

.....and other major programs across the country. Why not go to USC/UCLA if I can get paid there?

 

[huskymedic]

Fair read

 

[whaler11]

I posted this in the basketball board thread to:

I really think that most of the pearl clutching and belly aching about this is much ado about nothing.

If these rules come to pass (and that’s still a big if at this point) I think you’ll find your experience as a college sports fan will be mostly unchanged.

Meanwhile the quality of life for some athletes will be improved.

It’s a win-win.

upstater is kinda right.

the schools hate it because they want the money to build lazy rivers. if you can pay direct the boosters have the power not the schools.

 

[whaler11]

do people not know why ucla basketball was a dynasty? THEY PAID EVERYONE

 

[Guapo]

do people not know why ucla basketball was a dynasty? THEY PAID EVERYONE

Hey man you stole my joke!