Dorka Should Start

[jchusky]

If we continue to see the contrast between Dorka and Liv does Liv start based on seniority? Yup, that's great coaching. Sarcasm emoticon needed. Interesting question: if Liv was replaced in the starting line up could she cope with that.

a game against Fort Hayes State is NOT the reason to take her out of the starting lineup. If she has another bad game like Arizona vs an elite team then I'd consider it, but it seems like jackals ready to pounce the opportunity Olivia has a bad outing for Dorka, I don't understand that.

 

[JoePgh]

The trio of Liv, Aaliyah, and Dorka playing the two post positions looked good today no matter which pair was in the game at any time. I think if all three play and have roughly equal minutes, that should produce good results for the team and for their durability as players.

Of course, if they (particularly Liv and Aaliyah) continue to be waylaid by foul trouble, then that will undermine this strategy unless one of [Caroline, Piath, Amari] can step up to the post role. I was particularly impressed with Piath today, and wondered why Geno didn't put her in the game until only 4:30 was remaining.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

a game against Fort Hayes State is NOT the reason to take her out of the starting lineup. If she has another bad game like Arizona vs an elite team then I'd consider it, but it seems like jackals ready to pounce the opportunity Olivia has a bad outing for Dorka, I don't understand that.

"If we continue to see the contrast"., meaning not because of this exhibition game. Everybody has an opinion and name calling because you disagree doesn't strengthen your opinion. It just cheapens it.

 

[Boreifs]

I agree.. I believe Liv will be more confident coming off the bench and contributing in that manner. Dorka was too good today and it didn't take her too long to begin easing into the game. I can tell Amari, once acclimated into the system, will be really good. Liv needs to leave all her card on the table and ball her butt off this year.

I was really quite astounded at how nine players were able to function in multiple combinations so seamlessly so early in the season, particularly since three of them are new to the program. That rotation of nine is going to be unbeatable by the end of the season.
Also, it doesn’t matter at all who starts; the minutes of these nine players might be close to equal by March. That’s how a juggernaut develops.

 

[Boreifs]

The trio of Liv, Aaliyah, and Dorka playing the two post positions looked good today no matter which pair was in the game at any time. I think if all three play and have roughly equal minutes, that should produce good results for the team and for their durability as players.

Of course, if they (particularly Liv and Aaliyah) continue to be waylaid by foul trouble, then that will undermine this strategy unless one of [Caroline, Piath, Amari] can step up to the post role. I was particularly impressed with Piath today, and wondered why Geno didn't put her in the game until only 4:30 was remaining.

Caroline played most of her minutes at the four; it wasn’t a rotation of three.

 

[HuskylnSC]

In my, oh so, humble opinion, it's very simple. Dorka is a better 4 than Liv. Dorka is a better 5 that Aaliyah. Sitting on the bench Dorka can see what is happening and be instructed by the coach before entering the game. Dorka replaces whichever role needs to be beefed up. Dorka as a team player sacrifices starts to facilitate victories. The starting five may be stronger with Dorka. But the team is stronger with Dorka coming off the bench.

 

[Cuango]

If we want to win another National Championship then Dorka should start over Liv.

Whether Dorka starts or not is going to have little to no effect on whether we win number 12! They both have a big role to play and both will contribute to what we all hope and expect will be a national championship. Who starts is unimportant. What matters is what they both do with their time on court!

 

[HuskylnSC]

Caroline played most of her minutes at the four; it wasn’t a rotation of three.

Yes against a team with little height. Can she do that against bigger players ( i.e. Saxton)?

 

[D J B]

There were games where Liv completely disappeared last year. She is a better shot blocker than Dorka but that's all.

Gotta give Dorka a chance here.

 

[Happydad745]

I'll wait a few games before agreeing with this idea....not saying it is a bad call, just waiting to see if it is obvious.

 

[hoopsfan22]

Who are we benching for Dorka? Paige or Aaliyah?

 

[jdote33]

I wanted Dorka to start all off season, even if it meant alongside Liv. However, I agree with a lot of others on this thread, her coming of the bench makes that unit all the more dangerous. She's super aggressive, and can really lead that unit that is less experienced (Nika, Azzi, sometimes CD). But I really like both Liv and Dorka. Dorka in interviews is always saying how they are similar but different. Each has an important role (probably close to equal minutes) and I envision them picking each other up throughout the season. Both had some bad performances against ranked teams last year, but its a new year and they can keep each other accountable.

 

[mbr33ct]

Didn't take long to hear the "infamous" chant(s) of "Dorka should start"...what player is next to "start"? Dorka played 3 less minutes than ONO and four less minutes than Edwards.

 

[oldhusky]

I agree that Liv is a pretty good passer and appears to be the best of the bigs in that category. I don't think, however, that she has unique or special instincts in that regard. In many ways her passing is a byproduct of the system. Uconn has always had bigs that passed the ball and had better assist/turnover ratios than other team's bigs by far.

In Liv's case it is also trying to find a role for her in the offense. Against much smaller opposition we can and do go to her frequently down low in an effective way. Against bigger and more physical players that kind of disappears as an effective option. She is not a good long range shooter, and at best mediocre from mid-range so turning her into more of a passer was the best way to use her against better opponents.

Statistically Liv was a much better passer than Dorka based on last year's stats. In this exhibition game I thought Dorka was looking for others pretty consistently, and even Aaliyah had a nice pass on a pick and role. She needs to get better passing as well. My prediction would be both Dorka and Aaliyah will both improve their passing stats substantially with additional time in the Uconn system, where bigs that pass is the norm not the exception. Aaliyah may also advance in that area because she was used more as a wing with the Canadian national team.

 

[Littlemin]

All three; Ono, Dorka, and Edwards will get their minutes. Who starts is irrelevant, who finishes is certainly anything but.

 

[Bald Husky]

If we want to win another National Championship then Dorka should start over Liv.

I said it before, it doesn't matter who starts. If they are good enough they all will get the minutes they deserve. Besides, when was the last time we had so many ( if any ) high impact players coming off the bench. Now instead of groaning when a starter sits down, we have a new feeling of excitement when the bench players come in. Geno will do his NEW thing and play more players during a game than he has ever done, and it will be exciting.

 

[Eagle4]

The biggest revealation I saw was that now Geno has three primary options in the "bigs". Last year with only two it was a gamble to start two because if they got into early foul trouble there was no option to replace the player in foul trouble. Looks like this year he can start two bigs without worry about early foul trouble. I liked the look of two bigs along with Paige, CW and E.

Dorka showed versality to score both inside and from the perimeter. She was quick and skilled with her post moves. She showed an excellent left hand. She rebounded well. I'm not surprised, this is what I expected to see from her.

While it is too early to make definitive calls based one one exhibition game, I thought Dorka looked great and Liv looked like the Liv we have seen. I was disappointed in what I saw from Liv and hope it is not a harbinger of what is to come from her.

As many of the posters have said, its not who starts that matters, it is who plays the most against strong copetition and at the end of close games. It's also important for players coming off the bench to be able to have an immediate and positive inpact on the game. Dorka and Azzi boh eem to have that ability.

We should get a good idea of where everyone stands at Atlantis, especially if we see South Carolina in the finals.

 

[Waquoit]

Interesting question: if Liv was replaced in the starting line up could she cope with that.

Honestly, who cares. If Ono was the player her fans insist she is, Dorka wouldn't be here. And the idea that a superior player sits because reasons is nonsense to me.

 

[Inthepaint]

I don't know if I'm one of Liv's "fans".
Seems like a good teammate, not a prima-donna. Of course I don't know what takes place off camera. No reason for Liv or Geno to tell me
I like what I see from her, when she's moving back and forth from high to low post. Also can be an obstacle in the lane and blocks her share.
She gets herself up and down the court with dispatch. Not afraid to scramble or go to the floor if needs be.
However...
I see her shortcomings when the going gets tough against superior teams.
Still commits rookie fouls, fade-aways often come up short, doesn't seem to want to impose herself into the paint in traffic.
As far as F/T shooting goes, she's no worse than many, or better for that matter. Problem is nobody is afraid to put her on the foul line.
Liv, Dorka-whoever gets the job done.
Maybe one is better against teams with strong post players, one might be more effective against smaller, quicker guards.
I say let 'er rip and may the chips fall where they may.

 

[donalddoowop]

Honestly, who cares. If Ono was the player her fans insist she is, Dorka wouldn't be here. And the idea that a superior player sits because reasons is nonsense to me.

Do you really think Geno would have refused Dorka just because Ono was a really good player? He is smarter than that.

 

[Boreifs]

Didn't take long to hear the "infamous" chant(s) of "Dorka should start"...what player is next to "start"? Dorka played 3 less minutes than ONO and four less minutes than Edwards.

One should not be obsessed with more or fewer minutes in an exhibition game.

 

[ClifSpliffy]

it is astounding for me to read the many years long attempt by some here to continually blather on aboot what both liv, and tyler at the other board,
will be.
when?
they are who they are. ya know, based upon the years of data in evidence.
i am quite confident that both coaches are more focused on winning, not on feelings, and will use both where reasonably expected to do what they actually can do.

 

[MD#12Fan]

I should just keep my big pie-hole shut, but I swear that I need the BY for some stimulating banter...
What does it feel like for a 6'5" post player (I add 6" to women for some sort of equivalence, + the factor that not so many women can jump- where are you Gabby), to play against a 6'0" or 6'1" post player? Remember when you were younger and you played against smaller players?
Come on folks, calm down! Let's talk after next Sunday.
BTW you can have all these jumpers by our bigs. What were they, 2 for 10? Don't need it, don't need it. Not a rule that you have to have a big at the high post. I know, the high- low look is beautiful, but not if the D is playing 6 feet off the high post.
Did Coach use Tina up there?

 

[veryolddog]

I am not an expert at people at positions or an elite basketball observer like you guys, but what I see as a difference between the two players is this: Dorka, when she receives the ball keeps her hands high and when she is swarmed under the basket she twists, pivots and goes for the layup getting fouled in the process. Liv in the same position when getting swarmed will try to pass, but keeps her hands low and is open to have the ball taken away from her by shorter people.

 

[MD#12Fan]

Somebody's gotta say it: Stop piling on Liv!!
She's improved in every facet of the game, the last 2 years. UConn has won some blockbuster games with her in the pivot. South Carolina? Baylor? Iowa? How did she do against Syracuse's big last year?
She's a decent passer, outlet and in the offense. Her post moves improve every year. Her touch all around the key improves every year. She blocks shots and she gets better every year at keeping her hands straight up.
BTW if Geno didn't bring her up high, she wouldn't have to be there.
UConn can win with Liv in the post. Teams are collections of players, all with strengths and weaknesses. Not even UConn can have the #1 HS'er at every position. Coaches take advantage of their players strengths and hide/minimize their weaknesses. (not expose them)

 

[Zorro]

Of course this is based on only one game specifically but it fits what Geno has been saying about her since she arrived and, we know, she was First Team All Big 10 two years in a row. In today's game she had close to twice ONO's production in scoring and rebounds in less minutes. She was dominant while Liv was Liv. Dorka also didn't make the same foolish fouls that we are used to from Liv.

Azzi and Charmer should be the first off the bench replacing E and AE.

Right! And so should Azzi and Nika and maube Caroline. But the stupid NCAA will only let us start five players. The fault is with the NCAA!

 

[Dokey]

What you have to remember is she a two time All Big Ten player. That was on a team that couldn’t carry UConn’s water. What she could do when surrounded by UConn talent could be incredible.

 

[MooseJaw]

In my, oh so, humble opinion, it's very simple. Dorka is a better 4 than Liv. Dorka is a better 5 that Aaliyah. Sitting on the bench Dorka can see what is happening and be instructed by the coach before entering the game. Dorka replaces whichever role needs to be beefed up. Dorka as a team player sacrifices starts to facilitate victories. The starting five may be stronger with Dorka. But the team is stronger with Dorka coming off the bench.

Maybe but 1 ex game proves little in the long run. What we did get was a clearer picture of what Dorka can bring to the team. We will know more with a few games under our belts. I was most impressed when AE and Dorka were in the game together. Will I feel the same after a few more games? Only the future and Carnac hold the answer.

 

[BostonBay]

Somebody's gotta say it: Stop piling on Liv!!
She's improved in every facet of the game, the last 2 years.

She has?? I think most on this thread would disagree (if there is an anonymous survey). Her post moves has not improved one bit in the games I've watched. Same bad habits.

getting back to the main message of this thread, I dont think posters are piling on as much as being very, very excited to see Dorka's talent being leveraged. IMO, cant have enough Bigs/post players to wear out the competition in March.

 

[SVCBeercats]

Didn't take long to hear the "infamous" chant(s) of "Dorka should start"...what player is next to "start"? Dorka played 3 less minutes than ONO and four less minutes than Edwards.

Dorka had bad games at Ohio state. Everyone does. But when she plays poorly in some UCONN game you can bet your bottom dollar the same folks calling for Liv head will be after Dorka's.