DePaul Post Game Thread

[RichCTBB]

I’d love to see Alleyne get starter minutes over Jackson. His offense is an unknown to our opponents and would therefore have to be respected. No sagging and it would open things up for Sanogo. Again, let’s get back to the lineups that got us off to a 14-0 start. Andre needs to get out of his head and start using it, but I’m not sure he can with such a limited offensive skill set. He tries to make up for his offense by going for home run defensive plays and ends up getting burned all too often.

 

[ValleyGuy]

I’d love to see Alleyne get starter minutes over Jackson. His offense is an unknown to our opponents and would therefore have to be respected. No sagging and it would open things up for Sanogo. Again, let’s get back to the lineups that got us off to a 14-0 start. Andre needs to get out of his head and start using it, but I’m not sure he can with such a limited offensive skill set. He tries to make up for his offense by going for home run defensive plays and ends up getting burned all too often.

Unknown? He airballed a pull up 3 from the foul line. Do you think coaches who get paid millions of dollars don’t do scouting reports? By unknown do you mean non-existent?

 

[yungdowork]

We all know Andre can’t shoot, but his athleticism is insane. Because of this, why don’t we send him into the post more? He’s guarded by a wing his size or smaller normally, and he can rise above pretty much any defender to (hopefully) hit a short jumper or layup. Plus, he’s a good passer when he’s not forcing it. Seems like something that has to happen, because having him camp outside the 3 point line allowing the defense to clog the lane hurts us too much. If none of this is feasible, he really needs minutes cut. He hurts us too much in the current offensive set up, and his defense hasn’t even been good enough to make up for it.

When we've tried it, it hasn't really worked I think. He's really almost never used a post-up to his advantage offensively that I can remember, although I do think it'd be good for him. When I watch how somebody like Jerome Hunter from Xavier plays, it's hard for me to understand how Andre can't do much of that same stuff, since he has basically all the same tools and more. I do think at this point, he needs to focus on being more of a forward and less of a guard because it's getting too hard to rationalize him spending so much time on the ball.

 

[Umami Zen]

Subtle but effective.. Have noticed that Newton and Hawk have been "selling" the refs on getting fouled.. Result--Our two best FT shooters getting to the line with more frequency where they are both money.. Will pay dividends at crunch time in BET/Tournament games.

 

[HuskyHawk]

When we've tried it, it hasn't really worked I think. He's really almost never used a post-up to his advantage offensively that I can remember, although I do think it'd be good for him. When I watch how somebody like Jerome Hunter from Xavier plays, it's hard for me to understand how Andre can't do much of that same stuff, since he has basically all the same tools and more. I do think at this point, he needs to focus on being more of a forward and less of a guard because it's getting too hard to rationalize him spending so much time on the ball.

I'll say the same thing I've said before, he plays like he's allergic to contact. Twists away from it, launches floaters instead of going to the rim, angles away from the defender and theows up bank shots. I don't know what his injury history is, and he does have a fairly slight build, but he does not want to bang on people inside. Until he does, he (a) won't get foul calls and (b) makes every shot far more difficult than it would be.

 

[whosurdaddy2720]

Removing Jackson from the starting lineup at this point would absolutely torpedo is already teetering confidence no?

He's obviously struggling but he still does a lot f good little things that this team desperately needs and it all might evaporate if his playing time is handle poorly.

 

[Umami Zen]

More often than not. Good things happen when the ball is in Newton's hands (esp. last few games).. Jackson is valuable to the team in other aspects of the game.. If he can be a secondary facilitator/distributor rather than a primary ball handler.. Our results are usually better.. He is more effective on D/boards/disruption and when the ball is getting into the hands of our offensive weapons.

 

[Palatine]

I’d love to see Alleyne get starter minutes over Jackson. His offense is an unknown to our opponents and would therefore have to be respected. No sagging and it would open things up for Sanogo. Again, let’s get back to the lineups that got us off to a 14-0 start. Andre needs to get out of his head and start using it, but I’m not sure he can with such a limited offensive skill set. He tries to make up for his offense by going for home run defensive plays and ends up getting burned all too often.

Alleyne was the key to DePaul's second half run. Bad shots early in the shot clock. Turnovers. And his D was sketchy.

BTW, to add some context, for the season Alleyne shoots .330 from the field. Dre shoots .359

 

[Giddyup5]

Because they can't play man together, and we needed to stop their shooters. Best zone for that.

With that specific personnel would you not prefer an extended 2-3 or base 3-2 zone? Heck even a 1-2-2.

 

[husky429]

With that specific personnel would you not prefer an extended 2-3 or base 3-2 zone? Heck even a 1-2-2.

It isn't about personnel, it's about what we're trying to do with a zone. Yeah, generally speaking I'd prefer to have Sanogo in a zone that doesn't require him to play on the perimeter.

But when Depaul is shooting 45% from deep and we can't plan man... your best option that we've practiced is a 1-3-1. It's designed to stop wing shooters--exactly the shot that was killing us yesterday.

 

[yungdowork]

I'll say the same thing I've said before, he plays like he's allergic to contact. Twists away from it, launches floaters instead of going to the rim, angles away from the defender and theows up bank shots. I don't know what his injury history is, and he does have a fairly slight build, but he does not want to bang on people inside. Until he does, he (a) won't get foul calls and (b) makes every shot far more difficult than it would be.

It feels weird to say that a guy with his handles and athleticism should be working on his back-to-the-basket game, but he just doesn't seem capable of consistently finishing at the rim right now, and he's not a guy you really want creating his own shot off the dribble. I think even if he can mitigate the negative plays on offense, that'd be huge for his mindset right now. I'm pretty confident that if he can start getting some of the little things right again, he's going to start playing a lot better than he has been this month.

 

[Slick]

Alleyne is better overall...played well at a higher level last year. The next 2 months you play the best players. Joey will gets mins but not major.

If Joey shot like he did early in the year he would be playing more. I think he is shooting around 20% which is not going to get him minutes

 

[HuskyHawk]

It feels weird to say that a guy with his handles and athleticism should be working on his back-to-the-basket game, but he just doesn't seem capable of consistently finishing at the rim right now, and he's not a guy you really want creating his own shot off the dribble. I think even if he can mitigate the negative plays on offense, that'd be huge for his mindset right now. I'm pretty confident that if he can start getting some of the little things right again, he's going to start playing a lot better than he has been this month.

I don't want him playing back to the basket. I want him to play more like Hunter at Xavier, get to the paint and go at the rim no matter who or what is in your way. Andre did that once and it was a charge, but he actually made that shot. It's not a coincidence that he's missing when he's avoiding the defender. He needs to use that agility to get to the side of the defender, then go up for a +1.

This was at our expense, but it should look like this.

 

[krinklecut]

Serious question - can Sanogo dunk? What’s his vertical?

 

[HuskyHawk]

Serious question - can Sanogo dunk? What’s his vertical?

Yes, but it's easier to block a dunk than his ambidextrous layups, where he shields the ball with the rim.

 

[yungdowork]

I don't want him playing back to the basket. I want him to play more like Hunter at Xavier, get to the paint and go at the rim no matter who or what is in your way. Andre did that once and it was a charge, but he actually made that shot. It's not a coincidence that he's missing when he's avoiding the defender. He needs to use that agility to get to the side of the defender, then go up for a +1.

This was at our expense, but it should look like this.

Yeah, the slashing is what I meant when I brought up Hunter as well. But if you watch the first Xavier game especially, there are several moments where Hunter backs Karaban down, overpowers him, and scores over the top of him. That's a big part of his game. The fact that Andre hasn't shown that's in his bag limits his ability to be that type of player. He's been guarded by guys smaller than him in every game this year and I can't remember him using his strength to his advantage offensively. Hunter, on the other hand, seems like he's looking for that mismatch every time down the floor.

 

[UConnRock]

Seems like Joey and Alleyne are battling for minutes. Joey hasn’t been getting as many shots and when open has been hitting less. Alleyne brings a better all around game and just needs to refain confidence on offense. The minutes for the 8th and 9th guys off the bench are dwindling. Will be interesting where Hurley goes with the rotation down the stretch.

 

[krinklecut]

Yes, but it's easier to block a dunk than his ambidextrous layups, where he shields the ball with the rim.

I get that, it’s just so weird that he NEVER dunks. I don’t get it. It would make his game a lot stronger.

 

[Storrs South]

A concerning trend: UConn has allowed 40+ points in the second half in 5 of the last 6 games. The one game it didn't happen was Butler. The other 5, UConn is 1-4 in such contests, with the lone win being DePaul.

 

[Palatine]

Zone is also a way to cut down on fouls. While were not in seriious foul trouble, we were close. I think that probably played some part in the decision.

 

[Conndog]

Removing Jackson from the starting lineup at this point would absolutely torpedo is already teetering confidence no?

He's obviously struggling but he still does a lot f good little things that this team desperately needs and it all might evaporate if his playing time is handle poorly.

Call to coaching staff- work with Andre to help him transition into scoring forward. Do drills so he learns how to shot fake, pivot for a shot, take the ball while defended into the lane to shoot a good shot or be fouled, how to seal off defender, maybe how to use backboard more for close shots. I think his confidence will re-grow as he sees a new, more effective part of his game growing. He needs to learn how to shoot a pull-up jumper when in the lane.
One thing I love, though, is when he brings the ball up court , he is across the mid-court line in about 2 seconds.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Yeah, the slashing is what I meant when I brought up Hunter as well. But if you watch the first Xavier game especially, there are several moments where Hunter backs Karaban down, overpowers him, and scores over the top of him. That's a big part of his game. The fact that Andre hasn't shown that's in his bag limits his ability to be that type of player. He's been guarded by guys smaller than him in every game this year and I can't remember him using his strength to his advantage offensively. Hunter, on the other hand, seems like he's looking for that mismatch every time down the floor.

Fair. Hunter is a big 4, and Andre a 3. He backed down Alex because he can. Against bigger 4s he doesn't do that. But there are 3s and even guards who go in, draw contact and score, but never play that way. Andre simply won't for some reason.

 

[Conndog]

Yes, but it's easier to block a dunk than his ambidextrous layups, where he shields the ball with the rim.

True, yet it’s also easier to be fouled. Getting the other team’s bigs in foul trouble would be nice to see.

 

[aburks41]

Let’s just run the rest of the regular season table. That would make me happy

If we run the table we would be back on the 2 seed line. Wins over Bama, Iowa State, Creighton 2x, PC, Marquette, Nova 2x. That would be a damn good resume.

That St Johns and Seton Hall loss are total killers. We should be sitting at 4 losses right now with a shot at a 1 seed. Oh well

 

[RichCTBB]

I think Alleyne is going to give us more of a potential offensive threat if it clicks for him than Andre could hope to provide. He at least wants to score when gets the ball and doesn’t look lost for several moments before he decides what to do. Honestly, it’s probably a wash between the 2 right now.

 

[Billy Jack]

Yeah, the slashing is what I meant when I brought up Hunter as well. But if you watch the first Xavier game especially, there are several moments where Hunter backs Karaban down, overpowers him, and scores over the top of him. That's a big part of his game. The fact that Andre hasn't shown that's in his bag limits his ability to be that type of player. He's been guarded by guys smaller than him in every game this year and I can't remember him using his strength to his advantage offensively. Hunter, on the other hand, seems like he's looking for that mismatch every time down the floor.

X has Nunge who is a scoring threat from 3, so he pulls the opposing center out with him, who has to guard him at the arc. That opens the middle for Hunter to go down low. Our bigs aren’t a threat from the perimeter. Even when Sanogo goes out to the arc, the opposing center does go out with him. They leave him open and continue to protect the middle. So, there’s really no opening on the interior for Jackson to take his man to the rim.

 

[87Xfer]

The pivot toward a flat non scoring time was triggered by several poor passes and playing a bit too fast. This is easily corrected. The bones are very good, just need more connecting tissue! The double bigs brought a new look that had to be a nightmare for the opposition. The high low of Santago at the top with Cligman under worked to perfection as Santago drove for several lay-ups from the top of the key.

Santago and Cligman?

 

[yungdowork]

X has Nunge who is a scoring threat from 3, so he pulls the opposing center out with him, who has to guard him at the arc. That opens the middle for Hunter to go down low. Our bigs aren’t a threat from the perimeter. Even when Sanogo goes out to the arc, the opposing center does go out with him. They leave him open and continue to protect the middle. So, there’s really no opening on the interior for Jackson to take his man to the rim.

I think the biggest part of it is winning the 1-on-1s. Sure, Nunge is more of a deep threat so there's a bit more space, but once Hunter gets the ball, he's full attack mode. Even last night when we were running double big, which should have been clogging the lane, Hawkins and Newton were able to attack the rim because they were beating their man. Right now, a lot of the time I don't even think Andre considers trying to attack and instead is instantly looking for an open teammate. It's honestly the same problem that I thought Newton was experiencing early in the season, even though they have very different offensive games.

 

[Captbluefin]

Last night Alex took it to the rim and stuffed it with 2 hands in traffic. ALEX…

Why… why can’t Jackson do the same thing he is 2x more athletic and has way more hops..

And Hawk took it to the rack with authority too.

That’s what Jackson “ should “ be doing

 

[bendm]

Because they can't play man together

Yeah, generally speaking I'd prefer to have Sanogo in a zone that doesn't require him to play on the perimeter.

and this is the problem with the double big lineup. we cant play man with clingan and sanogo in the game, but whether we're in a 2-3 or 1-3-1, clingan is going to be in the middle and sanogo is going to be on the perimeter.