Delany on East Coast pre-expansion push: espn

[UConnRock]

I could certainly see the Ivy League hockey schools bolting for the B1g en masse. Would the Ivies rather be associated w/ UM, UW and other prominent public institutions or with St. Lawrence, Clarkson, RPI, Quinipiac, Colgate from the ECAC? Add Ivy lacrosse, and selective wrestling programs and there is a fit.

I always looked at the Hockey upgrade by UConn as a positive w/ the B1G, but Delany may have bigger plans.

 

[Kolumbo]

Let's make this simple
The B1G is not going after any non flag ship school
In the East there are only 3 remaining flagships playing FSB , UConn,UV,and UNC,

Any talk of further eastern expansion ,by the process of elimination would include these schools. If you believe the iron clad nature of the GOR ,who does that leave?
UConn

Don't forget UMass. Or Buffalo. Just saying.
B1G and ACC are going in different directions, the GOR is not iron-clad, and I wouldn't be surprised to see UNC or UVA make a move for long-term success. The "4 schools in North Carolina" model will hold the ACC back.
Interesting: Texas has 3 flagship U's: Texas, Texas A&M and North Texas.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Anyone who creates a scenario involving UConn and an affiliate membership in anything should be put into restraints and bludgeoned with their keyboard.

Of all the dopey theories developed here, those stand out for the audacity of their dopiness. (Although, I have to say that the Cornell-to-the-Big Ten talk is a threat to the crown.)

The Cincinnati to the B1G rumor is up there, too. BC has been stabbing UConn in the back with a knife with respect to conference realignment efforts. Ohio State would drop a nuke on Cincinnati if they even tried to get into the B1G.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I could certainly see the Ivy League hockey schools bolting for the B1g en masse. Would the Ivies rather be associated w/ UM, UW and other prominent public institutions or with St. Lawrence, Clarkson, RPI, Quinipiac, Colgate from the ECAC? Add Ivy lacrosse, and selective wrestling programs and there is a fit.

I always looked at the Hockey upgrade by UConn as a positive w/ the B1G, but Delany may have bigger plans.

Out of the ECAC, academically, RPI is at least on the same page as the Ivy League; but, they are smaller and lack a medical college which most Ivy Leagues have. Colgate is also a very strong school; but, it’s a liberal arts school. So, an alliance with the B1G academically makes sense, see U Chicago and now Johns Hopkins.

US News National Research Universities– 1) Princeton, 2) Harvard, 3) Yale, 4) Columbia, 5) U Chicago,* 7) U Penn, 10) Dartmouth, 12) Johns Hopkins,* 14) Brown, 16) Cornell, 41) RPI, 121) Clarkson

US News National Liberal Arts Universities– 20) Colgate, 41) Union, 56) St. Lawrence

US News Regional Universities , North– 11) Quinnipiac

 

[CallMeBruce]

The Cincinnati to the B1G rumor is up there, too. BC has been stabbing UConn in the back with a knife with respect to conference realignment efforts. Ohio State would drop a nuke on Cincinnati if they even tried to get into the B1G.

I don't understand how bc has that kind of clout. They're bad at almost everything. I have to think that a lot of ACC schools are wondering if they could just swap bc out for UConn.

 

[kingdobbs]

I could certainly see the Ivy League hockey schools bolting for the B1g en masse. Would the Ivies rather be associated w/ UM, UW and other prominent public institutions or with St. Lawrence, Clarkson, RPI, Quinipiac, Colgate from the ECAC? Add Ivy lacrosse, and selective wrestling programs and there is a fit.

I always looked at the Hockey upgrade by UConn as a positive w/ the B1G, but Delany may have bigger plans.

The only bolting anyone from the Ivy League is doing from the ECAC is to form an Ivy hockey league.

The idea of Brown or Princeton being actual viable B1G hockey candidates is undeniably laughable on its face. I mean, literally as much of a non-starter as AIC or Bentley being B1G candidates.

 

[FAIRTIDES]

I could certainly see the Ivy League hockey schools bolting for the B1g en masse. Would the Ivies rather be associated w/ UM, UW and other prominent public institutions or with St. Lawrence, Clarkson, RPI, Quinipiac, Colgate from the ECAC? Add Ivy lacrosse, and selective wrestling programs and there is a fit.

I always looked at the Hockey upgrade by UConn as a positive w/ the B1G, but Delany may have bigger plans.

I think people would be shocked to know that at, especially Yale and Harvard, significant alumni types question as to why their Institutions can't return to the "glory day" of Football? So far, nothing has ever come of it. Probably, never will. But I stopped believing in anything being impossible when Gretzky got traded.

 

[kyleslamb]

The Cincinnati to the B1G rumor is up there, too. BC has been stabbing UConn in the back with a knife with respect to conference realignment efforts. Ohio State would drop a nuke on Cincinnati if they even tried to get into the B1G.

The Big Ten has absolutely no interest in Cincinnati. If the Big Ten were ever to relax its academic standards, it's going to do it for someone out of region who has a national profile. At least someone like Pitt is a research giant. Cincinnati is bordering on being a commuter school.

 

[Fishy]

I don't really pay attention to these things, but I actually think Cincinnati is a well-regarded research university - they would be in the first cut of schools with AAU aspirations.

 

[Seaa Blue]

The Big Ten has absolutely no interest in Cincinnati. If the Big Ten were ever to relax its academic standards, it's going to do it for someone out of region who has a national profile. At least someone like Pitt is a research giant. Cincinnati is bordering on being a commuter school.

Cincinnati actually puts up some pretty good numbers on the research front. It's a moot point though since tOSU will never let them in.

 

[Ldandy]

I could certainly see the Ivy League hockey schools bolting for the B1g en masse. Would the Ivies rather be associated w/ UM, UW and other prominent public institutions or with St. Lawrence, Clarkson, RPI, Quinipiac, Colgate from the ECAC? Add Ivy lacrosse, and selective wrestling programs and there is a fit.

I always looked at the Hockey upgrade by UConn as a positive w/ the B1G, but Delany may have bigger plans.

Wrestling, Hockey, and Lacrosse are all sports that could be integrated into the conference outright as associate members or be involved in a scheduling alliance. They could fill many hours of programming on The BTN and possibly other Fox Based Networks.

The question of why would the Ivies want to join forces with a Midwest Conference doesn't hold much water IMO. I don't think anyone is going to look down on a Harvard Education because their Hockey Team is suddenly playing hockey against Minnesota. If in the process these universities' ADs can put some decent coin in their coffers from the TV end, what's the harm? No one is advocating that they alter their identity, but why not make a few more dollars a year on the sports of which they are already competing at a high level?

 

[Gfunk]

Cincinnati actually puts up some pretty good numbers on the research front. It's a moot point though since tOSU will never let them in.

True. Cincy has a lot of respectable graduate programs. Moreover, it's one funky cool campus, at least for an urban one.

Cincy has dealt with a lot of de-urbanization over the past 40 years, but those folks generally stayed in the metro & now things are starting to rebound in the urban core. It's got rough patches, but it's my favorite city in Ohio & it's a pretty decent sports town. Ciny is a crossroads culture as well - a gateway to the northern South & a great hs football-basketball area. But a lot of those kids aren't necessarily putting OSU at the top of their list anymore. For example, Ky football has been making a living on this area's recruits the past two years.

 

[Gfunk]

Wrestling, Hockey, and Lacrosse are all sports that could be integrated into the conference outright as associate members or be involved in a scheduling alliance. They could fill many hours of programming on The BTN and possibly other Fox Based Networks.

The question of why would the Ivies want to join forces with a Midwest Conference doesn't hold much water IMO. I don't think anyone is going to look down on a Harvard Education because their Hockey Team is suddenly playing hockey against Minnesota. If in the process these universities' ADs can put some decent coin in their coffers from the TV end, what's the harm? No one is advocating that alter their identity, just make a few more dollars a year on the sports that they are already competing at a high level.

Some good points. but we all need to remember that 3 big schools in the East are now part of the BIG, one since 1991 and the Midwest-Northeast have historically deep culturally ties, esp in education. A lot of BIG fans have overlooked the fact that the 2017 DC BIG tourney is actually not that far of a road trip for OSU, likely less than 7 hours and the Indiana and Michigan schools can get to DC in less than 10 hours, the Mi schools in less than 9 - that's more than half the BIG capable of getting to DC in less than 10 hours drive time. The Rust Belt Midwest and Northeast have more in common than we often see on these boards - I'd say more than the Corn Belt & Rust Belt Midwest.

We all have a tendency of overrating regional differences on here.

 

[kingdobbs]

Wrestling, Hockey, and Lacrosse are all sports that could be integrated into the conference outright as associate members or be involved in a scheduling alliance. They could fill many hours of programming on The BTN and possibly other Fox Based Networks.

Leagues which the B1G already has, or has recently started. Other than Johns Hopkins men's lax (who it turned out they did, in fact, need), the B1G doesn't NEED more teams.
In fact, they *lose* valuable games between their marquee names just to bring on new talent.

The question of why would the Ivies want to join forces with a Midwest Conference doesn't hold much water IMO. I don't think anyone is going to look down on a Harvard Education because their Hockey Team is suddenly playing hockey against Minnesota. If in the process these universities' ADs can put some decent coin in their coffers from the TV end, what's the harm? No one is advocating that they alter their identity, but why not make a few more dollars a year on the sports of which they are already competing at a high level?

...Because the Ivy League is, perhaps, the one league that gives LESS THAN A SHIT about how much coin their athletic programs as an aggregate bring in. You can't tempt them with something they don't want.

 

[woomba]

Leagues which the B1G already has, or has recently started. Other than Johns Hopkins men's lax (who it turned out they did, in fact, need), the B1G doesn't NEED more teams.
In fact, they *lose* valuable games between their marquee names just to bring on new talent.

There's enough room in both Hockey and Lax to accomodate more members - it just means that they'll need to have fewer OOC games or lose the second home-home games for hockey.

Not that I think this discussion will actually go anywhere - but scheduling concerns around Olympic sports won't be a factor

 

[kyleslamb]

Cincinnati actually puts up some pretty good numbers on the research front. It's a moot point though since tOSU will never let them in.

No it's a moot point because none of the conference wants Cincinnati, which was my point the first time.

Yeah, they're decent with research, but fairly or unfairly, they're perceived as a commuter school (which the Big Ten doesn't want) and they're in the existing footprint (which the Big Ten doesn't want). They're not even remotely a candidate so what Ohio State would or wouldn't want is irrelevant.

As I said, if the league were going to consider someone in the footprint, it would at least be someone like Pitt who is top-10 in total research expenditures. Cincinnati puts up decent numbers, but they ranked 14 out of 15 schools in the Big Ten in R&D in 2012. So if the league is going consider someone already in the footprint, it's going to be someone that a) better than what they have academically and/or b) better than what they have athletically.

I don't know how else to say this, but flatly, the Big Ten doesn't even remotely consider Cincinnati a candidate. They were not even included in the Big Ten's research of 20-25 possible candidates back in 2010 when they hired a firm to determine value.

 

[Adios]

I don't think the Ivy League would even care about that. They're not looking at themselves as being 'regional' entities.

Oh, and for the record, the Midwest as a whole is not declining. It's growing just like every other region in the country. The growth just isn't as rapid right now as the South or other areas.

The "growth" in the Midwest is going to be based on natural resources. Farming, mining, etc, and whatever else they can conjure up. CT and NJ used to have the worst cities in the country. Not anymore.

I know the Ivies are not regional. But the B1G is.

 

[kingdobbs]

There's enough room in both Hockey and Lax to accomodate more members - it just means that they'll need to have fewer OOC games or lose the second home-home games for hockey.

Not that I think this discussion will actually go anywhere - but scheduling concerns around Olympic sports won't be a factor

The point being...those are valuable games.

Michigan v. Minnesota is WAY more valuable to the BTN than Minnesota vs. Brown or Ohio State vs. Dartmouth.

 

[woomba]

The point being...those are valuable games.

Michigan v. Minnesota is WAY more valuable to the BTN than Minnesota vs. Brown or Ohio State vs. Dartmouth.

Michigan v. Minnesota is valuable, but the marginal benefits of playing 4x a season instead of 2x is small. The games won't go away entirely and meeting less often may actually improve the value of the remaining games.

The potential gains could outweigh the negatives...the bigger question would be the scope of the deal and what each side would get out of it. I'm still not sure how each side would benefit from the deal.

 

[Ldandy]

There is something intriguing to me about Cornell as a potential addition. Their dual status as a public/private as well as being the Land Grant University of the State of NY makes them stand out in The Ivy as something different. Academically they are probably more of a peer to NW or JH than they are to Harvard, Princeton or Yale.

While people down play it here, wrestling is HUGE in The B1G. Cornell would be a great addition and a natural rival for PSU

Hockey is obviously very important to Delany's future TV vision, and The Big Red would add another quality program and expand the conference from 6 members.

Finally Lacrosse is being groomed for the BTN, and they would be at the top with UMD and JH.

Another interesting outcome of a Cornell membership would be that CT suddenly becomes a contiguous state.

 

[UConnDan97]

There is something intriguing to me about Cornell as a potential addition. Their dual status as a public/private as well as being the Land Grant University of the State of NY makes them stand out in The Ivy as something different.

Uggh.

Will people please stop with the "Cornell to the B1G" craziness, please? Let's assume for a millisecond that the B1G had any desire to add Cornell, which they don't. Cornell would have zero desire to join the B1G. Literally zero. This is a school whose entire identity is built upon being an Ivy League school. Separating itself from Yale, Harvard, Columbia, and Princeton is essentially akin to saying, "We're not the absolute cream of the crop anymore."

Cornell is a school that has nearly a 6 billion dollar endowment (which means they couldn't give a about the B1G contract money); the vast majority of it being earned through donors who like the idea that they are "Ivy":

http://cornellsun.com/blog/2013/10/30/cornell-endowment-returns-grow-11-4-percent/

So please....PLEASE....for the love of Uyi Osunde, can we cut it out with the fantasy that is Cornell to the B1G...

 

[Rocktheworld]

Finally Lacrosse is being groomed for the BTN, and they would be at the top with UMD and JH.

Pfft

ND, UVA, Cuse, Duke, UNC > Cornell, MD and JH.

 

[kyleslamb]

The "growth" in the Midwest is going to be based on natural resources. Farming, mining, etc, and whatever else they can conjure up. CT and NJ used to have the worst cities in the country. Not anymore.

I know the Ivies are not regional. But the B1G is.

Every "league" is regional. The ACC is regional. The Big 12 is regional. The SEC is regional. They're all "regional." It doesn't mean a school with a national name is going to be suddenly degraded by being in a "regional" league.

I also don't understand your point about growth based on natural resources. You do realize that over the course of time, almost every major city/port/area has grown based on resources, right? New York City got to be big because of its access to the harbor; St. Louis because its access to the river; the Middle East got to be wealthy because of its access to oil; need I continue? Resources are a big reason for almost every area's growth, historically.

 

[whaler11]

Uggh.

Will people please stop with the "Cornell to the B1G" craziness, please? Let's assume for a millisecond that the B1G had any desire to add Cornell, which they don't. Cornell would have zero desire to join the B1G. Literally zero. This is a school whose entire identity is built upon being an Ivy League school. Separating itself from Yale, Harvard, Columbia, and Princeton is essentially akin to saying, "We're not the absolute cream of the crop anymore."

Cornell is a school that has nearly a 6 billion dollar endowment (which means they couldn't give a about the B1G contract money); the vast majority of it being earned through donors who like the idea that they are "Ivy":

http://cornellsun.com/blog/2013/10/30/cornell-endowment-returns-grow-11-4-percent/

So please....PLEASE....for the love of Uyi Osunde, can we cut it out with the fantasy that is Cornell to the B1G...

Something something something blah blah blah Uyi Osunde (like) something.

As much as I love Osunde, those interlocking UC helmets are only about 70000000x better than the current helmet. How about white helmet with the UC in blue?

I like the UC way more than the block C.

 

[whaler11]

Uggh.

Will people please stop with the "Cornell to the B1G" craziness, please? Let's assume for a millisecond that the B1G had any desire to add Cornell, which they don't. Cornell would have zero desire to join the B1G. Literally zero. This is a school whose entire identity is built upon being an Ivy League school. Separating itself from Yale, Harvard, Columbia, and Princeton is essentially akin to saying, "We're not the absolute cream of the crop anymore."

Cornell is a school that has nearly a 6 billion dollar endowment (which means they couldn't give a about the B1G contract money); the vast majority of it being earned through donors who like the idea that they are "Ivy":

http://cornellsun.com/blog/2013/10/30/cornell-endowment-returns-grow-11-4-percent/

So please....PLEASE....for the love of Uyi Osunde, can we cut it out with the fantasy that is Cornell to the B1G...

I woke up early and was browsing Twitter and overnight HFD was proposing UMass as a Big 10 partner with UConn.

It's amazing in the same day I could read something dumber than UMass to the Big 10. This Cornell nonsense may be the single dumbest rumor the internet has generated on conference realignment.

 

[noeynox]

I Liked The Interlocking U C Helmets As Well.

 

[UConnDan97]

Something something something blah blah blah Uyi Osunde (like) something.

As much as I love Osunde, those interlocking UC helmets are only about 70000000x better than the current helmet. How about white helmet with the UC in blue?

I like the UC way more than the block C.

It's funny; I first thought to myself, "I'm gonna use this 'bad ' picture of Osunde wrecking someone!" And about 3 seconds after that, I said, "Good God, that helmet looks good!" I would love for us to go back to either that or the block C. Now, queue up all of the people that are going to complain about my complaints of the new helmets...

 

[whaler11]

I know when I settle down to
watch a high level college sporting
event one of the immedate things I am concerned with understanding is if a participant is a land grant university.

Who cares what you are in 2014? What's most critical is how you were established in the 1860s.

Alabama and Michigan - - I want Kansas State and Iowa State.

 

[Stinger92860]

I was working by the WTC this week and I noticed the St Johns building on West Avenue. Could UConn open a location in NYC for MBA programs? Would that be allowed under the school charter?

 

[huskyrob1]

The Big Ten has absolutely no interest in Cincinnati. If the Big Ten were ever to relax its academic standards, it's going to do it for someone out of region who has a national profile. At least someone like Pitt is a research giant. Cincinnati is bordering on being a commuter school.

Agreed. OSU would blow up B1G headquarters if they ever added Cincinnati. For the same reasons, both OSU and Penn State would veto Pitt even being considered.