Creighton Post Game thread (merged thread)

[hoophuskee]

I do believe Caroline will be the player who gains the most from Paige's return. I'm not considering Azzi until we see her more.

We disagree on that but that's a small point.

I have to say am super-excited about CD this year and her future.

 

[Stymie]

Or the players can learn the fundamental of not traveling lol

It’s a decision that needs to fall somewhere between the strict interpretation of a rule and the overall entertainment value of the product.
Examples for me:
Total absence of enforcement, NBA has lost me.
Strict enforcement of rule(s), NFL has lost me.
Viewing the above entertainment options had become more of a chore than a pleasant diversion, so I left.
Need to strike an acceptable balance.

 

[WFFL]

It’s a decision that needs to fall somewhere between the strict interpretation of a rule and the overall entertainment value of the product.
Examples for me:
Total absence of enforcement, NBA has lost me.
Strict enforcement of rule(s), NFL has lost me.
Viewing the above entertainment options had become more of a chore than a pleasant diversion, so I left.
Need to strike an acceptable balance.

So are you saying allow more traveling for entertainment purposes ? This is division 1 college ball if you cannot learn to not travel you should not be playing at this level lol ?

 

[BBallF]

I see Dorka getting good position down low early in possession, has her man sealed, and they just don't get her the ball

That is exactly right. It's entirely about getting the ball to the big at the right time and in the right place. It's 50% of the basket.

 

[BBallF]

I like it when both Dorka and Caroline are on the floor together. They work well with each other. In any team dynamic there are the starters and then the usurpers. Both are essentially usurpers. Both are good enough to start but the team dynamic doesn't want to accept it sometimes. If you might not get PT if someone else succeeds it is a normal reaction to hesitate to pass to them. Uconn is pretty good about overcoming this but it still exists some. Newbies have to "earn" it.

I've bit my tongue all thread but no way Nika makes this team better in any way which warrants more than 15 minutes PT. She can't drive through the middle. She can't shoot that well. She struggles against good competition as she's physically over matched sometimes. We had a tougher time against full court pressure today than with other games. She gets some steals and adds enthusiasm. She gives people a breather. That's her role. If she keeps working hard she can definitely knock down some 3's and defend and that would help tremendously but her role should be 15 minutes a game ideally.

I disagree. It's not just her point defense and aggressiveness. It's her speed up the court in transition. Evina glides. Nika motors and we are a much better team in transition than in a set half court offense which Geno says "sucks". Watch her when she gets a rebound or an outlet pass. Nika moves right away.

Evina had 2 points and 6 turnovers and took 1 shot. I feel really bad for her. It's not like the bar is very high for Nika right now for PT. Evina is untapped talent right now because she needs to be a 2 not a 1. I think Nika should get 20-24 minutes when healthy and Evina can slide to the 2 at times. Geno likes Nika on the court so just watch and see.

That was the old Nika yesterday just like it was the old Leah. I firmly believe that their "bad" summers had a lot to do with their obviously regressive starts to the season.

 

[donalddoowop]

There is zero question that refs are calling traveling more now. It should be less nit picking and more basketball. It is a huge detriment to the sport to have the refs call it so carefully now

Evidently at the officials' meetings this season they were told to start cracking down on players traveling. Too many players were gaining an advantage on the defense. They are not calling it just to be calling it. If they let it go people will start complaining about the college refs not calling it like fans complain about NBA refs.

 

[Rixxx]

I think fans on the board have been a little hard on the seniors here. ONO and CW are good players. They aren't superstars but many are not. I recall a lot of criticism being thrown at Mercedes Russell for not developing at UT and many fans felt it was coaching. That was probably a factor but also rankings are imperfect and not everyone who comes through a program with talent or skill will become an AA or dominant player.

I've said for years I liked Westbrook at UT and was impressed by her then but she isn't a point guard. She wasn't one in Knoxville and isn't one now. She's played it out of necessity and injuries have no doubt impacted her development. Sadly it happens to a lot of young players.

If UConn gets back on track this year and winds up winning a NC it will be because PB comes back and wills them to it. It is certainly a possibility. Before the season started I understood the reason for the high level of optimism about the team and agreed this would be the most talented and deepest UConn team since 2001. Of course injuries have taken a huge toll but it's not as though UConn is out of the mix if people come back healthy.

Mercedes had foot issues her first two years. But it is true the coaching staff at TN, IMHO, failed at developing her. They were happy that she had a point guard's mentality on the floor. The WNBA coaching in Seattle can take credit for developing Mercedes to the point she is a rotation player and sometimes starter.

 

[TeamFirst!]

ONO is unofficially a bench player. She played 8 minutes less than the other starters, and logged the same 22 minutes as Edwards. The front court is Dorka and Ducharmes, both of whom played starter minutes against Creighton.

Ono was not optimal guarding their best 3 point shooter. That's why she didn't play a lot I bet.

 

[freshler40]

If they called it like this in the Pros, a game would take 6 hours.

Seems like some of our 3 point shooters shuffle their feet in place prior to getting off a shot. Is this a travel call? Most travel calls look like the real deal, extra steps. Sure, the pro game is different with highflying travels, entertainment value exceeds whistles.
There are a lot of things about the TV review of calls taking 4-5 minutes endless timeouts and running down the shot clocks that may dismay viewers, myself among them. With three refs now calling games it would seem that let the call stand or chat with the other refs would work better but what do I know. Great to have the teams playing again!

 

[Littlemin]

Seems like some of our 3 point shooters shuffle their feet in place prior to getting off a shot. Is this a travel call? Most travel calls look like the real deal, extra steps. Sure, the pro game is different with highflying travels, entertainment value exceeds whistles.
There are a lot of things about the TV review of calls taking 4-5 minutes endless timeouts and running down the shot clocks that may dismay viewers, myself among them. With three refs now calling games it would seem that let the call stand or chat with the other refs would work better but what do I know. Great to have the teams playing again!

Agree on the utterly ridiculous reviews at the end of games. The game clock could be off significantly by the time we get to the last two minutes because of human error but let’s spend 10 minutes to add 3/10 of a second in the last minute.
Likewise, a team could have gotten a couple of extra possessions throughout the game because of honest mistakes by refs in the first 38 minutes, but let’s spend the same 10 minutes to decide possessions in the last two minutes.
The human factor is the human factor, part of the game; if it is ok for the first 38 minutes it should be good for the whole game. Beyond stupid!!!
But technology and talking head sports shows has made a travesty of the flow of sporting events.

 

[MSSportsGuy]

Mercedes had foot issues her first two years. But it is true the coaching staff at TN, IMHO, failed at developing her. They were happy that she had a point guard's mentality on the floor. The WNBA coaching in Seattle can take credit for developing Mercedes to the point she is a rotation player and sometimes starter.

Agreed. I just remember Russell taking a lot of heat for not being in the image of a #1 player out of high school. She had foot issues and actually got better each year she was at UT even with what could be questionable coaching. I"m glad she's a solid WNBA player as you could see she had the tools.

 

[Cuango]

I like it when both Dorka and Caroline are on the floor together. They work well with each other. In any team dynamic there are the starters and then the usurpers. Both are essentially usurpers. Both are good enough to start but the team dynamic doesn't want to accept it sometimes. If you might not get PT if someone else succeeds it is a normal reaction to hesitate to pass to them. Uconn is pretty good about overcoming this but it still exists some. Newbies have to "earn" it.

I've bit my tongue all thread but no way Nika makes this team better in any way which warrants more than 15 minutes PT. She can't drive through the middle. She can't shoot that well. She struggles against good competition as she's physically over matched sometimes. We had a tougher time against full court pressure today than with other games. She gets some steals and adds enthusiasm. She gives people a breather. That's her role. If she keeps working hard she can definitely knock down some 3's and defend and that would help tremendously but her role should be 15 minutes a game ideally.

I have to agree (at least partially) about Nika. Her value/skill set has been overrated since she came. She’s tough, scrappy, and at her best) is a good relief pg for this team. Put it this way, does anyone think she will she the primary b/u to Paige mid January on next season? Barring further unfortunate circumstances K Arnold will be taking that spot. I think she can be effective as a spot reliever but doubt she’ll ever be the player some have described here. Toughness and attitude are all very well, but talent (assuming no other issues) will always out! Next year we’ll have PB, , CD, KA. as guards. Which one of those could Nika possibly beat out? Sure, it will take a couple of months for KA to settle in but after that it’s hard to see where her minutes are going to come from beyond spot relief duties and/or injuries.

 

[HuskyNan]

Found it strange and ominous that DeBerry and Gabriel were kept out of the game for reasons that included "unspecified" reasons not related to injuries. What's up with that? Attitude problems? "violation of team rules" is something that never happens at UConn. So the cryptic nature of the reasons for not playing them is troubling.

Amari is coming back from an injury or illness. She’s expected to play in the next gamne

 

[eebmg]

I have to agree (at least partially) about Nika. Her value/skill set has been overrated since she came. She’s tough, scrappy, and at her best) is a good relief pg for this team. Put it this way, does anyone think she will she the primary b/u to Paige mid January on next season? Barring further unfortunate circumstances K Arnold will be taking that spot. I think she can be effective as a spot reliever but doubt she’ll ever be the player some have described here. Toughness and attitude are all very well, but talent (assuming no other issues) will always out! Next year we’ll have PB, , CD, KA. as guards. Which one of those could Nika possibly beat out? Sure, it will take a couple of months for KA to settle in but after that it’s hard to see where her minutes are going to come from beyond spot relief duties and/or injuries.

KA is the year after Ice and Ayanna.

 

[donalddoowop]

I have to agree (at least partially) about Nika. Her value/skill set has been overrated since she came. She’s tough, scrappy, and at her best) is a good relief pg for this team. Put it this way, does anyone think she will she the primary b/u to Paige mid January on next season? Barring further unfortunate circumstances K Arnold will be taking that spot. I think she can be effective as a spot reliever but doubt she’ll ever be the player some have described here. Toughness and attitude are all very well, but talent (assuming no other issues) will always out! Next year we’ll have PB, , CD, KA. as guards. Which one of those could Nika possibly beat out? Sure, it will take a couple of months for KA to settle in but after that it’s hard to see where her minutes are going to come from beyond spot relief duties and/or injuries.

Without one second you have Arnold beating out a three-year player. That is what so many BY posters do with players before they get to Storrs. So, what happens when it takes her two or more years to develop into the kind of player you think she already is? It happened with Walker and now Wiliams and some people got upset at those two because they did not meet their own expectations. You seem pretty sure Muhl won't improve much, and Arnold will be very good from the start. We shall see.

 

[Cuango]

Why do you think they were overrated? Fans trusting the ratings as an absolute predictor is where the mistake lies. Players peak at different times, and it is a huge jump in competition from HS to D1. Williams and Ono are good players at this level, not dominant or great, but good.
IMO, from afar, I believe Westbrook’s career has been sabotaged to a large degree by injuries. I could be wrong but I believe she is currently playing hurt.
That is why I am cautious to people predicting how good Fudd is going to be. Not playing because of injuries, especially ones to the legs for extended times, can take its toll, both physically and mentally.
There are many factors that go into performing at this level and fans are very rarely (read, never) privy to all those things. While everyone can see this one, one example I will give is for my absolute favorite player on this team. IMO, if Muhl does not learn to channel her emotion and energy positively she is not going to have nearly the career she is capable of having.
To a degree, I root for and speak of Muhl from personal experience, I was a very similar player, a talented, pass and defense oriented aggressive and HOTHEADED point guard that could not really stay on the court through my junior year of HS. Luckily I had an older player from my town who played at Canisuis and in the ABA that convinced me in the summer between my junior and senior years that I was the problem, not the refs or coaches, and I had a really good senior season and a decent career at the NAIA level in college.
But my real point, players are human beings, not robots, with a myriad of factors affecting basketball development and performance; this notion that they have to perform at levels defined by subjective ratings at an entirely different level of competition or be deemed failures is just silly.

Agree that the ratings are very suspect and not to be trusted. However, my main point is not that they were overrated by the rating services (although they were) but rather that CW in particular was one of Geno’s rare misses. I believe ONO was a bit of a fallback after Collier decommited after some kind of disaster in her home state. Now Collier turned out to be a bit underwhelming at Texas but who knows what she could have been under Geno’s tutelage? However, CW has clearly turned out to be a pivotal miss on Geno’s part. She’s been a solid, loyal, likable, decent player for us but has definitely not played at the level you would expect from the number one player in the country!
To be fair, she was the clear best guard that year in a class that was largely dominated at the top by post/forward/wings. I don’t consider her a failure at all! I’ve never once felt that she or ONO were not trying to play their best. For my money, that’s all we can expect.

KA is the year after Ice and Ayanna.

My bad! How embarrassing!
In the immortal words of Rosanne Rosanna-danna; Never mind!!!

 

[TeamFirst!]

We want Nika and she has value. We are just saying ideally she is a back up. Maybe if she works hard and can knock down some 3 pointers she gets more PT. We want her to succeed to the nth level. Some of us ( at least ) don't see her as a primary solution. We are going to really need her next year unless something changes as we will lose both Christin and Evina. We should have signed a guard for next year. Maybe we counted on Kiki and lost. Maybe we counted on Mir and Saylor and it didn't work out. Now we will be guard challenged next year if anyone gets hurt. No doubt we need Nika and probably at least one portal transfer at guard hopefully.

 

[Stymie]

So are you saying allow more traveling for entertainment purposes ? This is division 1 college ball if you cannot learn to not travel you should not be playing at this level lol ?

I’m not saying anything other that they’d better be careful.
Do you ‘enjoy’ a 4-5 minute delay in the game to determine who last touched an out of bounds deflection?
4-5 minutes reviewing fouls?
Need to be careful not to make games unwatchable.
Do you enjoy NBA Games?
Where you can basically walk to the corner Deli and not get called?
I don’t, but a lot of fans do.
Just don’t screw up the product, that’s all.

 

[drweo]

Ono was not optimal guarding their best 3 point shooter. That's why she didn't play a lot I bet.

But why wasnt she in the game towards the end when Creighton was pressing and UConn was having taking the ball out? A high toss to the tallest player would have been really helpful....

 

[Javafan]

Seems like some of our 3 point shooters shuffle their feet in place prior to getting off a shot. Is this a travel call? Most travel calls look like the real deal, extra steps. Sure, the pro game is different with highflying travels, entertainment value exceeds whistles.
There are a lot of things about the TV review of calls taking 4-5 minutes endless timeouts and running down the shot clocks that may dismay viewers, myself among them. With three refs now calling games it would seem that let the call stand or chat with the other refs would work better but what do I know. Great to have the teams playing again!

Agree ! Cut down the nit-picking travel call !

 

[MD#12Fan]

It’s a decision that needs to fall somewhere between the strict interpretation of a rule and the overall entertainment value of the product.
Examples for me:
Total absence of enforcement, NBA has lost me.
Strict enforcement of rule(s), NFL has lost me.
Viewing the above entertainment options had become more of a chore than a pleasant diversion, so I left.
Need to strike an acceptable balance.

Yes, it's an interesting subject- rules. I think it all comes down to fairness. Does the step give the offensive player an unfair advantage. I say yes it does.
I think an example of rules being changed for the better is holding in the NFL. I think they've cleaned up a lot of those problems. I wish they could do the same with PI. I think they could allow DB's to use their arms as long as they are not extended, therefore no grabbing. My college hoops coach taught us to use "the hook" which is your arm not extended.
Note: NBA has cleaned up traveling to a degree.

 

[BobbyJ]

Agree that the ratings are very suspect and not to be trusted. However, my main point is not that they were overrated by the rating services (although they were) but rather that CW in particular was one of Geno’s rare misses. I believe ONO was a bit of a fallback after Collier decommited after some kind of disaster in her home state. Now Collier turned out to be a bit underwhelming at Texas but who knows what she could have been under Geno’s tutelage? However, CW has clearly turned out to be a pivotal miss on Geno’s part. She’s been a solid, loyal, likable, decent player for us but has definitely not played at the level you would expect from the number one player in the country!
To be fair, she was the clear best guard that year in a class that was largely dominated at the top by post/forward/wings. I don’t consider her a failure at all! I’ve never once felt that she or ONO were not trying to play their best. For my money, that’s all we can expect.

My bad! How embarrassing!
In the immortal words of Rosanne Rosanna-danna; Never mind!!!

I'm one of the most critical here on HS rankings and can't remember ever defending Auriemma on any point. But on CW's recruitment I'll give him a pass. I think he got what he could. My reasons are 1) This turned out to be a small class probably because a couple of presumed targets decided to go elsewhere. 2) It wasn't a banner year for non PGs volume wise that would be considered top 50 talents. 3) In hindsight there were 4 guards that I consider to have become impact type players from that class besides CW. Lexie Hull at Stanford, Joens at Iowa St., Howard at Kentucky, and Berger at Indiana. IMO, whether he recruited them or not, I don't believe the latter 3 were going to leave the area of the country where they wound up. And with Hull, as we saw with Haley Jones, it's very difficult to get a kid who has a Stanford offer. So again, I think GA got who he could considering there really weren't any better options. I don't consider it a miss when a kid chooses to go to another school. You can't put a gun to their head to get them. All these top programs do everything they can under the rules to recruit them and that's the best they can do.

 

[FairView]

Have you ever seen seniors dramatically improve during the season? Doesn’t often happen.

I don't think it's about improving as much as it is doing what they have done in the past.

 

[MD#12Fan]

I'm one of the most critical here on HS rankings and can't remember ever defending Auriemma on any point. But on CW's recruitment I'll give him a pass. I think he got what he could. My reasons are 1) This turned out to be a small class probably because a couple of presumed targets decided to go elsewhere. 2) It wasn't a banner year for non PGs volume wise that would be considered top 50 talents. 3) In hindsight there were 4 guards that I consider to have become impact type players from that class besides CW. Lexie Hull at Stanford, Joens at Iowa St., Howard at Kentucky, and Berger at Indiana. IMO, whether he recruited them or not, I don't believe the latter 3 were going to leave the area of the country where they wound up. And with Hull, as we saw with Haley Jones, it's very difficult to get a kid who has a Stanford offer. So again, I think GA got who he could considering there really weren't any better options. I don't consider it a miss when a kid chooses to go to another school. You can't put a gun to their head to get them. All these top programs do everything they can under the rules to recruit them and that's the best they can do.

Excellent post!
Wasn't CW the #1 recruit in the country? I still say, when you see a star, you know it. Maybe I'm naive. I watch a lot of sports though.
How about any of those 2nd tier recruits that Geno mentioned in the presser from that class?

 

[Longtime fan]

Overall some very welcome sights. Muhl back with some terrific energy when she first came in and nice seeing Edwards going strong to the basket. Too many unforced turnovers by UCONN between lackadaisical passes and travels that stopped momentum or prevented baskets.

At halftime, Geno was pleased with the defense, but frustrated with the offense. “Our guard play sucked – there’s no other word for it”. Can’t argue with that.

I found it amazing in the first half how Creighton was able to shake the defender for nice bank shots off the backboard. It almost seemed like they were “lucky” shots, but so many went in that I can’t attribute it to that. On the other hand, Creighton packed it in knowing our 3-point shooting is suspect and really harassed anyone who got the ball near the hoop.

The announcers said the Creighton coach planned to wear UCONN down with their depth and our lack of depth and figured they could keep it close and make a run in the 4th quarter. Q’w 2 and 3 were close, but we built the lead up to 17 in Q4 and held on as Creighton made their run. 5 minute FG drought did not help.

Dorka – Continued her strong play. I wonder if the “boo-birds” who said early on “All B10 team? How is that possible?”. Love her aggressiveness, she’s athletic, and can cover the perimeter as well as the post.

Aaliyah – is it possible that the Aaliyah that we saw last season who showed so much promise is back? Very active on defense, and in spite of a few TO’s and missed shots, was really strong going to the basket. Loved her steal and drive to the basket in the 1st quarter.

Caroline – should not be taking 3 point shots from way out – when she’s closer in, better change of making the basket. Having said that, very little she did to complain about. Moves her feet well on defense, blocks without fouling, and can score from everywhere on the floor. Probably the best player on the floor today.

Olivia – not a lot of scoring, but really solid on the defense. She’s athletic and able to (for the most part) get out on the perimeter and cover Creighton – who does not have a lot of inside play, but has a lot of shooters.

Nika – unfortunately picked up 3 fouls in the 1st half, but here energy and ball control seemed better than the other 2 guards. I felt more comfortable watching her run the point than Evina or Christyn. Her energy seems to be back to where it was last season which helps me understand how her foot injury impacted her play early this season. So glad to see her back. Wish she had knocked down 1 of those 3’s, but 1st game back – happy to see!

Christyn – Another unsurprising sub-par game. As Geno said at halftime “our guard play sucks”. Poor decision making, poor passing, I fear that the CW that we saw the final month of last season is gone for good. The new hairdo did nothing to improve her game. Sadly with all the injuries, we have no other options. And I say that knowing full well she scored double figures and grabbed 5 rebounds. She did have that nice spurt in Q4. But she seems to drive to the basket and then contort her body to avoid being fouled. Not sure why she has never leaned into fouls like so many ND guards have done over the years.

Evina - not sure what is going on with her but even if Paige is playing, 1 shot in a game is not good. Lazy passes, failing to box out her player when she takes a shot, sort of mystifying play from a 5th year senior on a team that needs her to be "more".

Really good summary. A few comments; Everyone wonders what happened to Evina? Her first two touches were unforced errors
(turnovers ). She did not have her game on at all. Maybe she had a bout with Covid and was not yet 100% ( pure speculation ). I still believe we have reason to be concerned about foul shooting. It was pretty poor. As for Caroline shooting threes, I notice that when she has time to set herself, she is deadly accurate. When she rushes the shot, it is off a bit. Part of the offense needs to be structured to give her more open shots ( we are talking split seconds here). Anyone know why DeBerry was "ineligible" yesterday? Is she injured?