Best program in the NNNBE | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Best program in the NNNBE

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whaler11 said:
You only judge their quality on NCAA tournament games. I look at the bigger picture - really Florida Gulf Coast had a fun run, but their two wins is worth more than 15 years of quality teams? Davidson had one sublime player - good for them, but he left and they disappeared back into the ether. Seriously Cleveland State and Loyola Marymount? Are there two better examples of flashes in the pan - from 25 years ago?

Yeah they aren't as good as Xavier, Butler and Gonzaga. Neither are 75% of the Big 12, ACC and SEC.
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What I'm saying is that even flashes in the pan have had more tournament success!!!!
 
Creighton's a good program - like most mid-majors, they don't have a hell of a lot of NCAA tournament success, but they have won games and generally showed they belonged, even when they lost. Their attendance is great and they've had two truly great players over the past decade or so.

But they ain't the best 'program' in the new Big East. (Not the worst, either.)
 
whaler11 said:
Since upstater loves to slander them, I figured I'd share a picture of Creighton's arena tonight.

View attachment 4849
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Where and what is "Creighton"? Is that some school that we start hearing about in Feb/Mar and then promptly forget about for the rest of the year?
 
ZooCougar said:
Where and what is "Creighton"? Is that some school that we start hearing about in Feb/Mar and then promptly forget about for the rest of the year?
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You've only used that joke a half dozen times. Very funny for someone who has lived in Kansas City - it's so far from Omaha.

Since you are a fan at watching human chemistry projects ride bicycles I'd be careful throwing rocks.
 
Fishy said:
Creighton's a good program - like most mid-majors, they don't have a hell of a lot of NCAA tournament success, but they have won games and generally showed they belonged, even when they lost. Their attendance is great and they've had two truly great players over the past decade or so.

But they ain't the best 'program' in the new Big East. (Not the worst, either.)
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I don't really think they are the best program in the latest Big East - but I wouldn't be shocked if they were in a decade.
 
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noeynox said:
I'm probably being too much of a homer, but I think UConn's ratings on FS1 would be better, much better than what the Big East is delivering. If it was only the channel they are on, the ratings would suck for their UFC, Big12, and PAC 12 content as well. Those other leagues have provided at least decent ratings on occassion from what I've seen.
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Their ratings suck pretty much for everything but UFC. I imagine UConn would would be above their averages - since just the Connecticut audience alone would be higher than what they get.
 
upstater said:
What I'm saying is that even flashes in the pan have had more tournament success!!!!
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Well that is why they are flashes in the pan, so by definition that's true. Would you like the list of hundreds of schools who haven't won 4 NCAA games in the last 15 years?
 
Creighton, Gonzaga and their ilk are one month darlings....nationally, folks only watch and care about them in the month of March.

Everyone loves an underdog...but as soon as their warm up act is done..it's over for them. The momentary spotlight on the third ring moves to the center ring and their act as introductory entertainment is forgotten as the main show begins.
 
billybud said:
Creighton, Gonzaga and their ilk are one month darlings....nationally, folks only watch and care about them in the month of March.

Everyone loves an underdog...but as soon as their warm up act is done..it's over for them. The momentary spotlight on the third ring moves to the center ring and their act as introductory entertainment is forgotten as the main show begins.
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Gonzaga gets more ink and more attention in one season than FSU basketball gets in a decade.
 
whaler11 said:
You've only used that joke a half dozen times. Very funny for someone who has lived in Kansas City - it's so far from Omaha.

Since you are a fan at watching human chemistry projects ride bicycles I'd be careful throwing rocks.
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Every player in the NFL is a human chemistry project. You should be careful about throwing rocks.
 
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billybud said:
Creighton, Gonzaga and their ilk are one month darlings....nationally, folks only watch and care about them in the month of March.

Everyone loves an underdog...but as soon as their warm up act is done..it's over for them. The momentary spotlight on the third ring moves to the center ring and their act as introductory entertainment is forgotten as the main show begins.
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Exactly. Nobody gives a crap. Except for the people that live wherever "Creighton" is.
 
Fishy said:
Or people who, you know, watch college basketball.
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I think that people who watch college basketball care far more about the big ticket programs. "Creighton" is a local thing.
 
whaler11 said:
Well that is why they are flashes in the pan, so by definition that's true. Would you like the list of hundreds of schools who haven't won 4 NCAA games in the last 15 years?
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What is the point of this question? Are you saying Creighton is in some middle ground? Yes, I agree. They aren't as bad as North Dakota, but they haven't done what the top say 10-15 mid-majors have done in the tourney the last 40 years. The thing that bugs me about Creighton is that when they were in the MVC, they were highly ranked nationally for many years. And it never amounted to anything. Gonzaga and Butler at least put a run together. VCU and Wichita St. too. Even Xavier. Come on.
 
upstater said:
What is the point of this question? Are you saying Creighton is in some middle ground? Yes, I agree. They aren't as bad as North Dakota, but they haven't done what the top say 10-15 mid-majors have done in the tourney the last 40 years. The thing that bugs me about Creighton is that when they were in the MVC, they were highly ranked nationally for many years. And it never amounted to anything. Gonzaga and Butler at least put a run together. VCU and Wichita St. too. Even Xavier. Come on.
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I love how you keep bringing it back to 40 years. That's what someone would do to disparage UConn's success.

You are insanely stupid on this topic and have some weird Creighton grudge that doesn't allow you to be reasonable.

I'd ask you to name 10 mid majors who were better over the last 15 years but you'd list idiocy like FGCU.

You are angry about rankings? They got one seed over 8 in 15 years. If anything they were underseeded and got screwed - not your bizarre impression that they have underperformed their 'ranking'.
 
whaler11 said:
Yes sorry Cincinnati. Comparing the basketball they will be very even I think in the long run. From a which games would I rather watch, if UConn wasn't in the AAC I'd ignore it - outside of Cincinnati there isn't anyone I could even pretend to be interested in. Yes, I have an odd hatred of Memphis - I've always hated them back to the Memphis State days.
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That's funny because without Uconn, Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville who really gives a sh *t about the Big East?
 
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Vuce said:
That's funny because without Uconn, Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville who really gives a about the Big East?
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Ding.
 
whaler11 said:
I love how you keep bringing it back to 40 years. That's what someone would do to disparage UConn's success.

You are insanely stupid on this topic and have some weird Creighton grudge that doesn't allow you to be reasonable.

I'd ask you to name 10 mid majors who were better over the last 15 years but you'd list idiocy like FGCU.

You are angry about rankings? They got one seed over 8 in 15 years. If anything they were underseeded and got screwed - not your bizarre impression that they have underperformed their 'ranking'.
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40/30/20/10/5 it's all the same. Out in the first weekend.
 
The BE is really dying right now.

Ain't gonna sell out its conference tourney.

And people are gasping at Georgetown's performance. Have you visited HoyaTalk lately?

Talk of UConn in the AAC and our CR disaster would be considered uplifting in comparison.
 
ZooCougar said:
Every player in the NFL is a human chemistry project. You should be careful about throwing rocks.
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I'm not really an NFL fan... But sorry I should have stressed bicycle over chemistry for maximum disdain.
 
Vuce said:
That's funny because without Uconn, Syracuse, Pitt and Louisville who really gives a sh *t about the Big East?
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Not many for sure. Yet their
TV rights for just basketball are 2.5 times the AAC rights for football, basketball and UConn women's basketball....
 
whaler11 said:
I'm not really an NFL fan... But sorry I should have stressed bicycle over chemistry for maximum disdain.
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Your disdain means incredibly little to me. But whatever sport you are a fan of, the athletes are probably juicing.
 
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billybud said:
Creighton, Gonzaga and their ilk are one month darlings....nationally, folks only watch and care about them in the month of March.

Everyone loves an underdog...but as soon as their warm up act is done..it's over for them. The momentary spotlight on the third ring moves to the center ring and their act as introductory entertainment is forgotten as the main show begins.
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Three "warm-up" acts have played in the past four Final Fours whereas only one ACC team has. . .
 
ZooCougar said:
Your disdain means incredibly little to me. But whatever sport you are a fan of, the athletes are probably juicing.
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The last thing I need to read is Boneyard pontificating on PEDs. I really am only a fan of college football and basketball but I imagine you are right a ton of them are juicing. I care about as much as I do about their academic commitment.
 
whaler11 said:
Not many for sure. Yet their
TV rights for just basketball are 2.5 times the AAC rights for football, basketball and UConn women's basketball....
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That's a totally different discussion. We got totally screwed by the terms of the previous contract and a low ball bid.
 
ZooCougar said:
Your disdain means incredibly little to me. But whatever sport you are a fan of, the athletes are probably juicing.
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You really don't get the irony of being a cycling fan and mocking
'Creighton' though do you? It
seems so obvious it would be hard
to miss.
 
Vuce said:
That's a totally different discussion. We got totally screwed by the terms of the previous contract and a low ball bid.
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It's really not a different discussion. You don't think anyone cares about
the Big East but the market says the Big East is a much more valuable television property. The contract should have led to overbidding if the product had value.
 
whaler11 said:
I love how you keep bringing it back to 40 years. That's what someone would do to disparage UConn's success.

You are insanely stupid on this topic and have some weird Creighton grudge that doesn't allow you to be reasonable.

I'd ask you to name 10 mid majors who were better over the last 15 years but you'd list idiocy like FGCU.

You are angry about rankings? They got one seed over 8 in 15 years. If anything they were underseeded and got screwed - not your bizarre impression that they have underperformed their 'ranking'.
Expand ...

I think that Creighton is generally better than upstater is giving them credit for...and I'm not sure it's wise to go solely on whether some team has gotten out of the first weekend. Pretending to not know who they are is also silly. If you love basketball, they've been around a long time.

But here's the thing about the MVC: it isn't a terrible conference. They have had many years with multiple bids. And they've had many S16 teams.

1994: Southern Illinois and Tulsa had bids, with Tulsa in the Sweet 16.
1995: Southern Illinois and Tulas - Tulsa in the S16
1996: Bradley and Tulsa
1997: Illinois State
1998: Illinois State
1999: Creighton, Evansville, Missouri State - Missouri State in the Sweet 16 (then Southwest Missouri State)
2000: Creighton, Indiana State
2001: Indiana State, Creighton
2002: Southern Illinois, Creighton - Southern Illinois in Sweet 16
2003: Creighton, Southern Illinois
2004: Southern Illinois, Northern Iowa
2005: Southern Illinois, Creighton, Northern Iowa
2006: Southern Illinois, Bradley, Witchita State, Northern Iowa - Bradley, Witchita State in Sweet 16
2007: Creighton, Southern Illinois - Southern Illinois in Sweet 16
2008: Drake
2009: Northern Iowa
2010: Northern Iowa - Northern Iowa in Sweet 16
2011: Indiana State
2012: Creighton, Witchita State
2013: Witchita State, Creighton - Witchita State in Sweet 16 (FF)

So, over 20 years, the MVC sent six different schools to the Sweet 16 nine times the conference averages a Sweet 16 team almost once every other year. And, over that time there have been 11 different schools in the conference, so over 50% of MVC schools have been to the S16 in the last 20 years. If Creighton is supposedly their best program, shouldn't they have been there once?

And sure, their seeding hasn't always been the best. A preponderance of 7-10 seeds, and those are hard to overcome. But Even a school like Drake got a 5 seed one year. Witchita State and Southern Illinois, as well, got into a top 5 seed. Which means that Creighton's in-season success has not bee enough to justify a higher seed.
 
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