Asia Durr Narrows list; topic morph circa p. 4 to Tennessee's status/outlook

[Buzzyboy]

I think she has done a fantastic job of recruiting top players and is setting Tennessee up to have all the tools to be a title contender again. This is why Tennessee fans are so optimistic for their team. The big concern is her in game coaching and her ability to develop a team that will play cohesive and execute at a high level. And that is why Tennessee fans are a bit scared that she may be another Coach P....someone who can land all the big name recruits but can't sniff a Final Four.

And I don't see her job being in jeopardy anytime soon, just like how Coach P's job isn't in jeopardy even though many women's college basketball fans (and Duke fans) feel that she has been a disappointment and Duke would be better with a different coach. If Holly doesn't deliver Final Fours in the next 3 years, she'll still have her job but UT fans wont be satisfied having her lead Tennessee.

I think there is so much truth in your remarks. It's really good that she's getting talent but it's what you do with that talent in the long term that makes all the difference. Duke has had an exceptional amount of talent over the years but they continue to fall short of expectations year after year. Can that be the story of the Lady Vols over the next ...... years?

 

[Buzzyboy]

Notre Dame, Connecticut and Stanford have done an exceptional job developing talent and helping players reach their potential. I'll admit Tennessee the last several years has not done as good of a job, but to say Tennessee seldom develops talent is just wrong. Look at Isabelle Harrison and her transformation from a mediocre freshman to one of the nation's top post players. Besides her, off the top of my head I can name Nicky Anosike, Candace Parker, Glory Johnson, Shekinna Stricklen, Sidney Spencer, And Shanna Zolman as players in the last decade who improved immensely throughout their career at Tennessee. Even Ariel Massengale lead improved significantly over her time at UT and still has a year left. The recent track record of player development does not match UCONN's, I'm not arguing that. But Tennessee does develop talent better than the majority of schools in the nation.

 

[msf22b]

Not in the Maya mold or she would be going to UCONN where she could have the opportunity to be the best player she can be. Maya didn't throw away the opportunity to win national titles, Asia has.

Too strong for me

 

[Beemer]

Somewhat OT but since we're talking about Tennessee- question for Lady Vol fans- how is Pat Summitt doing these days? Don't hear/see much about her up here in CT. I hope she's at least holding her own against the dementia.

 

[LadyVols9]

Somewhat OT but since we're talking about Tennessee- question for Lady Vol fans- how is Pat Summitt doing these days? Don't hear/see much about her up here in CT. I hope she's at least holding her own against the dementia.

apparently, she is doing well. she had a knee surgery to deal with over the summer. she still comes to the arena and some practices. the players often post comments about her. it's very strange that she is not the coach, but i think the fans and players are getting used to it...slowly but surely....

 

[LadyVols9]

I think there is so much truth in your remarks. It's really good that she's getting talent but it's what you do with that talent in the long term that makes all the difference. Duke has had an exceptional amount of talent over the years but they continue to fall short of expectations year after year. Can that be the story of the Lady Vols over the next . years?

i sure hope we don't end up being like Duke. yikes. now there's a talent wasteland....but you are right. holly has to meet expectations. period. end of story.

 

[LadyVols9]

Yes LV9 the talent is there indeed..... need to kick sum ass..... just my opinion, I think TN has given her plenty of time already..... it will be interesting to see how she stacks up against the up-and-comers USC and other possibles down your way. would have loved..... for your sake to c u make last April's FF in Nashville..... let this coming year be your year..... if not, well, we all know that the KVille bunch is not a patient group

and maybe Mercedes' feets will be good.... and you will have some good fortune on the injury front.....

i always enjoy your comments to me and others. thanks for the back and forth.

 

[Bayareahusky]

Likewise LV9 ..... always interested to know what the rest of WCBB is thinking...... thx for your comments

 

[BlueDevils]

i sure hope we don't end up being like Duke. yikes. now there's a talent wasteland....but you are right. holly has to meet expectations. period. end of story.

I'm curious. Whats the difference between Duke and Tenneesee the past five years? We actually play Uconn?

 

[Bayareahusky]

Yes, BlueDevils, credit where credit is due, you do indeed play us..... but I am afraid Duke will be wearing the tag of non-winner until it wins something big..... if not the NCAAs something significant on the way to that..... perhaps upset a higher seed on the way to the FF...... Tennessee has a lot to hang its collective hat on over the years, though to your point, i think, in the last 5 years not much of a roar has been eminating from KVille.

 

[meyers7]

I'm curious. Whats the difference between Duke and Tenneesee the past five years? We actually play Uconn?

Tennessee has a lot to hang its collective hat on over the years, though to your point, i think, in the last 5 years not much of a roar has been eminating from KVille.

This being the "doggy" days of August, heard this from a little "bird(dog)".

Duke 150-26, 4 regular season ACC championships, 3 ACC tourney championships, 4 elite eight, 1 round of 32.

Tennessee, 149-29, 3 regular season SEC championships, 4 SEC tourney championships, 3 elite eight and 2 Sweet Sixteen.

Incredibly even between the two programs the last five years.

 

[JS]

Incredibly even between the two programs the last five years.

Which brings us to the point implied, I think, by Blue Devils: The biggest difference in perceptions of the two teams' success over that period is likely the humiliations Duke endured at the hands of UConn -- especially at home and while highly ranked -- which humiliations Tennessee was spared.

 

[Bayareahusky]

meyers7 - Yes, I know the intent of your post here is to manifest the head-to-head equality of Duke and TN over this time period..... but I feel compelled to put forth an opinion, and I believe one which may be in the minority of popular thought...... I believe the only good measuring stick in WCBB is national championships..... I say this not because we have some in our hip pocket, but because of strength of competition..... in the men's game, I would applaud conference championships and conf. tournament championships..... particularly in the competitive conferences..... but in WCBB, the competitive quotient is still quite soft...... it just isn't impressive to me if a team is ranked #10 in the country..... or makes the Elite 8..... I think (understanding this is again a minority opinion perhaps) that making the fianl 4 in WCBB shouldn't be that difficult if in fact you have a good team worthy of contending for the WCBB title..... I mean, look at some of the pretenders to get to the FF the last several years..... I mean look at Maryland last year..... I think they were an embarrassment to our game ...... the way they played against ND in the semis..... they didnt want to compete in that game..... they let them score at will.... while the announcers heaped praise on Wright and the other Achonwa fill-in for ND, MD just gave the game to them..... I wish WCBB had been better represented in this regard,..... before I get too scattered here replete with isolated thoughts.... at least Gary Blair won when he got there.... at least Kim backed up her claim of a talented team with a 40-0 record, if only for one year in the BG era......

If I am Duke or I am TN, I would not use conference championships as a measuring stick..... it means virtually nothing..... I will allow that making the FF means something, though not much more than a conf chmpnshp in my way of thinking..... maybe that is an acceptable measuring stick, but look where it has gotten ND and Stanford...... the only thing that matters is how you do when you hit the big stage...... you play for the opportunity, AND THEN you muct be ready to seize the moment when that opportunity presents itself. The NCAA title, it simply is all that matters.

 

[Beemer]

apparently, she is doing well. she had a knee surgery to deal with over the summer. she still comes to the arena and some practices. the players often post comments about her. it's very strange that she is not the coach, but i think the fans and players are getting used to it...slowly but surely....

That is good to hear

 

[Bayareahusky]

Yes, Nan, good point.... and I give Coach P great credit for wanting to play the "big dogs"...... how do you know how good you are unless you constantly are testing yourself and taking an ongoing temperature of your program...... I sincerely hope for the sake of Coach P and her program that she has some success, though of course certainly not at our expense...... I think she is well intentioned and has a good vision..... walking it through by implementation has been difficult, yes, but she deserves something good to happen in Durham for her good efforts.

 

[connboy77]

Which brings us to the point implied, I think, by Blue Devils: The biggest difference in perceptions of the two teams' success over that period is likely the humiliations Duke endured at the hands of UConn -- especially at home and while highly ranked -- which humiliations Tennessee was spared.

I give Duke all the credit in the world for having the guts to play UCONN.

 

[meyers7]

Which brings us to the point implied, I think, by Blue Devils: The biggest difference in perceptions of the two teams' success over that period is likely the humiliations Duke endured at the hands of UConn -- especially at home and while highly ranked -- which humiliations Tennessee was spared.

Well I believe being a LadyLikes fan is pretty humiliating in and of itself.

 

[meyers7]

meyers7 - Yes, I know the intent of your post here is to manifest the head-to-head equality of Duke and TN over this time period..... but I feel compelled to put forth an opinion, and I believe one which may be in the minority of popular thought. I believe the only good measuring stick in WCBB is national championships..... I say this not because we have some in our hip pocket, but because of strength of competition..... in the men's game, I would applaud conference championships and conf. tournament championships..... particularly in the competitive conferences..... but in WCBB, the competitive quotient is still quite soft. it just isn't impressive to me if a team is ranked #10 in the country..... or makes the Elite 8..... I think (understanding this is again a minority opinion perhaps) that making the fianl 4 in WCBB shouldn't be that difficult if in fact you have a good team worthy of contending for the WCBB title..... I mean, look at some of the pretenders to get to the FF the last several years..... I mean look at Maryland last year..... I think they were an embarrassment to our game . the way they played against ND in the semis..... they didnt want to compete in that game..... they let them score at will.... while the announcers heaped praise on Wright and the other Achonwa fill-in for ND, MD just gave the game to them..... I wish WCBB had been better represented in this regard,..... before I get too scattered here replete with isolated thoughts.... at least Gary Blair won when he got there.... at least Kim backed up her claim of a talented team with a 40-0 record, if only for one year in the BG era.

If I am Duke or I am TN, I would not use conference championships as a measuring stick..... it means virtually nothing..... I will allow that making the FF means something, though not much more than a conf chmpnshp in my way of thinking..... maybe that is an acceptable measuring stick, but look where it has gotten ND and Stanford. the only thing that matters is how you do when you hit the big stage. you play for the opportunity, AND THEN you muct be ready to seize the moment when that opportunity presents itself. The NCAA title, it simply is all that matters.

ummm ok, then they both have "0". So they are still both pretty even over the past 5 years.

 

[Bayareahusky]

Oh meyers7, you make it SO DAMN HARD to disagree with you!!!

Facts are stubborn things ain't they?

 

[j66kicker]

I'm curious. Whats the difference between Duke and Tenneesee the past five years? We actually play Uconn?

I looked to see what their head-to-head record was over last 5 years and couldn't find where Duke and TN even played each other since 2008-9 (regular season, Duke won 62-54 in Knoxville)

 

[JoePgh]

BayAreaHusky, would you not agree that it is nearly self-evident that Notre Dame and Stanford (and probably Baylor), for the past 5-6 years, have been truly excellent WCBB programs, occupying a place on the mountain well above Duke, Tennessee, Maryland, A&M, and several other colleges in the "pretty good" territory?

Saying that NC's are the only thing the matter, especially at this moment in history, is like saying that every golfer in Tiger Woods's prime was mediocre because they couldn't compete with him.

 

[bballnut90]

meyers7 - Yes, I know the intent of your post here is to manifest the head-to-head equality of Duke and TN over this time period..... but I feel compelled to put forth an opinion, and I believe one which may be in the minority of popular thought. I believe the only good measuring stick in WCBB is national championships..... I say this not because we have some in our hip pocket, but because of strength of competition..... in the men's game, I would applaud conference championships and conf. tournament championships..... particularly in the competitive conferences..... but in WCBB, the competitive quotient is still quite soft. it just isn't impressive to me if a team is ranked #10 in the country..... or makes the Elite 8..... I think (understanding this is again a minority opinion perhaps) that making the fianl 4 in WCBB shouldn't be that difficult if in fact you have a good team worthy of contending for the WCBB title..... I mean, look at some of the pretenders to get to the FF the last several years..... I mean look at Maryland last year..... I think they were an embarrassment to our game . the way they played against ND in the semis..... they didnt want to compete in that game..... they let them score at will.... while the announcers heaped praise on Wright and the other Achonwa fill-in for ND, MD just gave the game to them..... I wish WCBB had been better represented in this regard,..... before I get too scattered here replete with isolated thoughts.... at least Gary Blair won when he got there.... at least Kim backed up her claim of a talented team with a 40-0 record, if only for one year in the BG era.

If I am Duke or I am TN, I would not use conference championships as a measuring stick..... it means virtually nothing..... I will allow that making the FF means something, though not much more than a conf chmpnshp in my way of thinking..... maybe that is an acceptable measuring stick, but look where it has gotten ND and Stanford. the only thing that matters is how you do when you hit the big stage. you play for the opportunity, AND THEN you muct be ready to seize the moment when that opportunity presents itself. The NCAA title, it simply is all that matters.

If that's the case then only 1 team each year wins something that matters. The ultimate goal is to win a title, but you can't diminish conference championships/Final Four appearances even if the team doesn't win a championship. For UCONN this may be the case, but they are also the preeminent team in women's basketball right now and are so loaded with talent that anything less than a championship is a disappointment. Hell, next year I think anything less than another undefeated season will be a disappointment in some peoples eyes. And alos, Maryland got throttled by Notre Dame last year but Notre Dame was damn good. Notre Dame was 36-0 against a strong schedule...even though Maryland was blitzed by Notre Dame, I wouldn't label Maryland a pretender. Especially after the way they handled Tennessee and beat Louisville on the road to get to the Final Four. They also gave Notre Dame their closest game of the season in the first match up. Maryland deserved to make the Final Four this year.

 

[Bayareahusky]

Hmmm , JoePgh, upon reading your 1st paragraph..... you may have me backing off a bit because I can find no fault in what you say here..... ND was always a good program which jettisoned forth with addition of Diggins..... Stanford was always getting the key recruits to plug in their needs..... and YES YES YES, last 5 or 6 yrs.... head and shoulders above the rest of the pack.....

2nd paragraph I am less inclined to go along with..... I don't want to compare WCBB with pro golf..... but to go along with it...... Tiger had some great years..... and some great performances.... i remember that sick major win at Pebble Beach i think where he won by 15 strokes or something....... but the rest of the field at least I feel is kind of with him in terms of technique and talent...... there is so much I see in the WCBB game that excludes some teams from the top shelf clubs..... the fundamentals..... effecting screening, running ordered offensive sets, capitalizing on strengths..... playing smart defense, playing tough defense..... and then of course the execution of all of this..... or lack thereof......

Maybe if I was to pull back from statement that all that matters are NCs, I would say flatly that conf chmpnshps and conf tourney chmpnshps are a bad way to measure the strength of your program...... Sorry to pick on the Lady Vols, but Holly has been an effective asst for 30 plus years, had the helm for one year while Pat was not on the bench for games and has had the job officially for 3 more years now...... and am I to believe that her progress has been superb on the basis of her conf chmpnshps? Not at all...... I do not see her with a vision at all..... some of her tactics I have been in agreement on (formally rewarding effort, etc),..... but she is just in over her head it seems......

In general WCBB is not as competitive as MCBB, even at the highest levels..... you would not see a blowout like the LVille UC chmpnshp game in 2013 in the mens game...... there is much more parity and it goes deep into the field...... Belmont can knock off Duke and we are not that blown away...... when St Johns beats us (reg season) or Ball State hits up TN in the 09 tournament, those are seismic events because they almost never happen in the womens game.....

Our game is still growing...... it is still becoming more competitive..... and I expect it will take a while before I personally am impressed with a team proudly making the top 20..... It simply isn't that competitive now..... that is the genesis of my nat'l chmpnshp talk..... to reach for a hard measure, and not to be born on 3rd base and think you hit a triple to use a metaphor slightly incorrectly...... if your program is good, then good. If your program is supposed to be good, then make it good. But don't say..... well we had this conference freshman of the year, and we won our conference, etc..... too many programs are setting their bar too low......

And a keen eye should be cast on the programs that have great natural resources for lack of a better term..... Duke and Stanford have great academics..... Tennessee has great tradition, etc... these programs should be held to a higher standard...... and if they are not performing, I do not want to see it said that, "well we did do this and we did do that"..... that is when I bring back my natl chmpnshp talk..... that is the measure......

In college football, I think of Mack Brown at Texas.......the former coach at the most profitable college program in the country...... doesnt have to recruit he can select.....#1 recruiting ground in the nation is Texas..... (kinda of like it is getting for WCBB!)...... all the resources and panache in the world...... he was a good fund raiser.... a good stand up guy it looked like.... but he wasnt getting the job done.... he should have been out several years ago!!!!! (parenthetically, I saw that Charlie Strong, who just took over removed several players from the program for different incidents, including violence versus women..... makes you wonder how much Mack looked the other way)

My former boss had a slogan on his desk ...said "No explanations, no excuses!!"...... I wish more people would seize their fire within and harness this thought

 

[Bayareahusky]

Bballnut90...... yeah i guess i am saying that sure there is only 1 trophy to be won..... but the steps to get there are frequently cited by partisan fans as big building blocks to success when they really are not...... kind of like Notre Dame fans storming the football field after defeating Purdue.

And I certainly do diminish many conf chmpnshps (though not all) because I truly think they are not that hard to achieve for some...... and yes i know i am in the minority on this.....

and on Maryland....perhaps I am going to have to look at the tape again.... the way i remember they simply gave ND offensive position all game long, and did not play an inspired game at all..... I really do think they were an embarrassment.... though to your point, yes they did deserve to get there.....

 

[BlueDevils]

I just have a problem with Vols fans calling Duke a talent wasteland when over the past few recruiting classes I don't see VOLS players progressing. I will admit there's no excuse for the Chelsea Gray class not to make ONE final four, but before Notre Dame entered Duke absolutely OWNED the ACC for whatever its worth. Liston, Gray, Alexis Jones, and Richa (pre injury) improved while at Duke over the years. For four straight years we saw Simmons jack up shots. Watch your mouth if you aren't in a position to really talk.

 

[BlueDevils]

Back to Asia Durr. I think its between Duke, Baylor, or Notre Dame. Baylor will have Lex(baby come back) and Durr two guards who are playmakers. Notre Dame will have Allen and Durr as their future backcourt. There Durr will be able to play along side a pass first point guard. Finally, if she chooses Duke Coach P will have 4 years with the number 1 and number 2 point guard even though Durr is more of a combo guard. Thing about Durr going to Duke is that we already have Sierra Calhoun and Rebecca Greenwell both of whom are freshman guards, so one person would be playing the 6th man role majority of their duration at Duke. Which I think would be either Calhoun or Lambert.

 

[Bayareahusky]

BD - why would Durr consider Baylor..... did her parents not say academics were vital in this decision...... do you know something i do not?

Regarding Duke..... I think ND's arrival on the scene will be the tide which raises all boats, do you agree?

 

[triaddukefan]

Been on a 6 week self-imposed exile from all things WCBB ... so I have to catch up on a few threads

Now that's odd: it seems to me that the UConn fans on their fan board: the boneyard - are stating obvious facts. every year Tennessee fans come on the board stating "this will be the year!" and this goes back a number of years. the difference is on the UConn board we have some discussion about it, including posts expressing doubt and valid reasons supoorting that doubt, yet we never reach the heights rudeness found on other fanboards of that team where posters and even the moderators make nasty comnents to us.



Tennessee can come on here and have their say and engage in debate with the UConn fans who are basically saying, "you have a lot to prove"..

Dookie fans for example appear to have a better handle - or are at least tongue and cheek about it - and with good humor about their team's potential, yet we don't see from them and need to constantly reaffirm how well their team is going to do.

It's almost as if the Tennessee fans need some sort of affirmation from the UConn fans about how well their team is going to do. that probably isn't going to happen although I have seen posts supporting Tennessee when players are injured and I have seen some posts wishing them well.

Well guess I start to brag on the 2014-15 season..... Duke will be the TOP WCBB team that plays its home games within a 5 mile radius of Interstate 85. Sorry UNC-Charlotte, Georgia Tech, NC Central, Elon, Furman..... Duke is HANDS DOWN the top dog along that interstate

i sure hope we don't end up being like Duke. yikes. now there's a talent wasteland....but you are right. holly has to meet expectations. period. end of story.

A wasteland ??? For teenagers ?




It may be a wasteland... but the BBQ is top notch

 

[rvwsleep]

Been on a 6 week self-imposed exile from all things WCBB ... so I have to catch up on a few threads





Well guess I start to brag on the 2014-15 season..... Duke will be the TOP WCBB team that plays its home games within a 5 mile radius of Interstate 85. Sorry UNC-Charlotte, Georgia Tech, NC Central, Elon, Furman..... Duke is HANDS DOWN the top dog along that interstate




A wasteland ??? For teenagers ?




It may be a wasteland... but the BBQ is top notch

baba o'riley. One of my personal favorites.
Oh. Welcome back

 

[caramel]

She,most likely,will become an outstanding college player,barring injury.
However,I,for one,could not be much more thrilled than who Connecticut has arriving or, giving their verbal,to the team.In my opinion,no matter who anyone else gets,from here on in,Connecticut will be very hard to beat the next few years.Teams will need their AA++ games to do so.