OT: A real class act.....

[Bronx23]

I'm sorry but I totally disagree with those most expressive here on this issue.
Naomi truly outplayed Serena most of the match. Instead of winning her first grand slam and being thrilled it will forever be shadowed by a lack of common sense and restraint by the judge. The fact that the referees come out and were seemingly helpless makes it even worse.
The coaching rule is rarely enforced and goes on all the time. Yes it's a rule and yes you have rules you should follow them! We'll surely most of the time but there's a great deal of judgement, common sense and thought that goes into enforcing any rule whether it be the head judge, a basketball referee, a policeman or a teacher.
Yes, she slammed and broke her racket breaking another rule. Which cost her a point. I have the least problem with this penalty although I wonder why a player whose probably a human being to show frustration. To defuse the situation had she been clearly warned then or as she became more verbally upset and confrontational with the ref and still continued then maybe, it would make a bit of sense.
Actually Serena afterwards handled this incredibly graciously realizing her opponent was crying and not able to enjoy her win. She asked the crowd to stop the booing which had become intense. And the fans stopped booing! A much more graceful and sensitive response than seen by others in stressful situations.
She's an incredibly talented, multifaceted, accomplished classy woman, who is now a mother and a role model. (Yes I know the response to this is going to be what type of role model breaks rules, rackets and us verbally angry and critical of the judge and jury in front of millions of people).
Speaking up firmly and clearly when something is perceived as wrong, is an important American value that too often one gets criticized for.
Let the game be played and won ON the court, not taken away. It was likely that Naomi Osaka would still have won, but do it. Serena has a very long history of comebacks so while unlikely she still might have won.
The worst part of this is Naomi Osaka's tremendous play and being ahead of probably the greatest woman of all time was tarnished by weak judgment and leadership. She is a very young 20 year old and seems kind of sweet, shy and reticent so while a better outcome was for her to refuse the penalty, that could only come with years of life experience and great personal strength. I don't in the least fault Naomi for that.
I lastly wonder what's behind some of the harsh comments of Serena Williams.
Any or all of you can like or hate my comments, but they need to be said!
Bronx23

 

[Bronx23]

I have witnessed (once in person) several prior Serena outbursts where I would have agreed with the negative views of her being expressed here but not this time.

First, I think chair umpire showed extremely bad judgment to give official warning to Serena on the coaching violation regardless of what Patrick Mouratoglou, her coach, admittedly was trying to signal to her because this was second set of a grand slam final and this violation is exceedingly rarely called even though coaching of this type is exceedingly common.

Second, chair umpire showed even worse judgment in taking away a game from Serena that thereby left her opponent one game away from winning the championship where Serena did not even use foul language.

Third, I will add that, in my view and it’s a view which I understand is not universal, there is no way a male player of a stature in the game equivalent to Serena Williams (and that really means only Federer) would have been formally warned for the coaching violation, much less had the penultimate game of a grand slam final awarded to his opponent for a verbal outburst that did not include any swearing.

Fourth, I think Serena showed great control in not simply walking away after the tournament referee refused to overrule the chair umpire decision to take away a game from her particularly when apparently many in her box were urging her to do just that.

Last, Serena showed class and dignity at the awards ceremony by telling the crowd to stop booing and to celebrate Naomi Osaka especially when, whatever one’s view of the merits, Serena clearly continued to believe in her own mind she had been unfairly and inequitably treated.

I agree with this wholeheartedly!
A champion should be decided on the field of play! If U Conn loses a game let alone a championship on a horrible call, most of the same ones here castigating her would be in an uproar.
This 2018 Women's US Open championship will forever be marred. And the biggest stain is on the judge, the leadership of the tennis organization not Serena Williams.
Also I'd bet my last dollar this would never be done to a top male player from the beginning of the incident until the end.
I could go on and on, and bring this into a lot of other related issues, which will only lead me to be suspended from this site.
In summary, Serena was not cheating or trying to gain any advantage and if there was any fault in her part at all, is she verbally stood up for herself.
Beonx23

 

[Sluconn Husky]

Nice to see Serena's woman-card victimization ploy is being picked up by impressionable girls. That's real helpful.

 

[temery]

There is no way in the world a shy inexperienced player could try to over-rule the umpire. Serena got what she deserved. If this was a baseball game Serena would have been long gone.

Then Serena has the gall to claim sexism at the press conference. Serena, smashed her racket, was coached and verbally abused the umpire. This has nothing to do with the men.

I didn't see what she did, but my guess is the noise wasn't affecting her, but the delays were.

As for Serena, I've met her several times, and she is one of the few down to earth players who is anything but a prima donna off the court. I'm not sure what got into her yesterday, and she was wildly out of line. But that shouldn't define her as a person, or a player. My guess is she'll appologize privately, the publicly.

 

[Orangutan]

Last, Serena showed class and dignity at the awards ceremony by telling the crowd to stop booing and to celebrate Naomi Osaka especially when, whatever one’s view of the merits, Serena clearly continued to believe in her own mind she had been unfairly and inequitably treated.

I have a little trouble stomaching all the praise for Serena on this point. It seems like calming the crowd and focusing the spotlight on Osaka was the least Serena could do given the role she played in the whole nasty spectacle.

For as much as the umpire is the villain here, he didn't break Serena's racket. She is at least partly to blame here so to me her actions at the awards ceremony amount to little more than basic decency.

 

[Zanzman]

Your all right just take emotions out of sports just play like robots .thats what I want to see

 

[Bronx23]

I didn't see what she did, but my guess is the noise wasn't affecting her, but the delays were.

As for Serena, I've met her several times, and she is one of the few down to earth players who is anything but a prima donna off the court. I'm not sure what got into her yesterday, and she was wildly out of line. But that shouldn't define her as a person, or a player. My guess is she'll appologize privately, the publicly.

Go watch the whole event from beginning to end, then decide what she needs to apologize for?
Your responses are valuable but without context you're responding to the noise and others comments!
Bronx23

 

[JustinesGuy]

2 Serena was losing and her coach signaled her to go to the net. Yes, she needed coaching today.

3 For what? Verbal abuse, any other player would have been defaulted. There is no way Naomi could have done the same thing without the same or worse repercussions

4 So what. Playing the victim card is getting old. If Serena wants equality with the men then play 5 sets in 90+ degrees and 60%+ humidity

Yes fantastic post. I think we are all saying Serena is a fantastic player and perhaps the best female tennis player of all time. Clearly I give her a ton of respect for the hard work, titles etc. That being said she deserved everything she got today. She was getting beat pretty badly, needed coaching and got the coaching and that’s illegal. The umpire was more than fair. She wants equal treatment and she got it. I’m sick of hearing about sexism. She should go play with the men if she wants to be treated like a man. I have news for you Serena would get destroyed on the men’s circuit. No sexist just truth. It’s comments like hers and actions like she undertook that makes people not like her. It has nothing to do with her skin color

 

[temery]

Go watch the whole event from beginning to end, then decide what she needs to apologize for?
Your responses are valuable but without context you're responding to the noise and others comments!
Bronx23

I have no interest watching the match beginning to end, but did see highlights. Her behavior overshadowed a young players first Open title. For that, she should apologies.

And I'm not sure what context you are looking for, and not sure what you mean by "whole event."

 

[JustinesGuy]

Your all right just take emotions out of sports just play like robots .thats what I want to see

Isn’t there a difference of emoting and acting like out of control, smashing racquets and cursing out chair umpires then claiming sexism. This act is getting old.
I will be on the Sloan Stevens train now if you want to find me.

 

[Zanzman]

She didn’t curse the umpire

 

[Lynx23]

I'm not a big tennis fan by any means but I recognize Serena's greatness. As a passive observer, I wanted to see her win. Sort of like rooting for Tiger, although I'm not a golf fan, either. Serena had a right to be angry, I guess, since rules are not always rules. I get that. But in my profession we teach children and adults that sometimes you just have to walk away and "let go". This is not any easy thing to do but had Serena just accepted the warning, like it or not, we wouldn't be having this discussion today. However, she exacerbated the situation not once, but twice, resulting in the loss of a game. In a NYT article this morning Naomi states that she was confused about what was going on and was surprised to see the 5-3 score in her favor following Serena's meltdown. To expect a young shy, relatively inexperienced 20-year-old to have requested the judge change the score is just ridiculous. As a passive observer, I'm left with the image of a young champion in tears, apologizing to the booing crowd for beating her idol. Really? To Serena's credit, she tried to calm the crowd down but she bears some responsibility for its actions. A joyous moment stolen from a young player. The crowd booing as she tried to hide her tears with a towel. This is what I'll remember.

 

[eebmg]

What I will remember from this match is the inspiring play of Osaka and how she outplayed Serena in every facet of the game over 2 sets. And when we speak of competitors, I will remember Osaka finishing off the match brilliantly on her serve as fan's were screaming their heads off.

The pleasure I got from watching her play so beautifully was very similar to a well orchestrated UConn game.

 

[temery]

She didn’t curse the umpire

She apparently called him a thief and a liar while complaining at length about his officiating, which is a significant rules violation. I've seen men tossed for similar tantrums, so he argument is ridiculous, and she looked silly insisting there is a double standard.

Coaching from the players box is a violation. Personally I think it's a stupid rule, but it's a rule, so everyone must comply. The warning was earned.

Breaking a racquet is a violation, and she deserved the point penalty.

I'm not sure what there is to disagree with. She was out of line, and was treated no differently than any other player in the same situation.

 

[Siestakeyfan]

Osaka clearly outplayed her, but it wasn't a good look for the US Open/game today. Unfortunate because Osaka really deserved all the accolades. Granted, if Osaka really wanted to avoid the controversy, she could have refused the Serena penalty and the powers be would have probably accepted to avoid a greater controversy.

Umpire with an some type of agenda CREATED this MESS !! He was out of line !!

 

[Bronx23]

I have a little trouble stomaching all the praise for Serena on this point. It seems like calming the crowd and focusing the spotlight on Osaka was the least Serena could do given the role she played in the whole nasty spectacle.

For as much as the umpire is the villain here, he didn't break Serena's racket. She is at least partly to blame here so to me her actions at the awards ceremony amount to little more than basic decency.

Another response that looks at things from ones own life experience and can't actually fathom what Serena was actually feeling.
While you didn't go whole hog against her, sorry to say, you too don't get it.
Imagine growing up in a poor, minority community and starting to play tennis on a cement playground. Being both black and a woman and being on the precipice of tying the record for most grand slams by a woman in history.
Truly look at the full body of her life, work, interests, accomplishments from where she has come. Don't forget there were at least two other major incidents at the US Open previously where she got unfair treatment.
Common decency and "the least she could have done", are truly minimizing what she did.
She truly wasn't totally totally faultless but her transgressions come from years of HER (and others) life experiences and I can think of few others who would have responded any better.
One of our recent threads is about the meaning and import and loss of Senator John McCain, who demonstrated such class in a comparable situation. But while he was a six year POW, with all the horrors that must have been brought upon him, he's a white male who came from a military background and family. I don't wish to minimize what he did and who he was one iota, but he didn't grow up a black women with parents of limited means from the inner city in the USA, and for her to become who she now is. A wonderful (not perfect) role model for girls, young women as well as boys and young men.
All of us must and I say must, not need, to engage with, others especially who are different than us. We need to stop judging others by our standards, which if examined fully, many of us don't live up to too well and / or they are not such great standards to begin with.
Bronx23

 

[temery]

Osaka clearly outplayed her, but it wasn't a good look for the US Open/game today. Unfortunate because Osaka really deserved all the accolades. Granted, if Osaka really wanted to avoid the controversy, she could have refused the Serena penalty and the powers be would have probably accepted to avoid a greater controversy.

Players cannot refuse a penalty. The best she could have done is tank the next point, which creates other problems.

 

[Bronx23]

She apparently called him a thief and a liar while complaining at length about his officiating, which is a significant rules violation. I've seen men tossed for similar tantrums, so he argument is ridiculous, and she looked silly insisting there is a double standard.

Coaching from the players box is a violation. Personally I think it's a stupid rule, but it's a rule, so everyone must comply. The warning was earned.

Breaking a racquet is a violation, and she deserved the point penalty.

I'm not sure what there is to disagree with. She was out of line, and was treated no differently than any other player in the same situation.

All sounds so darn rational but one can disagree with every point!
Have you seen MEN curse, using expletives and not get that penalty many times!
It was handled with very little common sense and discretion! And the fact that there are rules (one of which is blatantly ignored by almost everyone), doesn't in and of itself stand.
I'll make a strange analogy that was an issue here not too long ago. The rules / norm required something of a team winning a national championship. Does or should one break the rule / norm when one / or the team / or the coaches have questions and concerns.
This situation and life itself often is not that simple, clear cut and / or black / white.
Just try seeing other ways of viewing this from that persons context, not yours!
Bronx23

 

[temery]

2 Serena was losing and her coach signaled her to go to the net. Yes, she needed coaching today.

3 For what? Verbal abuse, any other player would have been defaulted. There is no way Naomi could have done the same thing without the same or worse repercussions

4 So what. Playing the victim card is getting old. If Serena wants equality with the men then play 5 sets in 90+ degrees and 60%+ humidity

Playing best three out of five sets would be to Serena's advantage.

 

[Bronx23]

Yes fantastic post. I think we are all saying Serena is a fantastic player and perhaps the best female tennis player of all time. Clearly I give her a ton of respect for the hard work, titles etc. That being said she deserved everything she got today. She was getting beat pretty badly, needed coaching and got the coaching and that’s illegal. The umpire was more than fair. She wants equal treatment and she got it. I’m sick of hearing about sexism. She should go play with the men if she wants to be treated like a man. I have news for you Serena would get destroyed on the men’s circuit. No sexist just truth. It’s comments like hers and actions like she undertook that makes people not like her. It has nothing to do with her skin color

Your comments are an absurd jump! She should go play with and beat the men, then maybe she'd have the right to say something!
Would ANY of our national championship women's team beat any low Division 2 teams let alone Division 1.

Bronx23

 

[temery]

All sounds so darn rational but one can disagree with every point!
Have you seen MEN curse, using expletives and not get that penalty many times!
It was handled with very little common sense and discretion! And the fact that there are rules (one of which is blatantly ignored by almost everyone), doesn't in and of itself stand.
I'll make a strange analogy that was an issue here not too long ago. The rules / norm required something of a team winning a national championship. Does or should one break the rule / norm when one / or the team / or the coaches have questions and concerns.
This situation and life itself often is not that simple, clear cut and / or black / white.
Just try seeing other ways of viewing this from that persons context, not yours!
Bronx23

The argument that there is a double standard is silly. Connors and McEnroe received numerous penalties, fines, and suspensions. Everyone remembers when they didn't, but forget that their early tantrums led to tighter enforcement of the rules in place - and they suffered the consequences multiple times.

And it is that simple (black and white): She broke the rules, and they were enforced. Complaining about times the rules were not consistently enforces changes nothing.

 

[msf22b]

I watched the match in fascination and horror.
Both in this thread and in various commentaries there is a strong divergence of opinion over where the fault resides for the debacle of Serena being penalized a game...which made the (perhaps but not certain) inevitable ending a foregone conclusion.

-I believe that the umpire overreacted at least twice...could have defused the situation rather than pour accelerant over it.
-That Serena's temper is unseemly, has gotten her in trouble before.
-That is some ways, Serena is still being penalized for being, a strong, successful woman, for being black, for her family having brought her and her sister up apart from the usual junior circuit, almost thumbing their nose at the federation
and society as a whole...for being a pushy, minority, athlete who doesn't understand her place (and what is the place of outspoken woman of color...Have they achieved complete equality)?...In a sense, is not this very issue, the cause of angst in greater society in our country, indeed throughout the world.

I looked forward to this match; indeed, until the tumult, thought it of exceptional quality....Serena is a great champ; Naomi is her 20 years ago...like looking at a mirror of her young self. What a solid game she has; how magnificently she strikes the ball.

I am truly sorry it ended as it did, but I am unable to cast definitive blame as to who should most be held responsible for the unpleasantness. There's plenty of blame to go around.

Naomi is poised to become a great champion and Serena may likely still have it in her to win another major or two.

Some commentators have spoken about the fact that Naomi's outstanding play will be forgotten; I disagree.
But the issues Serena raised are serious and despite her intemperate behavior, deserve scrutiny.


(Later addition): When I wrote some of the words above: I realized that I was paraphrasing my favorite moment from Ken Burn's Jazz series when a young, Southern, caucasian college freshman, first hears Louis Armstrong:

"Louis Armstrong was the first genius I had ever seen," Black later recalled. "It is impossible to overstate the significance of a 16-year-old Southern white boy seeing genius in a black person. Louis opened my eyes wide and put to me a choice. Blacks, as the saying went, were all right in their place. But what was the place for such a man, and the people from whence he sprung?"

Charles Black later was a lead lawyer in Brown vs the Board of Education

 

[temery]

Umpire with an some type of agenda CREATED this MESS !! He was out of line !!

Her coach admitted he was coaching. It's a stupid rule, but I've seen it enforced before, and the umpire was doing his job.

 

[Zanzman]

She apparently called him a thief and a liar while complaining at length about his officiating, which is a significant rules violation. I've seen men tossed for similar tantrums, so he argument is ridiculous, and she looked silly insisting there is a double standard.

Coaching from the players box is a violation. Personally I think it's a stupid rule, but it's a rule, so everyone must comply. The warning was earned.

Breaking a racquet is a violation, and she deserved the point penalty.

I'm not sure what there is to disagree with. She was out of line, and was treated no differently than any other player in the same situation.

I stated she didn’t curse after Justine’s guy stated she cursed at the official so I’m not sure why you replied to this comment

 

[Zanzman]

The problem seems to have started with the officials being inconsistent wether to enforce not coaching from the sidelines