XL Center renovation

[Waquoit]

Parking is so much more easier at Gampel.

If you think parking is so much easier at Gampel, you're doing it wrong.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

What Hartford really needs is a monorail. It put Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook on the map.

Thanks, Lyle...

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Hartford was doomed when the city lines were drawn. Hartford proper is too small and when people started fleeing for the suburbs it was left with blight. People couldn’t relocate to different parts of the city as their needs changed, it was too small. They also couldn’t get away from the new interstate in their back yard. Ultimately, this resulted in segregation and the decline of the public school system. Once Hartford public schools weren’t considered safe and of good quality to many people, it was lights out. It is still a problem. I have a friend that invested quite a bit in Hartford rental property and bought a nice house there. Once he got married he couldn’t see sending his kids to school there and they left


I-84 supposedly marked the beginning of the end and I suspect there is something to it in this case. Imagine what it is like to live in a beautiful city with unique neighborhoods, wealth, theater and food, by many accounts, one of America’s truly great citie (dead serious, Hartford was big time). Then imagine having somebody build a highway right through the middle of it. So many people would perceive it as ruined and permanently changed for the worse. It took away the feeling a of a tight knit town and made it sterile, loud and fractured.

One thing I notice is that many people long for the way Hartford was in the 80’s and 90’s. It wasn’t good then either. There were different positive things going on, like Whaler games and the Civic Center wasn’t considered old and nasty, but still, the city was dead. There are more restaurants and stores now, with the exception of the mall back then, almost everything was closed or closing. G Fox closing really sucked the last bit of positivity out of the town. Hartford has been going downhill since the 60’s. Efforts to bring it back have been impressive but the inability to get people of all races and education levels to repopulate the city has been a killer. Without a smoother way to say it, you’ve got to make white people comfortable moving there. That’s a tough task. It doesn’t seem to want to happen organically and I’ve always felt some targeted effort would need to happen to start that trend. I’m not sure how you’d do it though.

I had an idea in the late 90’s that I proposed in a Courant letter to offer unique academic programs in Hartford and allow kids from outside the city to enroll. Now days, I’d suggest advanced coding, app building, maybe biomedical engineering. The state could fund it as an investment in the city that would keep talent home and help the region as a whole. My thought was that if a handful of brave suburban kids came in to take advantage of it, maybe more would come and then people would start looking at Hartford as viable living option again.

Your first sentence says it all.

If only there were examples of US cities that enlarged their boundaries, sometimes by incorporating adjacent towns. Oh wait...

 

[krinklecut]

What Hartford really needs is a monorail. It put Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook on the map.

The ring came off my pudding can...

 

[dennismenace]

Those seats aren't cheap, that's for sure! What I hope doesnt happen is that the lower bowl is revamped yet the piss poor sightlines are still the same from the upper. The less seats in the lower will move people up to some of the worst seats in the USA. After about row M in the upper level you can look down and see the clouds.

Hartford was doomed when the city lines were drawn. Hartford proper is too small and when people started fleeing for the suburbs it was left with blight. People couldn’t relocate to different parts of the city as their needs changed, it was too small. They also couldn’t get away from the new interstate in their back yard. Ultimately, this resulted in segregation and the decline of the public school system. Once Hartford public schools weren’t considered safe and of good quality to many people, it was lights out. It is still a problem. I have a friend that invested quite a bit in Hartford rental property and bought a nice house there. Once he got married he couldn’t see sending his kids to school there and they left


I-84 supposedly marked the beginning of the end and I suspect there is something to it in this case. Imagine what it is like to live in a beautiful city with unique neighborhoods, wealth, theater and food, by many accounts, one of America’s truly great citie (dead serious, Hartford was big time). Then imagine having somebody build a highway right through the middle of it. So many people would perceive it as ruined and permanently changed for the worse. It took away the feeling a of a tight knit town and made it sterile, loud and fractured.

One thing I notice is that many people long for the way Hartford was in the 80’s and 90’s. It wasn’t good then either. There were different positive things going on, like Whaler games and the Civic Center wasn’t considered old and nasty, but still, the city was dead. There are more restaurants and stores now, with the exception of the mall back then, almost everything was closed or closing. G Fox closing really sucked the last bit of positivity out of the town. Hartford has been going downhill since the 60’s. Efforts to bring it back have been impressive but the inability to get people of all races and education levels to repopulate the city has been a killer. Without a smoother way to say it, you’ve got to make white people comfortable moving there. That’s a tough task. It doesn’t seem to want to happen organically and I’ve always felt some targeted effort would need to happen to start that trend. I’m not sure how you’d do it though.

I had an idea in the late 90’s that I proposed in a Courant letter to offer unique academic programs in Hartford and allow kids from outside the city to enroll. Now days, I’d suggest advanced coding, app building, maybe biomedical engineering. The state could fund it as an investment in the city that would keep talent home and help the region as a whole. My thought was that if a handful of brave suburban kids came in to take advantage of it, maybe more would come and then people would start looking at Hartford as viable living option again.

I don't think Hartford is unique. Look at what happened to every major city in CT. They were all manufacturing based which paid a lot of taxes. Bridgeport, New Haven, Waterbury, New Britain. Then the interstate highway system made it easy for folks who still had jobs in cities to commute and go home to the suburbs. It has been an exodus and now there are many less good paying jobs so no need to commute. I see the need to bring back manufacturing or high tech well paying jobs. You cannot build wealth without somewhere creating value added labor (manufacturing, construction, mining, etc.) Downsize government and bring back jobs. We are 22 Trillion plus in national debt and eventually the dollar will no longer be the world reserve currency. If that day happens we will see inflation that will bring us to our knees. That picture of the foot (a well dressed man) kicking the can (down the road) is very apropo. Tick tick tick................. Ask yourself: Would you invest in any of these cities (without friends in government of course)?

 

[gampelcrazies]

If you think parking is so much easier at Gampel, you're doing it wrong.

I think you’re doing it wrong when you go to Gampel. Plenty of good parking at gampel. Just don’t park in the main lot

 

[EdgewoodNHV]

The XL hate is very unwarranted on this board. It's tiring.

It's not just XL Center. It's Hartford. it's Connecticut.

It's endless negativity and self-flagellation. I don't know what it is. Too many Catholics, maybe?

Some people view everything through the prism of Government Is Bad. And everything comes back to that.

UConn spending too much? Cut funding. Tuition raising? How could you cut funding?!

Some folks just want to bitch and moan. I don't know. I think everyone needs to chill out and go to therapy and relax a little. Yes, life is Hell, but what else you got going on. Try to enjoy yourself once in awhile.

Anyway. Hartford needs something. The idea that the middle of the state is just not going to have any venue whatsoever for 8-15K is insane.

Also the idea that Hartford is the only city with a terrible highway running through it is hilarious. Go to another city, really, almost anywhere.

 

[bendm]

Why would you live there if you hate it so much?

as long as i had to work in hartford i wanted to walk to work, walk to UConn games, and go home for lunch every day. GF also lived downtown. but the thought of sitting in rush hour/construction traffic for an hour every day just to get to west hart was most depressing of all

 

[CL82]

I don't think Hartford is unique. Look at what happened to every major city in CT. They were all manufacturing based which paid a lot of taxes. Bridgeport, New Haven, Waterbury, New Britain. Then the interstate highway system made it easy for folks who still had jobs in cities to commute and go home to the suburbs. It has been an exodus and now there are many less good paying jobs so no need to commute. I see the need to bring back manufacturing or high tech well paying jobs. You cannot build wealth without somewhere creating value added labor (manufacturing, construction, mining, etc.) Downsize government and bring back jobs. We are 22 Trillion plus in national debt and eventually the dollar will no longer be the world reserve currency. If that day happens we will see inflation that will bring us to our knees. That picture of the foot (a well dressed man) kicking the can (down the road) is very apropo. Tick tick tick................. Ask yourself: Would you invest in any of these cities (without friends in government of course)?

The county seat not far from where I live was getting rundown, dingy and dangerous. People left it at the end of the workday and didn't look back. It isn't a major city like Hartford but I think its history is instructive.

There was a major department store, not unlike GFox, which was struggling. The owners redeveloped it very intelligently with upscale apartments above and smaller restaurants and retail stores down below. Kind of like an upscale and larger Storrs Central. No surprise that the concept was resisted because "it was a landmark" which it was. A failing business, but a landmark. After months of acrimonious hearings, the plan was approved and the project was built. It kick started the night life and turned the city around. More upscale apartments went in and then upscale ($1M) town homes. It now is vibrant, safe, walkable and a destination. Note that this "redevelopment" was done with private money. I view this as a good thing as people seem to make better decisions when their capital is being invested. Note also that this turnaround managed to happen without annexing the surrounding communities.

Now Hartford is much larger and thus harder to turnaround, but it can be done there as well, if the redevelopment is thoughtfully done. I am not particularly hopeful that it will happen as CT is incredibly shortsighted, but it definitely could be done.

I will say that not dividing the the city is absolutely critical. As others have noted, 84 did just that.

 

[CashewCrew]

It's not just XL Center. It's Hartford. it's Connecticut.

It's endless negativity and self-flagellation. I don't know what it is. Too many Catholics, maybe?

Some people view everything through the prism of Government Is Bad. And everything comes back to that.

UConn spending too much? Cut funding. Tuition raising? How could you cut funding?!

Some folks just want to bitch and moan. I don't know. I think everyone needs to chill out and go to therapy and relax a little. Yes, life is Hell, but what else you got going on. Try to enjoy yourself once in awhile.

Anyway. Hartford needs something. The idea that the middle of the state is just not going to have any venue whatsoever for 8-15K is insane.

Also the idea that Hartford is the only city with a terrible highway running through it is hilarious. Go to another city, really, almost anywhere.

You're preaching to the choir. I moved to Hartford after 4 years in the suburbs because I think it's what the city needs - more young people to actually LIVE here.

I just think the incessant negativity and the "just tear it down" attitude is the wrong one. No one ever does anything about it or puts a real plan forward.

 

[CL82]

You guys are spoiled. Embrace the suck that is the XL Center.

You, my friend, are a marketing genius:

Embrace the Suck!​

 

[Waquoit]

Let's all pretend we don't know what the problem is.

Correct, we all know how the right-wing elites sold out Hartford. Not just by sticking a highway in the middle of the city for private benefit. But the move away from county government, making it easier for affluent suburbs to pretend that society's problems are Hartford's alone.

 

[CL82]

Correct, we all know how the right-wing elites sold out Hartford. Not just by sticking a highway in the middle of the city for private benefit. But the move away from county government, making it easier for affluent suburbs to pretend that society's problems are Hartford's alone.

Wow those right wing elites are absolutely nefarious. I'm amazed they keep getting reelected in Hartford.

 

[Waquoit]

Wow those right wing elites are absolutely nefarious. I'm amazed they keep getting reelected in Hartford.

Nah, they're all in Florida now. Their work is done

 

[Letsgohuskies11]

I only got approached twice for money the last time I went to the XL center, so I guess that was a plus.

 

[John]

I only got approached twice for money twice the last time I went to the XL center, so I guess that was a plus.

I got my soul saved outside of the XL.

 

[kobebeanbryant]

at a minimum everyone should fill out the survey. can’t get better if we all just complain into the ether on the boneyard.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

I don't think Hartford is unique. Look at what happened to every major city in CT. They were all manufacturing based which paid a lot of taxes. Bridgeport, New Haven, Waterbury, New Britain. Then the interstate highway system made it easy for folks who still had jobs in cities to commute and go home to the suburbs. It has been an exodus and now there are many less good paying jobs so no need to commute.

With likely no bad intent, you omitted mention of Stamford. The City of Stamford had a manufacturing heritage that was similar to other CT cities. In 1949, it was consolidated with the larger Town of Stamford. Over such time, Stamford's population has grown through its inclusion of North Stamford, Shippan, Springdale, and Glenbrook. This has ensured a population that includes urban poverty AND vast wealth.

Stamford's population has grown from ~60,000 before consolidation to ~100,000 around the time of I-95 running through the city (1970) to current day ~125,000, which is greater today than Hartford which has in a similar time frame has gone from ~180,000 to ~160,000 to ~120,000.

The Hartford METRO population has grown while the city has been hemmed in. If Hartford were, say, Hartford, West Hartford, East Hartford, Windsor, Wethersfield, and Bloomfield, things would probably be different.

 

[Letsgohuskies11]

With likely no bad intent, you omitted mention of Stamford. The City of Stamford had a manufacturing heritage that was similar to other CT cities. In 1949, it was consolidated with the larger Town of Stamford. Over such time, Stamford's population has grown through its inclusion of North Stamford, Shippan, Springdale, and Glenbrook. This has ensured a population that includes urban poverty AND vast wealth.

Stamford's population has grown from ~60,000 before consolidation to ~100,000 around the time of I-95 running through the city (1970) to current day ~125,000, which is greater today than Hartford which has in a similar time frame has gone from ~180,000 to ~160,000 to ~120,000.

The Hartford METRO population has grown while the city has been hemmed in. If Hartford were, say, Hartford, West Hartford, East Hartford, Windsor, Wethersfield, and Bloomfield, things would probably be different.

Stamford though has the luxury of being on a 1 stop direct line to Manhattan within 50 minutes. If Hartford had something similar to Boston and was within a reasonable commuting distance, I would like to think it would see the same type of success.

 

[FatHank]

I responded and live out of state.

 

[Kenny11]

It's not just XL Center. It's Hartford. it's Connecticut.

It's endless negativity and self-flagellation. I don't know what it is. Too many Catholics, maybe?

Some people view everything through the prism of Government Is Bad. And everything comes back to that.

UConn spending too much? Cut funding. Tuition raising? How could you cut funding?!

Some folks just want to bitch and moan. I don't know. I think everyone needs to chill out and go to therapy and relax a little. Yes, life is Hell, but what else you got going on. Try to enjoy yourself once in awhile.

Anyway. Hartford needs something. The idea that the middle of the state is just not going to have any venue whatsoever for 8-15K is insane.

Also the idea that Hartford is the only city with a terrible highway running through it is hilarious. Go to another city, really, almost anywhere.

I love Hartford and the things being accomplished here. Some people will never know because they literally never go into any of the neighborhoods. And I love Connecticut...However, Connecticut residents (especially above 50 years old) are the most negative people and they really contribute to holding back progress because their constant whining and negativity.

 

[CL82]

Anyway. Hartford needs something. The idea that the middle of the state is just not going to have any venue whatsoever for 8-15K is insane.

If there is an actual need, wouldn't the free market fill it? One possible argument is that it would but the decaying XL Center is taking up the need and thus preventing a private vendor from investing to fill it.

 

[Ha Who]

Wow those right wing elites are absolutely nefarious. I'm amazed they keep getting reelected in Hartford.

He also neglected to mention that the riots In the 60’s chased many North End residents out of the city. The 84 split the city argument while valid is sometimes overstated.

 

[superjohn]

Stamford though has the luxury of being on a 1 stop direct line to Manhattan within 50 minutes. If Hartford had something similar to Boston and was within a reasonable commuting distance, I would like to think it would see the same type of success.

NYC is the financial and media center of the world. Being connected to Boston would help Hartford but it's nothing like being connected to NYC. The little fiefdom hamlet mentality has hurt Hartford immeasurably as it has all CT. cities, running an interstate through the middle of the city cutting off neighborhoods from each other and cutting the city off from the water is another massive killer. CT. is sadly about the least forward looking place, it's a shame because it has a lot of built in advantages.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Stamford though has the luxury of being on a 1 stop direct line to Manhattan within 50 minutes. If Hartford had something similar to Boston and was within a reasonable commuting distance, I would like to think it would see the same type of success.

More accurately, Stamford benefitted from CT's lower costs, lower taxes, and suburban beauty by comparison with NYC, which was weak at the time. In that sense, it offered the same appeal and alternatives that have been sought in suburbs adjacent to Connecticut'other cities.

Still, Stamford had laid the groundwork by not allowing its immediately nearby wealthy to escape 'urban ills.'