Would you make this trade?

[ucbart]

Huh? Clark is listed as 1 inch taller than Bueckers. Both are lanky. In what way is Paige bigger?

And Clark is RIPPED!

 

[RockyMTblue2]

I second this thought. I suspect she will not leave UConn before Azzi does. Of course, anything is possible. With this in mind, who might be in the first round of the draft alongside her in either of the next two years?

In ‘24, Caitlin, Brink, Holmes, Reese, Cardoso, Rickea, Key, Aaliyah, Aubrey, Aamoore, Déjà Kelly, Osborne, Van Lith…

In ‘25, many of the above plus Azzi, Miles, Citron, Morrow, Soares (if rehab goes well), and then my crystal ball gets fuzzy, if it isn’t way fuzzy already.

My point is Paige will be near the top of either of these lists, though fears of her durability may keep her from the #1 spot. But I suspect whoever drafts her, Paige will end up where she wants to be within a couple years.

This may sound odd but I think the best way to keep Paige with us until 25 is to win the Championship this year. She'll want the possibility of 2 for herself and Azzi.

 

[Alydar]

There was an interesting article in The Athletic after this year's WNBA draft for which 6 WNBA gm's and other front office types were asked anonymously about 2024 potential draftees. When Paige was discussed, the four quoted said that they would not draft her unless she was healthy for the entirety the upcoming season, returned to elite form, and showed growth in her game. Even then there was doubt that Paige would opt for the 2024 draft and I got the feeling that some would not be disappointed for her to be healthy and play college ball for 2 more years.

While following this thread, I got impression that some don't understand how the WNBA draft lottery works as there was discussion about would Minnesota doing a trade with Phoenix to get their pick or Phoenix drafting to replace Diana, implying that the Mercury had the #1 pick. They don't - not yet. The WNBA lottery is based on the four teams that don't make the playoffs, but the chances of getting the #1 pick are based on a 2 year winning percentage. Indiana, because they have been ghastly for so long, have the best shot at 44.2%, the Mercury at 27.6% and the Storm and the last non-playoff team in some sort order depending on who that team is.

The math is correct only if they actually have a drawing. The fact that it has never been held in public makes me very suspicious. I don't follow the W much at all but I can remember that the Sun had the best or second best chance some years but it was always another team that got the pick. It seemed that whenever the Sun got a really good player like Charles she was gone in a couple of years to a big market team.
Clark and Bueckers will be huge draws wherever they go. And maybe the W will see that shooting and offense is way more popular than rugby scrums and reinterpret the rules to reduce physicality's importance. I peruse youtube daily and it sees that 4 or 5 times a week there are fights among players. It's become the NBA of the 80's, when the Piston's Lambeer or the Lakers' Jackson thrived.

 

[The CDR-Ret]

Bueckers landing in Minnesota would be great for her, a hometown heroine returned. We know that Reeve wants that from statements she has made. My intuition has been this would be good for the WNBA and fans in general, as her beautiful to watch efficiency would be maximized there. However, there is virtually no chance the Lynx can draft her unless a trade can be made. Unfortunately, the only player attractive enough for such a trade is Collier.

If you were the GM with the first pick would you trade your first pick in the draft for Collier? What else would you require? What else might you throw in to get the sure thing in Collier and for the overall benefits of the trade? If you are both a UConn and Lynx fan who and how many would you trade instead of Collier in order to get first crack at Bueckers?

Inquiring minds want to know.

For a healthy Bueckers, I would trade my starting point guard and my sixth man.

 

[jdote33]

Yeah not too much thoughts on a draft trade to Minnesota. I would've loved for Paige to play for Minnesota with Dorka and Phee, for Cheryl Reeves, but Minnesota actually had quite the season turn around. They are not just a playoff team, but will most likely be in the bottom 6 in terms of draft order.

Definite lottery teams right now are Phoenix, Seattle, and Indiana. TBH, I don't love any of those landing spots for her. Indiana is actually pretty talented, and with Boston, Smith, Grace Berger and Paige. I think they could be a good team. And the market can be quite supportive. I just wish she was going to a bigger market. Phoenix is kind of a mess and same with Seattle. Of course stars had already left, and it would be cool to see Paige go to a franchise where she would have to turn it around. She could be ultra aggressive and take 30 shots a game. I just don't love the husky legend superstars that somewhat loom over her.. Also I don't like how either team is built.

Dallas is probably the funnest team IMO for her to end up. If Chicago doesn't make the playoffs, I think they end up with their lotto pick. Which means that she could get to finally play with Lou. But not only that, they would be a young-loaded team. Sabally, Arike, Paige, Lou, Maddie. On top of that they also have another draft pick. And Mark Cuban would do his best to market her.

LA is pretty close to being in the lottery as well. They are a difficult team to gauge. However, Jordin Canada has played really well this season, and I could see her being paired with Paige. Nneka is still pretty great, and Dearica Hamby will probably be a lot better next season. LA is LA. Probably my second favorite landing spot.

Don't want to jinx it tho. Hope Paige has an incredibly healthy and fun senior year. Will really appreciate every game she plays this season.

 

[Rowdy831]

Phoenix would be crazy to pass up a chance at Paige. She is the most plausible replacement for DT. Clark is good but she isn't the same as Paige/DT. Clark is smaller where Paige/DT are bigger.

Paige and Caitlin in the same draft would be something. Based on watching them both I think Clark would be the first pick and she is way closer to DT than Paige. Keep in mind that every team throws two or three players at Caitlin every game and she still scores a ton and led the country in assists. Either though could be a franchise player and future HOFer.

 

[Rowdy831]

The two best players available for the draft might be Paige and Caitlin but that doesn't mean they will be the best fit for a team. You have a couple girls that are really tall that are eligible, you will have a couple threes and fours in there too that are very good. Next years class has the potential to be the best ever and every team will get a shot a player that could play a long time and help their team get over the hump.

 

[Bone Dog]

The thing about Paige is she is a magnet for publicity and fans. Yes, Caitlin is popular, too. But I don't think she's quite as magnetic. So, yes, I agree, Caitlin is probably a better choice for the #1 pick just in terms of durability and talent. But Paige may be the more important pick (even if she goes in the second round) for any team that gets her and for the league as a whole. Paige simply exudes the sort of charm the league needs.

 

[The deacon]

The thing about Paige is she is a magnet for publicity and fans. Yes, Caitlin is popular, too. But I don't think she's quite as magnetic. So, yes, I agree, Caitlin is probably a better choice for the #1 pick just in terms of durability and talent. But Paige may be the more important pick (even if she goes in the second round) for any team that gets her and for the league as a whole. Paige simply exudes the sort of charm the league needs.

I'm with you, Bone Dog, and appreciate you accentuating the 'But Paige' sentence in bold so my old eyes could better focus on that cogent point.

I'll note that Clark's personality is perhaps not at Paige's magnetic level but is plenty charismatic. For those who have only seen Caitlin play basketball and not checked out her interaction with fans, you should have seen the crowds following her and her Pied Piper effect at this summer's PGA tournament in Iowa when she played the pro-am with Ryder Cup captain Zach Johnson, also an Iowan. It brought out a tournament record crowd and a high percentage were girls of all ages, mostly there to see Caitlin... turns out she's a pretty good stick, too.

Either way, the teams that get Paige and Caitlin will be fortunate.

I'll add, although it's not likely, Caitlin has a fifth year of eligibility, too, and hasn't dismissed the notion of playing for the Hawkeyes in '24-25, when she'll be 23. Could it be the Paige/Caitlin draft question will linger? I wouldn't be unhappy to think we'll have both around for WCBB for another two seasons!

 

[EricSD]

Late to the party, but there is no way I'd trade Paige for Pheesa. Regardless of Paige's injury vulnerabilities, she has the potential to be the next DT/Sue (combo). Pheesa will be an all star and maybe even 1st team all-WNBA, but I don't see her in the same category as Dee, Sue, Maya, Tina, Stewie, Aja, Candace, Tamika, Elena, etc.

 

[diggerfoot]

Lol. I never intended this to be a Bueckers v Clark comparison or discussion, but the BY will go where it wants to go.

 

[Ozimoto]

Indeed it will.

 

[Alydar]

Bueckers landing in Minnesota would be great for her, a hometown heroine returned. We know that Reeve wants that from statements she has made. My intuition has been this would be good for the WNBA and fans in general, as her beautiful to watch efficiency would be maximized there. However, there is virtually no chance the Lynx can draft her unless a trade can be made. Unfortunately, the only player attractive enough for such a trade is Collier.

If you were the GM with the first pick would you trade your first pick in the draft for Collier? What else would you require? What else might you throw in to get the sure thing in Collier and for the overall benefits of the trade? If you are both a UConn and Lynx fan who and how many would you trade instead of Collier in order to get first crack at Bueckers?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Forgive my cynicism but if the league wants her in Minn a deal will be worked out. Minn gives up their No 1 picks this year and next year along with a journeyman player. Toss in a No 2 pick. Personally I wouldn't ever trade the rights to Bueckers.

It used to be easy for teams to tank for a season and get the top pick, Parker to LA being one example. Nowadays it takes two bad seasons so they will have to work a deal through a trade. The best way would be for the third or 4th worst record to trade their top pick to Minn. The draft lottery is done behind closed doors so there's no problem. Anyone who thinks that the WNBA draft hasn't been fixed to some extent over the years is being naive.

 

[Alydar]

Once again, BYers just can't seem to come to grips with how good Caitlin Clark is. Not only has she accomplished so much more than the injury-plagued Paige on the court over three seasons, she's the much better bet to enjoy a long WNBA career.

Like all of us here, I'll be rooting hard for Paige and keeping my fingers crossed, for the Huskies' sake and for mine as a UConn fan. Yet I'm pretty sure I'd put my franchise's future in the hands of the durable, more strongly built Caitlin than Paige for that very reason.

As for drawing in the fans, as much as we cherish every second we get to watch Paige play, won't WNBA fans flock to see Caitlin do her thing?

Selfishly, I'm just hoping both stay healthy so I have that much more reason to watch WNBA games in the future.

As for your 'smaller' statement, DEpup, I'll echo nwhoopfan: while it seems Paige has grown a bit, I believe she's likely a half-inch to an inch shorter than Clark. No matter, really, both are tall enough and are good rebounders, to boot, to be all-timers as WNBA point guards.

Clark and Bueckers are both historical shooters/scorers and they are both aggressive and supremely confident. I haven't seen Clark enough to compare her ball-handling.
The clear difference that I see is that Clark's first thought is to find a shot and shoot while Bueckers' first thought is to find an open teammate and pass to them. That's why I think Bueckers is a more valuable player. If you want the scoring champ on your team then take Clark. If it's a title then Bueckers is the one. If you are a fan the choice is plain but if you own the franchise your goals may be different.

 

[Alydar]

There was an interesting article in The Athletic after this year's WNBA draft for which 6 WNBA gm's and other front office types were asked anonymously about 2024 potential draftees. When Paige was discussed, the four quoted said that they would not draft her unless she was healthy for the entirety the upcoming season, returned to elite form, and showed growth in her game. Even then there was doubt that Paige would opt for the 2024 draft and I got the feeling that some would not be disappointed for her to be healthy and play college ball for 2 more years.

While following this thread, I got impression that some don't understand how the WNBA draft lottery works as there was discussion about would Minnesota doing a trade with Phoenix to get their pick or Phoenix drafting to replace Diana, implying that the Mercury had the #1 pick. They don't - not yet. The WNBA lottery is based on the four teams that don't make the playoffs, but the chances of getting the #1 pick are based on a 2 year winning percentage. Indiana, because they have been ghastly for so long, have the best shot at 44.2%, the Mercury at 27.6% and the Storm and the last non-playoff team in some sort order depending on who that team is.

Can you explain why the drawing is held behind closed doors? To me there is only one reason.

 

[Bluenoser]

Can you explain why the drawing is held behind closed doors? To me there is only one reason.

Although I didn't see it, the lottery selection was televised by ESPN on November 11 before the South Carolina/Maryland game, Phee was the Minnesota rep at the drawing.

 

[The deacon]

Clark and Bueckers are both historical shooters/scorers and they are both aggressive and supremely confident. I haven't seen Clark enough to compare her ball-handling.
The clear difference that I see is that Clark's first thought is to find a shot and shoot while Bueckers' first thought is to find an open teammate and pass to them. That's why I think Bueckers is a more valuable player. If you want the scoring champ on your team then take Clark. If it's a title then Bueckers is the one. If you are a fan the choice is plain but if you own the franchise your goals may be different.

And yet, Alydar, Clark has been the national leader in assists for three seasons, even beating Paige during her NPOY season. As you kinda said, you need to watch Caitlin play more. She did lead her team, surely a lesser team than Paige played on in '20-21, to the '22-23 national title game. I have the feeling Clark will chalk up plenty of assists in the WNBA, too.

I wouldn't argue that Clark looks for her shot more quickly than Paige does but, unfortunately, as Geno well knows, doesn't pretty much everyone (except, perhaps, Nika)? Yet to call Caitlin purely a shoot-first player is not accurate. She is a brilliant ballhandler and passer.

Sorry, diggerfoot, I've strayed again from the topic.

 

[nwhoopfan]

She did lead her team, surely a lesser team than Paige played on in '20-21, to the '22-23 national title game.

Exactly. Several of Paige's teammates from that year have already played in the WNBA, and surely there will be several more in the coming years. It's very likely NONE of Caitlin's teammates from the runner up team will ever play in the W. That tells me everything I need to know about Clark, and let's me very easily dismiss any of her naysayers.

 

[JellyBean]

Lol. I never intended this to be a Bueckers v Clark comparison or discussion, but the BY will go where it wants to go.

 

[Bone Dog]

Questions about Paige after college are sort of inseparable from analogies to Caitlin. I don’t even want to think of Paige leaving so Caitlin is sort of like a stalking horse so I don’t have to face it.

 

[hoophuskee]

In regard to Digger's initial question, I read a post on here that I believe mirror's every UCONN fan's sentiment is that if Paige is healthy, showed elite form, and improved from beginning to the end, she would be a worthy number 1 pick. That's not to say Clark isn't.


Paige if healthy could play ball-dominant like Clark does. She showed that highlighted by her 1st game vs South Carolina and her NCAA Tourney Game vs NC State. However, she chose to join a program used to winning championships and get to FF's. Make no mistake when you are looking to trade for her or trade her away with this characteristic will be viewed/analyzed as part of her makeup in an extremely positive light even for the team that might trade her in Digger's scenario; because they would use it to want more.

*****Another interesting note - a video was posted on here with an interview with Geno at some point after UCONN lost to Arizona in 2021. The video has him quoted as saying he could put Paige in pick-n-rolls and have her dominate the ball and he said she would be unstoppable and UCONN would play like the pros do but to do that then that would require other players on the team to sit in the corner and do nothing but wait for a pass. He said he doesn't want to coach liek that or play like that (That's not to say one game here or there that might be different.).

***I wish I could find that video. I tried looking a while back beyond Paige 140 on here but couldn't find. IF anyone has it or knows how I can find it, would appreciate any help.

Anyhow, for any poster believing that you shouldn't trade Collier, think of how many pro teams put the ball in the player’s hands form out front and give that player a potential pick if they choose and let that player make the decisions. That's Paige's one-on-one type of daily potential, never mind how easily she can play in a structured offense if in fact there is a great more efficient player than her how easily she can make that player even better due to her passing prowess.

 

[Alydar]

Although I didn't see it, the lottery selection was televised by ESPN on November 11 before the South Carolina/Maryland game, Phee was the Minnesota rep at the drawing.

I've watched the show in the past and the winner was just announced, there was no actual drawing shown. There should be a revolving drum with each team getting a proportional number of chances. It would be a popular visual. The fact that it isn't done tells me all I need to know.
I worked in the gaming industry for over thirty years and know the lengths that are taken to insure fairness and that despite that there have been fixes. If the draft lottery was an honest drawing then some betting service would be taking wagers on who the top pick will be. The fact that that has never happened is good evidence that something funny is going on.

 

[Bigboote]

I've watched the show in the past and the winner was just announced, there was no actual drawing shown. There should be a revolving drum with each team getting a proportional number of chances. It would be a popular visual. The fact that it isn't done tells me all I need to know.
I worked in the gaming industry for over thirty years and know the lengths that are taken to insure fairness and that despite that there have been fixes. If the draft lottery was an honest drawing then some betting service would be taking wagers on who the top pick will be. The fact that that has never happened is good evidence that something funny is going on.

The problem with the revolving drum is that it needs to contain enough balls that the odds related to the teams' records are properly represented. That would be a few hundred balls, I think. Then they'd need to remove those assigned to the team that got the first pick in order to draw the second. I assume it's done by an accounting or actuarial company offline. And also the team with the highest odds can finish no lower than third (? that's what I remember), so a drawing isn't necessary for the last two teams in that case. There's just an awful lot going on for the drawing itself to be a live-televised event.

 

[Alydar]

The problem with the revolving drum is that it needs to contain enough balls that the odds related to the teams' records are properly represented. That would be a few hundred balls, I think. Then they'd need to remove those assigned to the team that got the first pick in order to draw the second. I assume it's done by an accounting or actuarial company offline. And also the team with the highest odds can finish no lower than third (? that's what I remember), so a drawing isn't necessary for the last two teams in that case. There's just an awful lot going on for the drawing itself to be a live-televised event.

It is a simple thing to have several vats pre-prepared for any 1st pick possibility. Multiple lottery drawings are held every day. The balls are actually weighed prior to and after every drawing. The W hold one a year.

What if some organization raffled a car off to raise money and on the day of the drawing those running it took the drum of tickets into a room and came out to announce to the hundred or so present who won?

There have been fixed drafts in most every pro sport. They are businesses first and foremost.

 

[01Neaggrad02]

Bueckers landing in Minnesota would be great for her, a hometown heroine returned. We know that Reeve wants that from statements she has made. My intuition has been this would be good for the WNBA and fans in general, as her beautiful to watch efficiency would be maximized there. However, there is virtually no chance the Lynx can draft her unless a trade can be made. Unfortunately, the only player attractive enough for such a trade is Collier.

If you were the GM with the first pick would you trade your first pick in the draft for Collier? What else would you require? What else might you throw in to get the sure thing in Collier and for the overall benefits of the trade? If you are both a UConn and Lynx fan who and how many would you trade instead of Collier in order to get first crack at Bueckers?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Did I miss something... did Paige say this was going to be her last year? I was hoping she would be back next year... and maybe even one after that... But next year at least....

 

[Majic Hands]

The question as I understand it is
"Would I trade Collier for the #1 pick to get Paige?"

Not no, but Hell No!

Nor would I trade Dorka.

Would I trade 2 of my starting guards along with my bench. . . Well Da!

Hell's bells. I would trade a couple guards and the bench even for Caitlin Clark.

 

[diggerfoot]

Did I miss something... did Paige say this was going to be her last year? I was hoping she would be back next year... and maybe even one after that... But next year at least....

Sorry for the confusion. The question is for whenever Bueckers is drafted, whether ‘24, ‘25, ‘26, and is intended merely for an offseason, let’s entertain ourselves somehow, exercise.