WNBA 2023 Season, Part 2

[bballnut90]

Wilson with a monster game. For much of her career Young in the playoffs has not been the same player as the regular season, but she's been fantastic in this series. Gray was putting on a clinic with her passing. How 'bout Plum w/ 23 points/8 assists/3 steals. Stokes even got in on the scoring early w/ a pair of 3s and 8 points.

Vegas is unbeatable when they have all 4 stars in sync plus Stokes knocking down triples. Biggest problem for Aces right now is deciding who gets Finals MVP. Through 2 games:
Wilson-22.5 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 2 blocks, 63% FG
Gray-17.0 points, 6.0 rebounds, 10.0 assists, 44% FG, 39% 3pt
Plum-24.5 points, 3.0 rebounds, 4.5 assists, 2.0 steals, 52% FG, 40% 3pt
Young-25.0 points, 6.5 rebounds, 4.0 assists, 1.5 steals, 58% FG, 53% 3pt

I'm inclined to go with Gray just based on how she sets the tone of everything for Vegas but you can't go wrong with any of the 4. Wilson has been a beast, Plum is playing lights out and Young is as well.


I still think NY takes games 3 but I don't see them pushing a game 5. I'm not sure why the team looks to be in such disarray. Ionescu and Vandersloot have been just awful the first 2 games and are getting destroyed by the Vegas guards. In earlier games this year they handily outplayed the Vegas guards. Their inability to get on track at all is bizarre.

Stewart hasn't played well the first 2 game either. Jones has been the lone bright spot for NY. Their bench has been useless (aside from Johannes hitting a flurry of insane 3s in the first half of game 1).

The regular season was dominated by these 2 squads and if NY gets swept in 3 straight blowouts it'll be a major let down considering this was one of the most hyped finals series we've had in a long time.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Biggest problem for Aces right now is deciding who gets Finals MVP. Through 2 games:
Wilson-22.5 points, 11.5 rebounds, 2.5 assists, 2 blocks, 63% FG
Gray-17.0 points, 6.0 rebounds, 10.0 assists, 44% FG, 39% 3pt
Plum-24.5 points, 3.0 rebounds, 4.5 assists, 2.0 steals, 52% FG, 40% 3pt
Young-25.0 points, 6.5 rebounds, 4.0 assists, 1.5 steals, 58% FG, 53% 3pt

I'm inclined to go with Gray just based on how she sets the tone of everything for Vegas but you can't go wrong with any of the 4. Wilson has been a beast, Plum is playing lights out and Young is as well.

It's supposedly Finals MVP, but do they consider the previous rounds of the playoffs at least a little bit? That had to work in Gray's favor last year. I'd lean towards Wilson, because she's been so dominant throughout the entire playoffs.

 

[nwhoopfan]

The Liberty still is the most talented team with the deeper bench

Both teams have been going barely over 6 deep. Liberty depth is a non factor if they don't use any of them. If it's just Johannes vs. Clark it's fairly even thus far. Thornton has been playing more than whoever the seventh player in the Aces rotation is, but not by all that much. Dolson got a bit of run tonight after pretty much nothing in Game 1.

 

[TheFarmFan]

To me the major differential is in the coaching. Almost every possession LV had a plan and executed it well 80 percent of the time. They were both efficient and smooth. The Liberty were resorting to hero ball or a ref bailout on almost every possession. Very little tactical ball movement, and a lot of hesitation at the top of the key followed by hopeless passing around the perimeter. Not sure what's up with Sloot, but when she's neither shooting nor directing traffic well, the Lib seem to go up in flames if they can't just massively out-talent their opposition. And when you're facing 3 #1 picks, that ain't happening...

 

[MSSportsGuy]

I watched last night and didn't expect this margin of victory. Teams sometimes shoot lights out and that was Vegas but NY was a mess the entire game.

I love Sloot as a player and she's been incredible but she was unable to keep up with the three headed monster of Gray/Plum/Young. Ionescu wasn't good either. She doesn't look as though she has gas left in the tank. Maybe she will prove me wrong in game 3.

NY has too much talent for a sweep unless something is brewing among the players. Neither team has depth but Vegas looked so much younger and fresher.

FMVP will likely be Aja for missing out on the regular season one but my vote is Gray.

 

[cancontent]

I'm floored by the lack of response from NY during the second half. With how they clawed back during the second, I was expecting a game of runs after half time.

And to the comments about NY's depth, I agree. It's useless if it's not being utilized. Leaving Sabally on the bench, I understand because she's a rookie. Thornton and Dolson however, that's the head scratcher to me. During their run in the second, having Thorton in the game seemed to help. Thought they would go back to that more during the second.

 

[GCKSFN4L]

Both teams have been going barely over 6 deep. Liberty depth is a non factor if they don't use any of them. If it's just Johannes vs. Clark it's fairly even thus far. Thornton has been playing more than whoever the seventh player in the Aces rotation is, but not by all that much. Dolson got a bit of run tonight after pretty much nothing in Game 1.

That's what I take issue with. Vegas has a 6 player rotation because they have to not because they want to.They have that advantage and don't make use of it. If your starting lineup keeps retreating then maybe put in some fresh legs in or change it. A more defensive lineup that consists of KT, Laney, JJ , Stewie and only one defensive liability (Sloot or Sabrina) could be utilized.

I do think coaching is definitely hurting NY. While I think Sandy is a decent coach I have always thought her teams have underperformed despite how talented her teams were no matter if we're talking about Phoenix or team Australia. It seems that Sandy's only alternative for her gameplan was that hope that Marine go off and that be enough.

 

[cancontent]

That's what I take issue with. Vegas has a 6 player rotation because they have to not because they want to.They have that advantage and don't make use of it. If your starting lineup keeps retreating then maybe put in some fresh legs in or change it. A more defensive lineup that consists of KT, Laney, JJ , Stewie and only one defensive liability (Sloot or Sabrina) could be utilized.

I do think coaching is definitely hurting NY. While I think Sandy is a decent coach I have always thought her teams have underperformed despite how talented her teams were no matter if we're talking about Phoenix or team Australia. It seems that Sandy's only alternative for her gameplan was that hope that Marine go off and that be enough.

Great point re the "have to". Vegas doing this without Parker and Williams who they were banking on at the start of the season hasn't been discussed too much.

 

[visitingcock]

I'm floored by the lack of response from NY during the second half. With how they clawed back during the second, I was expecting a game of runs after half time.

And to the comments about NY's depth, I agree. It's useless if it's not being utilized. Leaving Sabally on the bench, I understand because she's a rookie. Thornton and Dolson however, that's the head scratcher to me. During their run in the second, having Thorton in the game seemed to help. Thought they would go back to that more during the second.

Jonquel's second quarter was awesome, and I thought it was basically a new game at the half. But for JJ's heroics, this would have been a blowout of epic proportions. But the Aces seemed to adjust to her in the second enough and NY's other stars didn't give her any help.

In two games AT HOME, the Ace's defense has made a bunch of offensive stars look mundane. But let's see if the story can be repeated in NY.

 

[GamecockFam]

Jonquel's second quarter was awesome, and I thought it was basically a new game at the half. But for JJ's heroics, this would have been a blowout of epic proportions. But the Aces seemed to adjust to her in the second enough and NY's other stars didn't give her any help.

In two games AT HOME, the Ace's defense has made a bunch of offensive stars look mundane. But let's see if the story can be repeated in NY.

Yeah I've got a gut feeling this series is about to get crazy. I think the Aces either take it in 3 or it goes to 5 games where the Liberty come back with a vengeance and dominate the next two games on their home court.

 

[visitingcock]

Yeah I've got a gut feeling this series is about to get crazy. I think the Aces either take it in 3 or it goes to 5 games where the Liberty come back with a vengeance and dominate the next two games on their home court.

In other words: "It ain't over 'til it's over."

 

[visitingcock]

POST SEASON STATS:

2024 WNBA Team Stat Leaders - ESPN

ESPN is the place for WNBA stats! Find a list of the team stat leaders for the 2024 WNBA Regular Season.

www.espn.com

 

[nwhoopfan]

They’ve been playing poorly since the end of the regular season, this isn’t a surprise to me.

I don't really see how you can say that when they've gone 5-1 against Washington and Connecticut. If they were truly playing poorly, they wouldn't have gone thru those 2 series with only 1 loss. They were awful in Game 1 against the Sun, but the rest of the series they played gritty and at times were on fire offensively. They have been bad in both games against Vegas, they looked nothing like that against Connecticut other than Game 1.

 

[TheFarmFan]

I don't really see how you can say that when they've gone 5-1 against Washington and Connecticut. If they were truly playing poorly, they wouldn't have gone thru those 2 series with only 1 loss. They were awful in Game 1 against the Sun, but the rest of the series they played gritty and at times were on fire offensively. They have been bad in both games against Vegas, they looked nothing like that against Connecticut other than Game 1.

OTOH, when you look at the post-season stats, NY is legitimately performing worse on basically every metric that matters than at least 3-4 other post-season teams (and worse than the Aces, Dallas, and CT almost across the board). Honestly, the team I watched last night did not belong in the finals. It doesn't feel like the team has clear leadership or communication, and there were a lot of miscues that you shouldn't be seeing in the post-season...

 

[GamecockFam]

In other words: "It ain't over 'til it's over."

Basically. Either the Liberty give up or they take it to another level. I suspect the latter. I think the Liberty will even it up at 2-2 and Vegas wins it at home in a wild 5th game.

 

[nwhoopfan]

OTOH, when you look at the post-season stats, NY is legitimately performing worse on basically every metric that matters than at least 3-4 other post-season teams (and worse than the Aces, Dallas, and CT almost across the board). Honestly, the team I watched last night did not belong in the finals. It doesn't feel like the team has clear leadership or communication, and there were a lot of miscues that you shouldn't be seeing in the post-season...

The last 2 games have totally skewed their stats. They beat the Sun 3-1. That's the only metric that mattered. Yes, they've looked terrible in the Finals, and I am shocked by that. If they had played the same way against Connecticut, they would've gotten swept. I have no idea what's going on with them right now, but clearly they are not playing the same way they did earlier in the playoffs. They wouldn't be in the Finals if they had been performing like this all along.

 

[JellyBean]

Yeah I've got a gut feeling this series is about to get crazy. I think the Aces either take it in 3 or it goes to 5 games where the Liberty come back with a vengeance and dominate the next two games on their home court.

I can see New York winning a game back in New York. I just can't see the Aces losing three in a row.

 

[JellyBean]

It's supposedly Finals MVP, but do they consider the previous rounds of the playoffs at least a little bit? That had to work in Gray's favor last year. I'd lean towards Wilson, because she's been so dominant throughout the entire playoffs.

If the Aces hold on to win the whole thing, I could see Young getting the Finals MVP award. I mean it could go either way but we will have to wait and see what develops.

 

[GoChips20]

I’ll put it this way — if a team is ever going to come back from being down 2-0 in a five-game series, it’s probably going to be the team with two MVPs, a former MIP, the league’s best passer of all time, and the league’s best three-point shooter.

 

[GoChips20]

I’ll put it this way — if a team is ever going to come back from being down 2-0 in a five-game series, it’s probably going to be the team with two MVPs, the league’s best passer of all time, and the league’s best three-point shooter.

 

[GoChips20]

Jonquel's second quarter was awesome, and I thought it was basically a new game at the half. But for JJ's heroics, this would have been a blowout of epic proportions. But the Aces seemed to adjust to her in the second enough and NY's other stars didn't give her any help.

In two games AT HOME, the Ace's defense has made a bunch of offensive stars look mundane. But let's see if the story can be repeated in NY.

The problem with A’ja covering JJ is it means she’s not guarding Stewie. It worked fine last night because she was off her game, but I can’t see that happening for a third straight game while at home in a packed arena.

 

[The deacon]

The last 2 games have totally skewed their stats. They beat the Sun 3-1. That's the only metric that mattered. Yes, they've looked terrible in the Finals, and I am shocked by that. If they had played the same way against Connecticut, they would've gotten swept. I have no idea what's going on with them right now, but clearly they are not playing the same way they did earlier in the playoffs. They wouldn't be in the Finals if they had been performing like this all along.

I've enjoyed reading everyone's comments here, while noticing that the thread is conspicuously missing apt critique of Stewie. To me, her poor playoff performance except for a couple of games vs. the Sun has been eye-poppingly poor.

That might be blasphemous to some dedicated Huskies fans, of which I am very much one, but it's been the elephant in the room. All the Liberty's flaws you've all been noting have been valid and could prove NY's undoing in the series but, heck, if Stewie is the player she's cracked up, to me, and she's certainly always been just that, why hasn't she carried the load? Great players do great things when lesser teammates can't...

6 of 17 and such performances just won't do. How about a 13 of 18, including some of those threes she used to make with such flair?

Anyway, the Liberty definitely isn't out of it, but Stewie is the Liberty's big weapon. Please be just that, Breanna.

 

[cancontent]

The last 2 games have totally skewed their stats. They beat the Sun 3-1. That's the only metric that mattered. Yes, they've looked terrible in the Finals, and I am shocked by that. If they had played the same way against Connecticut, they would've gotten swept. I have no idea what's going on with them right now, but clearly they are not playing the same way they did earlier in the playoffs. They wouldn't be in the Finals if they had been performing like this all along.

The body language of the Liberty starters at the end of the game didn't look good. Not sure how to interpret it as I don't think I've ever seen players like Stewart look like that during a loss.

 

[cancontent]

I've enjoyed reading everyone's comments here, while noticing that the thread is conspicuously missing apt critique of Stewie. To me, her poor playoff performance except for a couple of games vs. the Sun has been eye-poppingly poor.

That might be blasphemous to some dedicated Huskies fans, of which I am very much one, but it's been the elephant in the room. All the Liberty's flaws you've all been noting have been valid and could prove NY's undoing in the series but, heck, if Stewie is the player she's cracked up, to me, and she's certainly always been just that, why hasn't she carried the load? Great players do great things when lesser teammates can't...

6 of 17 and such performances just won't do. How about a 13 of 18, including some of those threes she used to make with such flair?

Anyway, the Liberty definitely isn't out of it, but Stewie is the Liberty's big weapon. Please be just that, Breanna.

Maybe some held off as it would be perceived as trolling, especially after some of the discussions about the MVP award? Just a guess from my end. But at the same time, she had a double double, so it's not like she wasn't contributing in some form.

Personally I think more of the critique should be towards Ionescu and Sloot. They've disappeared and Brondello hasn't found a way to get them going.

 

[GamecockFam]

Maybe some held off as it would be perceived as trolling, especially after some of the discussions about the MVP award? Just a guess from my end. But at the same time, she had a double double, so it's not like she wasn't contributing in some form.

Personally I think more of the critique should be towards Ionescu and Sloot. They've disappeared and Brondello hasn't found a way to get them going.

Yeah, I've held my tongue on Stewie's performance this season. I wish the post season would factor into the award because she has not performed like a MVP this post season.