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WNBA 2023 Off-season

Dillon77

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I posted this a few minutes before HuskyNan started a new WNBA thread. It fits the Post-season criterion. Here goes:

Last Vegas Aces, Looking Forward:
Richard Cohen's Overview on Where the 2-Time Defending Champs Are, Could Go This offseason

Exec. Summary on Personnel:

2024 draft picks: The Aces don't have a first-round pick in 2024 after sending it to Los Angeles in the Dearica Hamby trade, but ultimately only moved down from No. 12 to No. 16 in that deal as they got LA's second-rounder in return. They also own Washington's second-rounder (No. 18) from the Amanda Zahui B. trade, and still hold their own second- and third-round picks.

Free agents: Riquna Williams (UFA), Candace Parker (uncoreable UFA), Kiah Stokes (UFA), Sydney Colson (UFA), Cayla George (RFA)

Under contract: Kelsey Plum, A'ja Wilson, Chelsea Gray, Jackie Young, Alysha Clark, Kierstan Bell


Financial Outlook: "The Aces are in good shape. As Cohen says, "Scarily for other teams around the league, the Aces have the cap space to make some moves this offseason.

"Wilson, Plum, Gray, Young and Clark are all signed, none of them for more than $200,000, which leaves an unusual amount of room for a team that's already so loaded. If they keep the six currently under contract, they would have $512,585 for the remaining five or six roster spots. They could, for example, fill three of those with base minimum deals ($64,154 each) and have $320,123 remaining for two players. That's potentially a max deal ($208,219) and another mid-range veteran."

My take:

- While Candace Parker and Kiah Stokes are probably the first two options, other bigs are discussed, most notably.
While Jonquel Jones has seemingly liked being in NYC and Liberty GM says talks are ongoing, JJ passed up an opportunity to extend her contract. She could probably slot in well with A'ja Wilson.

- Or the Aces could go with Wilson in the paint and sign a forward such as Alanna Smith or Rebecca Allen.

BTW, there are links in the artcile to each post-season write-up on all the other teams,
Should be interesting. Stay tuned.

 
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I posted this a few minutes before HuskyNan started a new WNBA thread. It fits the Post-season criterion. Here goes:

Last Vegas Aces, Looking Forward:
Richard Cohen's Overview on Where the 2-Time Defending Champs Are, Could Go This offseason

Exec. Summary on Personnel:

2024 draft picks: The Aces don't have a first-round pick in 2024 after sending it to Los Angeles in the Dearica Hamby trade, but ultimately only moved down from No. 12 to No. 16 in that deal as they got LA's second-rounder in return. They also own Washington's second-rounder (No. 18) from the Amanda Zahui B. trade, and still hold their own second- and third-round picks.

Free agents: Riquna Williams (UFA), Candace Parker (uncoreable UFA), Kiah Stokes (UFA), Sydney Colson (UFA), Cayla George (RFA)

Under contract: Kelsey Plum, A'ja Wilson, Chelsea Gray, Jackie Young, Alysha Clark, Kierstan Bell


Financial Outlook: "The Aces are in good shape. As Cohen says, "Scarily for other teams around the league, the Aces have the cap space to make some moves this offseason.

"Wilson, Plum, Gray, Young and Clark are all signed, none of them for more than $200,000, which leaves an unusual amount of room for a team that's already so loaded. If they keep the six currently under contract, they would have $512,585 for the remaining five or six roster spots. They could, for example, fill three of those with base minimum deals ($64,154 each) and have $320,123 remaining for two players. That's potentially a max deal ($208,219) and another mid-range veteran."

My take:

- While Candace Parker and Kiah Stokes are probably the first two options, other bigs are discussed, most notably.
While Jonquel Jones has seemingly liked being in NYC and Liberty GM says talks are ongoing, JJ passed up an opportunity to extend her contract. She could probably slot in well with A'ja Wilson.

- Or the Aces could go with Wilson in the paint and sign a forward such as Alanna Smith or Rebecca Allen.

BTW, there are links in the artcile to each post-season write-up on all the other teams,
Should be interesting. Stay tuned.

Jones with Wilson is an interesting idea. Aces would immediately lead the league in rebounding. From a skill and talent perspective it’s a great fit but I think Wilson works better when she can roam as a hybrid 4/5 alongside a stretch forward (a lot of Parker’s shots came from the perimeter this season) rather than a true center. But Jones has much more range than Cambage ever showed so I could still see it working. I’m guessing she returns to New York though. It seems like there’s fast becoming some heat between these two teams (Plum’s comments certainly didn’t help absolve it) so I’d be shocked if anyone makes a switch. Even if Jones does become available I’d prioritize Parker. Her playmaking ability is an exemplary match for the Aces’ identity.

Aces are in a predicament of sorts. Taking into account the entire body of work, their bench is clearly inferior to most teams in league which leaves them particularly susceptible to injury. That said, George and Colson came up big in Game 4 and that might have renewed Aces’ confidence in them. I’d probably lean towards finding an athletic wing or forward which is where I think they need the most help (assuming Gray can play next year).
 
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I posted this a few minutes before HuskyNan started a new WNBA thread. It fits the Post-season criterion. Here goes:

Last Vegas Aces, Looking Forward:
Richard Cohen's Overview on Where the 2-Time Defending Champs Are, Could Go This offseason

Exec. Summary on Personnel:

2024 draft picks: The Aces don't have a first-round pick in 2024 after sending it to Los Angeles in the Dearica Hamby trade, but ultimately only moved down from No. 12 to No. 16 in that deal as they got LA's second-rounder in return. They also own Washington's second-rounder (No. 18) from the Amanda Zahui B. trade, and still hold their own second- and third-round picks.

Free agents: Riquna Williams (UFA), Candace Parker (uncoreable UFA), Kiah Stokes (UFA), Sydney Colson (UFA), Cayla George (RFA)

Under contract: Kelsey Plum, A'ja Wilson, Chelsea Gray, Jackie Young, Alysha Clark, Kierstan Bell


Financial Outlook: "The Aces are in good shape. As Cohen says, "Scarily for other teams around the league, the Aces have the cap space to make some moves this offseason.

"Wilson, Plum, Gray, Young and Clark are all signed, none of them for more than $200,000, which leaves an unusual amount of room for a team that's already so loaded. If they keep the six currently under contract, they would have $512,585 for the remaining five or six roster spots. They could, for example, fill three of those with base minimum deals ($64,154 each) and have $320,123 remaining for two players. That's potentially a max deal ($208,219) and another mid-range veteran."

My take:

- While Candace Parker and Kiah Stokes are probably the first two options, other bigs are discussed, most notably.
While Jonquel Jones has seemingly liked being in NYC and Liberty GM says talks are ongoing, JJ passed up an opportunity to extend her contract. She could probably slot in well with A'ja Wilson.

- Or the Aces could go with Wilson in the paint and sign a forward such as Alanna Smith or Rebecca Allen.

BTW, there are links in the artcile to each post-season write-up on all the other teams,
Should be interesting. Stay tuned.

They seem to be in a good position for next year. Obviously bringing back Parker and Stokes would give them the 5th starter in Parker, allow Clark to resume her super-sub role and let Stokes be a solid defending/rebounding sub behind Wilson and Parker.

Parker took far less than market value last year and I don't know if she will do that again, but if she doesn't return there is a decent chance Vegas can get another ring chasing veteran for less than market value

The economics for championship contenders is a little different. Most are going to use just 11 players. that 60 or $70,000 is better spent upgrading your first couple of players off the bench. Spend the cap mostly on the top 7-8 players and the rest at or near minimum.

The contenders have the advantage that they can frequently get players for a little less than market value, whereas the bottom teams often have to overpay to get the same level player. As the rosters take shape and salary cap is used many players know the best they can do is the minimum, and if that is the case they would frequently prefer a better team, so the super teams get better minimum players most of the time too.
 
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I think Parker will be back unless physically she’s no longer able, which would be a surprise since she’s just a year removed from an All-WNBA First Team nod. There was speculation she’d be done after the 2022 season and I think she wants to ride into the sunset on her own terms.
 
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If I were the Liberty, I’d try to get one of Rebecca Allen or Katie Lou Samuelson to replace Johannes and then a defensive minded guard to come off the bench and called it an off-season if they can sign JJ back up.
 

bballnut90

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Jones with Wilson is an interesting idea. Aces would immediately lead the league in rebounding. From a skill and talent perspective it’s a great fit but I think Wilson works better when she can roam as a hybrid 4/5 alongside a stretch forward (a lot of Parker’s shots came from the perimeter this season) rather than a true center. But Jones has much more range than Cambage ever showed so I could still see it working. I’m guessing she returns to New York though. It seems like there’s fast becoming some heat between these two teams (Plum’s comments certainly didn’t help absolve it) so I’d be shocked if anyone makes a switch. Even if Jones does become available I’d prioritize Parker. Her playmaking ability is an exemplary match for the Aces’ identity.

Aces are in a predicament of sorts. Taking into account the entire body of work, their bench is clearly inferior to most teams in league which leaves them particularly susceptible to injury. That said, George and Colson came up big in Game 4 and that might have renewed Aces’ confidence in them. I’d probably lean towards finding an athletic wing or forward which is where I think they need the most help (assuming Gray can play next year).
I can’t imagine Jones signs with Vegas next year.

Vegas should honestly just run it back. When healthy they looked like arguably the best WNBA team of all time. They also appear to have great chemistry and camaraderie, plus excellent leadership in Parker/Wilson/Gray.
 

Dillon77

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I can’t imagine Jones signs with Vegas next year.

Vegas should honestly just run it back. When healthy they looked like arguably the best WNBA team of all time. They also appear to have great chemistry and camaraderie, plus excellent leadership in Parker/Wilson/Gray.
If everyone is guaranteed to be healthy, I agree with you. They've actually got a boatload of second round picks that could bring in some inexpensive depth.

However, I think these "what will happen" questions hang in the air:
  • What is the state of Chelsea Gray's injury? How long will she be out?
  • What will Candace Parker do?

- If Gray's injury is serious and long-term, I think you've got to examine the guard market. Could be worth discussions about and with Natasha Cloud and/or Courtney Williams. The latter is a known, fierce quality and Williams showed unexpected talent as a distributor last year.

- If Parker decides to call it a career, Las Vegas could keep it in house and utilize a Stokes/George platoon, opposite Wilson.

Is it worth a call to JJ? Sure. She saw the joyous moxy the Aces play with under Hammon. On the other hand, JJ worked so hard to get to the Aces, you'd think she'd want to give the team another effort.

Like most, I'm very aware that a player you bring in has to allow Wilson to have her space and JJ could do that. But you could also go with a rangy forward, such as Rebecca Allen or Alanna Smith.

So, let's see what happens with the Gray injury/Parker career situation first.
 
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I just can't see JJ with the Aces. So, I am not even looking at that option. The Aces, like a few have stated, should just run it back. They have a solid core and if Chelsea's injury allows her to return next season, they are in an even better position. With Parker, like someone stated, if her injury allows her to come back, she is going to come back and go out on her terms. But a lot depends on her health.

Now for my Minnesota Lynx. Hopefully they are active this off season. I don't see Aerial Powers staying in Minnesota, which will be our loss and some other team's gain. Not sure what happened after Powers came back from her "injury" but her playing time was reduced or cut. But whatever we do, we need to get Phee some help. The free agency list looks pretty slim. There are some solid players on the list, but I just don't see Coach Reeve making any moves to go after those players and those players having any interest in coming to Minnesota. It is going to be a fun off season here in Minneapolis.
 

bballnut90

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If everyone was guaranteed to be healthy, I'd agree with you. They've actually got a boatload of boatload of second round picks that could bring in some inexpensive depth.

However, I think two "what will happen" questions hang in the air:
  • What is the state of Chelsea Gray's injury?
  • What will Candace Parker do?

- If Gray's injury is long-term, I think you've got to examine the guard market. Could be worth discussions about and with Natasha Cloud and/or Courtney Williams. The latter is a known, fierce quality and Williams showed unexpected talent as a distributor last year.

- If Parker decides to call it a career, Las Vegas could keep it in house and utilize a Stokes/George platoon, opposite Wilson.
Is it worth a call to JJ? Sure. She saw the joyous moxy the Aces play with under Hammon.
Like most, I'm very aware that a player you bring in has to allow Wilson to have her space and JJ could do that. But you could also go with a rangy forward, such as Rebecca Allen or Alanna Smith.

So, let's see what happens with the Gray injury/Parker career situation first.

We’ll see what happens but I’d be surprised if Parker retires this off season. Guessing she wants to go out on a different note than retiring due to injury.

Gray is a major question mark. I really hope she’s able to come back 100% next year. She’s solidified herself as the premier PG in the world and is in the peak of her career. Cloud is another interesting option but I wouldn’t expect her to sign unless she knew Gray was out for the full year. She’s one of the top PGs in the league and likely wants a solidified starting spot, ideally for a contender. I don’t see the Aces going after Courtney Williams with her history of violence, especially after the Riquna Williams fall out.

Diggins-Smith willl be another one to keep an eye on. I don’t see her personality fitting with the Aces but I think she’ll end up in the league next year and is a great player.


As for J. Jones, I’d be very shocked if she ended up at the Aces. Bad blood after this series and she’d get labeled a ring chaser if she pulls a KD and jumps ship to the champs (right after jumping ship to form a super team).
 

Dillon77

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We’ll see what happens but I’d be surprised if Parker retires this off season. Guessing she wants to go out on a different note than retiring due to injury.

Gray is a major question mark. I really hope she’s able to come back 100% next year. She’s solidified herself as the premier PG in the world and is in the peak of her career. Cloud is another interesting option but I wouldn’t expect her to sign unless she knew Gray was out for the full year. She’s one of the top PGs in the league and likely wants a solidified starting spot, ideally for a contender. I don’t see the Aces going after Courtney Williams with her history of violence, especially after the Riquna Williams fall out.

Diggins-Smith willl be another one to keep an eye on. I don’t see her personality fitting with the Aces but I think she’ll end up in the league next year and is a great player.


As for J. Jones, I’d be very shocked if she ended up at the Aces. Bad blood after this series and she’d get labeled a ring chaser if she pulls a KD and jumps ship to the champs (right after jumping ship to form a super team).
With you on S D-S: I just don't think her personality is a fit for a team that already has their own working ethos.
My only caveat on that is if she and Hammon clicked on some level.

Along those lines, I could see her working with Teresa Witherspoon in Chicago (once again, close to Sky's South Bend roots). But there are a couple of teams with fluid point guard situations, from Chicago and Minnesota to (possibly) Washington and Atlanta. Does Connecticut want to have a standard point guard? One that can also score.

Should be quite interesting with the Gray injury, S D-S, Cloud and Canada.

(Oh, and if Chelsea is out for awhile, that creates a major opening on the Olympic team, for sure. But that's another post -- err, thread -- for another time ;))
 
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I just can't see JJ with the Aces. So, I am not even looking at that option. The Aces, like a few have stated, should just run it back. They have a solid core and if Chelsea's injury allows her to return next season, they are in an even better position. With Parker, like someone stated, if her injury allows her to come back, she is going to come back and go out on her terms. But a lot depends on her health.

Now for my Minnesota Lynx. Hopefully they are active this off season. I don't see Aerial Powers staying in Minnesota, which will be our loss and some other team's gain. Not sure what happened after Powers came back from her "injury" but her playing time was reduced or cut. But whatever we do, we need to get Phee some help. The free agency list looks pretty slim. There are some solid players on the list, but I just don't see Coach Reeve making any moves to go after those players and those players having any interest in coming to Minnesota. It is going to be a fun off season here in Minneapolis.
They signed McBride to an extension along with Juhasz and Miller going into year two. That along with Collier is a nice nucleus to start with. Can't recall the contract status of Shepherd, but for some reason I'm under the impression she's back next year. If she is, they have a good tandem in the post between her and Juhasz.

One question I have is what they do with Carleton. Compared to how she did at World Championships, she didn't perform as I thought she would this season. Is she worth bringing back for another season? Not sure.
 
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They signed McBride to an extension along with Juhasz and Miller going into year two. That along with Collier is a nice nucleus to start with. Can't recall the contract status of Shepherd, but for some reason I'm under the impression she's back next year. If she is, they have a good tandem in the post between her and Juhasz.

One question I have is what they do with Carleton. Compared to how she did at World Championships, she didn't perform as I thought she would this season. Is she worth bringing back for another season? Not sure.
Yup, we have Shepherd for another year. McBride, Miller, Juhasz, along with Collier, is a nice nucleus, especially if Diamond and Dorka continue their progression. They were looking pretty good down the stretch, minus the playoffs. They will get better.

Carleton shocked me as well. Watching how she played during the World Championship, I was thinking that she would show some of that with the Lynx. But to be fair to Carleton and the rest of the team, nothing about this season was consistent other it being inconsistent. I just know that Bridget had glimpses of her World Championship performances. I just think that with her inconsistent minutes, it was tough for her to get into a decent rhythm.
 

Bigboote

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Didn’t Carleton have a nagging injury most of the season?

She not only didn’t play as she had in the Worlds, she didn’t play as she had in the last couple of seasons.
 

bbsamjj

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With Loyd, Copper, and Laney also signing extensions with their current teams, the free agent market in 2024 appears much less interesting. Yes, Jonquel Jones, Dewanna Bonner, Brionna Jones, Natasha Cloud and EDD "could" change teams--but it would surprise me.

The biggest question mark, as others have mentioned, is where does SDS end up [She would be a major upgrade over Wheeler in Indiana...just saying]. A lot of the other movement I think we'll see is among role and bench players.
 
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I still can’t believe the Aces won without Gray and Stokes, but Wilson was incredible. If you told me when she entered the draft that she would be on par with Stevie, I would’ve said no way, but she’s worked her butt off and improved so much.

Stewie is the more versatile offensive player, but A’ja has overtaken her this year. She does not have the 3pt shot in her arsenal like Stewie, however everything else she does, she’s DAMN good at it.

Any further news on Gray’s injury? Not only is she important for the Aces, but she’s also Team USA’s starting pg. Paris isn’t that far away :eek:

Aces vs Liberty has the makings to be a nasty rivalry and I’m here for it. Jackie Young and Kiah Stokes are normally docile, but this series brought out an edge in them. From Jackie flexing after an and1 to Stokes chirping at JJ :D

Let’s not mention Plum’s postgame comments :rolleyes:
 

bballnut90

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With Loyd, Copper, and Laney also signing extensions with their current teams, the free agent market in 2024 appears much less interesting. Yes, Jonquel Jones, Dewanna Bonner, Brionna Jones, Natasha Cloud and EDD "could" change teams--but it would surprise me.

The biggest question mark, as others have mentioned, is where does SDS end up [She would be a major upgrade over Wheeler in Indiana...just saying]. A lot of the other movement I think we'll see is among role and bench players.
SDS at Indiana is an interesting potential fit. She’d certainly be an upgrade, but Indiana also has 44% odds to get the #1 pick and potentially draft Clark. Indiana would be a great landing place for her IMO with a young core of her/Boston/Smith. Diggins-Smith doesn’t fit into that IMO, but at the same time, I think they’d be smart to sign SDS if they can since neither the #1 pick nor Clark coming out are guaranteed.

Another way to look at things for Indiana—they likely aren’t competing with Vegas this upcoming year so it’d make sense to focus on getting players who will likely stick around that can develop. They’ll get a top 3 pick and likely land a very good player, and I believe Jackie Young (an Indiana native) enters free agency in 2025. If they could draft a strong guard in 2024 and sign Young or another big name in the off-season, Indiana could be a title contender in 2025 or 2026. A potential lineup of Clark/Bueckers, Mitchell, Young, Smith and Boston would be lethal.
 
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SDS at Indiana is an interesting potential fit. She’d certainly be an upgrade, but Indiana also has 44% odds to get the #1 pick and potentially draft Clark. Indiana would be a great landing place for her IMO with a young core of her/Boston/Smith. Diggins-Smith doesn’t fit into that IMO, but at the same time, I think they’d be smart to sign SDS if they can since neither the #1 pick nor Clark coming out are guaranteed.

Another way to look at things for Indiana—they likely aren’t competing with Vegas this upcoming year so it’d make sense to focus on getting players who will likely stick around that can develop. They’ll get a top 3 pick and likely land a very good player, and I believe Jackie Young (an Indiana native) enters free agency in 2025. If they could draft a strong guard in 2024 and sign Young or another big name in the off-season, Indiana could be a title contender in 2025 or 2026. A potential lineup of Clark/Bueckers, Mitchell, Young, Smith and Boston would be lethal.
I think it’s more likely SDS ends up in Chicago. Fever front office makes too many bad decisions for someone of SDS talent to think they’ll magically start making smart moves to end the prime of her career.

Intriguing to me is another lottery team no one is talking about: LA. Major media market a known coach who’s made the finals a bunch. If they were to grab a top 2 draft pick and both Clark and Buckers entered the draft, I wonder if Parker considers returning to finish out her career so she doesn’t have to commute to be with her daughter. Maybe not a title contender but certainly would breathe some life back into the franchise.
 
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I still can’t believe the Aces won without Gray and Stokes, but Wilson was incredible. If you told me when she entered the draft that she would be on par with Stevie, I would’ve said no way, but she’s worked her butt off and improved so much.

Stewie is the more versatile offensive player, but A’ja has overtaken her this year. She does not have the 3pt shot in her arsenal like Stewie, however everything else she does, she’s DAMN good at it.

Any further news on Gray’s injury? Not only is she important for the Aces, but she’s also Team USA’s starting pg. Paris isn’t that far away :eek:

Aces vs Liberty has the makings to be a nasty rivalry and I’m here for it. Jackie Young and Kiah Stokes are normally docile, but this series brought out an edge in them. From Jackie flexing after an and1 to Stokes chirping at JJ :D

Let’s not mention Plum’s postgame comments :rolleyes:
She shot a few this season. Wouldn't be surprised if she continues to work at it to expand her shooting range. Not saying she'll live outside the paint though, but it seemed like she's moving outwards more in where she plays with this offense. It would be another arrow in her quiver to use when necessary.
 

Dillon77

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SDS at Indiana is an interesting potential fit. She’d certainly be an upgrade, but Indiana also has 44% odds to get the #1 pick and potentially draft Clark. Indiana would be a great landing place for her IMO with a young core of her/Boston/Smith. Diggins-Smith doesn’t fit into that IMO, but at the same time, I think they’d be smart to sign SDS if they can since neither the #1 pick nor Clark coming out are guaranteed.

Another way to look at things for Indiana—they likely aren’t competing with Vegas this upcoming year so it’d make sense to focus on getting players who will likely stick around that can develop. They’ll get a top 3 pick and likely land a very good player, and I believe Jackie Young (an Indiana native) enters free agency in 2025. If they could draft a strong guard in 2024 and sign Young or another big name in the off-season, Indiana could be a title contender in 2025 or 2026. A potential lineup of Clark/Bueckers, Mitchell, Young, Smith and Boston would be lethal.

Your 2nd paragraph makes sense for a variety of reasons whispering in my year:
  • Remember, Lin Dunn and Christy Sides brought Wheeler north from Atlanta with newly hired Coach Sides and they gave her a two-year contract (bidding against themselves), which runs through 24-25. Would be hard -- impossible -- to dump that contract and it's hard to eat $$$ in the W.
  • Since the frontcourt is young and the core going forward, I don't know if S D-S is the fit here.
  • However, I like your idea of Young possibly coming back to Indiana. She's from Princeton in the southern part of the state, and is very close to her family.
  • As per getting Clark in 2024, who knows if Caitlin, Paige, et stay (in college) or go (pro). If they stay, the Fever do have Grace Berger who, while not CC or Paige, showed some heady play for a rookie last year. Now that I think of it, if Paige or Caitlin do come out and are available, Berger is so adaptable, she could play off either of them easily, a la her work with Ali Patberg.
 
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Indiana is type of franchise to get the #1 pick in the draft and by pass an available Paige and Clark to pick up Reese or Brink when they already have more than enough options in the post.
 

bbsamjj

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SDS and Mabrey together would be...interesting!

If LA could afford SDS, that's a very interesting landing spot for her. With Nneka still as their franchise player, they are probably trying to win NOW--so SDS makes sense if she's still anywhere near her 2022 level. Canada showed huge growth this year and could be a huge get on the free agent market if she wants to be; that being said, she's from LA and I bet would love to stay if the Sparks can pay her. The health of Lexie Brown and Jasmine Thomas (who never fully looked herself this year) are also big question marks.

IF Indiana is able to get Clark or Bueckers in the draft, that's a nice 1-2-3 draft rebuild, potentially on par with Vegas's Plum/Wilson/Young.
 
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Indiana is type of franchise to get the #1 pick in the draft and by pass an available Paige and Clark to pick up Reese or Brink when they already have more than enough options in the post.

While I get your point, some of their decisions this year helped the team improve overall last season. I wasn't a fan of some of them myself, but they made strides where most assumed they wouldn't.

Dunn is in her third year and Sides her second. Can't assume the decisions of the previous management team will continue with this group.
 

bbsamjj

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Indiana is type of franchise to get the #1 pick in the draft and by pass an available Paige and Clark to pick up Reese or Brink when they already have more than enough options in the post.
I don't think they are that bad; but they are the type of franchise that doesn't need a post and then gets the #3 draft pick after the two best guards are gone .
 

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