Who would be your First Pick,Taurasi,Maya,Parker or Delle Donne?

[Buzzyboy]

Yes, because they were really good pitchers.

No, they weren't! They were pretty much journey men pitchers who had success based more on the Yankee lineup than their own skill set! I'm a life long Yankee fan and they aren't even close! Bob Turley was a much better pitcher than either of these guys and I know there was others whose names don't come to mind who were far, far better than Terry and Stafford!

 

[Buzzyboy]

No, they weren't! They were pretty much journey men pitchers who had success based more on the Yankee lineup than their own skill set! I'm a life long Yankee fan and you aren't even close! Bob Turley was a much better pitcher than either of these guys and I know there was others whose names don't come to mind who were far, far better than Terry and Stafford!

Ralph Terry had a won lost record of 107-99 which is totally marginal, considering the juggernaut the Yankees were during his time with them. Bill Stafford had a 43-40 lifetime won lost record so for you to mention him is just a bit strange to me. They had a bit of success with the Yankees in a couple of year period during the very early 60's but not enough that I would mention their names in the same breath as Whitey Ford!

 

[Wally East]

Ralph Terry had a won lost record of 107-99 which is totally marginal, considering the juggernaut the Yankees were during his time with them. Bill Stafford had a 43-40 lifetime won lost record so for you to mention him is just a bit strange to me. They had a bit of success with the Yankees in a couple of year period during the very early 60's but not enough that I would mention their names in the same breath as Whitey Ford!

Yes, they both had success for a while and contributed to a number of championship seasons. Terry was 78-59 for the Yankees.

 

[meyers7]

To borrow a phrase from our HOF brother Chris Carter: "C'mon man". Willie, you just want to start some mess. Asking this question is like asking someone which would they rather have cut off, an arm or a leg.

Easy, left arm.

 

[TerpWomenFan]

Great thread. I have to find the time to read through this. Of the top of my head I would choose Delle Donne.

 

[CL82]

This is confusing. You understand that you're talking about team sports but don't seem to want to attribute success or failure to the rest of the team.

Robert Horry has won 7 NBA titles, which is one more than Kareem, Michael Jordan, and Bob Cousy. Will those three ever be the player that Robert Horry was? Or were they far, far greater players who just diddn't play on as many teams that won titles?

Maria Conlon has three rings. Maya Moore has two. Will Maya ever "accomplish all that [Maria] did" so that we can say Maya was a better player?

See the point?

I'm not saying EDD is better than D but looking at titles won as a way to assess a player in a team sport is not great.

Yes and no Wally. I agree with your point, generally, (and on the men's board we occasionally note that Tyler Olander has won more national championships than Jim Beoheim, much to the annoyance of our Syracuse guests) but the other side of the coin are many 'would be greats' that never won a national championship. There is something to say for putting yourself in a place to succeed, putting in the very hard necessary to do so, and then getting it done. FWIW, two of Di's three championships were without an all-star complement of players. As noted by Geno, that's pretty special.

I think ignoring titles won as a way to assess a a player in a team sport is (also) not great.

 

[Orangutan]

Delle Donne reminds me of Carmelo,exceptional shooter ,improved re-bounder and defensive player but something is missing.Must prove she has the heart of a Champion.The only one in the group that has Never won a Championship at the College or Pro level.Led a talented cast to the finals last year but pulled a Skylar at crunch time.Turn loose.

Elena scored 17 points in the 4th quarter to help erase a 20-point deficit against Atlanta (the East 1-seed) last year in the playoffs. She managed that after suffering a back injury early in that series (game 1, I think) that worsened throughout the playoffs. By the time the Phoenix series rolled around, she could barely play. She only played 11 minutes in game 1. She still came back to put up 22 and 23 points in the final two games.

I don't think the implication that she performed poorly at crunch time in last year's playoffs is either fair or accurate. As for championships, she obviously never had a chance at Delaware. Just getting them to the Sweet 16 is a huge accomplishment. The Sky had never been to the playoffs before she arrived and in her 2nd year she took them to the Finals while battling a bad back. She may not have the championships, but she's a winner. She's only really had one fair shot (healthy and surrounded by sufficient talent) and that was her rookie year in the WNBA.

 

[Orangutan]

To respond to the OP: I would take Maya. I think she's a little bit more cold-blooded than Parker. EDD is tough to pick because of the Lyme and she seems to be a little fragile in general. I didn't really follow the women's game closely for much of Diana's career, so I could be underrating her. Statistically, Maya's numbers are a little better in the overall metrics (e.g. PER, Win Shares). Diana's intangibles are obviously off the charges, but so are Maya's, so I would lean towards Maya.

If we're taking the players at their current age, I definitely feel comfortable taking Maya (having seen all of them play in person within the last two season). If we're getting Diana in her athletic prime, it's possible that Diana is the better choice.

 

[Justavisitor]

1. Parker
2. Catchings
3. D.T.
4. EDD
5. Maya

 

[Orangutan]

Diana's intangibles are obviously off the charges

charts* It appears I can't type this morning.

 

[j66kicker]

Ralph Terry had a won lost record of 107-99 which is totally marginal, considering the juggernaut the Yankees were during his time with them. Bill Stafford had a 43-40 lifetime won lost record so for you to mention him is just a bit strange to me. They had a bit of success with the Yankees in a couple of year period during the very early 60's but not enough that I would mention their names in the same breath as Whitey Ford!

Yes, they both had success for a while and contributed to a number of championship seasons. Terry was 78-59 for the Yankees.

Fact: Ralph Terry had a 57% winning percentage as a Yankee and 42% as a non-Yankee.

Speculation: I think Mickey Mantle may have had something to do with it.

 

[Wally East]

Fact: Ralph Terry had a 57% winning percentage as a Yankee and 42% as a non-Yankee.

Speculation: I think Mickey Mantle may have had something to do with it.

View attachment 10454

You realize that's EXACTLY my point, right? Teammates determine your success.

 

[j66kicker]

You realize that's EXACTLY my point, right? Teammates determine your success.

From your post on Sunday: "Yeah, but to get those rings, Mickey also needed Whitey Ford, Bill Stafford, and Ralph Terry."

I don't think Ralph Terry made a lick of difference in Mickey's success - basically a 50/50 career pitcher only because he played with the Yankees for more than half of that career - his non-Yankee-aided record was 42%. It might be a stretch, but one could even infer that Mickey was successful in spite of Ralph Terry.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Really, really ...bleeping Mickey Mantle and Ralph Terry.... and OT snore SNORE that I have to click into 'cuz the thread is about a UConner I care about!!! Holy Merde.

 

[Wally East]

There is something to say for putting yourself in a place to succeed, putting in the very hard necessary to do so, and then getting it done.

And then choosing to go to UConn (or signing the Yankees.)

FWIW, two of Di's three championships were without an all-star complement of players. As noted by Geno, that's pretty special.

This idea that D played with four stuffed shirts needs to be put to bed.

Ann Strother was a high school NPOY. Barbara Turner was a USA Today and WBCA high school All-American. Ashley Battle was a WBCA All-American. Willnett Crockett was a WBCA high school All-American. (Crockett, Strother, and Turner were accompanied as incoming freshmen by Nicole Wolff, another WBCA high school All-American who got hurt and never was able to contribute. All in that class: Gillian Goring. I think she's going to transfer to UConn next year )

These were not players that struggled to make a varsity team in high school. They were really, really good players. Were they among the all-time greats at UConn? No but that is a ridiculously high standard.

Certainly far, far beyond players on EDD's Delaware teams.

I think ignoring titles won as a way to assess a a player in a team sport is (also) not great.

It's better than the alternative. Tony Gwynn is not any less of a hitter because he never played for a championship team. Neither is Ernie Banks.

 

[Wally East]

From your post on Sunday: "Yeah, but to get those rings, Mickey also needed Whitey Ford, Bill Stafford, and Ralph Terry."

I don't think Ralph Terry made a lick of difference in Mickey's success - basically a 50/50 career pitcher only because he played with the Yankees for more than half of that career - his non-Yankee-aided record was 42%. It might be a stretch, but one could even infer that Mickey was successful in spite of Ralph Terry.

Huh. Imagine that. A pitcher wins less games when not playing with the Yankees.

Terry had some good seasons early in his career and from 1959 through 1963, hwwas above average to well above average (yes, you can be an above-average pitcher and still go 3 and 7). He got hurt in 1964 and was never the same pitcher.

Stafford, from 1960 to 1965, ranged from about average to really, really good (except for 1963, when he was awful). By looking at the stats, I'd say his arm was destroyed by pitching more than 200 innings when he was just 23.

 

[j66kicker]

Tony Gwynn is not any less of a hitter because he never played for a championship team. Neither is Ernie Banks.

And Dan Marino was a great passer and Patrick Ewing was a great center. And EDD is a great rebounder and great shooter, and she's tall, and really pretty. DT is a great winner. Her teams win because of her. If I wanna WIN, I'm taking DT first every time.

 

[DaddyChoc]

And EDD is a great rebounder and great shooter, and she's tall, and really pretty..

matter of opinion

 

[Orangutan]

And Dan Marino was a great passer and Patrick Ewing was a great center. And EDD is a great rebounder and great shooter, and she's tall, and really pretty. DT is a great winner. Her teams win because of her. If I wanna WIN, I'm taking DT first every time.

Taurasi has also had way more chances to win and played on much better teams. There is obviously no fair comparison between UConn and Delaware, so we only really have two seasons of WNBA to judge Delle Donne on.

So far she's been to the playoffs twice, including the Finals once and the Sky are already clinched for the playoffs this year. Taurasi didn't make the WNBA playoffs until her 4th year.

Lumping Delle Donne in with Marino and Ewing at this stage of her career is frankly absurd.

 

[j66kicker]

Taurasi has also had way more chances to win and played on much better teams. There is obviously no fair comparison between UConn and Delaware, so we only really have two seasons of WNBA to judge Delle Donne on.

So far she's been to the playoffs twice, including the Finals once and the Sky are already clinched for the playoffs this year. Taurasi didn't make the WNBA playoffs until her 4th year.

Lumping Delle Donne in with Marino and Ewing at this stage of her career is frankly absurd.

All that's fine. If I'm picking my team, I pick DT first

 

[easttexastrash]

Are write-in votes allowed? I think even a little more height is needed.

After watching BG with DT and then without, I pick DT. She demands the best from her teammates and makes them better than they ever knew they could be.

 

[FAN11]

I would say Diana mainly because she runs the point and can effect the game in so many ways. I'm thinking that had EDD finished her career at UCONN, championships or not she'd recieve far more respect than she's getting. I would take her second in a heart beat.

 

[DaddyChoc]

her lack of finishing at uconn shows some that she isn't serious about being the head honcho of a team..., not sure if she'll finish what she starts. That's all.... but as a basketball player she's awesome

 

[Orangutan]

her lack of finishing at uconn shows some that she isn't serious about being the head honcho of a team..., not sure if she'll finish what she starts. That's all.... but as a basketball player she's awesome

People change between 18 and 26.

 

[DaddyChoc]

People change between 18 and 26.

again... in their prime, early on, not talking about the pro, before the Olympics etc. the criteria is all over the place that's why these things are silly.

and my post is why some will not pick her, still disgruntled. Wasn't talking about her changing just way people wouldn't select her

 

[Beemer]

And Dan Marino was a great passer and Patrick Ewing was a great center. And EDD is a great rebounder and great shooter, and she's tall, and really pretty. DT is a great winner. Her teams win because of her. If I wanna WIN, I'm taking DT first every time.

I absolutely agree with this. Diana is a great player- she's got skill, talent & work ethic to die for. But it is her attitude that makes her my #1 pick every time. She has that incredible drive to win and it is infectious.

 

[Orangutan]

again... in their prime, early on, not talking about the pro, before the Olympics etc. the criteria is all over the place that's why these things are silly.

and my post is why some will not pick her, still disgruntled. Wasn't talking about her changing just way people wouldn't select her

I kind of glossed over the "shows some" part the first time. My bad. So my post should have been - "Some people need to consider that people change between 18 and 26".

That's my inner Sky fan showing - I get defensive of EDD.

 

[triaddukefan]

My first pick would be Taurasi.

 

[Waquoit]

Delle Donne was obviously included for trolling purposes only.

 

[Wally East]

All that's fine. If I'm picking my team, I pick DT first

I'm assuming you'd take Holdsclaw over Moore.