Who succeeds Pat?

[Vowelguy]

eric, I agree up to a point.

It is difficult to replace legendary coaches, but as your KY & NC examples show, it can be done.

Secondly, one difference with men's basketball is still the limited number of women's programs that are serious contenders. No doubt that number has grown substantially in the past decade, but it is still dwarfed by the men's side. Just having a university that strongly supports WCBB - which TN surely has - puts them ahead of many others.

 

[EricLA]

eric, I agree up to a point.

It is difficult to replace legendary coaches, but as your KY & NC examples show, it can be done.

Secondly, one difference with men's basketball is still the limited number of women's programs that are serious contenders. No doubt that number has grown substantially in the past decade, but it is still dwarfed by the men's side. Just having a university that strongly supports WCBB - which TN surely has - puts them ahead of many others.

don't disagree. but in the cases of Kentucky, and UNC, the coaches who took over either had already won NC's elsewhere, or had a tremendous amount of success at previous places (ie. final 4's, etc). i still maintain that Kentucky and UNC are destination, dream-job schools for any MCBB head coach. on the women's side, schools like ND, Stanford, and Duke are probably destination schools. look at the recruiting success McCallie has had at Duke while Gail has pretty much flopped at Texas. and Texas/Austin is a hell of a better destination school than tennessee...

i'm not saying it can't be done. i'm just saying Tennessee fans are deluded if they think their future looks rosy because they are Tennessee...

 

[stwainfan]

what is "WCC"? i know WCB but not WCC... Women's College Canoodling?

as for the rest of what you said, it's interesting because there have been several treads about what would happen to both Tennessee and UCONN if/when Pat/Geno finally decided to hang it up. i tried pointing out that i thought Tennessee was like UCLA when they had Wooden, without the terrific campus, great location, or quality education. where has UCLA been since Wooden left? nowhere fast.

they have 11 NCAA championships, 10 under Wooden, and one in 1995 under Harrick. other than that, a complete goose egg. so people can talk about Tennessee having a super rich history, which it does, but once Pat goes, so does the main draw. Tennessee is an average academic school (not even in the top 100), average as far as college towns goes, and not a destination school unless you are looking for a decent football school, or a terrific WCBB school. Football won 6 NC's, but none since 1998, and the last one before that was in 1967. sure they usually have a good football team, but there are 16 teams with more NC's than tennessee football.

my point is WCBB at tennessee IS Pat Summitt. Just like WCBB at UCONN IS Geno Auriemma. Tennessee will be LUCKY to win one NC in WCBB after Pat leaves just like UCONN will be lucky to win one after Geno leaves. i know we don't want to hear it and we don't want to believe it, but history supports my statement. NC teams are about the head coach and who they recruit. Duke was nothing before Coach K. Indiana was little before and nothing after Knight. MCBB at UCONN was nothing before JC. UCLA MCBB was nothing before and after Wooden.

Kentucky and UNC might be the two exceptions to that as Rupp won 4, and Tubby, Pitino, and Hall each won one as HC. UNC might be the other exception as Guthridge has 1, Smith has 2 and Williams has 2. and i hate Calimari but he may well win another NC at Kentucky before NCAA violations catch up with him and he skedaddles...

Bottom line, IMHO Tennessee fans are delusional if they think anyone exists who can replace Pat, and even more in denial if they think the next generation will even come close to the success Pat had. this is why they (and we) should enjoy our legendary coaches while we can...

Eric I agree that there is no one who can replace Pat Summitt. A true legend like her can't be replaced.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Very good points, but -​

Mentioning Van seems pointless. Do we all realize how old he is? And he never had super great success at the college level - although he would argue that was because he had to play Tennessee all the time.​

 

[Icebear]

I cannot imagine TN hiring any man as a head coach in place of Pat. I think that simply would be unacceptable to too many involved.

 

[jdubct]

The question remains how long does she want to continue to coach. I would imagine, like other coaching giants (Joe Paterno, for example), she will want to continue to coach as long as she thinks she can do a good job. Could be 1 year, could be 3 years, could be 5 years. Who knows. At the time when she wants to step down, I would imagine that she would be replaced by a current or ex-Tennessee coach.

 

[Vowelguy]

The question remains how long does she want to continue to coach. I would imagine, like other coaching giants (Joe Paterno, for example), she will want to continue to coach as long as she thinks she can do a good job. Could be 1 year, could be 3 years, could be 5 years. Who knows. At the time when she wants to step down, I would imagine that she would be replaced by a current or ex-Tennessee coach.

She said that she'd like to coach for 3 more years. While that's not carved in stone, I took that as some indication of how she thought the disease would progress. And to some extent as an upper bound on that.

I imagine that this season (or next) she will transition to being more of a figure-head, with DeMoss or Warlick taking over day-to-day operations, setting up the next coach.

 

[ScarlettB]

I think UT might want to consider taking the route Florida State took when choosing a replacement for Bobby Bowden. They should start immediately to either look for their next head coach and hire them as associate head coach under Pat starting with the 2012-2013 season, or if they are going to promote one of their assistants, make it known as soon as possible. This will stabilize the program and should help with recruiting. They should be able to avoid the unpleasantness of forcing Pat to retire before she is ready (as with Bobby) as Pat will retire due to her illness, not because some of the boosters and fans think that the legend is too old to coach and that the game has passed them by.

 

[Icebear]

She said that she'd like to coach for 3 more years. While that's not carved in stone, I took that as some indication of how she thought the disease would progress. And to some extent as an upper bound on that.

I imagine that this season (or next) she will transition to being more of a figure-head, with DeMoss or Warlick taking over day-to-day operations, setting up the next coach.

This is very close to what I think will happen.

 

[stamfordhusky]

Some men's coaches should be considered. Off the top of my head, I would suggest Chuck Martin at Marist, and Steve Alford at UNM.
I don't think Muffet Mcgraw will be offered the job. If she is offered the job, there is a very good chance, she will take it.

Chuck Martin??? He has done a terrible job at Marist and will almost certainly be fired at the end of the year.

 

[Waquoit]

Doesn't matter who replaces Pat. They are just another program the minute she hangs it up.

 

[Vowelguy]

Doesn't matter who replaces Pat. They are just another program the minute she hangs it up.

Not true.

 

[KnightBridgeAZ]

Have to agree with Vowelguy -

Tennessee's future will be entirely dependent on who they hire. As discussed earlier in the thread, it could work out not so well, but the right coach might be able to continue a tradition of success. While a Tennessee fan might not want to consider falling from a unique position to "just" a contender, there are not very many good schools that can be considered more than that.

Slippage - unquestionable; "just another program" - doubtful.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Caldwell is not the obvious choice if Pat retires sooner rather than later. She does not have a lot of head coaching experience.

Honestly, I see this as a Bill Guthridge situation. Gut was holding the place for Dean's successor for three years (thought to be Roy Williams, but it was delayed by the D'Oh era). I could see Warlick coaching for three years, depending on when Pat retires, then allowing someone from the TN family to take over. The sooner Pat retires, the more likely there will be someone like Warlick to hold the position. If Pat continues for five more years, Caldwell, if successful at LSU, could step right in.

 

[Waquoit]

Not true.

Yeah, it's true. Same with UConn. There is nothing inherent about TN that says top program besides Pat.

 

[codger]

I would guess either Mickie DeMoss or Nicki Caldwell. In any event it will either be a past or present Summitt assistant, or a UT alumna.

I do not see Jeff Walz, although that would be a good choice. Muffet won't move from such a great situation she currently has.

 

[avolfan]

I think when PHS steps down, Tenn. will go after a proven head coach. Probably Caldwell first. Tenn. will slip some, but will still remain a premier program. Simply too many good players within 250 miles of Knoxville for someone like Caldwell not to get several of them.

 

[Buckaroobanzai]

Caldwell is the obvious choice. If I were the UT administration, I'd be keeping an eye on Walz, who they might be able to sneak out of Louisville for an opportunity like Tennessee. Other than those two, I'm not sure if there are other sure things. I don't think McGraw would move that this time in her career (but who knows). McGuff has had some success at Xavier, but I have not seen them enough to have a sense of his coaching ability. Who else is out there?

The other factor here is that this disease sometimes moves slowly. I wouldn't be surprised to see Summitt have another several years left in her.

 

[Vowelguy]

Yeah, it's true. Same with UConn. There is nothing inherent about TN that says top program besides Pat.

(1) University support
(2) Prime location near recruits in hotbeds Georgia, Ohio, Indiana, deep south, and Carolina
(3) A top-5/top-10 fan base
(4) Great facilities, built via past success
(5) Tradition & history
(6) BB Alumni

 

[Vowelguy]

Honestly, I see this as a Bill Guthridge situation. Gut was holding the place for Dean's successor for three years (thought to be Roy Williams, but it was delayed by the D'Oh era). I could see Warlick coaching for three years, depending on when Pat retires, then allowing someone from the TN family to take over. The sooner Pat retires, the more likely there will be someone like Warlick to hold the position. If Pat continues for five more years, Caldwell, if successful at LSU, could step right in.

I agree with this. It also would avoid the curse of the coach-who-follows-a-legend.

 

[stwainfan]

Both Caldwell and Harper have more head coaching experience than Walz did when he went to Louisville.

 

[doggydaddy]

(1) University support
(2) Prime location near recruits in hotbeds Georgia, Ohio, Indiana, deep south, and Carolina
(3) A top-5/top-10 fan base
(4) Great facilities, built via past success
(5) Tradition & history
(6) BB Alumni

What is different about this situation than UCLA when Wooden left?

 

[EricLA]

What is different about this situation than UCLA when Wooden left?

well it's UCONN. or tennessee. i seriously don't get why people think UCONN and Tennessee will be super successful once Pat and Geno leave. there is zero historical proof. it would be far different if one or the other were named Duke, but neither is. Kentucky and UNC men are the only 2 shools that have shown an uber successful head coach can leave and eventually be replaced by someone else who can win a NC or two. ZERO historical proof on the women's side.

i know a lot of fans of both schools live in fantasy land. both schools will enjoy some success once Pat and Geno leave, but it will be NOTHING like it is now. and by the way, the only reason the UCONN fan base is so active is because we've had so much success. you think attendance was off the past 2-3 years? watch what happens when UCONN is the 2nd or 3rd best team in the big east and making the elite 8 is considered a great season...

 

[Vowelguy]

What is different about this situation than UCLA when Wooden left?

I don't know enough about UCLA in the 70s to answer. But again I'd emphasize the gap between the top women's programs and the rest is quite large.

The vast majority of other schools have no chance of achieving #1, 3, or 4 in the next decade.

Geno once made a comment (which I'm surely butchering) along the lines of "any school could be as successful as us if they just tried. But most schools don't care about WCBB."

 

[Vowelguy]

well it's UCONN. or tennessee. i seriously don't get why people think UCONN and Tennessee will be super successful once Pat and Geno leave. there is zero historical proof. it would be far different if one or the other were named Duke, but neither is. Kentucky and UNC men are the only 2 shools that have shown an uber successful head coach can leave and eventually be replaced by someone else who can win a NC or two. ZERO historical proof on the women's side.

But there are few examples for women's basketball period. How many examples are there of WCBB teams being uber successful and then falling off? Few, since so many of the pioneering coaches are still active.

- Purdue strikes me as a program that has managed to be successful through a series of coaches. F4 under Dunn in 94. NC in 99 under Peck.

- Duke is still strong under McCallie (though, yes, down a peg).

- Rutgers followed up Grentz (1982 NC) with Stringer (multiple F4s).

- LSU was as successful under Chatman than Gunter.