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How could a 2 seed be the most dominant team in the tourney? Based on your logic it would have to be one of the 1 seeds, since you're arguing that seeding equates exactly to how good a team is.
When the history of Big East Basketball is written....
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And LOL at anyone suggesting that a team that wins 11 consecutive neutral court games in March/April (including Georgetown, Pitt, Syracuse, Lousville, San Diego State, Arizona, Kentucky, and Butler) was just "lucky."
No more ludicrous than anything you have posted. LOL at you talking about seeding.
Here's a question, what was the seed of the team that terrified Cuse fans the most in 2003?
Answer: 5 seed. UConn would have curb stomped Cuse and Boeheim would have been at zero NC's. Cuse got lucky not to face UConn that year.
Sidenote:
2011 was a very interesting tournament. UConn was the only team in the final four that didn't beat a #1 seed to make the final four.
UConn took out a 14, 6, 2 (three highest seeds it could have played in the first three rounds as a #3), 5, 4, 8 but you really need to look at it closer as to why UConn didn't play a #1.
- Arizona (#5) took out #12 Memphis, #4 Texas, #1 Duke by 16.
- UK (#4) took out #13, #5, #1 OSU by 2, #2 UNC by 7
- Heck, even Butler beat #9, #1 Pitt by 1, #4, #2 Florida by 3, before playing an easy #11.
- Of course #11 VCU beat #6, #3, #10, #1 Kansas by 10.
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9 neutral court, 2 road games. Good thing we had all that luck.
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Waaaahhhhh!! Again, you are comparing our weakest championship team to you're only one. Go back home with your tail between your legs.
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What's up with these Cuse fans?
"But, but, but, but, we were great in the '80's and good every subsequent decade. Therefore, we are the face of the Big East."
Since 1990, UConn has been the only elite team from the conference. Minus a decade, the Cuse is 2 decades behind us. We've carried this league.
"But, but, but, but, we were great in the '80's and good every subsequent decade. Therefore, we are the face of the Big East."
Since 1990, UConn has been the only elite team from the conference. Minus a decade, the Cuse is 2 decades behind us. We've carried this league.
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We played SDSU 90 miles from their campus in 2011 (plus a virtual road game vs Arizona - easy weekend trip down I-10 for those folks). Syracuse got to play 90 miles from its campus in 2003.
In fairness to corduroy here, he actually did raise one good point (even a stopped clock...) A 2-seed can indeed be the most dominant team in a tournament. We proved that in 2004.
But the best thing about our titles is we won them with different people and different styles: there was a masterpiece in 1999, an offensive clinic in 2004, and a defensive clinic in 2011. A little bit of everything - shows we weren't just a one trick pony who caught a break one time.
In fairness to corduroy here, he actually did raise one good point (even a stopped clock...) A 2-seed can indeed be the most dominant team in a tournament. We proved that in 2004.
But the best thing about our titles is we won them with different people and different styles: there was a masterpiece in 1999, an offensive clinic in 2004, and a defensive clinic in 2011. A little bit of everything - shows we weren't just a one trick pony who caught a break one time.
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Has a Big East team leaving for the ACC done anything? No. Good luck becoming irrelevant on Tobacco Road.
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The funny thing about the 2 seed comment is he's really just undermining his main point. He's saying we got lucky because we played lower seeded teams, while at the same time saying that a team's seed is not necessarily indicative of how good that team is at the point when the tournament starts.
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Similiar to how they have a 4 page thread ragging on ray lewis who they find guilty of murder despite the court not finding him or the other two guys tried as such while at the same time declaring bernie fine innocent because he was never found guilty by the court.
They are very very delusional out there. Great comedic relief on slow days though.
OkaForPrez
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There's enough swiss cheese in his logic to make a helluva fondue.
Can't say beating Butler for a 'ship taints it when that same nucleus punked your one-seed selves out in the Sweet 16 the year before (then did it again to Pitt in '11 for good measure).
Can't say beating Butler for a 'ship taints it when that same nucleus punked your one-seed selves out in the Sweet 16 the year before (then did it again to Pitt in '11 for good measure).
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They were a half-court shot (that wasn't far off) from being defending national champions, for .
Is Duke's championship invalidated since they beat a 4-seed for the title, and a 2 seed was the highest they played?
Inyatkin
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It's really not surprising they're getting antsy, though. We were the same way when our mid-90s regular season dominance didn't translate into the tournament. That 49-5 run was ridiculous, but made for some pretty painful Marches. At this point you know Syracuse is just dreading the start of the NCAAs.
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It's been 5 hours since the last post. I guess the Cuse fans did the right thing and ran away with their tails between their legs. Even though they won't admit it, they obviously know their place.
jleves
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We all agree, UConn sucked in the 80s and Cuse was solid but still not the best in the conference. That's a pretty big reason for a 43 game lead. We'll give you that. Without bothering to try to look it up and gather the numbers, you may have more BE wins since 1990.
So here is a simple question for you: Would you give up 43 BE wins for two more National Championships? You might say no, but from my seat, I wouldn't give up 2 rings for 43 more big east wins.
Similar question: Would you rather be 9-9 in the BE and win the BE Tourney and a National Championship or would you prefer to be 15-3 in the BE and not win either? Again, I know what I would choose.
Bottom line is May - October, people talk about who won the tournaments, not who won the most games in conference. You can keep piling up regular season wins; we're happy to keep piling up Championships.
It sucks we're without a conference that really matters, but you will continue to be solid in the ACC and be the 2nd or 3rd best team in the conference. Unless we join, then you will have to settle for 3rd or 4th best. Wouldn't that be a frucking nightmare?
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Everyone remember's the halfcourt shot missing since it was so dramatic. But they also had a legit chance before that - with five seconds left and Duke up one, Hayward missed a 10-foot baseline fadeaway that was right on line - just went off the back rim (Duke got the rebound, got fouled, made first, missed second on purpose, and then the halfcourt heave).
We don't know what would have happened had Hayward made that one, of course. Duke would have had five seconds left to go coast-to-coast, and with no Trajan Langdon around for a face plant, they might have succeeded.
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Well, duh, it is. It takes half a brain to figure that out.
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Cuse fans have grown increasingly jealous since our third ring created wide separation between our programs. They perceive themselves as equal to or better than uconn, and with a longer history and more recent conference success. But the numbers show we have been better at cementing our seasons with trophies, whereas they are very consistently good but fall a bit short in crunch time.
What bothers me is that they all are ecstatic that uconn has been banned from tourney and does not have a conf to go to in realignment. They want uconn to be banished back to Yankee league. This is jealousy talking. If the roles were reversed I would be cheering for cuse to get into the ACC and allow our rivalry to continue, to play it out on the court. And to make the conf better and more fun to watch. I think most uconn fans agree with me here. But cuse fans don't want that, they want us gone, so they can sort of maneuver around their jealousy and have a reason to believe they are better. Because, if we stay on even terms with them in termsi of recruiting, they know we will win the big ones when they don't.
I'm a fan of Boeheim, but their fans have become tough to deal with. Shame they don't want the rivalry to go on and build, could be great if we do eventually get to ACC.
What bothers me is that they all are ecstatic that uconn has been banned from tourney and does not have a conf to go to in realignment. They want uconn to be banished back to Yankee league. This is jealousy talking. If the roles were reversed I would be cheering for cuse to get into the ACC and allow our rivalry to continue, to play it out on the court. And to make the conf better and more fun to watch. I think most uconn fans agree with me here. But cuse fans don't want that, they want us gone, so they can sort of maneuver around their jealousy and have a reason to believe they are better. Because, if we stay on even terms with them in termsi of recruiting, they know we will win the big ones when they don't.
I'm a fan of Boeheim, but their fans have become tough to deal with. Shame they don't want the rivalry to go on and build, could be great if we do eventually get to ACC.
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Your only championship came from the heavens because of the ultimate one-and-done player who bolted town so fast I'm suprised you even remember his name. If not for him making a 6 month stop on campus, Boeheim may have been thrown out with his friend Bernie Fine.
So by my handle you see I'm a Syracuse fan. I'm also an alum ('87) and I live in Connecticut.
I registered for your site because I felt I had to comment in this thread.
Here's the deal - Anyone, and I mean anyone, who says that Syracuse is the most successful program in the history of the Big East is simply wrong. As much as it pains me to say it, it is just undeniable. Connecticut is far and away the most successful program in the history of the league. And believe me, I truly, truly hate saying it. It drives me crazy. I was a student in the mid '80's during the heyday of the Big East. UConn was an afterthought in those days. To say that now in 2013, they are THE program of the conference just speaks to the amount of success they've had.
As you all say, 3 Championships. Period. End of story. Nobody else in the conference has more than 1.
UConn & Georgetown have 7 BE tourney titles. Syracuse has 5. St. John's is next closest with 3. Again though, no contest.
Regular season titles - UConn - 7, Syracuse, 7. Only category where the two schools compare.
The only thing I can say that Syracuse has over Connecticut is that Syracuse has been the more consistently good team of the two during the entire life of the Big East. Syracuse's regular season and tourney titles have come in each decade of the conference's existence. UConn didn't win their first regular season title until '89-'90 (when they shared it with Syracuse) and their first BE Tourney that same year.
In reading this thread I find it ridiculous to see that a Syracuse fan says that SU should have 3 Championships, if, if, if..... Well, guess what? If my grandmother had a dick she'd be my grandfather. Bottom line is that SU does NOT have 3, they have ONE. Connecticut has 3. And it does not matter what the seed was in the tournament and who either team played.
All you really have to say to anyone who tries to compare the two programs and thinks Syracuse is the better of the two over the history of the conference is this: If you swap the history of the two teams. Do you think you'd find one Syracuse fan that would say UConn was better? Nope. They'd do just what you are doing - point to those 3 trophies and laugh at you.
Look - I love my school, love being a fan, am very proud of their history. But there are levels. At the top is Kentucky, Indiana, UCLA, the next tier is Duke, UNC and UConn. Is Syracuse in that third tier? Yeah, maybe but even if they are - and that's debatable, the third tie is still a far, far cry from the second and UConn is closer to the first tier than SU is to the second.
Again - I hate UConn, I hate all you guys who root for UConn but its not even a debate.
I do however think that when the average fan across the country thinks 'Big East', they think Syracuse and Georgetown before they think UConn. That's the national perception of the conference and its simply a result of the rivalry that SU and G'town developed in the '80's on ESPN.
In closing let me say that I think that having a program like UConn's twisting in the wind looking for a conference home is a travesty. I really think that the ACC is the perfect place for the Huskies and hope that's where they'll wind up. Unfortunately I think your fate is tied to Notre Dame deciding what to do with football and we all know how that's gone in the past.
I registered for your site because I felt I had to comment in this thread.
Here's the deal - Anyone, and I mean anyone, who says that Syracuse is the most successful program in the history of the Big East is simply wrong. As much as it pains me to say it, it is just undeniable. Connecticut is far and away the most successful program in the history of the league. And believe me, I truly, truly hate saying it. It drives me crazy. I was a student in the mid '80's during the heyday of the Big East. UConn was an afterthought in those days. To say that now in 2013, they are THE program of the conference just speaks to the amount of success they've had.
As you all say, 3 Championships. Period. End of story. Nobody else in the conference has more than 1.
UConn & Georgetown have 7 BE tourney titles. Syracuse has 5. St. John's is next closest with 3. Again though, no contest.
Regular season titles - UConn - 7, Syracuse, 7. Only category where the two schools compare.
The only thing I can say that Syracuse has over Connecticut is that Syracuse has been the more consistently good team of the two during the entire life of the Big East. Syracuse's regular season and tourney titles have come in each decade of the conference's existence. UConn didn't win their first regular season title until '89-'90 (when they shared it with Syracuse) and their first BE Tourney that same year.
In reading this thread I find it ridiculous to see that a Syracuse fan says that SU should have 3 Championships, if, if, if..... Well, guess what? If my grandmother had a dick she'd be my grandfather. Bottom line is that SU does NOT have 3, they have ONE. Connecticut has 3. And it does not matter what the seed was in the tournament and who either team played.
All you really have to say to anyone who tries to compare the two programs and thinks Syracuse is the better of the two over the history of the conference is this: If you swap the history of the two teams. Do you think you'd find one Syracuse fan that would say UConn was better? Nope. They'd do just what you are doing - point to those 3 trophies and laugh at you.
Look - I love my school, love being a fan, am very proud of their history. But there are levels. At the top is Kentucky, Indiana, UCLA, the next tier is Duke, UNC and UConn. Is Syracuse in that third tier? Yeah, maybe but even if they are - and that's debatable, the third tie is still a far, far cry from the second and UConn is closer to the first tier than SU is to the second.
Again - I hate UConn, I hate all you guys who root for UConn but its not even a debate.
I do however think that when the average fan across the country thinks 'Big East', they think Syracuse and Georgetown before they think UConn. That's the national perception of the conference and its simply a result of the rivalry that SU and G'town developed in the '80's on ESPN.
In closing let me say that I think that having a program like UConn's twisting in the wind looking for a conference home is a travesty. I really think that the ACC is the perfect place for the Huskies and hope that's where they'll wind up. Unfortunately I think your fate is tied to Notre Dame deciding what to do with football and we all know how that's gone in the past.
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Jeez, it does exist.
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Orange, well written post.
As far as the national perception that Cuse and Gtown are the first two BE teams that are thought of is hard to say. I think older people *may* think that but people 30 and under probably still put UConn up there. Since UConn asserted themselves from say 1990 on you would think that a kid who started watching college hoops at 10 years old is now in their early 30's and probably thinks UConn as the #1 team if not in the top 2.
I'd say you should stick around but what's the point since our rivalry may be dead due to CR. Nice to see a Cuse fan who isnt afraid to keep the rivalry going instead of hiding under the fake "recruiting" excuses for not wanting us to join the ACC. Your fanbase is starting to look as weak as BC fans who were tired of us beating them down for so long.
As far as the national perception that Cuse and Gtown are the first two BE teams that are thought of is hard to say. I think older people *may* think that but people 30 and under probably still put UConn up there. Since UConn asserted themselves from say 1990 on you would think that a kid who started watching college hoops at 10 years old is now in their early 30's and probably thinks UConn as the #1 team if not in the top 2.
I'd say you should stick around but what's the point since our rivalry may be dead due to CR. Nice to see a Cuse fan who isnt afraid to keep the rivalry going instead of hiding under the fake "recruiting" excuses for not wanting us to join the ACC. Your fanbase is starting to look as weak as BC fans who were tired of us beating them down for so long.
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This is annoying. I really prefer the delusional, bitter, butthurt Cuse fans who try to diminish our accomplishments and project how we will suck in the future in order to make themselves feel better about their own accomplishments.
I get a lot of laughs out of those guys. You just seem intelligent and reasonable. I hope this is not a trend.
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If The Cuse wins the BE regular season, AND the BE tourney, AND the national championship this year, then MAYBE they would have a case:
BE regular season: Syracuse 11, UConn 10
BE tournament: UConn 7, Syracuse 6
National Championships: UConn 3, Syracuse 2
Final 4: UConn 4 - Syracuse 4
Elite 8s: UConn 9 - Syracuse 6
Sweet 16s: Syracuse 15 - UConn 13
NCAA Appearances: Syracuse 27 - UConn 18
That would make us about even in the BE, and close to even in the NCAAs. Yes we would still have 3 NC vs. their 2, but the overall NCAA success is pretty close. But that said, I think the best you could call it would be a tie.
I'm not holding my breath......
BE regular season: Syracuse 11, UConn 10
BE tournament: UConn 7, Syracuse 6
National Championships: UConn 3, Syracuse 2
Final 4: UConn 4 - Syracuse 4
Elite 8s: UConn 9 - Syracuse 6
Sweet 16s: Syracuse 15 - UConn 13
NCAA Appearances: Syracuse 27 - UConn 18
That would make us about even in the BE, and close to even in the NCAAs. Yes we would still have 3 NC vs. their 2, but the overall NCAA success is pretty close. But that said, I think the best you could call it would be a tie.
I'm not holding my breath......
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