I wanted to highlight this line because IMO this is why the waiver was not accepted. You could remove the suddenly because Uconn under Calhoun has been working around the rules quite often. Not to say lots of other schools don't operate the same way because they do, but when the NCAA is pretty nice with the Miles thing and lets you have last years tourney which you win making them look really stupid and weak only to see you follow up the scholly penalty by laughing and pointing at them with the #1 recruit walking on . . . . . . well this shouldn't be a shock. I'm not saying its right or fair or that I like the NCAA but the world has always worked this way because people run it and it always will.
Waiver Request Denied by NCAA
- Thread starter jfuchs91
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I wanted to highlight this line because IMO this is why the waiver was not accepted. You could remove the suddenly because Uconn under Calhoun has been working around the rules quite often. Not to say lots of other schools don't operate the same way because they do, but when the NCAA is pretty nice with the Miles thing and lets you have last years tourney which you win making them look really stupid and weak only to see you follow up the scholly penalty by laughing and pointing at them with the #1 recruit walking on . . . . . . well this shouldn't be a shock. I'm not saying its right or fair or that I like the NCAA but the world has always worked this way because people run it and it always will.
BRS24
LisaG
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Ok, so this is what confuses me. My husband even asked, how can Calipari consistently churn and burn the one and domes at KY and not be penalized?
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I not sure if understand the conditions of the waiver. Would all BE schools forfiet revenue from participating in the '13 tournament if the waiver was granted?
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Any lawyers on the board...is this something that UCONN could take to court if all of other options (the appeal) are exhausted? Like someone earlier said, to change the rules after they have already happened, and after you have already been punished seems unconstitutional. I know the NCAA lives in its own world, but still...
Also, it is important to note that back in October, Walt Harrison (the committee chairperson) did say he was in favor of using the 2010-2011 and 2011-2012 years for data. The concern though is that different schools have different schedules (i.e. trimesters, semesters, quarters, etc.) making it difficult to collect the data. It will be interesting to see this play out.
Also, it is important to note that back in October, Walt Harrison (the committee chairperson) did say he was in favor of using the 2010-2011 and 2011-2012 years for data. The concern though is that different schools have different schedules (i.e. trimesters, semesters, quarters, etc.) making it difficult to collect the data. It will be interesting to see this play out.
This is a great argument. Probably the best argument, when combined with the fact that they are currently subject to the loss of scholarship penalties.
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All you need is to leave school in good standing in your classes. If you take a few intersession courses in December, or summer classes prior to freshman year, then all you need to do is maintain the minimum credits (2 courses). If those courses are filled with athletes and the professor allows them to finish the class post April 3 electronically (i.e. 3 more weeks of study online) then you leave in good standing.
And that's as good as having a kid graduate.
In fact, it's better, since the course offerings for juniors and seniors constrict as they meed to meet requirements, but for freshman like those at Kentucky, you can design the curriculum pretty easily to keep them eligible and keep the APR intact.
In short, the APR is a figleaf for college presidents to pretend that they are doing something about the education of basketball players.
If they really cared, they'd raise admissions standards but that would maybe hurt the bottom line.
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It sucks that UConn will not be eligible for 2013, but it seems like somebody at the top dropped the ball, maybe intentionally. The school President and AD are fighting this hard and I think they will get it done, eventually. The NCAA is punishing the wrong people.
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Just come out and say it, I have no idea what the hell your post means
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""A review of points lost in the Academic Progress Rate cohort comprised of the 2007-2008 through 2010-11 academic years show that three student-athletes who departed the University to pursue professional opportunities left academically ineligible. [Information redacted.] Had those student-athletes maintained their eligibility through the conclusion of the Spring semester, the Men's Basketball multi-year Academic Progress Rate score reported during the 2011-2012 academic year would have been 921 . . . providing us access to the post-season." The three Connecticut players who left early to turn pro during that timeframe, according to NBA early-entry lists, were Kemba Walker, Hasheem Thabeet and Ater Majok."
"Prior to the start of the 2011-12 season, a new position was added to the men's basketball staff - an assistant director of men's basketball administration, whose primary job is working with the team academic counselor and performing duties including "directly monitoring class attendance of the student-athletes.""
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/coll...enalty-ncaa-tournament-jim-calhoun/53036476/1
"Prior to the start of the 2011-12 season, a new position was added to the men's basketball staff - an assistant director of men's basketball administration, whose primary job is working with the team academic counselor and performing duties including "directly monitoring class attendance of the student-athletes.""
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/coll...enalty-ncaa-tournament-jim-calhoun/53036476/1
""A review of points lost in the Academic Progress Rate cohort comprised of the 2007-2008 through 2010-11 academic years show that three student-athletes who departed the University to pursue professional opportunities left academically ineligible. [Information redacted.] Had those student-athletes maintained their eligibility through the conclusion of the Spring semester, the Men's Basketball multi-year Academic Progress Rate score reported during the 2011-2012 academic year would have been 921 . . . providing us access to the post-season." The three Connecticut players who left early to turn pro during that timeframe, according to NBA early-entry lists, were Kemba Walker, Hasheem Thabeet and Ater Majok."
Don't understand this. I thought leaving earl to play professionally doesn't hurt APR?
Don't understand this. I thought leaving earl to play professionally doesn't hurt APR?
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It doesn't if the student leaves in good academic standing, ie. finishes their last semester. I guess these three left and did not finish their course work for the Spring. It's not clear if anyone was trying to get them to finish up before they left.
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You can't just stop attending classes. You have to leave and still be eligible for the next season. None of those guys were, apparently. I thought Kemba graduated early though, so I'm doubting the accuracy of the list of players.
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Kemba was ahead of schedule. We didn't lose credit for him - it's been confirmed that last year's team only lost one point, and it was for Jamal Coombs-McDaniel.
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Really now that I think about it, the list could be any UConn player that is now a professional. You can abandon your classes in the second semester of your senior year just as easily as you can your junior year, so it wasn't definitely those three guys.
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UConn identified 3 athletes in its 100 page report to the NCAA. The names were redacted in the version the USA Today looked through. The USA Today speculated on who those 3 were. I suspect they got it wrong.
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Uh, Majok left before classes started in September. Walker is definitely not someone who hurts them, and you seem to have confused the word "pro" with the NBA. Pro means you get paid to play ball.
The problem with your (USA Today's) reading of this is that it says nothing about leaving early to pursue professional opportunities. The three most likely were Robinson, Edwards and one other. Thabeet may have been the third but not Dyson, Adrien, Kemba or Majok from what I have heard.
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These are quotes from the article, I didn't write any of it, read the article.
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As I recall Kemba has one course to finish and did not graduate.
mets1090
Probably returning some video tapes...
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True but he was still academically eligible. Being one course shy implies he finished all of his courses in the Spring, which means he was still academically eligible for the following semester.
It doesn't matter if Kemba did or did not graduate for APR purposes. He was well beyond where he needed to be for his class credit wise. Now if his not finishing made his GPA drop below whatever the NCAA says it has to be, then it would be a problem. To my knowledge he was fine both in terms of credits and GPA.
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I'm pretty sure Kemba took a class first semester to graduate
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I like the cut of his jib
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I have a more fundamentla question that I haven't seen answered anywhere...Was there some sort of deadline as to why UCONN submitted its application for the waiver BEFORE naming the new AD? Seems to me that adding his resume, especially his experience at Buffalo with exactly this issue of teams not meeting the APR would have greatly strengthened the argument. To say nothing of having his input on the proposal which will significantly impactthe operations of his department next year...
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I think the idea was to submit the waiver as quickly as possible. As long as this is hanging out there unresolved, only bad things can happen. Recruits won't commit for next year, our guys will start thinking about not coming back, etc.
Plus, I'm pretty convinced that there was nothing we could have added to the waiver that would have made it acceptable in the NCAA's mind.
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The committee is meeting this month on this issue. UConn needed both the initial proposal and the appeal heard prior to the meeting. The first time Manuel talked to someone from UConn was on Friday.
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I figured there must have been some kind of time constraint. I couldn't figure out any other reason why, given Manuel's history, it wouldn't be at least logical to include him and get his input. And while he didn't interview formallly before Firday, by most accounts he was the preferred candidate for quite a while, so I'm pretty sure there had been at least informal communications with UCONN prior to Friday. And it just seems to me that you build your strongest case, regardless of the NCAA's potential action, and our case would have been that much stronger had we been able to say that we have appointed a new AD who is uniquely experienced in dealing with this issue (oh, and by the way, he's a minority...it never hurts to work ont he white guilt, especially of academics, lol) and then recap his UB experience...
RS9999X
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2009-10 scholarships
Kemba Walker
Stanley Robinson
Jerome Dyson
Gavin Edwards
Alex Oriakhi
Alex Bailey?
Ater Majok
Jamal Coombs-McDaniel
Donnell Beverly
Charles Okwandu
Darius Smith
Jamaal Trice
Jonathan Mandeldove
2009-10 roster (APR of 826) is a 38 of 46 points. Majok was 1 semester. Mandelove was likely 1 semester.
I score it something like this:
Majok 1/1. Left eligible after 1 semester and went pro.
Smith 3/4. Eligible transfer
Trice 2/4, Ineligible transfer
Edwards 3/3: Eligible pro
'Dyson 2/4: Ineligible pro
Robinson 2/4: Inelible pro
Mandelove 1/2.: Ineligible Retain
That group: 14/22 total
Everyone else 4/4 or 24/24 total
Team total 36/48
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