Vols/UConn Series Might be Renewed

[Icebear]

Renotony wrote: "I obviously feel differently. I choose not to let some who descend "into vulgarity and ugliness" dictate how I feel and prefer not to give them the satisfaction that they somehow have changed my life. I will always feel that ending that series was the most disrespectful thing that Pat and/or Geno did to WCBB. You can choose who you believe is to blame."

 

[RadyLady]

wow - just wow

 

[reno tony]

I must say that in your lack of background you have done both the Boneyard and UConn coaches and administration an injustice. The end of the series was a unilateral Tennessee decision directly attributed to Pat Summit. There was no craziness going on here over the Tennessee hooligans. Occasionally one of their trolls would show up and try to rile things up, and once in a while they would get something going that quickly was locked down. Pat and her minions attacks upon UConn and Geno did create understandable discussion and a good deal of justifiable ill will. Personally I will be glad to see the dead rivalry stay buried as long as Tennessee carries on the attitude of the Summit era.

I took background from a post directed to me earlier in this thread concerning what went on in the boneyard during the craziness and I was lead to believe that even the most diplomatic of bloggers became frustrated and lashed out in irrational ways. But I have been reading and watching UCONN WBB for 25 years now. And I will restate that the worse thing that happened has been the termination of THE series.

I believe it is the responsibility of the Athletic Directors to direct and the coaches to coach. Obviously the coaches should have some input, but the A.D.s are ultimately responsible for their school's athletic departments. That means at TENN as well. More complicated differences have been overcome than some coach getting his/her undies in a bunch. I hope people that have better attitudes than some on this blog are the ones making the decision on the reinstatement of the UCONN/TENN series. It is a complete shame that two teams that share 16 titles between them don't play...... such a shame.

 

[reno tony]

Renotony wrote: "I obviously feel differently. I choose not to let some who descend "into vulgarity and ugliness" dictate how I feel and prefer not to give them the satisfaction that they somehow have changed my life. I will always feel that ending that series was the most disrespectful thing that Pat and/or Geno did to WCBB. You can choose who you believe is to blame."

I left the decision to others and chose not to take a side.

 

[Icebear]

I left the decision to others and chose not to take a side.

None the less Geno had no say, never did and had no part or responsibility for the cancellation. There was no decision for others to make as you implied.

 

[msf22b]

You weren't here then. You didn't have the Compliance office call you about a SIGN. You didn't have someone request the FBI look into one of your posts. You didn't see the ethnic slur about Geno. You didn't have posts used against UConn.


It was personal. It still is for many here. You won't change that.

Doggy

I am reminded of what one of my idols Herr Mozart had to say about this sort of situation
.
In Dr. Bartolo's aria (Act I/4) in the Marriage of Figaro (lyrics by Lorenzo da Ponte), Bartolo (10 years earlier) had managed to lose control of his youthful ward, whom he had intended to marry (in the best commedia tradition), in part due to the machinations of the local barber, Figaro

A decade later, his anger and thoughts of revenge are unabated. (all chronicled in Rossini's opera, written 30 years or so later)

I always thought this backwards Golden Rule a perfect antidote to long term holders of grudges.

La vendetta, oh, la vendetta! Vengeance, oh, vengeance
È un piacer serbato ai saggi. Is a pleasure reserved for the wise
L'obliar l'onte e gli oltraggi To overlook affront and insult
è bassezza, è ognor viltà. Belongs to the base and cowardly

(emphasis mine).

 

[Kibitzer]

Where did I say Geno ended the series?

When you said: "I feel both school's [sic] athletic departments let all WCBB fans down by discontinuing this series."

That's when you wanted Geno to share the blame with Pat when the action to end the series was solely, exclusively and unilaterally by her.

Got it now?

 

[reno tony]

When you said: "I feel both school's [sic] athletic departments let all WCBB fans down by discontinuing this series."

That's when you wanted Geno to share the blame with Pat when the action to end the series was solely, exclusively and unilaterally by her.

Got it now?

Nope

 

[reno tony]

None the less Geno had no say, never did and had no part or responsibility for the cancellation. There was no decision for others to make as you implied.

I guess I will end my participation in this by stating that more than one person is responsible. If you will read my later response, I mainly blame the A.D.s for not having the nerve to do what they should have done.... keep the series going. Coaches don't(or shouldn't) run the athletic departments.

 

[Kibitzer]

Doggy

I am reminded of what one of my idols Herr Mozart had to say about this sort of situation
.
In Dr. Bartolo's aria (Act I/4) in the Marriage of Figaro (lyrics by Lorenzo da Ponte), Bartolo (10 years earlier) had managed to lose control of his youthful ward, whom he had intended to marry (in the best commedia tradition), in part due to the machinations of the local barber, Figaro

A decade later, his anger and thoughts of revenge are unabated. (all chronishled in Rossini's opera, written 30 years or so later)

I always thought this backwards Golden Rule a perfect antidote to long term holders of grudges.

La vendetta, oh, la vendetta! Vengeance, oh, vengeance
È un piacer serbato ai saggi. Is a pleasure reserved for the wise
L'obliar l'onte e gli oltraggi To overlook affront and insult
è bassezza, è ognor viltà. Belongs to the base and cowardly

(emphasis mine).

I was personally insulted and humiliated by Pat's complaint to the NCAA to an extent I have shared with only a few Boneyarders. You are not nor will you be among them. I have (read my posts in this thread) advocated renewal of the UConn-Tennessee series because it will IMO stimulate interest in wcbb. That is the overriding consideration.

I enjoyed the quote from your idol, Herr Mozart. I like a shorter quote from an idol of mine, Brigadier General Tony McAuliffe, when surrounded and facing possible annihilation at Bastogne. The Germans demanded he surrender his 101st Airborne Division. His response: "Nuts!"

And I offer you the same terse comment.

 

[DobbsRover2]

To all those who are decrying all the extra decibels that have been emitted by Vol and UConn fans against each other over the past dozen and a half years, I can only assume you are not members of the Yankees\Red Sox or Dodgers\Giants feud nests and more likely have the traits of the A's\Phillies sparring partners (hey, we can both share the City of Brotherly Love now that one of us moved away a while back). One of the beauties of sports is the opportunity to unleash shock and awe barrages against main rivals who fire back with cruder but highly imaginative salvos. Baseball, football, women's college basketball -- it's the sport within the sport.

What WCBB really doesn't need right now is the passion and energy of fan bases sapped away by groovy peace-l0ve-and-empathy why-can't-we-all-be-friends happy fests. Ethnic slurs and personal appearance\orientation attacks should be left to the mountain clan folk to amuse themselves with, but a world of nicey-nice fans who are willing to go all amnesia over the past actions of the orange kind is a bit revolting. MMC's latest little spiteful tease that the Vol admins firmly refute just shows how well received any "forgive and forget" talk will be in the Knoxville spittoons. Sure, make yourselves feel good -- but you still gotta be kidding. And keep wishing for and dreaming about the Dream Series that has nada chances because of Pat's wishes -- her enduring bequest to WCBB.

 

[Bayareahusky]

As for this potential restart of the series, WE DO NOT NEED IT...... Unfortunately, all of WCBB could use it...... Interest in the WCBB game could have been escalated had PHS not cancelled the series..... It is the one game both men and women would tune into......

It is so ironic that UTenn needs the game more than us to reestablish their national relevance......

I am glad that Geno and Holly get along, but let's wait until the NCAAs, and then let's crush them!

 

[RadyLady]

Since we were going "all classical" here I had thought to post a clip of "vesti la guibba" with the famous line "ridi Pagliaccio, sul tuo amore infronto" (laugh clown, at your broken heart), but after thinking about it for a while I wonder if I would be mocking the folks who clearly remember (and were personally involved in some of) the circumstances surrounding the events that lead up to the "break up" of UConn and Tennessee and hold firm their distaste, rightly so, which I don't want to do, or would it be correctly aimed at the people who decry the past and gloss over without knowing the details of what happened and hold out for the reinstatement of the series - which we now know will not happen, thanks to UConnCat's earlier post.

ridi, pagliaccio, e ognun applaudirà.....

 

[JS]

I mainly blame the A.D.s for not having the nerve to do what they should have done.... keep the series going. Coaches don't(or shouldn't) run the athletic departments.

Stop blaming the ADs, plural, and you've finally got a defensible position, at least theoretically. To what end, I don't know.

Pat Summitt was the one who ended the series, as several folks have accurately informed you. As for your "more than one person is responsible:"

Yeah. You can add Summitt's staff, who went along with her. Surprise, surprise. Can just imagine them saying, "Forget it, Pat. Don't be such a jealous janet."

You can argue that the Tennessee AD should have stopped her.

Should have, that is, as viewed by you from on high. It was out of the question in the real world, where the power dynamics and relationship were such that there was no freakin' way.

Tennessee had a separate women's AD, Joan Cronan, until the AD's were merged last June. Summitt was the tail wagging the Tennessee women's athletics department, and Cronan was women's AD for 29 of Summitt's 38 years as coach.

Cronan: "We've always laughed because I wanted her to coach as long as she could, because she was a pretty good AD when she was coaching." (WBIR.com, 5/2/12)

So much for the Tennessee AD should've cracked the whip on Pat. She not only didn't crack it, she wrote the accusatory "we'd prefer to remain anonymous" poison pen letter about UConn to the SEC.

Turning to UConn, you can't plausibly argue the UConn AD, whether or not possessed of nerve, or anyone else on the UConn side, had the ability to keep the series going when Summitt decided it would end.

So, you're left with the abstract proposition that an AD should be the boss of a coach (and should, incidentally, have seen it your way). Fair enough, provided you recognize that, in reality, it isn't always the case (see, e.g., Paterno, J. and Summitt, P.)

And that's why people have a problem with your both-sides-were-to-blame sally. Whatever your reason for advancing it, it suffers from the appreciable defect of being unsupportable.

 

[Icebear]

I guess I will end my participation in this by stating that more than one person is responsible. If you will read my later response, I mainly blame the A.D.s for not having the nerve to do what they should have done.... keep the series going. Coaches don't(or shouldn't) run the athletic departments.

Both parties are not responsible when one takes unilateral action. It is silliness to say so. Now if you want to say that both parties are responsible for seeking a resolution and working towards restarting the series today that may be true.

 

[johnnyc]

If you will read my later response, I mainly blame the A.D.s for not having the nerve to do what they should have done.... keep the series going.

Nerve? You serious? Pat Summit?

 

[Tonyc]

Those of us lived through it don't want to relive it. You have no idea how bad it was. It was despicable and the lowest that anyone could stoop. The things that were done to our heros like Diana Sue EDD Maya Caroline, their parents, out coaches and school and our Boneyarders. Have you ever read the 37 pages? Have you read the articles? Did you see what Tenn tried to accuse all of us of? The boards were out of control as were the media. IA Tenn board was a cesspool of insults, complaints, and filth. For those of you who would like to see the game resume are thinking of what it once was. It isn't anymore. Tenn cant compete with UConn. When we face them again we will completely humilitate them which will only fuel another war which I do not want to live through again. This was all caused by Geno getting all the prize recruits when Tenn thought they had them. Namely EDD Caroline and Maya. Some day when we meet at a game I will sit with you and tell you what happened. It was the lowest most despicable things anyone could do and it was orchestrated imo by the leaders on the Tenn board, as the clan never let up, and Tenn tried to use the power of Pat to influence the SEC and NCAA to do something. The NCAA threw it out. We were all humilitated embarrassed and shocked by what Tenn did. Reputations were hurt. Never Ever do I want to relive that nightmare. For the good of WCBB UConn should never be subject to be playing Tenn again. What was is no longer. What pipe dreams fans have of what was is no longer and will never be the same. I don't wanna even consider "IF's" either. How would you like to wake up in the morning and find your name in the papers with posts you wrote twisted, mangled and misrepresented, making you look like a criminal? How would you like to be investigated by the FBI? How would you like to get calls from Compliance Officers? You have no idea what lengths Tenn went to to destroy, everybody associated with UConn. No Idea. I don't ever want to play them again. I don't care if we beat them by 100 pts it wouldn't be enough and would serve no purpose. They players have changed but the rest of the program hasn't. It could do UConn no good but it could hurt and destroy every thing UConn represents and has built. I don't think UConn could take that chance. You don't know what your dealing with when you bring up Tenn. We overcame it once I don't want to have to live through it again.

 

[Icebear]

Don't worry, Tony, you won't have to even if the series is renewed because no one can see or use anything written on The Summitt. With pay to play The Summitt have made themselves entirely irrelevant to the world of WCBB.

 

[Phil]

Stop blaming the ADs, plural, and you've finally got a defensible position, at least theoretically. To what end, I don't know.

Pat Summitt was the one who ended the series, as several folks have accurately informed you. As for your "more than one person is responsible:"

Yeah. You can add Summitt's staff, who went along with her. Surprise, surprise. Can just imagine them saying, "Forget it, Pat. Don't be such a jealous janet."

You can argue that the Tennessee AD should have stopped her.

Should have, that is, as viewed by you from on high. It was out of the question in the real world, where the power dynamics and relationship were such that there was no freakin' way.

Tennessee had a separate women's AD, Joan Cronan, until the AD's were merged last June. Summitt was the tail wagging the Tennessee women's athletics department, and Cronan was women's AD for 29 of Summitt's 38 years as coach.

Cronan: "We've always laughed because I wanted her to coach as long as she could, because she was a pretty good AD when she was coaching." (WBIR.com, 5/2/12)

So much for the Tennessee AD should've cracked the whip on Pat. She not only didn't crack it, she wrote the accusatory "we'd prefer to remain anonymous" poison pen letter about UConn to the SEC.

Turning to UConn, you can't plausibly argue the UConn AD, whether or not possessed of nerve, or anyone else on the UConn side, had the ability to keep the series going when Summitt decided it would end.

So, you're left with the abstract proposition that an AD should be the boss of a coach (and should, incidentally, have seen it your way). Fair enough, provided you recognize that, in reality, it isn't always the case (see, e.g., Paterno, J. and Summitt, P.)

And that's why people have a problem with your both-sides-were-to-blame sally. Whatever your reason for advancing it, it suffers from the appreciable defect of being unsupportable.

I suppose it is probably a bridge too far, but I hadn't considered, until your post, the possibility that the extreme incompetence of the Women' AD, smashing the crown jewel of the ebb regular season, knocking the Lady Vols off the top rung of the ladder, lead to the decision that maybe duplication of effort wasn't so efficient. You might be willing to out up with the inefficiencies when it produces results, but when it produces cow pies, what's the point. The timing means it wasn't a simple cause and effect, but I wonder if that decision played a role in the school's decision to merge the departments.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Pat Summit - you know, the one with the Tenn Athletic Arena named after her - controlled the termination decision and held and may still hold far greater sway in Tenn athletics than any AD.

 

[doggydaddy]

I guess I will end my participation in this by stating that more than one person is responsible. If you will read my later response, I mainly blame the A.D.s for not having the nerve to do what they should have done.... keep the series going. Coaches don't(or shouldn't) run the athletic departments.

Yes, more than one person is responsible.

Summitt - she was the one that went to her AD with these cockamamie charges against Uconn and told her not to sign the contract to renew the contract.

Cronin - the AD. She could have told Summitt no.

MCC - Maria, the mod of The Summitt. And writer with DIRECT connections to the team, including Summitt. I would bet she has Pat's cell phone number. I doubt anyone on Summitt's staff reads The Boneyard, but Maria certainly did. Please tell me who else would have let Summitt know what was discussed here, who else would have made copies of 30+ pages of posts from The Boneyard for use in the complaint to the NCAA about Uconn's alleged recruiting violations?

Who WASN'T responsible for the game being cancelled?

Geno - he asked the Uconn AD to sign the contract to continue the series.

Uconn AD - Jeff Hathaway signed the contract and had it mailed to Tennessee for their signature.

The Boneyard - unlike the Summitt, this site has no affiliation or direct connection to the Uconn coaching staff.

For you to continue to blame both parties for the series being cancelled shows me that I was right, you are indeed clueless about this situation.

 

[meyers7]

I actually love the idea of Pat being required to sit and watch while her team of Big Mac all-stars is ripped open and demolished on National TV.

Well that might, but only might, be worth it.

 

[meyers7]

Nope

Well then you might be a little slow.

 

[meyers7]

The Boneyard - unlike the Summitt, this site has no affiliation or direct connection to the Uconn coaching staff.

Yea, actually, they are not even particularly found of us.

 

[JS]

I doubt anyone on Summitt's staff reads The Boneyard, but Maria certainly did. Please tell me who else would have let Summitt know what was discussed here, who else would have made copies of 30+ pages of posts from The Boneyard for use in the complaint to the NCAA about Uconn's alleged recruiting violations?

Not so sure about that. There were Summitteers of longer standing than MMC who also had access to Summitt and whose noses were pressed closer to the BY window. Of course it may have been a joint effort. Teamwork and all that.

As far as her monitoring you, she had various snitches reporting in. You ensured a high employment rate in that sector.