Vance to Rutgers ? | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Vance to Rutgers ?

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whaler11 said:
Just so it's clear.

When posters point out the poor recent results and the paper thin roster they are accused of damaging recruiting because somehow the recruits can't see a losing record and players transferring and de-committing.

When a player and his father make a decision that hurts some people's feelings they savage the player and father.

It would seem to a reasonable person that attacking specific players and their families for making decisions you don't agree with would be more damaging to recruiting.

#boneyardlogic
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It happens on every passionate fan message board in America. Get over it. In regards to Vance and Lavar, I mean Vance, Sr., the criticism is fair and warranted.
 
whaler11 said:
Just so it's clear.

When posters point out the poor recent results and the paper thin roster they are accused of damaging recruiting because somehow the recruits can't see a losing record and players transferring and de-committing.

When a player and his father make a decision that hurts some people's feelings they savage the player and father.

It would seem to a reasonable person that attacking specific players and their families for making decisions you don't agree with would be more damaging to recruiting.

#boneyardlogic
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Attack the kids and not the 3 million dollar man who brought them here. Brush off the defections because the player doesn't buy into the sixth place in AAC UConn way then replace them with nothing. Literally everything in a D1 basketball program starts and ends with the coaching staff, except here. It's the kid and dads fault.
 
FartMan69 said:
Attack the kids and not the 3 million dollar man who brought them here. Brush off the defections because the player doesn't buy into the sixth place in AAC UConn way then replace them with nothing. Literally everything in a D1 basketball program starts and ends with the coaching staff, except here. It's the kid and dads fault.
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Not even close to true. This doesnt happen at just UConn. Kids choose to go to lower level programs for a bigger role all the time. Its not the staff or the players fault it just happens. No need to assign blame all the time
 
Are people really "attacking" Vance? I don't think so. If we can't talk about shortcomings of a player, we might as well close up shop.

As for his dad, his social media postings are way over the top. It is entirely fair game to talk about them.

I don't see it as an issue in the least.

There are those on this board who spend their entire time being contrarians, so that when they are randomly correct they can take a victory lap. That's fine, its part of the BY, but saying that people can't discuss players games or one former player's hugely over reaching dad is just silly.
 
AntG168 said:
No need to assign blame all the time
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I respectfully disagree on the need to assign blame. If you are the head coach then you are accountable for everything that happens. whether it be good or bad. If you are getting paid $3 million a year the accountability is even higher.

Clearly Vance wasn't interested in playing the 4 and wanted the offense to run through him. Vance did not want to be a role player and wasn't interested in playing the kind of defense that KO wanted. The mistake KO committed was recruiting a player like Vance. It was never about the talent but more about the vision for the team.

I am not taking a shot at Vance or his father. My guess is they were consistent in their desires for Vance throughout the recruiting process. The flaw is with the coaching staff who did not realize Vance was not a fit for their system. The good news is coaches continue to learn throughout their tenure and the Vance Jackson experiment should help KO better decide what type of player he recruits in the future.

KO is better coach for having gone through the Vance drama....that is the silver lining in an otherwise difficult process.
 
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Mano said:
Seems pretty clear that Vance and his dad thought Larrier was going to be going pro after this last year and they were prepared for VJ to be the guy in the wings on the wing for a year before stepping out onto the stage as a soph. Once TL went down I'd wager they were ready to move on after that considering the uncertainty of TL's return and whether he might be ahead of Vance for a year or more. Silly really since I would've wagered that we would've seen a lot of the two of them on the court at the same time next year in that position less basketball style of play KO has been trying to enact since he's been here.
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That's a new take on it about TL. May be right.
 
AntG168 said:
Not even close to true. This doesnt happen at just UConn. Kids choose to go to lower level programs for a bigger role all the time. Its not the staff or the players fault it just happens. No need to assign blame all the time
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We lost what would be our starting center to an ACC team our only prized recruit to a big east team we have an all AAC rookie looking at Big 10 and PAC schools, Durham is looking at Norte Dame... all of these guys would have gotten tons of burn this year and are now going to P5 schools with deeper rosters than us (except maybe Rutgers idk) so don't act like it was because they couldn't make it here when playing time would have been wide open.
 
FartMan69 said:
We lost what would be our starting center to an ACC team our only prized recruit to a big east team we have an all AAC rookie looking at Big 10 and PAC schools, Durham is looking at Norte Dame... all of these guys would have gotten tons of burn this year and are now going to P5 schools with deeper rosters than us (except maybe Rutgers idk) so don't act like it was because they couldn't make it here when playing time would have been wide open.
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They all have different stories and I'm sure KO, the staff have some "blame" but if you throw Vance and his dad in and blame KO I don't know what to tell you? The kid got "tons of burn" already and a lot for a freshman Not a tough one to figure out here Farty, he needs to be the man and KO would have none of his dad's preference. Nothing here points to KO or UConn, nothing!
 
whaler11 said:
Just so it's clear.

When posters point out the poor recent results and the paper thin roster they are accused of damaging recruiting because somehow the recruits can't see a losing record and players transferring and de-committing.

When a player and his father make a decision that hurts some people's feelings they savage the player and father.

It would seem to a reasonable person that attacking specific players and their families for making decisions you don't agree with would be more damaging to recruiting.

#boneyardlogic
Expand ...

The funniest thing here is that it has nothing to do with minutes (which are available in bunches at the 4) nor win/losses (as he's looking at Rutgers).

I don't think there was any way Vance was coming back next year, no matter what happened. Just not the right fit for anybody.
 
FartMan69 said:
Attack the kids and not the 3 million dollar man who brought them here. Brush off the defections because the player doesn't buy into the sixth place in AAC UConn way then replace them with nothing. Literally everything in a D1 basketball program starts and ends with the coaching staff, except here. It's the kid and dads fault.
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If Vances's looking to transfer to Rutgers, then clearly that wasn't a factor in the least. Given his interest, I'm think he doesn't prioritize wins/losses, profile of program, nor a minutes of the average player.
 
dwalks93 said:
I respectfully disagree on the need to assign blame. If you are the head coach then you are accountable for everything that happens. whether it be good or bad. If you are getting paid $3 million a year the accountability is even higher.
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Not necessarily. Too black and white. If a player doesn't want to be here, there can be a number of reasons for that which don't fall directly on the HC's doorstep. There's two sides to any relationship.

Reality of this situation is that there are two parties with different visions/interest in what is happening with the product on the floor. Nobodies 'fault' in that sense.

Also note, three are still a number of people on here who still don't give 'accountability' to Ollie for the good, ie winning a NC.
 
.-.
mauconnfan said:
They all have different stories and I'm sure KO, the staff have some "blame" but if you throw Vance and his dad in and blame KO I don't know what to tell you? The kid got "tons of burn" already and a lot for a freshman Not a tough one to figure out here Farty, he needs to be the man and KO would have none of his dad's preference. Nothing here points to KO or UConn, nothing!
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Yup, as I said, it ain't black and white. Recruiting is fluid.
 
intlzncster said:
If Vances's looking to transfer to Rutgers, then clearly that wasn't a factor in the least. Given his interest, I'm think he doesn't prioritize wins/losses, profile of program, nor a minutes of the average player.
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Perhaps he didnt know his true value. Thought after a solid freshman year that the schools he wanted would come aknockin and instead he got Rutgers?
 
UconnFanNVa said:
Perhaps he didnt know his true value. Thought after a solid freshman year that the schools he wanted would come aknockin and instead he got Rutgers?
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What are you saying here? I mean, if you are unanimous All AAC freshman and you don't think you're good...you've got some real confidence/insecurity issues.
 
FartMan69 said:
We lost what would be our starting center to an ACC team our only prized recruit to a big east team we have an all AAC rookie looking at Big 10 and PAC schools, Durham is looking at Norte Dame... all of these guys would have gotten tons of burn this year and are now going to P5 schools with deeper rosters than us (except maybe Rutgers idk) so don't act like it was because they couldn't make it here when playing time would have been wide open.
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We're talking about vance specifically though. KO definitely deserves blame for other things that have happened
 
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intlzncster said:
Not necessarily. Too black and white. If a player doesn't want to be here, there can be a number of reasons for that which don't fall directly on the HC's doorstep. There's two sides to any relationship.

Reality of this situation is that there are two parties with different visions/interest in what is happening with the product on the floor. Nobodies 'fault' in that sense.

Also note, three are still a number of people on here who still don't give 'accountability' to Ollie for the good, ie winning a NC.
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How about when its 3 players? On a team of 8.
 
dwalks93 said:
I respectfully disagree on the need to assign blame. If you are the head coach then you are accountable for everything that happens. whether it be good or bad. If you are getting paid $3 million a year the accountability is even higher.

Clearly Vance wasn't interested in playing the 4 and wanted the offense to run through him. Vance did not want to be a role player and wasn't interested in playing the kind of defense that KO wanted. The mistake KO committed was recruiting a player like Vance. It was never about the talent but more about the vision for the team.

I am not taking a shot at Vance or his father. My guess is they were consistent in their desires for Vance throughout the recruiting process. The flaw is with the coaching staff who did not realize Vance was not a fit for their system. The good news is coaches continue to learn throughout their tenure and the Vance Jackson experiment should help KO better decide what type of player he recruits in the future.

KO is better coach for having gone through the Vance drama....that is the silver lining in an otherwise difficult process.
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Agree, but in the end winning is a huge part of Ollie's job. So, whether it is due to coaching, recruiting, or the training regime, last season's record is on him. That doesn't mean he needs to be ridden out of town on a rail, but it is rightfully on him to right the ship, regardless of the cause.
 
HuskiesAllDay said:
How about when its 3 players? On a team of 8.
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How about it? Let's go by each kid, you answer:

Vance - done on him and dad.

Steve - thought he deserved more time wasn't happy, nor was dad as he voiced his opinion. Did he deserve more time?

Juwan - off of 2 knee surgeries, most programs would have pulled their offer not knowing the future. Hadn't played in basically 2 years, he looked like a new born colt out there most of the time with promise though. He thought he should have played more also. Should he have? Did he earn it?

Could the last 2 have been handled differently in some ways? Not sure I guess there's a maybe somewhere in there, but at the expense of who, a batter player? That would make sense huh?

And just to clarify things it's 11 players not 8. The 3 who were hurt are all staying here and can't wait to get back to it this year. Not to say that some of you throw these 3 out as to any impact on the bad season, it's all KO - the kids attitudes, the injuries everything I get it.
 
mauconnfan said:
C'mon it wasn't jest, pure dig and I should care less I admit it, but you know me. I'm done we won't get into it but really why go there again HAD?
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fair point. its beyond a dead horse at this point. i agree with what you said about all 3 of them for the record.
 
Anyone perplexed by Vance's dad's arrogant behavior, needs to just remember that this dude quit his job to coach and mentor Vance, nuff said.
 
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HuskiesAllDay said:
fair point. its beyond a dead horse at this point. i agree with what you said about all 3 of them for the record.
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Seriously HAD you don't have to agree I don't have a clue if I'm right pure speculation. Let's just try to keep the stuff we know so little about off KO and the staffs neck for now, they have enough work to do as it is right? All good my friend, we're all frustrated no matter what we may post I promise.
 
AntG168 said:
We're talking about vance specifically though. KO definitely deserves blame for other things that have happened
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Completely disagree - all three were not on KO
Vance got more PT than he and or his father, if honest, would have dreamed of - now comes back a player off injury and VJ has to now fight fot PT - obviously not in his interest
SE - worst defender in recent memory, KO brings a couple of bigs in a now he "decides" the program isn't for him - BS - doesn't want to work for a place
JD - his actions are weird - can't think of another program who would have invested the patience with him and what does he do? walk away
All thrre don't want to be Huskies - get out of town
KO doesn't need this BS
 
gtcam said:
Completely disagree - all three were not on KO
Vance got more PT than he and or his father, if honest, would have dreamed of - now comes back a player off injury and VJ has to now fight fot PT - obviously not in his interest
SE - worst defender in recent memory, KO brings a couple of bigs in a now he "decides" the program isn't for him - BS - doesn't want to work for a place
JD - his actions are weird - can't think of another program who would have invested the patience with him and what does he do? walk away
All thrre don't want to be Huskies - get out of town
KO doesn't need this BS
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The 3 transfers were misfits and recruiting mistakes - KO is a defense first coach and the 3 transfers were not quick enough to be good defenders. In the end the players judged their entitlement to playing time by their offense and KO judged it by their defense. They realized their desires would be better met elsewhere.

The loss of MAL is on KO for not recruiting him hard enough post-LOI and for the Miller breach.

Fortunately there's no reason to think any of those problems will recur.
 
TIL that Enoch transferred because he doesn't want to compete.

He left an AAC team with no frontcourt for the ACC because he doesn't want to compete.

#boneyardlogic
 
whaler11 said:
Mock Rutgers all you like for their past.

Their current head coach knows what the hell he is doing.

If Ollie goes to the NBA he is the first person you call.
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If Ollie goes to the NBA??? What exactly would he be doing there?
 
RJScootin said:
If Ollie goes to the NBA??? What exactly would he be doing there?
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It's a different ballgame inthe NBA. Ollie might actually be better in the league than in college. The pros have the skill to actually be to do what he wants. And like the freedom he gives guys to create.

And he'd relate to them as peers, which seems to be his style.
 
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