USMNT Falling

[upstater]

Don't disagree with the soccerheads - as you've seen, they can't possibly ever be wrong.

It's really not that hard, guys - even with the "identification" and "Messi" examples, it's the same answer - the more who play (and continue to play) soccer, the better the US product becomes. Lots play, fewer stay, and they move on to other sports. Maybe putting "athletes" confuses some, but it's really just a numbers game.

There are many countries around the world that have teeny populations and they do quite well.

It's because they take soccer a lot more seriously and they have people who can teach the sport properly.

So not a numbers game. Not with our population. It's more of a knowledge problem.

Anyone who has been around the youth game for any time knows that.

 

[ZooCougar]

Don't disagree with the soccerheads - as you've seen, they can't possibly ever be wrong.

It's really not that hard, guys - even with the "identification" and "Messi" examples, it's the same answer - the more who play (and continue to play) soccer, the better the US product becomes. Lots play, fewer stay, and they move on to other sports. Maybe putting "athletes" confuses some, but it's really just a numbers game.

It’s truly amazing how many different ways people can arrive to the exact same wrong conclusion.

 

[ZooCougar]

Iceland has a better team than us. And they have less than 300k people.

 

[LIuconn]

Why bring Jesse Gonzalez if you're not gonna use him? Nick Rimando was available after all. Or only play Pomykal for a couple min?

Anyone think Dest sticks around?

 

[Waquoit]

Anyone think Dest sticks around?

Would you play for this guy if you had a choice?

 

[ZooCougar]

Why bring Jesse Gonzalez if you're not gonna use him? Nick Rimando was available after all. Or only play Pomykal for a couple min?

Anyone think Dest sticks around?

I do.

 

[Palatine]

Dest was undressed in both games. In the Mexico game it led to a score.

Hard to judge the team. Disappointing is the best word for the two game set. For a long time it looked like a three game scoreless streak.

I'll probably get killed for saying this. But I think that Bradley would have settled the team down versus Mexico. Once we went down, there was no steady hand, we needed that badly and no on the field was able to supply it.

 

[outlaw]

Anyone think Dest sticks around?

was hard to ignore how disgusted he looked when subbed off vs Uruguay - even Stu called him out for poor body language - hopefully he's starting vs Cuba and cap tied, we can't let him get away regardless of his recent performances.

 

[meyers7]

was hard to ignore how disgusted he looked when subbed off vs Uruguay - even Stu called him out for poor body language - hopefully he's starting vs Cuba and cap tied, we can't let him get away regardless of his recent performances.

True, but not sure why he was disgusted. Because he was being subbed off, because he realized this team/coach sucks, or because he didn't have a real good game, i.e. didn't show very well in his debut for the USA?????

 

[meyers7]

Why bring Jesse Gonzalez if you're not gonna use him? Nick Rimando was available after all. Or only play Pomykal for a couple min?

Anyone think Dest sticks around?

Take a look at him, see where he is. Get him used to how the NT works.

Don't think using him against Mexico or Uruguay would have been a good idea.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Mexico was drubbed by Argentina the other day 4-0. During the post-game interview, Tata said the following:

"I don't think [the defeat] is our reality and I also don't think that going 11 games without losing was our reality," the ex-Argentina and Barcelona manager said after the game. "It's the second 'A level' game we've had. The first was against Chile [in March]. And the substantial difference against Argentina and Chile is that tonight we committed the kinds of errors in which we knew Argentina could damage us." ​

So Mexico has now had 2 "A" level friendlies in the last few months - Chile in March and Argentina in September. Tucked in between they also played Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Martinique, Costa Rica, Haiti, and the US (twice, Gold Cup & friendly). All were wins except for Argentina. So, based on what he has seen in two wins over the US and likley a bit of a elbow at USSF, the US is a B team. Ouch.

 

[Waquoit]

Is the international break over yet?

 

[meyers7]

Mexico was drubbed by Argentina the other day 4-0. During the post-game interview, Tata said the following:

"I don't think [the defeat] is our reality and I also don't think that going 11 games without losing was our reality," the ex-Argentina and Barcelona manager said after the game. "It's the second 'A level' game we've had. The first was against Chile [in March]. And the substantial difference against Argentina and Chile is that tonight we committed the kinds of errors in which we knew Argentina could damage us." ​

So Mexico has now had 2 "A" level friendlies in the last few months - Chile in March and Argentina in September. Tucked in between they also played Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Martinique, Costa Rica, Haiti, and the US (twice, Gold Cup & friendly). All were wins except for Argentina. So, based on what he has seen in two wins over the US and likley a bit of a elbow at USSF, the US is a B team. Ouch.

 

[BlueMAB]

This was not a "take", it's my opinion. I didn't realize I needed your approval. If the best athletes in the U.S. decided to play soccer we would have one of the best teams in the world. Unfortunately, or fortunately depending on your perspective, our best athletes play basketball, football, baseball, and hockey.

The thought that with a population of over 300 million, we have a large enough talent pool to compete with the rest of the world in basketball, football, baseball, AND hockey....but NOT soccer... is really moronic. It's specious, oversimplified, and just dumb. If Lebron James was a professional soccer player, he'd look entirely different. Or he'd have to be a goalie; you can't carry that much weight and run as much as is needed in soccer. He'd be an amazing keeper, but goalkeeping has almost always been the strongest part of the team.

It's a matter of focus. Our kids don't focus on soccer from a very young age the way they do in other countries. through their academies.

I don't know why you'd even mention hockey. Canada doesn't have more/better athletes than the US. But their national team is typically better in hockey because they care more than we do. The US has only won 2 gold medals in hockey (1960 & 1980). Canada has 9 gold medals in Hockey despite having a smaller population than the state of California.

The Dominican Republic doesn't have the population or the resources America does. It's practically a third-world country with a population of 10 million. But they have more foreign born players in MLB than any other country. 1 in 8 MLB players are Dominican. Why...?

1) they are wildly passionate about baseball
2) the professional clubs have invested in identifying and training talent at a young age.

Baseball is the most popular sport in the Dominican Republic and now all 30 major league clubs have baseball academies there, Salazar said. Younger players in their teens are recruited by major league teams and hone their baseball skills at the academies in hopes of signing contracts with minor league teams affiliated with Major League Baseball,

The US needs more academies, and they need to identify kids earlier, and have them playing all year round. Until that happens, we will continue to fall behind.

 

[BlueMAB]

Would you play for this guy if you had a choice?

He was abused repeatedly. The nutmeg that led to the first goal for Mexico, and then the tap around and blow by they should have led to a goal for Uruguay.

I'm not saying he's not good enough to play for us, but our back line is atrocious and he was anything but a bright spot in defense.

I know we have little depth, and less talent, but this kid has a long way to go.

 

[BlueMAB]

the US is a B team

A teams make the World Cup.

 

[upstater]

Our kids don't focus on soccer from a very young age the way they do in other countries. through their academies.

From what I'm seeing is there is a big willingness among kids to do exactly this, to spend a huge amount of time on soccer.

But the coaching leaves much to be desired. When you see kids being coached right, you wonder why it took so long for them to get into a situation with someone who knew what they were doing.

I actually appreciated many of the coaches I've come across in the past who were not properly trained and at least could help with some aspects of the game (as opposed to some who had been trained as coaches by top academies in Europe but who ended up being disasters). But nonetheless, when you finally see someone who is on top of things and has a thorough understanding of the game, and can teach it, you realize that we have a huge deficit in understanding soccer. It really might take another couple of generations to get there. Many of the coaches have only been trained as players through high school, ODP, and college--and this is why they don't have a finer understanding of what they are doing.

 

[ZooCougar]

He was abused repeatedly. The nutmeg that led to the first goal for Mexico, and then the tap around and blow by they should have led to a goal for Uruguay.

I'm not saying he's not good enough to play for us, but our back line is atrocious and he was anything but a bright spot in defense.

I know we have little depth, and less talent, but this kid has a long way to go.

He’s a right back. He shouldn’t have made his debut on the left. That’s Gregggg for you.

 

[ZooCougar]

Mexico was drubbed by Argentina the other day 4-0. During the post-game interview, Tata said the following:

"I don't think [the defeat] is our reality and I also don't think that going 11 games without losing was our reality," the ex-Argentina and Barcelona manager said after the game. "It's the second 'A level' game we've had. The first was against Chile [in March]. And the substantial difference against Argentina and Chile is that tonight we committed the kinds of errors in which we knew Argentina could damage us." ​

So Mexico has now had 2 "A" level friendlies in the last few months - Chile in March and Argentina in September. Tucked in between they also played Paraguay, Venezuela, Cuba, Martinique, Costa Rica, Haiti, and the US (twice, Gold Cup & friendly). All were wins except for Argentina. So, based on what he has seen in two wins over the US and likley a bit of a elbow at USSF, the US is a B team. Ouch.

I hate our Federation.

 

[BlueMAB]

He’s a right back. He shouldn’t have made his debut on the left. That’s Gregggg for you.

that’s fair, and I’m not trying to pick on him. The back line is awful regardless of who is in there.

 

[BlueMAB]

From what I'm seeing is there is a big willingness among kids to do exactly this, to spend a huge amount of time on soccer.

But the coaching leaves much to be desired. When you see kids being coached right, you wonder why it took so long for them to get into a situation with someone who knew what they were doing.

I actually appreciated many of the coaches I've come across in the past who were not properly trained and at least could help with some aspects of the game (as opposed to some who had been trained as coaches by top academies in Europe but who ended up being disasters). But nonetheless, when you finally see someone who is on top of things and has a thorough understanding of the game, and can teach it, you realize that we have a huge deficit in understanding soccer. It really might take another couple of generations to get there. Many of the coaches have only been trained as players through high school, ODP, and college--and this is why they don't have a finer understanding of what they are doing.

I see some kids doing this (and I see the corresponding results). But it’s not on the level that it is elsewhere, IMO.

I totally agree about the coaching.

 

[crewbear742]

Lots of people have theories about how to fix US Soccer. Implement Pro/Rel. Provide transfer payments. Get rid of pay-to-play. But no one has any idea how to do it.

1. How do you implement Pro/Rel in this country when there is no cultural history of supporting Soccer at the community level? Relegation would mean financial disaster. And it's moot anyways because the MLS will never accept it.

2. Transfer payments won't survive US courts. And players in the US oppose them as money taken from their pockets.

3. Pay-to-play is the only reliable source of money for soccer programs. How do you replace that money if you get rid of pay to play?

The US is too big and too uninvested in soccer for any of this to work. Until kids play soccer the way they play basketball, the US will always remain at the margin of world soccer competition. So the question becomes "Why does it matter if the USMNT can't compete?" If the MLS succeeds on its own terms, why isn't that enough?

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I hate our Federation.

Its not the Federation, its the people who now run the Federation. They have moved away from the vision of developing world-class soccer players and teams in the US to generating money for the Federation and it's MLS owners. The focus has been changed from using money to spur development to profits.

 

[upstater]

I am optimistic about the training US soccer has put in place. I think we have had only about a decade of the DA and we are seeing some of the fruits of it. As for the coaching selection, that’s another story. But I think US soccer is on the right road with development

 

[ZooCougar]

Lots of people have theories about how to fix US Soccer. Implement Pro/Rel. Provide transfer payments. Get rid of pay-to-play. But no one has any idea how to do it.

1. How do you implement Pro/Rel in this country when there is no cultural history of supporting Soccer at the community level? Relegation would mean financial disaster. And it's moot anyways because the MLS will never accept it.

2. Transfer payments won't survive US courts. And players in the US oppose them as money taken from their pockets.

3. Pay-to-play is the only reliable source of money for soccer programs. How do you replace that money if you get rid of pay to play?

The US is too big and too uninvested in soccer for any of this to work. Until kids play soccer the way they play basketball, the US will always remain at the margin of world soccer competition. So the question becomes "Why does it matter if the USMNT can't compete?" If the MLS succeeds on its own terms, why isn't that enough?

We already have transfer payments. Are you talking about solidarity payments? I don’t understand why the US has to be different in this regard. In PA Classics got a piece of the payment on the Pulisic that could go a long ways towards knocking down the barriers that pay to play creates.

Who gives a crap about MLS? It’s lucky to be the third most popular league in the USA behind EPL and Liga MX.

 

[ZooCougar]

We won’t be able to win the FIBA World Cup again until our best athletes play basketball.

 

[Waquoit]

I don’t understand why the US has to be different in this regard.

Because they have a chip on their shoulder and they know better. If one points out that the rest of the world has been at this for a lot longer and perhaps they know what they are doing, one is labelled a "euro-snob".

 

[ZooCougar]

Because they have a chip on their shoulder and they know better. If one points out that the rest of the world has been at this for a lot longer and perhaps they know what they are doing, one is labelled a "euro-snob".

The mentality of most American soccer coaches and MLS is just bad for American soccer. They are a bunch of gym teachers who should stick to teaching kids how to climb rope.

 

[ZooCougar]

Green is the highest or second highest scorer with 3 goals for Gruether Furth which is in 4th place in the 2 Bundesliga. He has a player rating of 7.3.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Good boy Greg has announced the USMNT Camp Roster for the CONCACAF Nations League. Don't worry folks, we're in good hands as Zardes will be there to ensure the safety of the other team's net while Wil Trapp will befuddle everyone with his shear incompetence playing a central defensive role. Out of 26 call-ups, 18 are from MLS (70%) who represent 14 of MLS’s 24 teams (58%). When MLS expands beyond 30 teams, will there be any slots on the USMNT roster for any non-MLS players?

There were a couple of notable absences due to injuries, including: Tyler Adams, Tim Weah, and John Brooks. The biggest shock absence is Sergio Dest (Ajax) who is being wooed by both USMNT and the Dutch national team. Why USMNT is not going all-out to Cap him is beyond me. Also, as Green has been playing well as noted above, not sure why he isn't at least getting a look. Overall, not much change from the summer friendlies, which worries me as if this is the team that Greg wants for WC qualifying next year, its scary.

GOALKEEPERS

• Brad Guzan – MLS, Atlanta
• Sean Johnson – MLS, NYCFC
• Zack Steffen - Bundesliga, Fortuna Dusseldorf

DEFENDERS

• Reggie Cannon – MLS, Dallas
• Nick Lima – MLS, San Jose
• Aaron Long – MLS, NJ Red Bulls
• Daniel Lovitz – MLS, Montreal
• Matt Miazga – EFL Championship, Reading
• Tim Ream – EFL Championship, Fulham
• DeAndre Yedlin – Premiership, Newcastle United
• Walker Zimmerman – MLS, LAFC

MIDFIELDERS

• Brenden Aaronson – MLS, Philly
• Michael Bradley – MLS, Toronto
• Sebastian Lletget – MLS, LA Galaxy
• Weston McKennie – Bundesliga, Schalke
• Christian Pulisic – Premiership, Chelsea
• Cristian Roldan – MLS, Seattle
• Wil Trapp – MLS, Columbus
• Jackson Yueill – MLS, San Jose

FORWARDS

• Jozy Altidore – MLS, Toronto
• Paul Arriola – MLS, DC United
• Corey Baird – MLS, Salt Lake
• Tyler Boyd - Turkish Süper Lig, Beşiktaş
• Jordan Morris – MLS, Seattle
• Josh Sargent - Bundesliga, Werder Bremen
• Gyasi Zardes – MLS, Columbus