USF…. (Merged threads)

[Hoophound]

Everyone has opinions but these guys even put UTSA ahead of UConn. USF sure is getting a lot of publicity this week. I can only imagine if they pull the upset in Miami. More likely PAC potentials if not ACC or Big XII

1 UNLV
2 Memphis
3 South Florida
4 Tulane
5 UTSA

Group Of Six To Power Four College Football Conference Realignment: Ranking G6 Teams Most Worthy To Move On

Quite a few Group of Five teams have gone to the Power Four in recent years. Which other G5 programs would be the most likely to move on?

herosports.com

PAC is not an option. We declined an invitation, that’s probably the reason.

 

[Kolumbo]

PAC is not an option. We declined an invitation, that’s probably the reason.

The article is about ranking G6 programs moving to P4 conferences

 

[Rufus]

USF approves $407 million price tag for stadium, related infrastructure

The USF Board of Trustees approved a $407 million expenditure for USF’s 35,000-seat on-campus stadium and other associated projects during a Tuesday meeting. The stadium will cost $348.5 million. It’s a slight jump from the previous price of $340 million the board approved in June 2023. The...

www.usforacle.com

USF's new stadium will have the same seating capacity as Northwestern's new stadium, but Northwestern is spending $850 million on their stadium. It will be interesting to see the end result of these two stadiums to see if Northwestern's stadium is over twice as nice as USF's since it cost over two times more.

 

[Hoophound]

The article is about ranking G6 programs moving to P4 conferences

Yeah. I saw a blurb about the schools the PAC could call on, I was confused.

Anyway, we aren’t a G6 school. That always creates confusion. We are a football Independent. We are no more G6 than ND is. Adding to the confusion is that many people think we do not want to leave the Big East and prefer to stay as we are.

 

[Kolumbo]

USF's new stadium will have the same seating capacity as Northwestern's new stadium, but Northwestern is spending $850 million on their stadium. It will be interesting to see the end result of these two stadiums to see if Northwestern's stadium is over twice as nice as USF's since it cost over two times more.

It's all in the details. Is a Porsche worth 2-3x more than a Chevy? I'm figuring Northwestern is going top notch. It looks that way from the info on the net.

Yeah. I saw a blurb about the schools the PAC could call on, I was confused.

Anyway, we aren’t a G6 school. That always creates confusion. We are a football Independent. We are no more G6 than ND is. Adding to the confusion is that many people think we do not want to leave the Big East and prefer to stay as we are.

There is no confusion. UConn is G6 level and ND is P2 level. At least for now, until UConn starts beating P2 programs regularly. UConn left a G5 conference to go independent. That doesn't bump UConn up to P status, especially when it outright cancelled a season. I agree with your other point though. Many outsiders think that not only does UConn want to be independent, but that we essentially gave up on football.

PAC tries to pretend it belongs with the P2 and tries to advertise that it is better than the AAC. So some AAC programs might consider moving over. I don't think they will.

 

[freescooter]

It’s really hard to predict any of this. USF didn’t beat 2024 Boise State. And the Florida team they beat isn’t winning the national championship. Both are good solid wins. But over the last few years the AAC has turned out several good teams. SMU, who went to the ACC, Tulane who was ranked in the top 10 in 2022, and top 25 in 2023 until losing to SMU and then their bowl, now USF. Let’s see how the season plays out, never mind 2-3 seasons from now. Remember, NIU beat Notre Dame last year. At the end of the year, ND played in the CFP. NIU finished tied for 6th in the MAC. Also it wouldn’t be shocking to see Golech (sp?) end up at a P4 if they indeed do end the season in the CFP. That too changes the equation in a big way.

 

[Hoophound]

It's all in the details. Is a Porsche worth 2-3x more than a Chevy? I'm figuring Northwestern is going top notch. It looks that way from the info on the net.


There is no confusion. UConn is G6 level and ND is P2 level. At least for now, until UConn starts beating P2 programs regularly. UConn left a G5 conference to go independent. That doesn't bump UConn up to P status, especially when it outright cancelled a season. I agree with your other point though. Many outsiders think that not only does UConn want to be independent, but that we essentially gave up on football.

PAC tries to pretend it belongs with the P2 and tries to advertise that it is better than the AAC. So some AAC programs might consider moving over. I don't think they will.

No, there is definitely confusion. People write articles about the G6 and don't include us, because we aren't G6. I never think they are slighting us in those situations. It just isn't factually accurate to include us.

After the B12 publicly flirting with us last year and Yormark publicly talking about his interest in a northeast presence, it really isn't conceivable that any decent journalist thinks we have a lesser chance than all of those schools.

 

[Chin Diesel]

It's all in the details. Is a Porsche worth 2-3x more than a Chevy? I'm figuring Northwestern is going top notch. It looks that way from the info on the net.

I would suspect a labor cost and raw material cost differential plays a large part of it. I will go on a limb and suggest Northwestern will be paying Chicago union labor rates for the project whereas USF will be paying non-union Florida labor rates. In general any building being built in Chicago I would think would cost much more than a comparable building built in Tampa.

UConn ran in to this cost difference when they built the new hockey rink and people were wondering why it cost so much Sacred Heart had a larger capacity for similar costs. Benedict brought up labor rates as one of the reasons why there were differences since UConn had union labor and it was negotiated as a state contract whereas Sacred Heart is a private school and had more wiggle room for labor costs.

 

[Kolumbo]

I would suspect a labor cost and raw material cost differential plays a large part of it. I will go on a limb and suggest Northwestern will be paying Chicago union labor rates for the project whereas USF will be paying non-union Florida labor rates. In general any building being built in Chicago I would think would cost much more than a comparable building built in Tampa.

UConn ran in to this cost difference when they built the new hockey rink and people were wondering why it cost so much Sacred Heart had a larger capacity for similar costs. Benedict brought up labor rates as one of the reasons why there were differences since UConn had union labor and it was negotiated as a state contract whereas Sacred Heart is a private school and had more wiggle room for labor costs.

All true. And I do think the new Ryan Field at Northwestern is a very different structure than your typical stadium. Check out the visuals if you haven't already. Canopies covering all the seats. Far more ADA compliant. Premium clubs. Many other amenities. Ryan Field and Rentschler Field are complete 100% opposite structures. USF's is probably somewhere in the middle.

Sure this is a lot of fluff, but the bottom line is, it is an investment in the Northwestern Campus, not a shell football stadium 30 minutes away.

"With the new Ryan Field, we are introducing a bold new vision for the future of college sports," said Pat Ryan Jr. "This stadium is not just a world class football stadium; it's for our students, and student-athletes, our fans, our alumni, and the Northwestern and Evanston communities. We're committed to creating spaces that embody the best of what the modern fan experience can be, while building a legacy of economic empowerment and cultural benefits for our community. The Ryan Family is proud to be partnered with Northwestern in creating this transformational project."

"The other 360 days of the year, the new Ryan Field will be an asset and hub for the Northwestern and Evanston Communities"

A Bold New Vision for College Football Unveiled at Northwestern - Northwestern Athletics

Northwestern University and the Ryan Family officially unveiled the first public look at the new Ryan Field, a state-of-the-art $850 million sports and enter...

nusports.com

 

[Kolumbo]

No, there is definitely confusion. People write articles about the G6 and don't include us, because we aren't G6. I never think they are slighting us in those situations. It just isn't factually accurate to include us.

After the B12 publicly flirting with us last year and Yormark publicly talking about his interest in a northeast presence, it really isn't conceivable that any decent journalist thinks we have a lesser chance than all of those schools.

The Big XII was jerking UConn's chain. Yormark loves basketball but the conference members don't care. No one is confused, UConn is not a P program. They may not mention UConn in the G6 because UConn is not in one of those conferences, but they know that is UConn's level. It's not like they thought UMass was at ND's level either. The vast majority of CR articles don't consider UConn a lead candidate so yeah, it certainly is conceivable.

 

[KryHavok]

The Big XII was jerking UConn's chain...The vast majority of CR articles don't consider UConn a lead candidate so yeah, it certainly is conceivable.

I cannot agree with you enough mate, absolutely spot on.

 

[Kolumbo]

It’s really hard to predict any of this. USF didn’t beat 2024 Boise State. And the Florida team they beat isn’t winning the national championship. Both are good solid wins. But over the last few years the AAC has turned out several good teams. SMU, who went to the ACC, Tulane who was ranked in the top 10 in 2022, and top 25 in 2023 until losing to SMU and then their bowl, now USF. Let’s see how the season plays out, never mind 2-3 seasons from now. Remember, NIU beat Notre Dame last year. At the end of the year, ND played in the CFP. NIU finished tied for 6th in the MAC. Also it wouldn’t be shocking to see Golech (sp?) end up at a P4 if they indeed do end the season in the CFP. That too changes the equation in a big way.

Very difficult indeed. They should be measuring the program, not short-term success. But boy look at UCF

UCF beginning in 1996 - 30 years
6 years Indie
3 years MAC
8 years CUSA
10 years AAC
3 years Big XII

USF beginning in 2000 - 26 years
3 years Indie
2 years CUSA
8 years Big East
13 years AAC

UConn beginning in 2000 - 26 years (excluding 1979)
4 years Indie
9 years Big East
7 years AAC
6 years Indie

 

[freescooter]

It’s really hard to predict any of this. USF didn’t beat 2024 Boise State. And the Florida team they beat

All true. And I do think the new Ryan Field at Northwestern is a very different structure than your typical stadium. Check out the visuals if you haven't already. Canopies covering all the seats. Far more ADA compliant. Premium clubs. Many other amenities. Ryan Field and Rentschler Field are complete 100% opposite structures. USF's is probably somewhere in the middle.

Sure this is a lot of fluff, but the bottom line is, it is an investment in the Northwestern Campus, not a shell football stadium 30 minutes away.

"With the new Ryan Field, we are introducing a bold new vision for the future of college sports," said Pat Ryan Jr. "This stadium is not just a world class football stadium; it's for our students, and student-athletes, our fans, our alumni, and the Northwestern and Evanston communities. We're committed to creating spaces that embody the best of what the modern fan experience can be, while building a legacy of economic empowerment and cultural benefits for our community. The Ryan Family is proud to be partnered with Northwestern in creating this transformational project."

"The other 360 days of the year, the new Ryan Field will be an asset and hub for the Northwestern and Evanston Communities"

A Bold New Vision for College Football Unveiled at Northwestern - Northwestern Athletics

Northwestern University and the Ryan Family officially unveiled the first public look at the new Ryan Field, a state-of-the-art $850 million sports and enter...

nusports.com

you might mention that the seating has been reduced by 25% to 35,000. There was a fair amount of consternation among the Big 10 management about that. Would you be good with us building a 30,000 seat stadium in Storrs? Plus I would argue moving from being a tenant in an NFL stadium to your own facility is not quite the same as playing in one where you are the prime tenant which was built to your specs. Yes Rentschler is in need of upgrades due to age.

 

[Hoophound]

The Big XII was jerking UConn's chain. Yormark loves basketball but the conference members don't care. No one is confused, UConn is not a P program. They may not mention UConn in the G6 because UConn is not in one of those conferences, but they know that is UConn's level. It's not like they thought UMass was at ND's level either. The vast majority of CR articles don't consider UConn a lead candidate so yeah, it certainly is conceivable.

I’m not saying that at all. I’m simply saying that we are not a G6 program. If you were a writer, would you refer to UConn as a G6 program, knowing that you were wrong? I don’t really understand the argument here.

There is absolutely a lot of confusion surrounding UConn. Average fans don’t really take the time to consider what conference our football program is in. A high profile, winning season would probably change that but we haven’t had one as an independent yet. I’ve been amazed that recently people that I talk to around Florida finally seem to be catching on that we are an independent. They do not seem to think that is a bad deal for us. We share that space with ND only now. It makes it look a little more appealing than it did before. Presumably winning a lot of recent basketball championships helps make us look better overall too.

I can assure you, the perception of some sports writer in Texas or Arkansas has no bearing on whether or not we end up in a power conference. I can also assure you, anyone speculating that Texas San Antonio will beat us to the P4 cannot be taken seriously. That would involve multiple Texas teams in the Big 12 jumping ship in order for that to happen.

 

[Kolumbo]

I’m not saying that at all. I’m simply saying that we are not a G6 program. If you were a writer, would you refer to UConn as a G6 program, knowing that you were wrong? I don’t really understand the argument here.

There is absolutely a lot of confusion surrounding UConn. Average fans don’t really take the time to consider what conference our football program is in. A high profile, winning season would probably change that but we haven’t had one as an independent yet. I’ve been amazed that recently people that I talk to around Florida finally seem to be catching on that we are an independent. They do not seem to think that is a bad deal for us. We share that space with ND only now. It makes it look a little more appealing than it did before. Presumably winning a lot of recent basketball championships helps make us look better overall too.

I can assure you, the perception of some sports writer in Texas or Arkansas has no bearing on whether or not we end up in a power conference. I can also assure you, anyone speculating that Texas San Antonio will beat us to the P4 cannot be taken seriously. That would involve multiple Texas teams in the Big 12 jumping ship in order for that to happen.

I get what you are saying and I'll concede the point, that there is too much confusion. I think some writers exclude UConn because UConn is not in a G6 conference, while others include UConn because the broader meaning of G6 is, not P4. Most writers also include ND when talking P4 because ND is one of the power players. Personally I would refer to UConn as G6 but that's me, Mr. Vegas.

I think there are 2 categories of programs, P or G.

P4, P2 and p2, G5, PAC2, G6, Independent. all still shaking out

I go with wikipedia, which includes UConn and the PAC2

 

[CL82]

Would you be good with us building a 30,000 seat stadium in Storrs?

(As long as it was built to be expanded.)

 

[jostar1]

USF is America's hottest underdog. Not bad for a program better known for parking tickets than wins

Ross Dellenger

Four years ago, in its latest expansion decision, the Big 12 passed on the school — a move that motivated those in Tampa, especially considering the league invited rival UCF. They are making sure that doesn’t happen again.

Leaders are positioning the school to be the most attractive brand of the non-power leagues before the long-discussed, and perhaps inevitable, split of NCAA Division I transpires. Though Weatherford speaks highly of the American and the aggressive approach from conference commissioner Tim Pernetti, he believes there will be a “new line of demarcation” within major college athletics likely determined by a school’s investment and success in football.

At a time when university finances are at their most stressful — declining enrollment, research grant cuts, etc. — many athletic departments are asking their schools for a financial infusion to support the compensation of players in this new athlete revenue-share era.

Universities have the choice, Weatherford says: Invest or be relegated.

Like many schools across the country — even those in the power leagues — the university, its foundation and key donors have buoyed the USF athletic department to the tune of millions. The investment — a 50-fold increase in NIL pay from the 2022 season to this year’s eight-figure revenue-share number — is paying off on the field.

USF is America's hottest underdog. Not bad for a program better known for parking tickets than wins

From its rising star head coach to wins over Boise State and Florida, South Florida is taking on all comers and Miami is next. Will USF's rise result in a level-up for the Bulls in the next realignment shakeup?

sports.yahoo.com

 

[B1GEast]

The Big XII was jerking UConn's chain. Yormark loves basketball but the conference members don't care. No one is confused, UConn is not a P program. They may not mention UConn in the G6 because UConn is not in one of those conferences, but they know that is UConn's level. It's not like they thought UMass was at ND's level either. The vast majority of CR articles don't consider UConn a lead candidate so yeah, it certainly is conceivable.

I'm not so sure that the 12 was toying with UConn.

I think the Yorrmark being an east coast guy and former NBA executive knows the potential value of UConn.

He doesn't have complete control of the Big 12, he guides conference and works with the presidents.

Yorrmark knows that the current CBS contract with the NCAA is way undervalued, by a lot and he understands that the 12 will never be on par with the Ten or SEC. He wanted to position the 12 to be the premier basketball conference and also be a very good football conference.

I think he was sincere and the door might remain open if the football program rises.

What killed UConn was the demise of the PAC 12. Once they declined ESPN's 30 million dollar per school offer, UCLA and USC bolted to the Ten and the rest is history.

Losing by 50 to Maryland in the first game of the season last year after we made our presentation didn't help. The football presidents weren't sold.

I think the 12 will take what left over of the ACC if it goes away. I think 20 is the magic number for them and the Ten and 18 for the SEC

That's 8 teams we have to be better than in football. That's asking a lot.

 

[billybud]

USF is America's hottest underdog. Not bad for a program better known for parking tickets than wins

Ross Dellenger

Four years ago, in its latest expansion decision, the Big 12 passed on the school — a move that motivated those in Tampa, especially considering the league invited rival UCF. They are making sure that doesn’t happen again.

Leaders are positioning the school to be the most attractive brand of the non-power leagues before the long-discussed, and perhaps inevitable, split of NCAA Division I transpires. Though Weatherford speaks highly of the American and the aggressive approach from conference commissioner Tim Pernetti, he believes there will be a “new line of demarcation” within major college athletics likely determined by a school’s investment and success in football.

At a time when university finances are at their most stressful — declining enrollment, research grant cuts, etc. — many athletic departments are asking their schools for a financial infusion to support the compensation of players in this new athlete revenue-share era.

Universities have the choice, Weatherford says: Invest or be relegated.

Like many schools across the country — even those in the power leagues — the university, its foundation and key donors have buoyed the USF athletic department to the tune of millions. The investment — a 50-fold increase in NIL pay from the 2022 season to this year’s eight-figure revenue-share number — is paying off on the field.

USF is America's hottest underdog. Not bad for a program better known for parking tickets than wins

From its rising star head coach to wins over Boise State and Florida, South Florida is taking on all comers and Miami is next. Will USF's rise result in a level-up for the Bulls in the next realignment shakeup?

sports.yahoo.com

Interestingly, Will Weatherord at USF's brother (and co-founder partner of Weatherford Capital with Will) is Drew Weatherford who led FSU's BOT charge against the ACC. I would expect a lot of note comparing and chat.

“We ultimately would love to stay in the ACC, and I want to make that clear. It would be great if we could remain in the ACC and have a media contract that was competitive and allowed us to compete on a level playing field as the Big Ten and the SEC. But that is just not the case with the way things are structured today. We are unapologetically looking at every option that we have, and are ultimately just trying to look out for the best interest of our university and our student athletes.”

Also..uSF is developing the area around the stadium much like FSU has with "FSU College Town".

 

[billybud]

The Weatherford's ancestor was Chief William Weatherford of the Upper Creek Nation...he famously was involved in the Fort Mims Massacre that brought down old Hickory to battle them.

The Lower Creeks, who the Upper Creek and Weatherford fought, migrated to Florida to escape them and became Seminoles.

 

[SU1968]

USF's new stadium will have the same seating capacity as Northwestern's new stadium, but Northwestern is spending $850 million on their stadium. It will be interesting to see the end result of these two stadiums to see if Northwestern's stadium is over twice as nice as USF's since it cost over two times more.

I think that the Northwestern stadium may have more bells and whistles. Also, construction costs are much higher in Chicago than in Tampa.

 

[Hoophound]

I think that the Northwestern stadium may have more bells and whistles. Also, construction costs are much higher in Chicago than in Tampa.

Florida has become very expensive. I have my doubts USF gets that stadium done for 350 million. If Chicago still costs more, it has to be because of the unions.