Uneven revenue distribution model picking up steam in the ACC? (The Clemson Insider)

[uchusky32]

FSU and Miami had every opportunity to be Clemson and blew it. Win on the field conference gets money.

 

[UCFBfan]

The plot thickens…

So, the really interesting question is if you are one of the lesser lights in the ACC is there greater value in you taking a reduced share in order to keep FSU and Clemson in the conference, or does it make more sense to let them try and break the GOR and then live off their exit fee and GOR settlement payment plus a reduced amount from ESPN?

This is where I think these schools need to be. I'd love to know where ESPN is in all of this business? It's their property so they will have some say but if the rest of the conference says no and Clemson decides to test the ability to break the GOR and bolt, will they let it get to that??

This whole thing is going to be fun to watch. I know we are on the outside looking in still and would love to be a part of the madness, but watching the Pac-12 fall apart and now the ACC possibly start infighting is going to be fun!

 

[Drew]

Where are Miami Clemson and FSU going exactly? What incentive do the other ACC schools have to take an uneven revenue share? They’re not getting a B1G invite and they’re not getting a SEC invite. They’re not leaving the ACC with the existing GOR and trying to start their own league and they’re almost assuredly not going independent.

I’d call their bluff if I was a president in the ACC. They have nowhere to go.

 

[CL82]

This is where I think these schools need to be. I'd love to know where ESPN is in all of this business? It's their property so they will have some say but if the rest of the conference says no and Clemson decides to test the ability to break the GOR and bolt, will they let it get to that??

This whole thing is going to be fun to watch. I know we are on the outside looking in still and would love to be a part of the madness, but watching the Pac-12 fall apart and now the ACC possibly start infighting is going to be fun!

It’s nice not to dread this stuff while it’s happening.

 

[WestHartHusk]

FSU probably should have rattled the cages when they were good and fans cared about their games.

 

[Ha Who]

FSU probably should have rattled the cages when they were good and fans cared about their games.

Karma

 

[jostar1]

So basically, the football schools are declaring war on the schools with basketball tradition and success. “You’re a traditional basketball power? Sorry don’t care.”

It's deja vu all over again.

 

[Bobol]

Approval of different revenue distribution by majority of ACC school may sufficient cause for dissenting members to declare GOR invalid by reason of subsequent material change.

 

[businesslawyer]

The smaller brands will ultimately do as they are told, because being 2nd class in the ACC is better than the alternative. That said, someone will fight this once they realize the larger programs consider them 2nd class.

The first question: in which category do you place a post- Coach K Duke?

They are second tier. People here keep wanting to think hoops matters more than it does.

 

[businesslawyer]

I would say when your wife suddenly grows ugly, dumb, annoying and is sapping your money, and you can pick anyone else in the world, I would lawyer up and get a divorce. I’m also not married so idk…

Here’s the problem with your analogy — on a national scale, BC was ugly, dumb and annoying when the ACC proposed to it,

 

[businesslawyer]

Where are Miami Clemson and FSU going exactly? What incentive do the other ACC schools have to take an uneven revenue share? They’re not getting a B1G invite and they’re not getting a SEC invite. They’re not leaving the ACC with the existing GOR and trying to start their own league and they’re almost assuredly not going independent.

I’d call their bluff if I was a president in the ACC. They have nowhere to go.

The GOR is a different issue. I am as a lawyer where I always was on that, which is not certain that it would work to lock up broadcasts (as opposed to entitle the non-breaching party to money damages), but put that aside. You don’t think the SEC would take FSU and Clemson today if offered them, phasing in the transition from ACC revenue to SEC revenue over a few years? The SEC would take them in a nanosecond. It has no dilutive effect on the conference, and it goes a HUGE way to accomplish what the SEC wants to accomplish, which is to put the P-2 on their own stage, as the dominant player on the field with an economically powerful but not as good in football Big Ten.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

Where are Miami Clemson and FSU going exactly? What incentive do the other ACC schools have to take an uneven revenue share? They’re not getting a B1G invite and they’re not getting a SEC invite. They’re not leaving the ACC with the existing GOR and trying to start their own league and they’re almost assuredly not going independent.

I’d call their bluff if I was a president in the ACC. They have nowhere to go.

Disagree - unless you are just saying this over the next year or two. Because beyond that, the top ACC football schools will have both the B1G and SEC interested. When the CFP expands in 2026, the conference revenue from it will in all likelihood be based on game units (like March Madness is), so there'll not only be more money to be made from CFP TV revenue but also from games/wins by conference member schools. The currently large football revenue streams are going to become HUGE when both those things happen - so huge that even the seemingly impenetrable ACC GOR will become less of an impediment. And many believe that the SEC and B1G will be the ones inordinantly writing the specific rules of how the huge sums will be spread across the P2/P5/G5. Time will tell and that time is coming pretty fast.

 

[UCFBfan]

Thinking more on this, I bet SEC and B1G schools are watching how this plays out too. They may be bathing in money but there's no way OSU or a PSU is ok with making the same as Rutgers or Maryland. Same in the SEC. You gotta bet that Bama, LSU, Georgia aren't ok with making the same as Vandy or Mizzou. Maybe saying "being ok with" is the wrong term, it's more that they feel they should be getting more than those schools.
They won't say it out loud but if they see this sliding scale play out favorably in the ACC, I bet there will be some wheels starting to move in some bigger programs.

 

[CL82]

Approval of different revenue distribution by majority of ACC school may sufficient cause for dissenting members to declare GOR invalid by reason of subsequent material change.

Which in turn would give the schools who would be getting a greater share the opportunity to leave for an even greater share. Interesting observation.

Since no change in distribution rights can be made without member school approval does that mitigate that risk so long as conference voting procedures are adhered to?

 

[MilliniumPrince]

They are second tier. People here keep wanting to think hoops matters more than it does.

I agree with you, but as a former resident of that area, I guarantee you Duke doesn't agree.

This is all about football and fanbases.

 

[MilliniumPrince]

Where are Miami Clemson and FSU going exactly? What incentive do the other ACC schools have to take an uneven revenue share? They’re not getting a B1G invite and they’re not getting a SEC invite. They’re not leaving the ACC with the existing GOR and trying to start their own league and they’re almost assuredly not going independent.

I’d call their bluff if I was a president in the ACC. They have nowhere to go.

I think the Big 12 would take FSU and Clemson in heartbeat. They might take Louisville as well. I think Fox would sweeten the pot for a Big 12 that includes FSU and Clemson.

 

[Chin Diesel]

It’s hard to say how that would work. BC has stunk, but they are probably a bigger brand than Wake Forest. Wake has actually been pretty good on the field though. Anyway, it seems like after FSU, Clemson and maybe UNC, it would be tough to establish who is worth what.

I'm morbidly curious as to how and why anyone would think BCU is a bigger brand than Wake Forest.

 

[Kolumbo]

The big boys can sue the ACC for incompetence or dereliction of duty. The B1G and SEC are able to make bank for their members, the ACC should be able to do the same. A contract it is a two way street. I'm sure there are numerous ways to blow it all up and I don't think there is really a similar precedent to this situation. Let's just sit back and watch the implosion.

 

[Rufus]

Thinking more on this, I bet SEC and B1G schools are watching how this plays out too. They may be bathing in money but there's no way OSU or a PSU is ok with making the same as Rutgers or Maryland. Same in the SEC. You gotta bet that Bama, LSU, Georgia aren't ok with making the same as Vandy or Mizzou. Maybe saying "being ok with" is the wrong term, it's more that they feel they should be getting more than those schools.
They won't say it out loud but if they see this sliding scale play out favorably in the ACC, I bet there will be some wheels starting to move in some bigger programs.

Unequal revenue sharing kills conferences. The lesser teams contribute in other ways….they pad the win totals for the top programs so they maintain a constant cycle of being top programs. Not to mention, for the B1G, having the Rutgers and Maryland markets to showcase Ohio State and Michigan increases the revenue of all, including Ohio State and Michigan.

 

[Slasher]

My guess is for ACC value:

Florida State
UNC
Clemson
Virginia
Miami
---- gap -----
NC State
Louisville
Virginia Tech
Duke
Pitt
---- gap ----
Syracuse
Georgia Tech
Wake
BC

 

[jostar1]

This is where I think these schools need to be. I'd love to know where ESPN is in all of this business? It's their property so they will have some say but if the rest of the conference says no and Clemson decides to test the ability to break the GOR and bolt, will they let it get to that??

Someone posted on the Dirt Burglars (Oklahoma) board the idea that ESPN would not want to lose these schools to the Big 10, so ESPN would facilitate their move to the SEC and continue to pay the ACC the same amount of money. By doing this, there would be no damages (or greatly reduced damages) to the ACC so no cause for legal action.

 

[geordi]

So, assuming that this devolves into unequal shares, what pray tell is the benefit to joining a conference at all? If we were in the ACC, we'd likely be grouped with the Syracuse, GT, Wake, BCU slice. That means that we'd likely be getting similar money to what we get now as an independent. Long term, I do believe this whole reorganization of conferences is going to implode on itself. It will become too expensive to even keep the sport considering only about a couple dozen schools break even in their athletic departments now and a few more may join that if there is unequal revenue sharing. Loss of rivalries, travel expenses, multimillion dollar coaches, expansion of coaching staff, etc, will drive the breakups of these super leagues.

Let's face it. UConn is never going to win a national football championship. Our football schedule is not ever going to consist of all top 25 teams. At least as an independent we control some of our own destiny.

 

[UCFBfan]

So, assuming that this devolves into unequal shares, what pray tell is the benefit to joining a conference at all? If we were in the ACC, we'd likely be grouped with the Syracuse, GT, Wake, BCU slice. That means that we'd likely be getting similar money to what we get now as an independent. Long term, I do believe this whole reorganization of conferences is going to implode on itself. It will become too expensive to even keep the sport considering only about a couple dozen schools break even in their athletic departments now and a few more may join that if there is unequal revenue sharing. Loss of rivalries, travel expenses, multimillion dollar coaches, expansion of coaching staff, etc, will drive the breakups of these super leagues.

Let's face it. UConn is never going to win a national football championship. Our football schedule is not ever going to consist of all top 25 teams. At least as an independent we control some of our own destiny.

We'd be making substantially more than what we make as an independent, even at the lower end of the sliding scale. We also would guarantee a schedule every year that doesn't need to consist of all MAC or Sun Belt or CUSA schools while hoping to land at least one P5. I'd take the ACC any day over our current status. It might seem nice now but it's going to very quickly dry up in terms of available games to play and we will see home schedules like our 2024 which consists of Army, FAU, Buffalo, and Georgia St as of right now. Toss in at least one FCS and that is probably it for our home slate.....I'd take ACC membership any day.

 

[Fishy]

I would imagine they would include North Carolina and Virginia as the schools to get a full share? Clemson, Florida State, Miami, North Carolina and Virginia are the most valuable properties in the ACC.

UNC
Viriginia
Georgia Tech






Florida State









Miami
Clemson

Clemson would not enjoy a revenue model based on reality.

 

[CL82]

Someone posted on the Dirt Burglars (Oklahoma) board the idea that ESPN would not want to lose these schools to the Big 10, so ESPN would facilitate their move to the SEC and continue to pay the ACC the same amount of money. By doing this, there would be no damages (or greatly reduced damages) to the ACC so no cause for legal action.

But that wouldn’t impact either the conveyance of the GOR or the exit fees.

 

[Hoophound]

I'm morbidly curious as to how and why anyone would think BCU is a bigger brand than Wake Forest.

I think BC’s highs in football were probably a little higher and their name recognition is better. Not everyone even knows Wake is a great school nor do they know where it is. Again, I said probably. My point is, neither is worth much and even with Wake’s recent football success, I don’t think anyone really cares at all. The ACC made the mistake of investing in too many private schools. They should have gone with WVU, UConn and UL years ago. Those schools have captive audiences in their home markets.

 

[Ha Who]

I think BC’s highs in football were probably a little higher and their name recognition is better. Not everyone even knows Wake is a great school nor do they know where it is. Again, I said probably. My point is, neither is worth much and even with Wake’s recent football success, I don’t think anyone really cares at all. The ACC made the mistake of investing in too many private schools. They should have gone with WVU, UConn and UL years ago. Those schools have captive audiences in their home markets.

Remember when they thought Swofford was a genius?

 

[CL82]

Remember when they thought Swofford was a genius?

He gave them stability when they desperately needed it.

 

[Hoophound]

He gave them stability when they desperately needed it.

He sold out the ACC to help his son make a deal at Raycom and earn a big promotion. His son was also instrumental in getting BC into the ACC, as he worked there at the time they were invited.

 

[CL82]

He sold out the ACC to help his son make a deal at Raycom and earn a big promotion. His son was also instrumental in getting BC into the ACC, as he worked there at the time they were invited.

All true, but he still gave them stability when they needed it.