Uconn ... the real story | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Uconn ... the real story

Danzz said:
No.
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We don't know for sure. We didn't have a scholarship to offer Dunn. We didn't have one for Andre either. Wolfe, I believe, gave his to Drummond.

We didn't miss on Dunn but no one can say for sure he would have come to UConn if offered. Based on what I remember, I think he would have.
 
champs99and04 said:
I want this to be about UConn hoops and not me, but let me tell you about the time I was a star athlete in another sport anyway.
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Again typical. Pull one sentence out of a complete story that had nothing else to do with me, and make it about me. It is called a credibility reference, having played doesn't make me an authority, but I am not some incompetent kid off the street either. That was the soul purpose, sorry all you got out of it was me. I suggest you block that sentence out, and read it again, seems to be a lot you missed.
 
Hoophound said:
We don't know for sure. We didn't have a scholarship to offer Dunn. We didn't have one for Andre either. Wolfe, I believe, gave his to Drummond.

We didn't miss on Dunn but no one can say for sure he would have come to UConn if offered. Based on what I remember, I think he would have.
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Pretty sure it was the opposite. Drummond gave up his scholarship to allow Michael Bradley to stay on the team
 
CTBasketball said:
KO also coached 100% of those games. Calhoun coached 0% of those games.
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I agree, he won and coached every game to get them there. I guarantee you he never sniffs another one. I hope I'm wrong on that account, but I don't see it. He had an elite team, albeit none of his construction, and got them to win, nothing to argue about there. Tell me how his own kids are doing?
 
CTBasketball said:
Very true and should be mentioned.

But it doesn't hide his deficiency to coach the game.
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True offensively. He is the least exeperienced coach in the NCAA with 5 experience. I believe he will improve drastically
 
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RUSS56 said:
I agree, he won and coached every game to get them there. I guarantee you he never sniffs another one. I hope I'm wrong on that account, but I don't see it. He had an elite team, albeit none of his construction, and got them to win, nothing to argue about there. Tell me how his own kids are doing?
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That '14 team was not elite in any sense of the word and KO thoroughly outcoached Izzo, Donovan and Calipari (not that the latter is impressive) in succession to win the title.
 
RUSS56 said:
I have watched the mixed feelings in these forums over the last several months. I am a former Uconn All---Conference athlete. I was fortunate enough to go on to a professional career in the States and abroad. We are all Uconn-junkies, or at least I will speak on my own behalf...I am a Uconn Hoops junkie. before anyone takes a swat at what I am about to write, just know it is my personal observations. You may agree or disagree, certainly that is everyone's choice.

I've watched kids from the state, that seldom got away under Calhoun, slip through without much notice. Dunn to Providence, Heron to Auburn (leading scorer as a freshman), Diallo to KY, etal. This simply didn't happen under Calhoun, or at least as frequently. He shut the door on the Pressley's, the Pinnone's, the Jenson's as Rollie used to camp out in CT, he slammed that door shut.

I have no angst against Kevin Ollie, but some is starting to build. I have been in the sports world my whole life, and the business world for a good chunk of it as well. There is an old adage, "When a fish stinks, it stinks from the head." What exactly does that mean? It means the AD, and Kevin Ollie regarding Uconn basketball. Trouble is watching players get thrown out of the huddle, watching players fight (with words), on the court, more times than I cared to watch, watching JA get scolded by KO, and JA erupts back in KO's face. I guarantee you, if that was Jim Calhoun, Adams would of been in the locker room, done for the night.

I have issues with the entire coaching staff being all former guards. Does it matter? I believe it matters in 2 ways. recruiting against Uconn is going to point this out for any big man. Yes, a coach knows what to tell a big, and can coach him, but he never lived it, and that is tough.

Recruiting is getting harder and harder. WHY? The AAC is just not where it is at. case in point, just 3 players in the top 100 signed with AAC schools this year, and 2 of those were in the 90s. Why does this matter? It ultimately is going to weaken the conference, and as it is, SMU 30-4, is a #6 seed. Cincinnati, 29-5 is a #6 seed. They both got bounced early. The optics of that are not good. We have seen AAC teams with 23,24 wins the last few years left out of the Big Dance. WHY? Because the opportunity for quality wins is very limited. You have to win 25 games in this conference to be a sure thing, 23/24 maybe 50-50. Uconn can no longer schedule 4-5 big out-of-conference games, they have to be like Geno, and schedule almost every game vs a top 25 team. If not, accept the fact that 23 wins, 24 wins may not be enough.

What has happened the last week or so, is not the problem, it is a symptom of a much bigger problem. I don't know KO, all I have heard and seen is he is a great guy, and I assume that is correct. You are what your record says you are, but the winning team he had was with a bunch of Calhoun's kids. he made the tournament one time with his own kids, on an answered 70 ft. prayer heave by Adams. What's next?

First off, Ollie is going nowhere, as Benedict locked him up for 5 years, and his stock once extremely high, has taken a big hit. he is a competitor supreme, his resume in the NBA is proof of that. He will take this personally, and what that means is he will rise above it all, and succeed, or fall flat on his face, in over his head. That script has yet to be written.

Larrier and Gilbert only played 3 games, and while they looked promising, that script is not written either. Theyfaced Wagner, northeastern, and Loyola,Marymount, 3 cupcakes, and did a respectable job. It would be easy to pencil them in for great careers, but we don't have that answer yet. Larrier is now 2 full years away from competition, Gilbert 1. It may matter, it may not.

If Ollie wins 23+ games with this team, as presently constituted next year, he did a fantastic job. If he makes the NCAA Tournament, he did an incredible job. If he doesn't, it will make his job unreasonably difficult going forward, as the perception of the public, the recruits, the coaches recruiting against them, will be Uconn is no longer Uconn, it would be 4 of 6 years out of the Dance, Calhoun missed it 4 times in his final 22 years, and if Ollie reaches 4 whiffs in 6 years, it will spell huge problems.

This brings me to the point of all this. Next season is as critical of a season for Uconn, perhaps in their history. Regardless of your feelings right now, and they are probably concerned, wounded, or carry on, don't under-estimate the need for every body in the stands, every cheer and reassurance one can give, because this is the biggest moment for Uconn basketball in our lifetimes, it is the biggest oment for everyone associated with Uconn basketball.

let's take what we have been gifted to, and not expect it, but put all your will into making it continue, and hopefully that trickles down to coaches and players. GO UCONN!
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Props to you on your pro-career but I think that time away from UConn disengaged you from Storrs a bit... quite a bit...
 
We didn't have to make a thread about posters who only show up when there's negative news and never when there's anything positive to discuss. This one has them all. Pin it
 
Doginaus said:
I have to agree with RUSS56, in his initial post, he presented an accurate assessment of the program as a whole since Kevin Ollie took over. I'm not bashing KO or anyone else for that matter, but, from what I've seen since Jim Calhoun took over the program to what it is now, we aren't even on the same page.

It is true, Jim Calhoun took over this program and built it from a regional power into a national power and winning 3 national championships along the way. Everyone knew who was in charge of this program, no doubt.

Speaking of recruiting, did Jim Calhoun get every high school recruit in the state of Connecticut, no, did Jim Calhoun get every high school recruit he had targeted, no, but, he did get the recruits that were best for what he wanted to do with his system and his program. In fact, there were many kids he didn't recruit because they weren't the type of kids he wanted for his program. Bottom line is this; we all know that Jim Calhoun knew what he wanted and he could recruit because the proof is he won 3 National Championships and had several of his players went on to have great careers in the NBA with a slam dunk future Hall of Famer.

Not to minimize Kevin Ollie and what he's done because last year, he had a great recruiting class; several 4 star bordering 5 star recruits and other possibly underrated players made up that great class. Previous recruiting classes haven't been as good as last years class, and we don't know what the future holds for upcoming classes.

It is possible that Jim Calhoun and Kevin Ollie have different philosophies when it comes to what they want in their programs and the types of players they recruit.

UCONN is nationally known, because of what Jim Calhoun has done, period. When Kevin Ollie took over the program, he took over a nationally known commodity that not only has name recognition but also has pedigree, 4 National Championship banners hang from the rafters at Gampel Pavilion as proof. We know what Jim Calhoun has done with the program, what has Kevin Ollie done with what he inherited? Yes, he won a National Championship in his second year of coaching, but not with his players. I'm not minimizing what he has done, I'm just asking what has he done with what he has recruited? We've won a few tournament games, agreed, but, we missed a couple of tournaments as well. Something is missing, not sure what it is either, but its just not there.

Does the AAC have something to do with it? I guarantee that has a pretty big part on why we don't get those top recruits to come to UCONN. We saw the respect this conference gets from the tournament committee, we had our two top teams seeded as #6's! Even though they lost early, they should have been seeded higher. Heck, we won the whole thing as #7 seed in 2014! My point here is that the blame is not all on Kevin Ollie, the conference we're in is part of the problem.

What we have not accomplished under Kevin Ollie is player development. The program needs to coach up these kids and not allow mediocrity to be the rule of the day. I understand "10 toes in" and "take the stairs and not the escalator", but, have we seen it? We had a Ferrari parked in the garage that sputtered when let out in the open road, who's fault is that? This past year, we played with 6 or 7 guys plus the walk-ons because the other players were out for the rest of the season with injuries, who's fault is that? In all honesty, we know the answer.

We've seen some recent changes made by Kevin Ollie and hopefully those changes will fix some of the things that has been a hindrance to the growth of this program. Whether we want to agree or not, leadership is not overrated. This program needs strong leadership, from the top on down.

Personally, I believe when you have strong leadership, you have a strong vision of what you want to accomplish and a strong willingness to go after it and, achieve it. That, I believe is one of the things that this program is missing. Kevin Ollie shouldn't be the players best friend, he needs to be their coach and lead them. Hey, sometimes strong leadership hurts feelings, but that's life.

RUSS56, you did a good job, and you're right, somehow a couple of sentences you wrote about recruiting kids in Connecticut were hijacked. That does not diminish all the other things you mentioned in your post.

Thanks for your post, it was needed.
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Very well stated, and thank you. The one thing I hear after every game from KO, is we have to work on this, we have to work on that. It is a constant. The problem is, if you recognize what is wrong, and you can't fix it, it means:

1) The kids are not buying in
2) The kids are trying hard, but are just not as good as the opponent
3) The coach is not getting the message through

What concerns me about these post-game pressers is Ollie sounds a lot like Diaco did, we have to fix things. That's ok, but when it becomes every loss, the same response, it gets old fast. The remedy is also starting to look like Diaco. We need to change things. So Diaco fires offensive coordinator, and KO...what happened to Miller? We don't know that whole story yet. We don't know why players are leaving that were sure to get a lot of court time next year either.

The AAC is slowly taking the bloom off the rose. That is an excuse though, why doesn't it impact Geno? Why doesn't anything impact Boise St football? The short answer is, when you have the right guys, in the right places, it doesn't matter.
 
ktuck911 said:
Props to you on your pro-career but I think that time away from UConn disengaged you from Storrs a bit... quite a bit...
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Thank you. I think maybe the opposite could be true. It allows me to view things without the spin masters in the media, the coaches, etc. They have become excuse masters, working in their own interests, not yours, remember that
 
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RUSS56 said:
I agree, he won and coached every game to get them there. I guarantee you he never sniffs another one. I hope I'm wrong on that account, but I don't see it. He had an elite team, albeit none of his construction, and got them to win, nothing to argue about there. Tell me how his own kids are doing?
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With the exception of Lasan Kromah and Amida Brimah, all of the players responsible for the 2014 title were also together on a team coached by Jim Calhoun, and didn't come close to winning a title.

There's two possible explanations for that:

One, players need time to develop into winners. But if you accept that explanation, doesn't this current team also deserve time to mature into a winner?

Two, Kevin Ollie hasn't recruited the replacement talent required to win. But wait... once Calhoun left we were relegated to a laughingstock of a conference that's easy as hell to negatively recruit against while simultaneously suffering two years of severe recruiting restrictions. Don't you think, if you accept this explanation, it's a bit silly to blame Ollie for this?

Ollie has been far from perfect... And I think even he would admit that. But to say he's already proven he's bad enough that you can definitively dismiss any future chances to compete for a title? Sorry, that's ridiculous.
 
RUSS56 said:
Thank you. I think maybe the opposite could be true. It allows me to view things without the spin masters in the media, the coaches, etc. They have become excuse masters, working in their own interests, not yours, remember that
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Oh Christ... this is going the full gamut... we have a concern troll and then a sock puppet... and now he's bringing us an outsiders prospective. Nice.
Oh wise one please enlighten us more! How many times do you think these very same things have been brought up on here... :rolleyes:

And while I don't want to exactly support this guys argument. Stop bringing up Vin Baker as someone Calhoun "missed on." No one knew that Vin Baker was going to become Vin Baker. He played for Old Saybrook and averaged 5 pts per game his freshman year at Hartford.
 
The bigger problem as I see it, is Calhoun, love him, or hate him has set the bar so high, it is extremely difficult to be the first behind him, especially a first with 0 head coaching experience. If we remove all that from the equation, KO has done at least an adequate job. He is learning every day himself. He is under extreme pressure. He knows more than anyone, he needs to win, and he needs to win now. He is a fighter, he is dedicated to the cause, and what and who he will be, may be nothing more than it is now, it may be exceptionally better. The jury is still out, but he is in the results business, and he soon has to prove he can deliver. What happens if Uconn finishes next season with a losing record? Failing attendance? You think he is not aware of what is going on. he needs his team to over-achieve next year, stop saying we have to work on things every presser following a loss, buckle down, and win. I pray for him, and that he digs himself out of a hole created, it is going to swallow him up, or he will dig himself out, I hope and pray he digs himself out.
 
IMind said:
Oh Christ... this is going the full gamut... we have a concern troll and then a sock puppet... and now he's bringing us an outsiders prospective. Nice.
Oh wise one please enlighten us more! How many times do you think these very same things have been brought up on here... :rolleyes:

And while I don't want to exactly support this guys argument. Stop bringing up Vin Baker as someone Calhoun "missed on." No one knew that Vin Baker was going to become Vin Baker. He played for Old Saybrook and averaged 5 pts per game his freshman year at Hartford.
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Thanks for your opinion, all are welcome
 
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Mr. Wonderful said:
With the exception of Lasan Kromah and Amida Brimah, all of the players responsible for the 2014 title were also together on a team coached by Jim Calhoun, and didn't come close to winning a title.

There's two possible explanations for that:

One, players need time to develop into winners. But if you accept that explanation, doesn't this current team also deserve time to mature into a winner?

Two, Kevin Ollie hasn't recruited the replacement talent required to win. But wait... once Calhoun left we were relegated to a laughingstock of a conference that's easy as hell to negatively recruit against while simultaneously suffering two years of severe recruiting restrictions. Don't you think, if you accept this explanation, it's a bit silly to blame Ollie for this?

Ollie has been far from perfect... And I think even he would admit that. But to say he's already proven he's bad enough that you can definitively dismiss any future chances to compete for a title? Sorry, that's ridiculous.
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Thanks for adding your input. Most teams that win a National Championship, didn't win it with most of the same kids the year before. I agree, Ollie didn't become a great coach winning it, or a bad one finishing with a losing record, his resume is incomplete, but this is truly a defining year or two ahead.
 
IMind said:
I know that. I've been here through thick and thin for decades... but you keep on playing your game.
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Thanks. I go back as a 7 year old listening to games on WTIC, because I was in bed already, and since that time I have seen in person, or TV all but maybe 20-25 games. I'm not the enemy, I am on your side, glad this discussion is free and open.
 
uconnphil2016 said:
We're in an age of alternative facts; anything is possible.
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Sorry UConnphil2006, Chief has to Coach you up a little: There are always alternate facts and it's not a negative:
1) Is it partly cloudy or partly sunny?
2) Is the glass half full or half empty?
3) Are you over optimistic or a positive person?
There is more than one way to approach something. None of these options are inherently false or correct. Sometimes it's a matter of perspective.
 
Lefty2one said:
That '14 team was not elite in any sense of the word and KO thoroughly outcoached Izzo, Donovan and Calipari (not that the latter is impressive) in succession to win the title.
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Calipari and Izzo coached better games against Ollie IMO. As a coach you can't prepare defensively for a 26' dagger 4-5 times a game with the shot clock under 5 seconds. That just breaks your back.
 
RUSS56 said:
I guarantee you he never sniffs another one.
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I wrote a big response. But let's just cut to the chase. You're new here. I've been on this board in its different iterations since 2002-03, and others longer. One thing I learned is that people show up and say these sorts of things every few years. They did it to Calhoun then--and a few other times. People act like the sky is falling after bad years, and that everything needs to change. And then, invariably, the team bounces back and those people disappear.

Now, we haven't seen the bounce back with KO. But there are a host of reasons for that. We may, later, re-characterize those reasons--though valid--as mere excuses. But I'm willing to bet UConn is back to being UConn pretty soon.

That's a polite way of me saying that I hope very soon you no longer have a reason to post here, and the history of UConn suggests that this is true.
 
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The Ollie to Calhoun comparisons in any aspect are dumb. We're comparing a vintage Ferrari, one of the best ever, to a 2014 Honda Civic Si.
 
CTBasketball said:
The Ollie to Calhoun comparisons in any aspect are dumb. We're comparing a vintage Ferrari, one of the best ever, to a 2014 Honda Civic Si.
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A Honda Civic really? Why not at least a Nissan GTR? ;-)
 
I just looked at NBA draft net mock drafts through 2019, and no Uconn player is on the 2018 1st 2 rounds, or the 2019 first round. There is a long way to go, don't remember this being the case 2 straight years, maybe I'm wrong on that. Maybe someone will play their way up.
 
CTBasketball said:
The Ollie to Calhoun comparisons in any aspect are dumb. We're comparing a vintage Ferrari, one of the best ever, to a 2014 Honda Civic Si.
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I agree with that comparison, maybe just not the way you compared it, but a pointless argument
 
RUSS56 said:
Thanks. I go back as a 7 year old listening to games on WTIC, because I was in bed already, and since that time I have seen in person, or TV all but maybe 20-25 games. I'm not the enemy, I am on your side, glad this discussion is free and open.
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Yes yes... I'm sure Dee Rowe personally tucked you in at night. :rolleyes:
 
Chief00 said:
Sorry UConnphil2006, Chief has to Coach you up a little: There are always alternate facts and it's not a negative:
1) Is it partly cloudy or partly sunny?
2) Is the glass half full or half empty?
3) Are you over optimistic or a positive person?
There is more than one way to approach something. None of these options are inherently false or correct. Sometimes it's a matter of perspective.
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HAHAHA... Chief, my man, that's called perspective not "alternative fact."

For instance...
Person 1: "Is that a 6 or a 9 written over there on the ground?"
Person 2: "I don't know, but I bet if we find the person who wrote it, or try to orient ourselves to our surroundings we can find out what it truly is."

It's not both. It's one or the other. There are no alternative facts. There are a lot of things in life that have varying degrees of grey; facts are not one of them. It's either a fact or not.
 
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