UCONN hockey program won't be complete until on-campus barn/team facility opens

[brasssbonanzaa]

Brasssbonanaa,
Huskymedic asked me a question. Write a check and a letter to Warde Manuel and Dannel a letter if you don't like the deal.

Here are some quotes for you:
"Hockey East bylaws require UConn to have a more suitable on-campus facility than Freitas, and when the Huskies agreed to join the conference in 2012, the school said it would begin construction by fall 2016. But a few games into UConn's second season in the conference, the deadline is somewhat looser, given the success of games the Huskies have hosted at the XL Center in downtown Hartford".

^^^See, I wrote about this earlier in thread…

"Even league commissioner Joe Bertagna acknowledged that if UConn were to build a state-of-the-art arena in Storrs, most home games still would be played at the XL Center."

Now in his third season at UConn, Cavanaugh said he stresses to recruits that people, not buildings, are the foundation for a strong program.

"I do say that," Cavanaugh said.
"If I get upset about the facility every day, it's like getting upset about a hooking call."

Your first bold quote is not a quote from anyone, that's the writer making that comment, editorializing a little bit. But if you can't see the disdain in Cav's quote you have bolded, I don't know what to tell you. When a coach is telling his recruits that it's people, not buildings, that are the foundations of the program, it's damn clear he knows he's going uphill. The problem he has, and that he knows, is that there are a good number of other programs in Hockey East and around the country that have BOTH the facilities and the people. If he doesn't have one, he's screwed and knows it - and when York hangs up the whistle that job up there is going to look mighty appealing.

There's a reason Bertagna doesn't speak to governors a lot - he has no reason to. There's no question New Hampshire is behind UNH, Maine behind UMaine, Vermont behind UVM, Massachusetts behind UMass (though they almost axed Lowell!). The reason he has to talk to Malloy is because Malloy has to convince him that Connecticut is behind UConn with these asinine plans that fit the mold of exactly zero programs in the country, and that require going against the agreement made between the conference and UConn with respect to an on-campus facility. If Malloy has anyone who is actively monitoring the HE situation he'd know that there are rumblings of Notre Dame leaving Hockey East within a few years. That person would be smart enough to know that two things could happen were that the case - neither of which is a positive for UConn. Either ND leaves, QU is added and we're back at 12, except now UConn has in-state competition. Or, say ND leaves, UConn's program is still muddling along, XL renovations are maybe coming along at some point, inevitably dragged through the mud in the legislature. There comes a point where UConn risks being booted out of Hockey East and the conference goes back to 10. It's a very low probability, especially since they never kicked Merrimack out despite being a garbage dump of a program for decades. But renegging on agreements with the conference, renovations not happening, the program not improving, and the looming possibility of the coach leaving all do not bode well for UConn. Of course all of that is 100% speculation on my part, and I do not believe there's a good chance at all it would happen. But, if Malloy has someone on his staff monitoring the HE landscape, that's what the internal discussion is in his office. And that's why he's having talks with Bertagna. There's a strong case to be made that it's not a good thing they're talking, but rather a precautionary measure.

 

[MASSconn]

Hartford is a crap city and UCONN needs to stop thinking it's main campus is located there.

If your head Men's Hockey and Men's Basketball coaches hate playing there, you should listen to them. It's not like our biggest donors live in Hartford. Most of them are closer to NYC. Doesn't make that big of a difference.

Build a freaking barn on campus and have half the games there. Unacceptable if this doesn't happen.

 

[Waquoit]

Hartford is a crap city and UCONN needs to stop thinking it's main campus is located there.

Here's where you Hartford haters miss the point, you continue to maintain that playing in Hartford is only about propping up Hartford. Wrong. It's a symbiotic relationship. "Only" 5.25K for the BU game? You aren't getting anywhere near that if the game is in Storrs. The fan base has spoken in hoop. You say the coaches hate the XL. The fact is the ticket-buying fans hate going to Gampel, especially during the week. Wisely, the AD is striving to accommodate both. So what if other schools don't have two homes. They don't have 14 titles either.

 

[FDNY99]

Here's where you Hartford haters miss the point, you continue to maintain that playing in Hartford is only about propping up Hartford. Wrong. It's a symbiotic relationship. "Only" 5.25K for the BU game? You aren't getting anywhere near that if the game is in Storrs. The fan base has spoken in hoop. You say the coaches hate the XL. The fact is the ticket-buying fans hate going to Gampel, especially during the week. Wisely, the AD is striving to accommodate both. So what if other schools don't have two homes. They don't have 14 titles either.

I'll disagree with you on the attendance for BU on campus...but let's look at things for second...if UCONN and Hartford have a "symbiotic relationship" as you said above...then why does;t the CRDA scale back the project..make UCONN the main tenant of the XL for the 30 games per yr and build it out to 12-15K. It's not like it will sell out at 18K for a basketball game anymore....and the NHL coming back to Hartford is a pipe dream that won't happen in this century.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

Here's where you Hartford haters miss the point, you continue to maintain that playing in Hartford is only about propping up Hartford. Wrong. It's a symbiotic relationship. "Only" 5.25K for the BU game? You aren't getting anywhere near that if the game is in Storrs. The fan base has spoken in hoop. You say the coaches hate the XL. The fact is the ticket-buying fans hate going to Gampel, especially during the week. Wisely, the AD is striving to accommodate both. So what if other schools don't have two homes. They don't have 14 titles either.

You're living in some alternate universe if you believe there were 5,200 there last night, there were not, that's at least 1,000 too many. The combined 30 hockey championships of the teams that were ahead of UConn in attendance last year, all playing on campus, roundly disagree with your last point.

 

[Waquoit]

I'll disagree with you on the attendance for BU on campus...make UCONN the main tenant of the XL for the 30 games per yr and build it out to 12-15K. It's not like it will sell out at 18K for a basketball game anymore...

We can disagree on 1st point. But I'm right. From what I saw last night, there were many, many fans that could be described as belonging to the Women's BB demographic. They aren't driving to Storrs on a Tuesday night. They don't do so for hoop, I'm gonna guess it would be the same for hockey.

And while the BB team doesn't draw 16K for hoop in this crap league. they will when we're in the B1G.

 

[Dooley]

Hartford needs a new arena or a very new model of the current arena. Period. If they want to make UConn the main tenant (like Raleigh, NC did with NC State), that's fine. Let the Wolfpack walk and then let UConn keep a good chunk of revenue generated from gamedays for hoops and hockey. It only makes sense for UConn if they can keep money from ticket sales and some of the concessions. They appease their alumni and fans who don't want to drive to Storrs on a Tuesday night by playing games more centrally located. It makes sense for Hartford regardless because UConn gamedays/nights are really the only days/nights that people voluntarily go into downtown Hartford and spend money.

Either way, UConn needs to, at the very least, build a Champions Center type of facility on-campus for hockey. Whether it includes 4K seating for a handful of weeknight on-campus games or not, it should include state-of-the-art training, nutrition, meeting rooms, coach's offices, study halls, etc. That is very much needed for recruiting and player development.

The negative perceptions that UConn is tagged with over football recruiting territorial location do not apply to hockey one bit. We are smack dab in the middle of one of the richest areas for youth hockey. With our AD budget, brand, size and student body/alumni numbers, there is no reason why UConn can't emerge as a national hockey power fairly soon. But to make that happen, an on-campus facility is an absolute must.

 

[FDNY99]

http://dailycampus.com/stories/2015/10/27/column-uconn-hockey-belongs-in-hartford
I actually like the thought process in this article....I would be ok with just the XL as long as the hockey programs get a practice facility that will give them everything they need to recruit and prepare their teams to win at an high level. But renovating Freitas to hold 4500-5000 and at the same time providing a state of the art team facility while continuing to play the bigger games (7-8 per year) at the XL works even better (and for the record is what I have been behind all along..).

 

[Dooley]

And while the BB team doesn't draw 16K for hoop in this crap league. they will when we're in the B1G.

^ This. Gampel was built way too small. Jeff Hathaway and UConn also missed a golden opportunity to expand the Rent to P5 levels back in the mid-2000s. The same mistakes cannot be made with the new Hartford arena. It doesn't need to be a behemoth, but building it with max capacity at 10-12K will be a mistake once UConn is playing home games against Michigan St, Wisconsin, Maryland, Ohio St, Michigan, etc. It should cater to the changing environment (i.e. "bar lounge" areas, standing areas for casual fans, luxury suites for the high rollers, etc), but capacity needs to remain at P5 levels. No question about that.

 

[FDNY99]

We can disagree on 1st point. But I'm right. From what I saw last night, there were many, many fans that could be described as belonging to the Women's BB demographic. They aren't driving to Storrs on a Tuesday night. They don't do so for hoop, I'm gonna guess it would be the same for hockey.

And while the BB team doesn't draw 16K for hoop in this crap league. they will when we're in the B1G.

I'll say this...I sit right behind the UCONN bench on the glass...I have been looking at the crowd every game since the place was packed against BC. I think the novelty has worn off a bit and attendance has plateaued out for most games....we will see 5000-5500 each game..which isn't bad at all for college hockey...BUT in an area that is built to hold 18K is gonna look empty. Now let's approach the B1G issue you brought up....for hoops yes B1G competition will bring back a packed house...like our old BE rivalries did. Hockey on the other hand IMHO will suffer. B1G hockey won't bring the crowds...outside of Minnesota Wisconsin is in desperate need of an overhaul, tOSU, MSU and UM aren't to the level of BU, BC and PC and PSU & ASU are new programs. The B1G is going to be a double edged sword with hockey for us.

 

[FDNY99]

^ This. Gampel was built way too small. Jeff Hathaway and UConn also missed a golden opportunity to expand the Rent to P5 levels back in the mid-2000s. The same mistakes cannot be made with the new Hartford arena. It doesn't need to be a behemoth, but building it with max capacity at 10-12K will be a mistake once UConn is playing home games against Michigan St, Wisconsin, Maryland, Ohio St, Michigan, etc. It should cater to the changing environment (i.e. "bar lounge" areas, standing areas for casual fans, luxury suites for the high rollers, etc), but capacity needs to remain at P5 levels. No question about that.

Gampel was built too small for a reason...I have said it here before,,my cousins husband was on the team that designed Gampel..they were told to submit 2 designs..1 of which was how it was built..the other expandable too make it double in size. It was built "too small" because of one reason...the XL Center...

 

[Dooley]

http://dailycampus.com/stories/2015/10/27/column-uconn-hockey-belongs-in-hartford
I actually like the thought process in this article....I would be ok with just the XL as long as the hockey programs get a practice facility that will give them everything they need to recruit and prepare their teams to win at an high level. But renovating Freitas to hold 4500-5000 and at the same time providing a state of the art team facility while continuing to play the bigger games (7-8 per year) at the XL works even better (and for the record is what I have been behind all along..).

I think that could work. I didn't even think about the soccer renovations coming. If they married the two, it would help keep costs low and at the same time, not require any additional land to be found/re-purposed.

 

[Dooley]

Gampel was built too small for a reason...I have said it here before,,my cousins husband was on the team that designed Gampel..they were told to submit 2 designs..1 of which was how it was built..the other expandable too make it double in size. It was built "too small" because of one reason...the XL Center...

Right. Which is exactly why the XL Center needs to continue to dwarf Gampel capacity. You can't cut 3-5K seats out of XL and provide the same financial gains to UConn for playing games there as they have now. XL (or the new arena) needs to maintain 15K capacity minimum.

Renovated XL/New Arena: 15-16K for hoops
Curtained off for hockey: 8-9K
Freitas Arena: 4500

The renovated/new arena should be reconfigured so that the lower bowl seats the 8-9K for hockey. It's absurd to think that the current arena seats 2/3 of the fans in the building so far away from the action. They will need to make it more intimate as well and expand on the lower bowl (and move some luxury suites closer to the ice/court too) to bring it into the 21 century.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

http://dailycampus.com/stories/2015/10/27/column-uconn-hockey-belongs-in-hartford
I actually like the thought process in this article....I would be ok with just the XL as long as the hockey programs get a practice facility that will give them everything they need to recruit and prepare their teams to win at an high level. But renovating Freitas to hold 4500-5000 and at the same time providing a state of the art team facility while continuing to play the bigger games (7-8 per year) at the XL works even better (and for the record is what I have been behind all along..).

It's an interesting argument but the problem is a practice facility alone will not give them everything they need to recruit at a high level. It would most certainly help, but it only takes them part of the way.

 

[FDNY99]

It's an interesting argument but the problem is a practice facility alone will not give them everything they need to recruit at a high level. It would most certainly help, but it only takes them part of the way.

IMHO end game for UCONN Hockey..sometime after the 2017-2018 season is finished they will be moving into a upgraded Freitas that will seat 4500 (with option to increase capacity to 5000 down the road) and also include a team facility on par with what UCONN is known for. They will play high profile teams like BC, BU, QU, PC and ND at the XL Center. I can also see a bid being put in for the Frozen Four at the XL Center as well.

 

[FartMan69]

Right. Which is exactly why the XL Center needs to continue to dwarf Gampel capacity. You can't cut 3-5K seats out of XL and provide the same financial gains to UConn for playing games there as they have now. XL (or the new arena) needs to maintain 15K capacity minimum.

Renovated XL/New Arena: 15-16K for hoops
Curtained off for hockey: 8-9K
Freitas Arena: 4500

The renovated/new arena should be reconfigured so that the lower bowl seats the 8-9K for hockey. It's absurd to think that the current arena seats 2/3 of the fans in the building so far away from the action. They will need to make it more intimate as well and expand on the lower bowl (and move some luxury suites closer to the ice/court too) to bring it into the 21 century.

What sucks about them "transforming" XL is that this problem is not being solved. If you look at the renderings its clear that the current seating bowl will be the same albeit spruced up.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

IMHO end game for UCONN Hockey..sometime after the 2017-2018 season is finished they will be moving into a upgraded Freitas that will seat 4500 (with option to increase capacity to 5000 down the road) and also include a team facility on par with what UCONN is known for. They will play high profile teams like BC, BU, QU, PC and ND at the XL Center. I can also see a bid being put in for the Frozen Four at the XL Center as well.

If that's the case of what they plan to do to Freitas, that's a different animal - if it'll be turned into a viable HE-quality home rink. Simply being a non-game practice facility would be a waste of money. And the NCAA won't go to a non-NHL arena in a small city for the FF, so that's not going to happen. The days of them putting the FF in the likes of Albany and Cincinnati are gone. Now, being a regular regional site host, that's realistic especially if UConn can work its way to be a fairly regular NCAA Tournament participant since it would mean an automatic placement of UConn in Hartford.

 

[Husky25]

The lower bowl is what it is and appears similar to other arenas. From this rending, it looks like the improvements are being made to the upper level and spectator entrances. Those are luxury boxes where the concourse currently is, which is a huge upgrade.

At the risk of discounting the fact that the MSG Bowl is Yuge with a capital Y. the above rendering is not unlike what MSG was renovated into. Before the most recent gutting/rebuild, the MSG Bowl was split into 3 segments with boxes surrounding the top of the arena.

 

[Husky25]

The current configuration replaces the middle segment with boxes and created a distinct upper level.

 

[FartMan69]

MSG had a better seating bowl than the XL. The steepness and awkward views at the XL needs to be addressed. It's a 10k seat arena that they crammed 16k in after the roof came in.

 

[Dooley]

What sucks about them "transforming" XL is that this problem is not being solved. If you look at the renderings its clear that the current seating bowl will be the same albeit spruced up.

You're right - that won't solve anything other than installing a few suites closer to the action (that needs to be done too though).

I would hope that they figure out a way of making 2 decks wrap around the arena. For example, raise that old 300s sections at the far side of the rink to be parallel with the yellow "Go Huskies Go!" sign (HFD would hate this drawing by the way...YELLOW?!?!?). Fill in the spaces in the corners with seating on a second level. Move the lounge/bar upstairs and fill up the entire second deck behind that goal. In the space left, add additional lower level seating up to the "yellow line". Do the same on the opposite side of the arena but leave the second deck for seating. Get the lower capacity to 7-8K and curtain off anything above the yellow line (except lounge/bar and nosebleed skyboxes) for UConn hockey.

I think renovating the XL is going to be tougher than we all think. It's a puny arena jammed into a small little space in an old shopping mall. Unless they can find a way to expand stuff into the old mall sq footage, space is limited. They might be better off starting from scratch.

 

[FDNY99]

I've been to MSG a bunch of times since they finished the refurb and outside of the Delta Sky Bridge...I don't think much changed. The last time they made a dramatic change to MSG was when they removed the Blue Seats and put in the sky boxes. As for the amenities changes...you don't see them unless you have the $$ to sit down at ice level. Then you basically have what they have at Yankee Stadium with the all you can eat lounge's...except that at MSG they charge you for food if they come to your seat.

 

[FDNY99]

You're right - that won't solve anything other than installing a few suites closer to the action (that needs to be done too though).

I would hope that they figure out a way of making 2 decks wrap around the arena. For example, raise that old 300s sections at the far side of the rink to be parallel with the yellow "Go Huskies Go!" sign (HFD would hate this drawing by the way...YELLOW?!?!?). Fill in the spaces in the corners with seating on a second level. Move the lounge/bar upstairs and fill up the entire second deck behind that goal. In the space left, add additional lower level seating up to the "yellow line". Do the same on the opposite side of the arena but leave the second deck for seating. Get the lower capacity to 7-8K and curtain off anything above the yellow line (except lounge/bar and nosebleed skyboxes) for UConn hockey.

I think renovating the XL is going to be tougher than we all think. It's a puny arena jammed into a small little space in an old shopping mall. Unless they can find a way to expand stuff into the old mall sq footage, space is limited. They might be better off starting from scratch.

I thought that was what the parking garage was purchased from the city for and the space they negotiated away from Northland...to expand the seating and concourse areas...

 

[CL82]

Gampel was built too small for a reason...I have said it here before,,my cousins husband was on the team that designed Gampel..they were told to submit 2 designs..1 of which was how it was built..the other expandable too make it double in size. It was built "too small" because of one reason...the XL Center...

...and the New Haven Coliseum.

 

[Waquoit]

I think renovating the XL is going to be tougher than we all think. It's a puny arena jammed into a small little space in an old shopping mall. Unless they can find a way to expand stuff into the old mall sq footage, space is limited. They might be better off starting from scratch.

Yeah, that's the rub. Right now it's 16,000 seats in a hole dug for 10,000.

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

Yeah, that's the rub. Right now it's 16,000 seats in a hole dug for 10,000.

Didn't even the renovation plan call for breaking into the space occupied now by the old mall a bit? There's no way they can create 18,000 seats with suites and what not in the footprint they have now.

 

[ct06111]

^^^

http://www.courant.com/real-estate/hc-pdf-hartford-stadium-study-20150219-htmlstory.html

Download the pdf to check out the SCI report.
Since the Feb 2015 report, the CT bonding commission has given an additional $500,000 to finalize the plans, costs, etc.

http://ct.gov/opm/lib/opm/Minutes_May11_2015.pdf
Page 15

 

[FDNY99]

Didn't even the renovation plan call for breaking into the space occupied now by the old mall a bit? There's no way they can create 18,000 seats with suites and what not in the footprint they have now.

yeah that and the parking garage they bought from the city.

 

[ct06111]

sept 29 meeting(not XL, but PAWSARF)

http://www.ct.gov/opm/lib/opm/Minutes_Sep29_2015.pdf
Page 25

 

[FartMan69]

Apparently they're releasing updated renderings in the coming weeks. 3 full shifts working over 3 summers. I do remember reading they're purchasing the mall area for expanded retail and a much needed second concourse, here's to hoping they fix the seating bowl issues. I also would hope if they're keeping the core of the building in tact that they make sure it's in good shape so we don't have to tear this joint down 20 years later.