Tom Thibodeau is out as head coach of the Knicks (Merged threads) | Page 7 | The Boneyard

Tom Thibodeau is out as head coach of the Knicks (Merged threads)

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navery12 said:
No, but Thibs is the guy who wasted the team built using those 6 1sts. Him waiting until the middle of the series to find out that there were things Delon Wright and Landry Shamet can do to help them win is his fault
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It's well known that Thibs, going back to his days in Chicago, doesn't go deep enough into the bench and then on top of that his practices are overly intense for the long season which runs his limited rotation. He deserves criticism for being stubborn in this regard, and yes that is his fault, we all know that, which is what I was alluding to in mention his hard coaching ceiling. He got outcoached by Carlisle for sure.

However, he still played a part in getting the Knicks farther then they ever had since the last 25 years and I stand by that. Did he deserves to get fired? I don't know. Am I surprised he got fired? Yes. Does he deserve credit for the Knicks defeating the reigning champion Boston Celtics, a series no one thought they would win? Or do only the players get that credit?
 
superjohn said:
It's also the most talented team I remember them having. They put the roster together to knock off the Celtics and to try and win the championship.

They have 4 guys who are considered top 50 in the league with Brunson back to back second team all-NBA.
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Brunson and KAT are very good players, but they were both available for a reason. It's hard to build a championship defense around them. The fact that they managed to finish just 14th in points allowed per 100 possessions even after the additions of Bridges & Anunoby would make me wary if I were a coach considering the job. Thibs isn't a great coach, but he isn't bad, either, and a lot had to go right for them to make it as far as they did.
 
This year is different than last year. I understand why it made business sense to publicly dance with the Lakers. That won’t happen this t8me. Danny should come out today and say thanks but no thanks. Not yet.
 
Blue Huskie said:
I don't care if it is close to Jersey. If he doesn't jump ship to coach an elite program like the Lakers he's not going to get involved with the New York Stiffs.
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Coaching the Knicks is certainly a possibility and our biggest threat. Its ideal for Hurley in respect to logistics, media and opportunity. He's a Coach who likes to coach and loves challenges and I'm not sure we even know his long term goals.

All good things come to an end, hopefully not soon.

Jay Z Money GIF
 
It makes more sense in many ways to bring in Jsy Wright over Dan Hurley. Tibs is a mirror image of Dan Hurley style wise without the ref baiting tendencies. Plus JW had a history with many of the players, most importantly with Brunson. Not the right time or team for Dan Hurley but the location is ideal. We will see.
 
gsmooth said:
It's well known that Thibs, going back to his days in Chicago, doesn't go deep enough into the bench and then on top of that his practices are overly intense for the long season which runs his limited rotation. He deserves criticism for being stubborn in this regard, and yes that is his fault, we all know that, which is what I was alluding to in mention his hard coaching ceiling. He got outcoached by Carlisle for sure.

However, he still played a part in getting the Knicks farther then they ever had since the last 25 years and I stand by that. Did he deserves to get fired? I don't know. Am I surprised he got fired? Yes. Does he deserve credit for the Knicks defeating the reigning champion Boston Celtics, a series no one thought they would win? Or do only the players get that credit?
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He definitely deserves credit for beating Boston, so I agree he might not have deserved to be fired. But I think it was also very obvious that they were never going to win a championship with him as the head coach. The best way I've heard it phrased is Thibs can make a bad team good, but he can't make a good team great. He's just too stubborn to make even the most obvious changes.

And FWIW, the criticism of Thibs' practices is the opposite now. The Knicks stopped practicing entirely, especially the starters, so that they could handle all the minutes they were being played
 
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jibsey said:
Hurley and his family have a great situation here on every level. He’s the kingpin in Ct. As a Knick coach he’s just one of 8 pro coaches.
He Iives in the city or Jersey it’s a big pain in the ass, and he doesn’t need the money which BTW will ALWAYS be there for him.
Completely shocked if he did this but this board has melted down over it not surprisingly.
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Right. If there's one thing about Hurley that's widely known it's his distaste for NJ and NYC.

If anything that would be the major selling point for this move. Think his parents are still in JC. Two hour drive up to Hartford or Danny sends them across the river with a car service?
 
VanDunk said:
I’ll admit that I don’t get why on earth you’d want to be an NBA coach other than money. Can you literally “coach” NBA players? How do you get them to defend for the 1,000 regular season games. How do you run complicated plays at half speed? When someone millionaire is slowly jogging back on défense how do you say “get the back on défense”! Does one bad call mean anything? A Danny Hurley that can’t be bothered to get a technical is not a Danny Hurley.
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When you’re wired the way Danny is, the ego always wants more challenges.

To be clear, I don’t think it’s the right move for him, but people saying he wouldn’t be good in the NBA just pushes someone like Dan freaking Hurley to try to prove them wrong.

That and the money.
 
FWIW borges doesn’t seem too concerned.

UConn sources indicated that there isn't a whole lot to worry about in this instance.
 
UConnTrumbull said:
FWIW borges doesn’t seem too concerned.

UConn sources indicated that there isn't a whole lot to worry about in this instance.
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I read that article. I guess it helps me feel a little better, but how many times have we heard this story elsewhere? I guess I’m truthfully a little less worried about it this time around because if he goes, who could blame him, it’s his dream job and it is what it is. But deep down I think he may have had a revelation that the college game suits him better for the near future. I also think the Knicks already have someone in mind or locked down before deciding to make such a drastic move. It is what it is either way
 
Current odds to be the next head coach below. Johnnie Bryant at 40-1 is a nice flier if you're betting man.

​

Michael Malone (+100)
Jay Wright (+150)
Jeff Van Gundy (+600)

Chris Quinn (+700)
Taylor Jenkins (+800)
Danny Hurley (+900)
Rick Brunson (+1200)
Mike Brown (+1400)
Mark Jackson (+1600)
Steve Nash (+2200)
James Borrego (+3300)
Johnnie Bryant (+4000)
John Calapari (+4500)
Mike Budenholzer (+5000)
Mike D'Antoni (+5000)
Sam Cassell (+6600)
 
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All of this speculation about who is going to replace Thibs. I will go with the people who put their money where there mouth is, the guys that set the betting odds. Glad there is a betting line on this at this point it is your best tool to guess who the Knicks next HC will be. I am happy to see Hurley is not one of the favorites.

I am a Knicks fan and although I understand him being fired is not fair, I am not certain how much fairness was or would be part of the decision making process not just for the Knicks but any team.

I agree with the theory that this was player driven. When you have Bridges saying I would not mind playing less minutes, I really don’t think he was as much speaking for himself as he was trying to be a leader. You have to have buy in 100% from the players to succeed in the NBA. I mean no way Ty Lu is thought of so highly on his pure x and o coaching skill. Lu is a consensus builder and forges great relationships with his players.

Thibs is just too rigid for today’s game, imo. Look what happened when he dipped into his bench finally in this series. When you have two stars who are really bad defensively, one who is physically, because of height and overall lateral quickness (Brunson) and one who will probably never exert maximum effort on defense (Towns), you have to figure out rotations that lessen that impact. To do that you have to play more than 7 players.

Yes I hate to see this but this team in my opinion has enough talent and only needs one more very good rotation piece to get back to the ECF next year and maybe further next year. Not sure Thibs was going to get this group to take the next step.

Is that thinking unfair…..absolutely…but we all know life ain’t fair.
 
aceboon said:
Yea you putting way too much sauce on it. Thibs got outcoached but based on the locked NBA playoff thread before the series started Knicks fans on here seriously underrated the Pacers because y'all were dismissing them like they had no chance in the series.
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I don't doubt that there were a handful knuckleheads who felt that but most fans realized it was going to be an extremely competitive series.

What it came down to was pace of play. In games that both teams would combine for ~200 points, Knicks win nearly every time. In games that both combine for ~250 points, Pacers win nearly every time. The Knicks also shot themselves in the foot over the final few minutes of game one, getting very sloppy on offense and very lazy on defense.

The Pacers did win a very competitive series. Anyone who understands the game knew going in that it was going to be a competitive series.
 
The Knicks have to win now. Hart is 30 and KAT turns 30 early next season. I don't see a college coach with no pro experience as a top choice. That said, Udoka is not leaving Houston because Houston is set up for a long run. The Knicks may recycle Budenholzer or Vogel. Budenholzer is a lot better at load management than Thibs but he is not a great game coach. I like Vogel. I don't know some of the other candidates that well.

Thibodeau was a moron for playing Hart, KAT and Brunson as much as he did, and they ran out of gas. It is amazing that in the modern day there are still coaches that think they can play top athletes 35 mpg for 70+ games. This is especially insane given that Thib's overplaying of Derrick Rose effectively ruined the career of one of the best guards of the 21st century. Even Kevin Ollie understood load management, and he was only the coach of a good not great college team 11 years ago, but he still figured out a way to get Nolan, Omar Calhoun and Brimah on the court to save his starters.

What was Thibodeau thinking?
 
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Hunt for 7 said:
All of this speculation about who is going to replace Thibs. I will go with the people who put their money where there mouth is, the guys that set the betting odds. Glad there is a betting line on this at this point it is your best tool to guess who the Knicks next HC will be. I am happy to see Hurley is not one of the favorites.

I am a Knicks fan and although I understand him being fired is not fair, I am not certain how much fairness was or would be part of the decision making process not just for the Knicks but any team.

I agree with the theory that this was player driven. When you have Bridges saying I would not mind playing less minutes, I really don’t think he was as much speaking for himself as he was trying to be a leader. You have to have buy in 100% from the players to succeed in the NBA. I mean no way Ty Lu is thought of so highly on his pure x and o coaching skill. Lu is a consensus builder and forges great relationships with his players.

Thibs is just too rigid for today’s game, imo. Look what happened when he dipped into his bench finally in this series. When you have two stars who are really bad defensively, one who is physically, because of height and overall lateral quickness (Brunson) and one who will probably never exert maximum effort on defense (Towns), you have to figure out rotations that lessen that impact. To do that you have to play more than 7 players.

Yes I hate to see this but this team in my opinion has enough talent and only needs one more very good rotation piece to get back to the ECF next year and maybe further next year. Not sure Thibs was going to get this group to take the next step.

Is that thinking unfair…..absolutely…but we all know life ain’t fair.
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Most NBA players would rather stretch out their prime and their careers than play an extra 5 mpg for a single season. It is a no brainer from the players' standpoint, and something that Thibodeau doesn't get. Budenholzer is kind of a choker as a game coach, but he got another year out of Middleton's prime with load management, and kept Giannis, Lopez and Holiday fresh for the playoffs. There is no way Thibodeau would have won a title in 2021 with that Bucks' team given the way Thibs coaches.

I don't think Malone is a great game coach, but he got the Nuggets to the playoffs in 2023 with only one starter playing over 70 games and no player averaging 34 mpg or more.

Malone and Budenholzer have rings. What does Thibodeau have?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
The Knicks have to win now. Hart is 30 and KAT turns 30 early next season. I don't see a college coach with no pro experience as a top choice. That said, Udoka is not leaving Houston because Houston is set up for a long run. The Knicks may recycle Budenholzer or Vogel. Budenholzer is a lot better at load management than Thibs but he is not a great game coach. I like Vogel. I don't know some of the other candidates that well.

Thibodeau was a moron for playing Hart, KAT and Brunson as much as he did, and they ran out of gas. It is amazing that in the modern day there are still coaches that think they can play top athletes 35 mpg for 70+ games. This is especially insane given that Thib's overplaying of Derrick Rose effectively ruined the career of one of the best guards of the 21st century. Even Kevin Ollie understood load management, and he was only the coach of a good not great college team 11 years ago, but he still figured out a way to get Nolan, Omar Calhoun and Brimah on the court to save his starters.

What was Thibodeau thinking?
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I love Nelson sneaking in KO whenever he can.
 
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superjohn said:
Just got a text that Jay Wright is a no, he's done with coaching.
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I think Seth Davis is annoying but I doubt he would have said what he did yesterday if there was any chance Jay Wright was going to the Knicks
 
I can't believe the Knicks are paying Thibs $30M not to coach, that is staggering. Any other business the GM loses his job for extending him last season.

I'm torn between thinking that payment means they will NOT also pay a buyout for their next coach (Udoka, Kidd or ??) OR that they are throwing around money anyway so who cares about another multi-million dollar buyout?!
 
i for one have to believe, you do not make this kind of decision without already having a plan!
 
Dogdeacon said:
I can't believe the Knicks are paying Thibs $30M not to coach, that is staggering. Any other business the GM loses his job for extending him.
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They’re such a sorry-ash franchise that their fans actually think the GM is some genius. 30M for Thibs to sit on the couch. 5 first rounders for an average Mikail Bridges. And somehow Rose is considered some kinda genius because Brunson decided to take a big pay cut.
 
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