Starting point guard

[hoopsnloops32]

Angel Reese is listed as PF/SF. (I haven't really seen her in games where she posts up.) I see her as a SF though, whether you think it's real or not. Someone who can drive/slash to the basket, long, and can board. Preferably has a decent mid-range jumper. Why don't you consider Reese a SF? Is she a PF, C, guard? I don't see Reese or Morrow guarding Paige. Best left to LSU's quicker guards.

She has no jump shot and she has a terrible handle. She can face up from the elbow ish but that’s about it. I’ve really only see her be successful posting up or owning the offensive boards. I’ve seen little of her ability to slash or drive. And I watched a lot of LSU games. She’s likely going to have to be their center for large portions of the game this year so I’m not sure we are talking about the same player.

 

[Bone Dog]

If anyone thinks seniority matters to Geno, or how someone played the previous year, or even that some players deserve minutes, think again. I'm pretty sure Geno determines playing time entirely on the basis of how someone performs in practice and in the last few games. You earn minutes with him. Nobody deserves them. In this most recent video, he reiterated this very principle. And in previous years he has said that seniors have no special priority for playing time and that getting playing for underclassmen is often more important to the program.

As fans, we are free to speculate on who will get minutes on the basis of seniority, prior year's performance, etc. And we're not wrong to do so. But that's just speculation. It's not what Geno bases his decisions on.

 

[Dogstar]

She is not a better shooter than Caroline.

The stats say tht she is

 

[sun]

The stats say tht she is

Carol scored .332 points per minute that she played last year.
Nika scored .194 points per minute that she played last year.

Geno said in his recent interview that he wants increased efficiency & will be rewarding it with PT since there will be less minutes to go around due to the larger roster.
He wants players to accomplish more during their limited PT.

 

[Alydar]

So not only is she a worst shooter statistically, she’s also a high volume poor shooter? Not really making the case to start Caroline over Nika here.

Nika’s form may be worse than Carolina but this far Carolinas shooting touch hasn’t translated into real college games. Where as Nika also has defense and creating shots for other in her skills set so even if she isn’t shooting well she is still creating points.

There is just not a rational argument at this time that validates putting Caroline or Aubrey over Nika in the line-up.

I acknowledged Muhl's somewhat higher shooting%. This isn't about Muhl's ability. It's about your inability to recognize Ducharme's. Dec. 19th 2021. The Hall of Fame game vs Louis. UConn lost. Ducharme, a month into her freshman season, started and played 40 minutes while leading the team in scoring (24) and rebounds (8). She took 40% of UConn's shots. Her 3 pt shooting 3-9 was about at Muhl's average but the more important point is that those were the only 3's UConn made. I remember not expecting a lot from her coming into the game. It wasn't her numbers that impressed me, it was her maturity. She played confidently and efficiently. She continued to do that until her 1st head injury. That's all I need to list her as eligible to start. She siezes opportunities, she anticipates. She's a 3 level scorer. And I know this because she has shown it in actual games.


That game also typified the ineffectiveness of both Williams and Westbrook and why Bueckers moved to scoring guard. Thankfully UConn has a stable of great shooting/scoring guards/wings this season.

 

[HuskyNan]

Carol scored .332 points per minute that she played last year.
Nika scored .194 points per minute that she played last year.

Geno said in his recent interview that he wants increased efficiency & will be rewarding it with PT since there will be less minutes to go around due to the larger roster.
He wants players to accomplish more during their limited PT.

Caroline scored more points because she took more shots per minute. Link to @JRRRJ stats here. But Nika shot a higher percentage

 

[Dogstar]

Carol scored .332 points per minute that she played last year.
Nika scored .194 points per minute that she played last year.

Geno said in his recent interview that he wants increased efficiency & will be rewarding it with PT since there will be less minutes to go around due to the larger roster.

Ohhhh ok so wht ur saying is tht the 2 and 3 pt percentages don't matter? For last year and carrer.

 

[hoopsnloops32]

I acknowledged Muhl's somewhat higher shooting%. This isn't about Muhl's ability. It's about your inability to recognize Ducharme's. Dec. 19th 2021. The Hall of Fame game vs Louis. UConn lost. Ducharme, a month into her freshman season, started and played 40 minutes while leading the team in scoring (24) and rebounds (8). She took 40% of UConn's shots. Her 3 pt shooting 3-9 was about at Muhl's average but the more important point is that those were the only 3's UConn made. I remember not expecting a lot from her coming into the game. It wasn't her numbers that impressed me, it was her maturity. She played confidently and efficiently. She continued to do that until her 1st head injury. That's all I need to list her as eligible to start. She siezes opportunities, she anticipates. She's a 3 level scorer. And I know this because she has shown it in actual games.


That game also typified the ineffectiveness of both Williams and Westbrook and why Bueckers moved to scoring guard. Thankfully UConn has a stable of great shooting/scoring guards/wings this season.

Great that one game almost two years ago means you think someone should start over someone who has shown up consistently on both ends of the court for three seasons. I won’t be operating on potential over reality.

 

[hoopsnloops32]

Caroline scored more points because she took more shots per minute. Link to @JRRRJ stats here. But Nika shot a higher percentage

View attachment 89097

I’d also be interest to know how many points Nika created per minute when you factor in points and assists into the equation.

 

[Alydar]

Then what is it that you are actually arguing about regarding Nika?


You are saying equal 26 minutes for Nika, Azzi and Paige when you mention a 3-guard rotation. I that's the case, that means Paige and Nika play 52 minutes which means they are on the court together at times. You think it best that Paige bring up the ball and one of her options on the Wing is Nika? Or on a fastbreak Paige drives to the ft line and looks for Nika to drill a 3? I don't think so. That's not even close to being the same as the other way-- >

When I say rotation that means 3 players for 2 positions. Eighty minutes between three players. When Bueckers/Muhl or Fudd/Muhl are on the court Muhl would be the pg. This does not preclude Bueckers and Fudd getting some minutes at the 3 in certain games. But I expect the depth at post to freeze Ducharme and Griffin back to mostly wing minutes.

The problem is a lot like trying to stuff a sleeping bag into its bags with a hangover. There are 200 minutes and possibly 12 players deserving of game minutes.

 

[Alydar]

Great that one game almost two years ago means you think someone should start over someone who has shown up consistently on both ends of the court for three seasons. I won’t be operating on potential over reality.

If you look it up you would see that from that game Dec 19 to the end of January she was UConn's leading scorer in 6 of their 8 games. That's when she hurt herself. I'm not positive but you check my numbers, OK?

Ducharme is expected to be 100% and if that is the case UConn will be overwhelming on offense. But the possibility of a reoccurrence may make Geno decide to make her a sub. She's a player B1G teams mold their offense around. That good. I've been watching a lot of Larry Bird videos and noticed that he wasn't very fast or very quick, was a decent ball handler but couldn't jump very high. That's Ducharme. Geno may have the luxury of bringing a player of that caliber off the bench?

 

[MilfordHusky]

Geno is unlikely to sit an upperclassman for a freshman unless he’s short handed or the freshman is Maya

There are freshmen, and there are freshmen. Maya was the best freshman I've ever seen, with the possible exception of P. Buckets.

 

[Alydar]

Nika will be a senior this season, as is Paige and Aaliyah. As I have posted previously, these three plus Azzi will most likely start games. And because of Aubrey being a red shirt senior, odds are that she will also start. It would be anyone's guess who will be the first off the bench.

When Muhl entered the starting lineup in her freshman season it was 5th year player Westbrook who sat.

 

[Blond D.]

Maybe this has been posted elsewhere...if the question is "Who is the starting point guard?", then maybe an associated thought would be "Who is the best floor general?" As a point guard all my hoop days, this has been the term for the PG. Who commands the ball, sees the defense, knows/sees how the defense is playing the offense, and vice-versa.

To me this is PB. Likely the best player on the team, pound for pound.

I agree that Paige is the best player on the team...maybe in the WNCAA but that doesnt mean she should be the point guard. Neither Jordon nor Kobi played point guard.

 

[oldhusky]

I’d also be interest to know how many points Nika created per minute when you factor in points and assists into the equation.

Good point, if you count two points for Nika for every assist and add that to her points her volume of points she was involved in may be as high as Ducharme' figured the same way. Or let me ask a question another way, will Azzi and Paige shoot a higher percentage with Nika in the lineup or Caroline? I for one think the additional open looks from Nika's passing will help those two more than the additional floor spacing Caroline might provide.

 

[HuskyNan]

When Muhl entered the starting lineup in her freshman season it was 5th year player Westbrook who sat.

Because Paige was hurt and E was forced to play out of position at point guard. Geno finally put a natural point in at the 1. Nika started out of necessity

 

[hoopsnloops32]

Good point, if you count two points for Nika for every assist and add that to her points her volume of points she was involved in may be as high as Ducharme' figured the same way. Or let me ask a question another way, will Azzi and Paige shoot a higher percentage with Nika in the lineup or Caroline? I for one think the additional open looks from Nika's passing will help those two more than the additional floor spacing Caroline might provide.

Exactly, a player like Nika complements Azzzi and Paige more than Ducharme, who needs higher volume to be effective. Nika kn the floor means more shots for our best shooters. Can’t lose with that combo.

 

[Alydar]

I agree that Paige is the best player on the team...maybe in the WNCAA but that doesnt mean she should be the point guard. Neither Jordon nor Kobi played point guard.

Jordan and Kobi both played in a position that best utilized their talent. Bueckers' talents are best utilized at pg.

 

[Alydar]

Because Paige was hurt and E was forced to play out of position at point guard. Geno finally put a natural point in at the 1. Nika started out of necessity

Not in Bueckers and Fudd's freshman year. Bueckers was the starting point guard until it became plain that Williams and Westbrook weren't the answer as perimeter scorers. Geno was very clear that he wanted Bueckers to concentrate on scoring. If Williams and Westbrook had scored more Muhl would have continued to come off the bench.

 

[JBK]

That line up does not have the size or athleticism to compete with the SC and LSU’s

 

[Alydar]

Exactly, a player like Nika complements Azzzi and Paige more than Ducharme, who needs higher volume to be effective. Nika kn the floor means more shots for our best shooters. Can’t lose with that combo.

And the defense can help on both Fudd and Bueckers, reducing the number of good looks they get.

 

[Cuango]

Unclear why AE or even Ice are better with Pb, azzi and Aaliyah? Defensively Nika is a better perimeter defender than Aubrey, which is what the SF position is in modern day basketball, and a better offensive threat as well. If you have two of the best shooters in college basketball it seems like a no brainer to pair them with the single season assist record holder rather than a tweener that shoots significantly worse from the perimeter.

AE is Aaliyah! I didn’t even mention Aubrey!

 

[hoophuskee]

How many years has Paige played at SF? (Maybe this is my general comment?) South Carolina lost to Iowa because they didn't shoot well from the outside. Packed it inside and dared South Carolina to make outside shots. And, for this game, they didn't shoot well. How many games did South Carolina lose last season playing their style? Stanford won against Arizona by how many points? Stanford still had the better front line...Cameron Brink, etc. with a nice complement of perimeter and attacking players.

This thread is about who is the starting point guard. It's my thought that Paige as a SF will likely get roughed up more than as a guard.
Yes, the winner is the one with the higher score. Whether you get there by offense or defense is immaterial. Personally, I've been coached by winning on the defensive side.

First off all it's okay- absolutely fine that you didn't answer my question (we can't answer everyone’s questions. I didn’t answer all of yours too)) as to who will stop Paige- but I think you implied it at the end by saying she'll get roughed up. I believe then we agree that you know of no one that can stop Paige Bueckers at the SF, correct? It's just that you think she'll get roughed up, right? Because you are unable to name one player on any team that can stop her, right?

Secondly, can you tell me why it's relevant how many years Paige has played SF? She played SG for the 2nd half oof her frosh year in which CWil played SF. UCONN switches everything. So you don't think that relevant yet on a prior post you replied to me about Morrow and Reese? Why is it that it was relevant to mention power players like Reese and Morrow vs Paige but at the same time ask how many minutes Paige has played at SF? And Paige has played a lot of sg in h/s and as mentioned the 2nd half of her frosh year which she ended up being NPOY.

And how many minutes did CWill play SF in her career before UCON put her there in 2020-2021? How about Evian Westbrook playing PF that year?

And your point about South Carolina losing to Iowa is the point that I made about this is college game and not a pro game. So, to summarize there's going to be several teams out there that can pound UCONN in the paint, defend the perimeter to minimize Paige/Azzi, play great transition defense and nail down outside shots. SO how many WNBA teams does UCONN have on their schedule?

And personally I've never seen a team win with defense only at Division 1 or Pro level or just Offense. You win with both. As far as having the better front line, now it's no longer about size when I mentioned it was the Arizona guard that most beat UCONN or the Stanford SF that was Paige’s size?

And the definition of "frontline" is archaic as a generalization. Is the Sf a part of the frontline or considered more of a perimeter player? Thus when I played and have watched for over 50 years, I notice teams can do things differently. Imo UCONN's Defense will be way better than you are representing here. And when you mention the frontline’s won because they were better, yet in the same post you made it clear Soth Carolina lost because their gaurs couldn’t shoot. So- whether you have the better frontline or not really doesn’t mean as much as you imply, does it?

 

[hoopsnloops32]

And the defense can help on both Fudd and Bueckers, reducing the number of good looks they get.

Except they can’t because Nika is a respectable shooter from outside 34% career which is, again, better than CD, and Nika will have the ball. You don’t help off the ball.

 

[Cuango]

You of course have a right to your opinion. I have never seen Ice play a minute alongside those four or even of college basketball so I can’t conclude she is either the best option at the five or would be part of our best starting roster. Nika clearly had a far superior year last season than Caroline and is a proven effective player when starting alongside both Paige (as a freshmen) and Azzi ( this past season).

I am not fixated, illogically with Nika starting at the PG but rather for the many reasons I’ve cited in various posts above I believe she will be part of the best starting five. What makes Caroline’s or Ice’s or any other player’s projected value trump Nika’s proven value?

Ice (or Jana) can play at the 5 spot. Caroline (as I stipulated) “if healthy” is a better scorer, is 6’2”, better rebounder, can post up, is better around the basket, is stronger, is a natural 3, and most important, allows Paige to play the point, which results in a better starting five. IMO, of course.

 

[HuskyNan]

Not in Bueckers and Fudd's freshman year. Bueckers was the starting point guard until it became plain that Williams and Westbrook weren't the answer as perimeter scorers. Geno was very clear that he wanted Bueckers to concentrate on scoring. If Williams and Westbrook had scored more Muhl would have continued to come off the bench.

Nika’s first game as a starter was vs Georgetown because Paige was hurt (Rolled ankle). Evina also started that game, as she did for the entire 2020-2021 season. Azzi was still in high school during Paige’s freshman season.

Three games after Georgetown, Nika entered the starting lineup and stayed there for the rest of the season.

Evina’s 2020-21 season, the asterisk indicates starter

 

[hoophuskee]

Maybe this has been posted elsewhere...if the question is "Who is the starting point guard?", then maybe an associated thought would be "Who is the best floor general?" As a point guard all my hoop days, this has been the term for the PG. Who commands the ball, sees the defense, knows/sees how the defense is playing the offense, and vice-versa.

To me this is PB. Likely the best player on the team, pound for pound.

Over time as long as I have been following for me pg defintion has changed. When UCONN won in 2003 and 2004 the starting pg was Maria Conlon. In the NBA Bird was the "pottn-forward." A few years ago Gabby was the leader of the team and lead in in assists. So who was the pg?

Do you really think it is so terrible that if Nika brings up the ball in a haflcourt set vs Paige? Because UCONn runs a motion offense, that is just so terrible that it will kill UCONN? And if healthy, how many games during the seaosn do you think UCONN will be incapable of blowing out other teams if Nika brought the ball up a portoin of the game instead of Paige and ran more fastbreaks than Paige whiel Paige catches many of those passes on the Wing?

 

[Cuango]

Caroline scored more points because she took more shots per minute. Link to @JRRRJ stats here. But Nika shot a higher percentage

View attachment 89097

.9% & .5% is pretty insignificant.

 

[Cuango]

I agree that Paige is the best player on the team...maybe in the WNCAA but that doesnt mean she should be the point guard. Neither Jordon nor Kobi played point guard.

They didn’t play point guard because that was not their natural, best position!

 

[Alydar]

Except they can’t because Nika is a respectable shooter from outside 34% career which is, again, better than CD, and Nika will have the ball. You don’t help off the ball.

Defenses will be happy to let Muhl's scoring beat them.

You lose me in any case because I see Geno playing 2 guards. He has three outstanding guards but after that there's a lot of inexperienced potential but no proven guards to put in the game while there will be several front court players who can play multiple positions sitting. Why risk all your guard depth at the start of the game with the front court depth available?