Religion in football

[Palatine]

I don't think Jesus cares if Puyol makes or misses. But it Puyol's right to express his religious views freely either way. That right is protected in the constitution which says.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

Note that it says nothing about football coaches. Except , like others protected by this document they are free to exercise their religion however they wish. They are free to worship in any way they want. And they are free to invite their players to church.

The fact that the Supreme Court has lost its way and made a bunch of idiotic laws that actually go against that phrase doesn't override it. The constitution is the higher authority.

 

[Husky25]

That was, is, and will never be the argument...ever. (it's also not entirely true)!!!!

Coaches and players at a public school are not barred from worship. Puyol can point to the heavens and cross himself after a successful kick if he so chooses. Tim Tebow can praise Jesus before every sideline interview question. Wonderful. Ivan Rodriguez is free to cross himself whenever he stepped into the batters box. Whatever. Karl Malone is free to say a little prayer before each free through. Who cares? No one will ever say anything about any of it.

Coaches of teams in the public realm (Public universities, public high schools, Town leagues, etc.) are also free to invite their players to church. That is still on this side of the line. They cross that line, however, if a player feels obligated against their wishes to accept the invitation for fear of consequence (whatever that may be).

Now to the untrue part.

The Court stated that "Laws are made for the government of actions, and while they cannot interfere with mere religious belief and opinions, they may with practices." For example, if one were part of a religion that believed in vampirism, the First Amendment would protect one's belief in vampirism, but not the practice.

Basically one is free to practice whatever religion that floats their boat, up to and including the exact instance where it infringes on the rights of others. As a libertarian, I don't understand how that is such a difficult concept to grasp.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

That is still on this side of the line. They cross that line, however, if a player feels obligated against their wishes to accept the invitation for fear of consequence (whatever that may be).
.

For all I know that may be the legal standard but it's pretty dumb base the law on how one person feels. Try proving that someone doesn't feel one way or another.

 

[Husky25]

For all I know that may be the legal standard but it's pretty dumb base the law on how one person feels. Try proving that someone doesn't feel one way or another.

Next time, read and comprehend the ENTIRE post before taking part of it out of context and replying.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

Next time, read and comprehend the ENTIRE post before taking part of it out of context and replying.

Which part of my opinion took you out of context?

 

[Husky25]

Do you understand the concept of coercion? How about hostile work environment? One is free to do anything up to the point where their actions infringes on the rights of others.

Which part of my opinion took you out of context?

 

[Palatine]

Do you understand the concept of coercion? How about hostile work environment? One is free to do anything up to the point where their actions infringes on the rights of others.

Coercion must be proved not just allegated.

 

[kibblesnbits]

There is, quite properly, a higher standard for people in positions of authority over others. Inviting a subordinate to church is extremely close to the line depending on circumstance. Having formal team "church days" makes it a program sanctioned event and unquestionably does cross that line. There is inherent coercion when the boss organizes such an event.

Frankly, I wonder how anyone that claims to believe in individual freedoms can believe that a boss (and make no mistake, that is the role played by a college football coach) should be able to intervene in any way with religious practices of subordinates. If someone even thinks to ask themselves, "what might happen if I say no" because of the role of the person making the offer then it was probably inappropriate.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Let's ask Native Americans who aren't Christians what they think of Christians.

What is native about the purported native Americans? Ancestors of mixed genetic composition who may have arrived in what is now the US, or the Americas, earlier than some European predominantly lighter skin tone also of mixed genetic composition? Truly native?

Were all purported native Americans without religion? Or, a different nature than some arriving whiteys, some who actually arrived in the Americas with varying to no religious beliefs?

Facts may get in the way of relating generalizations about so-called natives directly to Dabo. Perhaps, James Boster, UCONN's wack job, evolutionist anthropology professor now in a bit of a bind can explain the connection.

Football season cannot start soon enough!

 

[Nostical]

What is native about the purported Native Americans.

Or, as Donald Trump famously said in testifying against a group of individuals purporting to be members of a Native American tribe and seeking recognition to open a large competing casino: "They don't look like Indians to me!"

 

[NotreDameJoe]

Coach announces optional trip to Museum of Natural History to learn about Darwinism and survival of the fittest.

I feel like there might be repercussions for not going.

Lawsuit! School settles out of fear of punitive judgment.

 

[Husky25]

Nice strawman. The Museum of Natural History is not a holy building and Darwinism is a scientific theory, not theological.

 

[Palatine]

Nice strawman. The Museum of Natural History is not a holy building and Darwinism is a scientific theory, not theological.

It's a government building.

 

[Husky25]

Aaaaannnnddd that has to do with what exactly?

It's a government building.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Or, as Donald Trump famously said ... "They don't look like Indians to me!"

Indeed, someone changing the important sentence-ending question mark from the quoted post makes a big difference. Entirely tangental to the unrelated, how native is native topic, and Dabo's influence over Clemson gridiron athletes, Friday's Colin McEnroe Hartford Courant column on James Boster's recent tizzy in Storrs is equally humorous.

Wonder how much Boster's views expressed outside of the classroom influence his grading of UCONN students' academic work? After UCONN President Herbst's public condemnation of ex-football assistant Ernest Jones' over the top Jesus in the huddle remarks, will she now publicly express similar concerns regarding Boster? Where does it stop?

Football season cannot start soon enough!

 

[NotreDameJoe]

Nice strawman. The Museum of Natural History is not a holy building and Darwinism is a scientific theory, not theological.

You've said the law is based on what people feel, not how things appear in the phonebook. Or is a team trip to the Creationist museum okay ?

 

[Husky25]

You've said the law is based on what people feel, not how things appear in the phonebook. Or is a team trip to the Creationist museum okay ?

You appear to not understand the concept of a straw man either.

 

[Samoo]

You appear to not understand the concept of a straw man either.

Your mistake is believing that he is trying to understand the concept.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

I plucked the same terms that the opposition based their argument on, if that's a straw man then what have I been fighting?

 

[Husky25]

I plucked the same terms that the opposition based their argument on, if that's a straw man then what have I been fighting?

You haven't been fighting anything, just creating straw man arguments.

At first I thought you were trying to play devil's advocate, but i am unsure now if you are even able to grasp that concept either.

 

[Husky25]

Your mistake is believing that he is trying to understand the concept.

I was hoping he was attempting to play devil's advocate. Now I'm not so sure. To say nothing of the common practice of announcing beforehand that one will take on the role of devil's advocate.

 

[temery]

Or is a team trip to the Creationist museum okay ?

No

 

[CL82]

Probably not worth my time..but i will try.

You are right...it is voluntary. Dabo also is free to choose whoever he wants to be on his two deep. In a perfect world there isn't a connection between those two points.

So people of faith can't be coaches because they might, in our imperfect world, favor like minded individuals. Could the same be said of any characteristic? Say lefthanders can't be coaches because they just might favor other lefthanders? Just wondering.

 

[CL82]

Separate church and state and by him telling recruits he's a Christian that is crossing the separation line.

This sentence expresses a profound misunderstanding of the first amendment that is, sadly, far too commonly held.

 

[CL82]

You'd be very wrong to characterize all those who disagree with you, as atheisists. I realize it is needed to support your position, but you'd still be wrong.

Except if you read his post again, you may see that he didn't do that.

 

[BlueDogs]

It would take hours to recite the overwhelming evidence that the constitution does not prohibit any person in any context from expressing and practicing their religion (including public offcials). A wall between state and religion is not a term found in the constitution, nor even surfaced until much later in a Supreme Court decision that failed to follow precedent. Justice Story (a framer and Supreme Court justice) made it clear from day 1 that while all religions were to be permitted, the Christian faith was conceived as being an essential and necessary part of a healthy and strong country. The current abuse and cleansing off religion from public space is part of an ongoing assualt by progressives to knock down Western culture, which they perceive to be the origins of all human suffering and unfairness. I for one and sick and tired of it, and have no intention standing silent to the intolerance of the iconoclasts wrapped in progessivism.

If our football coach can be fired, then what about the professors attacking kids for espousing anti-Christian views like the UConn professor harassing kids or the Eastern professor.

 

[temery]

It would take hours to recite the overwhelming evidence that the constitution does not prohibit any person in any context from expressing and practicing their religion (including public offcials). A wall between state and religion is not a term found in the constitution, nor even surfaced until much later in a Supreme Court decision that failed to follow precedent. Justice Story (a framer and Supreme Court justice) made it clear from day 1 that while all religions were to be permitted, the Christian faith was conceived as being an essential and necessary part of a healthy and strong country. The current abuse and cleansing off religion from public space is part of an ongoing assualt by progressives to knock down Western culture, which they perceive to be the origins of all human suffering and unfairness. I for one and sick and tired of it, and have no intention standing silent to the intolerance of the iconoclasts wrapped in progessivism.

If our football coach can be fired, then what about the professors attacking kids for espousing anti-Christian views like the UConn professor harassing kids or the Eastern professor.

Many of the founding fathers were also members of Congress when the Treaty of Tripoli was signed, saying we were not a Christain nation.

 

[uconnfan68]

It would take hours to recite the overwhelming evidence that the constitution does not prohibit any person in any context from expressing and practicing their religion (including public offcials). A wall between state and religion is not a term found in the constitution, nor even surfaced until much later in a Supreme Court decision that failed to follow precedent. Justice Story (a framer and Supreme Court justice) made it clear from day 1 that while all religions were to be permitted, the Christian faith was conceived as being an essential and necessary part of a healthy and strong country. The current abuse and cleansing off religion from public space is part of an ongoing assualt by progressives to knock down Western culture, which they perceive to be the origins of all human suffering and unfairness. I for one and sick and tired of it, and have no intention standing silent to the intolerance of the iconoclasts wrapped in progessivism.

If our football coach can be fired, then what about the professors attacking kids for espousing anti-Christian views like the UConn professor harassing kids or the Eastern professor.

So evolution is now anti-Christian? Wow... what would Jesus pack?

 

[SubbaBub]

It's a government building.

And as far as I know, they don't discriminate from morons entering, nor do they wander out into the street proclaiming said morons are somehow less than the non-morons. They don't even pressure the morons to come inside and learn something.

 

[SubbaBub]

It would take hours to recite the overwhelming evidence that the constitution does not prohibit any person in any context from expressing and practicing their religion (including public offcials). A wall between state and religion is not a term found in the constitution, nor even surfaced until much later in a Supreme Court decision that failed to follow precedent. Justice Story (a framer and Supreme Court justice) made it clear from day 1 that while all religions were to be permitted, the Christian faith was conceived as being an essential and necessary part of a healthy and strong country. The current abuse and cleansing off religion from public space is part of an ongoing assualt by progressives to knock down Western culture, which they perceive to be the origins of all human suffering and unfairness. I for one and sick and tired of it, and have no intention standing silent to the intolerance of the iconoclasts wrapped in progessivism.

If our football coach can be fired, then what about the professors attacking kids for espousing anti-Christian views like the UConn professor harassing kids or the Eastern professor.

Wow, just wow. So, if I fired you for not sharing my particular brand of faith or just gave you the Milton treatment, that'd be OK with you? It's amazing that the self-proclaimed are some of the most intolerant people on the planet. You get to harass people at will, but if anyone protests it's warp speed to victimland.

Let's make this as simple as possible. Do whatever you want, the rest of us don't care. Pray, spout whatever ancient nonsense you think justifies your existence, thank Jesus after every breath on any street corner in America, just don't bother the rest of us with it in your official capacity as a member of a government organization.