QB controversy/ies? | Page 2 | The Boneyard

QB controversy/ies?

NowInStorrs said:
I thought the same thing about Fagnano this year but here we are and I'd prefer to see Fagnano in there. Either way, I completely agree on the portal. The nice thing is if we can get 7-8 wins then maybe getting a QB in the portal gets easier.
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I had the same thought. Add to that: win a bowl game.
 
MilliniumPrince said:
I think Cole beats him next summer, and like most of us you are addicted.
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I am and I am not. We buy tix one game at a time as our schedule fits, and will leave before the end of the game if the frustration builds or we get cold (both happened today).

The discussion here is usually collegial and respectful, so investing a half hour a day in the BY is a form of recreation, I suppose. But on occasion I do leave for extended periods.
 
Bongo Fury said:
What I have noticed is teams play QBs like Cole if they are absolutely better, others are injured or out of desperation of a struggling team. Tim Boyle?
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Cole isn't yet built ruggedly enough to take the pounding he is gonna get at this level. Let's see how he bulks up and develops his consistency before he gets thrown into the fire. For that matter, NE looks a bit lightly built to me ... which may be why he is so fast.
 
giddyup said:
Fagnano is no great shakes, but undoubtedly gives us the best chance to actually win a ballgame, which, when I last checked, was the objective. I get sticking with a guy to build reps and confidence but there is nothing there that even suggests he has something to offer.
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If Evers cannot throw and cannot run he is worthless. We just went through this the last two years.
 
RSTuthill said:
Cole isn't yet built ruggedly enough to take the pounding he is gonna get at this level. Let's see how he bulks up and develops his consistency before he gets thrown into the fire. For that matter, NE looks a bit lightly built to me ... which may be why he is so fast.
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He’s 6’6 225lbs.. Consistency?
 
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Husky68 said:
Getting more game reps doesn't make you a more accurate passer, how much better passer did Bones get. That is NE's comp.
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Did Tim Boyle get a little better after that first bad year at UConn? He got "NFL better".

I don't know if Evers should start next week. Today was a bad game from him. But the idea that he "is what he is" at this point in his football career is also not necessarily true either...
 
UConnDan97 said:
Did Tim Boyle get a little better after that first bad year at UConn? He got "NFL better".

I don't know if Evers should start next week. Today was a bad game from him. But the idea that he "is what he is" at this point in his football career is also not necessarily true either...
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I understand this was only his 6th start but he’d been practicing with P4 conference teams for two years before arriving. That definitely counts for quite a bit. A good QB talent is generally ready to start by year 3. He’s 21 years old.

Anyway, my expectations on his development curve are pretty low at this point. It’s possible, but I’m guessing what we see is just about all we’re gonna get.
 
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Hoophound said:
I understand this was only his 6th start but he’s been practicing with P4 conference teams for two years before arriving. That definitely counts for quite a bit. A good QB talent is generally ready to start by year 3. He’s 21 years old.

Anyway, my expectations on his development curve are pretty low at this point. It’s possible, but I’m guessing what we see is just about all we’re gonna get.
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Again, I'll point to Boyle. Did anyone think he'd be a solid pro after his time at UConn OR Eastern Kentucky??

My comment isn't just about Evers. It's also about Welliver too. QB development (like any other skill in the world) is not always a straight line and is not always predictable. Folks should try to keep that in mind when they try to "diagnose" the future of anyone else...
 
UConnDan97 said:
Again, I'll point to Boyle. Did anyone think he'd be a solid pro after his time at UConn OR Eastern Kentucky??

My comment isn't just about Evers. It's also about Welliver too. QB development (like any other skill in the world) is not always a straight line and is not always predictable. Folks should try to keep that in mind when they try to "diagnose" the future of anyone else...
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First time I saw Boyle, I thought he was our version of Matt Ryan. Great release, tight spirals and the ball jumped out of his hand. He was never the same at UConn after his first game. I’m no football genius, but his raw ability was evident.
To be honest, we haven’t seen those nuggets of hope coming from Nick. Maybe he’s banged up, I just know the ball doesn’t look great coming out and he’s not accurate.
 
UConnDan97 said:
Again, I'll point to Boyle. Did anyone think he'd be a solid pro after his time at UConn OR Eastern Kentucky??

My comment isn't just about Evers. It's also about Welliver too. QB development (like any other skill in the world) is not always a straight line and is not always predictable. Folks should try to keep that in mind when they try to "diagnose" the future of anyone else...
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Boyle is really good at holding a clipboard. He's not really a good quarterback. There are plenty of guys in every professional league that are on rosters because of potential or because they do other things well besides produce on the field.
 
RSTuthill said:
Cole isn't yet built ruggedly enough to take the pounding he is gonna get at this level. Let's see how he bulks up and develops his consistency before he gets thrown into the fire. For that matter, NE looks a bit lightly built to me ... which may be why he is so fast.
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He wasn't fast last night. And that was us yelling "Fagnano" from 123 all game long.
 
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JMick said:
Boyle is really good at holding a clipboard. He's not really a good quarterback. There are plenty of guys in every professional league that are on rosters because of potential or because they do other things well besides produce on the field.
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He is a good enough QB to have taken snaps in the NFL. I don’t know what your definition of a “good” QB is but in my world any QB in the NFL is a good quarterback.
 
UConnDan97 said:
Again, I'll point to Boyle. Did anyone think he'd be a solid pro after his time at UConn OR Eastern Kentucky??

My comment isn't just about Evers. It's also about Welliver too. QB development (like any other skill in the world) is not always a straight line and is not always predictable. Folks should try to keep that in mind when they try to "diagnose" the future of anyone else...
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I understand and I know what you mean. However, he’s 21. He can’t throw accurately and the ball lacks zip. He isn’t Pat White with his feet either. He just doesn’t appear to be the guy.

In your defense, we just saw Jordan Travis put things together at FSU for two great seasons after a long haul getting there. It’s certainly possible. However, Travis is built like a pro wrestler compared to Evers.
 
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Patman said:
If Evers cannot throw and cannot run he is worthless. We just went through this the last two years.
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I think our record would be the same with Roberson right now, They are similar except Roberson would not run the ball. Accuracy downfield, advantage T’Quan but no one was open last year. W/upgraded receivers this year - I see the team sitting at 5-3.

What the team needs is sitting on the bench - Joe and later this season I would love to see Cole.
 
JMick said:
Boyle is really good at holding a clipboard. He's not really a good quarterback. There are plenty of guys in every professional league that are on rosters because of potential or because they do other things well besides produce on the field.
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So your stance is that he is not a "backup level pro", but that he's somehow tricked 6 different pro teams to pay him to hold a clipboard.

Cool...
 
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Hoophound said:
I understand and I know what you mean. However, he’s 21. He can’t throw accurately and the ball lacks zip. He isn’t Pat White with his feet either. He just doesn’t appear to be the guy.

In your defense, we just saw Jordan Travis at FSU put things together at FSU for two great seasons after a long haul getting there. It’s certainly possible. However, Travis is built like a pro wrestler compared to Evers.
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But again... the breakthrough can happen this year. Or next year. Or never. There is no magic age or even body type (see Drew Brees) that determines when a QB becomes successful...
 
UConnDan97 said:
Did Tim Boyle get a little better after that first bad year at UConn? He got "NFL better".

I don't know if Evers should start next week. Today was a bad game from him. But the idea that he "is what he is" at this point in his football career is also not necessarily true either...
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Could be but given some of the examples using Boyle are off. Boyle always had NFL arm. NE doesn't have NFL arm or NFL legs (if he does he's hiding it well). Sure, guys can all of a sudden get lot better but usually have some "super thing" that need to harness. Sandy Koufax and Rod Guidry both became "instant" star pitchers because they had all the tools (even HOF level tools) and just needed to harness to the strike zone.

Keep coming back to 2 years of P4 practice and half season of starting and looked like this. UConn won 6 games a couple of years ago with freshman QB who looks like a career college backup, so getting 5 to 8 wins with mostly NE will be in spite of him, not because of him. NE is ranked #121 out of 122 in FBS passing efficiency stats, hard to be that bad.

There is something fundamentally wrong with NE related to accuracy and touch, if Mora and company haven't made it better as of know, why not? They have endless tape, computer imaging tools, a QB coach and time to work against problems. We talk about how "tough" Temple defense is, look at how many points they gave up yesterday (to East Carolina).

This season is already a success to me, so getting to 6 to 9 wins will be a bonus. Mora can do all the "he just needs reps" coach speak as long as he gets a better QB for next year (be it one of the young kids or from the portal).
 
Husky68 said:
Could be but given some of the examples using Boyle are off. Boyle always had NFL arm. NE doesn't have NFL arm or NFL legs (if he does he's hiding it well). Sure, guys can all of a sudden get lot better but usually have some "super thing" that need to harness. Sandy Koufax and Rod Guidry both became "instant" star pitchers because they had all the tools (even HOF level tools) and just needed to harness to the strike zone.

Keep coming back to 2 years of P4 practice and half season of starting and looked like this. UConn won 6 games a couple of years ago with freshman QB who looks like a career college backup, so getting 5 to 8 wins with mostly NE will be in spite of him, not because of him. NE is ranked #121 out of 122 in FBS passing efficiency stats, hard to be that bad.

There is something fundamentally wrong with NE related to accuracy and touch, if Mora and company haven't made it better as of know, why not? They have endless tape, computer imaging tools, a QB coach and time to work against problems. We talk about how "tough" Temple defense is, look at how many points they gave up yesterday (to East Carolina).

This season is already a success to me, so getting to 6 to 9 wins will be a bonus. Mora can do all the "he just needs reps" coach speak as long as he gets a better QB for next year (be it one of the young kids or from the portal).
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And when did he develop his "NFL arm"? Was it at Xavier High School?? Before that???

Again, people develop at different rates and achieve different heights. And nobody can say where the ceiling is for anyone. We need better from both Evers and Fagnano. We may not get it. Or we may get it next week...
 
Husky68 said:
Could be but given some of the examples using Boyle are off. Boyle always had NFL arm. NE doesn't have NFL arm or NFL legs (if he does he's hiding it well). Sure, guys can all of a sudden get lot better but usually have some "super thing" that need to harness. Sandy Koufax and Rod Guidry both became "instant" star pitchers because they had all the tools (even HOF level tools) and just needed to harness to the strike zone.

Keep coming back to 2 years of P4 practice and half season of starting and looked like this. UConn won 6 games a couple of years ago with freshman QB who looks like a career college backup, so getting 5 to 8 wins with mostly NE will be in spite of him, not because of him. NE is ranked #121 out of 122 in FBS passing efficiency stats, hard to be that bad.

There is something fundamentally wrong with NE related to accuracy and touch, if Mora and company haven't made it better as of know, why not? They have endless tape, computer imaging tools, a QB coach and time to work against problems. We talk about how "tough" Temple defense is, look at how many points they gave up yesterday (to East Carolina).

This season is already a success to me, so getting to 6 to 9 wins will be a bonus. Mora can do all the "he just needs reps" coach speak as long as he gets a better QB for next year (be it one of the young kids or from the portal).
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If Mora is trying to build something meaningful, he has to get to a new high water mark of 7 wins or more. You find the guy that best gets you there and you make hard choices which means cutting the cord on NE. Kid has nothing to offer and isn’t getting better. Maybe he’s hurt, but whatever the case you put players on the field that help you win.
 
Jacks5556 said:
He’s 6’6 225lbs.. Consistency?
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We know he has a good arm. He is listed at 6-7 220 now. Not sure I buy the 220 as he looks thin to me. He has had long enough to learn the playbook, so we are left with consistency by process of elimination. The same disease as the others.
 
RSTuthill said:
We know he has a good arm. He is listed at 6-7 220 now. Not sure I buy the 220 as he looks thin to me. He has had long enough to learn the playbook, so we are left with consistency by process of elimination. The same disease as the others.
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Do you know what 220 looks like on 6'7"??? He SHOULD look thin.

I'm 208 and I'm 5'9"...
 
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giddyup said:
Fagnano is no great shakes, but undoubtedly gives us the best chance to actually win a ballgame, which, when I last checked, was the objective. I get sticking with a guy to build reps and confidence but there is nothing there that even suggests he has something to offer.
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This is where I'm at. That said, I usually don't have a strong preference between the two of them. Although, yesterday heading into halftime, I sure did.
 
RSTuthill said:
To that point, if Evers is the guy next year I will disengage completely. They need to go to the portal in the off season.
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Well, that was pretty much my thought process about Fagnano prior to the Merrimack game. Things change and he may be a different looking kid if completely healthy. That said, I'll probably be quietly rooting for Welliver to get the starting nod next year during the off-season.
 
businesslawyer said:
Even if you think Evers had earned a clear #1, not making a change at halftime Saturday with the entire offense looking so incompetent was a sign of real stubbornness.
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Unlike what A&M did Saturday might against LSU.
 
businesslawyer said:
Even if you think Evers had earned a clear #1, not making a change at halftime Saturday with the entire offense looking so incompetent was a sign of real stubbornness.
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A like isnt enough for this post. It gives me real pause with Mora sticking with this kid like this. 9-24 with so many misses of open receivers is concerning. Whether it is injury or confidence, the kid is regressing on gameday. Last week, because they trailed all game he had a chance to throw a ton and picked up a lot of his passing yards in the 4th.
 
businesslawyer said:
Even if you think Evers had earned a clear #1, not making a change at halftime Saturday with the entire offense looking so incompetent was a sign of real stubbornness.
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Perhaps, and yet, staying the course resulted in a W. If stubbornness is successful, does it become steadfastness?

(Again, I was definitely screaming for a change, but the result is the result. Now, I'm sure there are some who say "Well we would've won by even more if the switch had been made to Fagnano." I'd respectfully remind them that that is a guess, not a fact. The fact is we stayed with Evers and won.)
 
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