Parker off Olympic team?

[iamcbs]

Sources: Parker left off women's Olympic team

I'm sure the Summit is exploding with anti-geno rhetoric.

Geno has extremely limited input in selecting the roster, there's a committee from USA Basketball that does that. He just coaches the team.

 

[wbbfan]

Tina Thompson Verified account ‏@IamTinaThompson 28s29 seconds ago

My face when I found out Candace Parker isn't on the USA Team! Smh...unbelievable how 1 person can diminish decades of work! #teamCP

 

[UcMiami]

She wasn't happy about no starting but she she played well enough in 2012 and played well enough thereafter as the poster tennparker said -- "Geno said Candace and Maya were at another level at the previous camp."

I agree Angel's attidue is overblown. She just isn't as good as Parker. To leave one of the greatest players off the team who can play any style and play in any manner "she isn't a fit" is ridiculous.

Two players imo no business to have over Parker are Angel and Fowles. To suggest that Tina can't slide down to backup center for teams that rebound well and have size and all of our other great forwards can't compete on the glass imo is far-fetched.

Neither Fowles or Angel provide the same game as Parker

We saw at the Pan Am games what international play can do to 'finesse' post players - body contact is not called while hand contact is. Fowles provides the type of low post defensive strength as well as height that is very valuable (and she is also a very skilled and experienced player.) It is the essential ingredient that made include Asjha in the last Olympic team important and she proved herself in the one game where she was needed. If you want to drop Fowles, you are going to need to find a player with her strength as a replacement. In my view there is not another post in the US with her combination of both strength and skill.

Angel is also a completely different type player from Parker - she had a pretty poor WC but a very good Olympics. She fully embraces her role as a multi-tool bench player. You want a little instant offensive energy, she can do that, you want a little defensive perimeter pressure defense, she can do that, you don't need either and leave her anchored to the bench, she is cool with that as well. She is in no way as skilled as Parker but she isn't competing for Parkers role. If you want to drop her, then you are looking for someone 6'-ish who can be disruptive on the perimeter and can when needed be a microwave on offense. (FYI - in the last three competitions Angel has led the team in steals (cumulatively doubling up on the next highest) shot .500 or better while starting zero games.)

The team as everyone says is not the twelve best players but the best players that make up the best team to play multiple styles of offense and defense.

Fowles, Griner, and Charles are 15' and in defenders and offensive players - Griner is unique in her height and defensive quickness, Fowles and Charles are the muscle options.

Bird, Whalen, and Taurasi are the PGs and orchestrators on offense.

Moore, Augustus, and EDD provide mid-range to three point shooting - EDD has the height to make up for less intense defensive pressure, Augustus doesn't get the credit for her defense that she probably should, and Moore is Moore. The last two can perform as two guards at both ends if necessary.

That leaves Stewart, McCoughtry, and Catchings - at this stage Catchings provides intensity on the defensive end especially and experience, McCoughtry I already discussed and Stewart is the future - she is the ONLY really young player that you can look at and say, she will be a mainstay of USA basketball into the 2020s and possibly beyond.

The issue that USA basketball has had for quite a while is the 'next' guards and since 2006 they have been looking - Lawson got her medal that year as did Pondexter, but in 2010 Lawson was replaced by Whalen and Angel replaced Pondexter as a swing perimeter player. And they have been cycling guards through the team trying to find someone - Sims, Diggins, January, Robinson, Vandersloot have all gotten a look, but this year Sims (who did win the last round) Diggins and Robinson are all coming off injuries or newly injured. I don't have a handle on January's game, but I suspect Vandersloot might end up being the next 'Whalen' type player who finally cracks through a little later in her career. Loyd has been added in this cycle but is still really young, and maybe Moriah gets added to the next cycle or maybe one of the other impressive guards still in college at this time. But none of these guards has distanced themselves from any other one, and none have been able to clearly supplant Whalen, Bird, or Taurasi. Is it a big concern going forward - absolutely, and I suspect the next cycle for USA basketball between 2016 and 2018 is going to try to incorporate a lot more team building time (not an easy proposition with schedules.)

 

[msf22b]

Candace just tweeted her surprise and disappointment...

Is Tina attacking Geno?

 

[bbsamjj]

I would put Candace Parker's chances of winning the WNBA MVP this year now close to 85%. When you have one of the top 5 players in the world playing with something to prove, watch out.

 

[ucdt3]

I would put Candace Parker's chances of winning the WNBA MVP this year now close to 85%. When you have one of the top 5 players in the world playing with something to prove, watch out.

If someone who is Top 5 in the world NEEDS this as motivation then the answer is clear as to why she isn't on the team and still doesn't have a WNBA title to her name.

 

[Blueconn]

Geno has extremely limited input in selecting the roster, there's a committee from USA Basketball that does that. He just coaches the team.

"Geno has extremely limited input..." ??? Am betting Geno has at least consistent and perhaps considerable input.

 

[Justavisitor]

Tina Thompson Verified account ‏@IamTinaThompson 28s29 seconds ago

My face when I found out Candace Parker isn't on the USA Team! Smh...unbelievable how 1 person can diminish decades of work! #teamCP

She is referencing Geno. Considering she is an Olympian, give her credit for knowing how these selections work and you certainly can't say it's TN being bitter. Tina wouldn't put that out there if she didn't know

 

[Lurker]

As a WBB (and a UConn) fan, I'm deeply disappointed that I will not be watching Candace play with the US team - she is an incredible athlete and I can still remember with awe some of what she did as a college player. Geno commented how good Elena and Candace looked together on the court, and I was looking forward to seeing that. I'm just totally bewildered and I agree, there has to be something yet to come out to explain it, because she certainly is among the very best.

 

[bbsamjj]

Breaking this down my position:

PG: Bird/Whalen
SG: Taurasi/Augustus
SF: Moore/Catchings/McCoughtry
PF: Charles/EDD/Stewart
C: Griner/Fowles

Augustus's position is somewhat tenuous, given that McCoughtry, and even Moore, could be used as a SG. And McCoughtry's position on the team is tenuous, given that she's probably the 3rd SF on the team.

Then you have the veteran and rookie slots. At this point in their careers, I think it's pretty undeniable that Parker is better than both Catchings and Stewart. But the committee obviously thought Catchings' experience and Stewart's potential were more important than Parker's immense talents. It's a decision you can make with a team this loaded, but I'm not convinced it's the correct one.

 

[HoopsFan21]

"Geno has extremely limited input..." ??? Am betting Geno has at least consistent and perhaps considerable input.

Kerith Burke asked Geno how much input he gets when choosing the team, and he responded "it depends" 3 times with a grin.

 

[bbsamjj]

If someone who is Top 5 in the world NEEDS this as motivation then the answer is clear as to why she isn't on the team and still doesn't have a WNBA title to her name.

Given the performance Candace put on when she returned to the WNBA last year, I don't think she needs this as motivation at all. My point was that the rest of the league better watch out.

 

[Orangutan]

Candace just tweeted her surprise and disappointment...

Is Tina attacking Geno?

Sure reads that way. Honestly, the optics on this are not good.

Taurasi, Moore, and Charles are no-doubt picks. But Stewart has no pro experience and Bird has been a statistically below average player for a couple years now. At those same positions, you have the most visible Tenn. player (Parker) and the most visible ND player (Diggins) missing out. Sure, Diggins is coming off knee surgery, but they didn't take her for Worlds right after she was named 1st team All-WNBA.

There might be good reasons for these decisions but it definitely looks like it's much easier to make the team if you went to UConn. And if you went to a rival of UConn, it's much harder.

 

[UcMiami]

On the Bird/Whalen vs. younger guards - neither Bird nor Whalen have ever been the leaders statistically amongst PGs at any level of competition but have continued to be viewed as among the best at their position throughout their careers - so comparing statistics amongst PGs has never told the whole story. (Whalen was traded for Tina (#1 draftee) (with Monica Wright and Renee also swapped) - just an indication of how highly valued Whalen was in 2010.) What Bird and Whalen provide is incredibly strong leadership and the ability to get disparate very talented players to work as a cohesive whole with an innate ability to know just when to assert themselves offensively.
Most of the other guards either need the ball too much or assert themselves offensively too infrequently. That can work well with a team that has a training camp lasting 4 weeks and plays three months of competition because you build the system around the particular skills of the players you have. It doesn't work well with a USA team that gets very little training time and only three games of pool play to gel - specially true when every player on the team is used to dominating the ball on their other teams.
We are probably all more familiar with the college landscape - the last two years Moriah was clearly the best PG in WCBB. She was:
#33 in assist/game
#7 in A/TO
NR in points per game (well below #250)
#32 in steals per game
She did not qualify for FT % or 3FG % because she didn't take enough of either. But she ranked:
#2 in FG % for guards (#18 overall)
and would have slotted in at:
#10 in 3FG%
#5 in FT%
What she clearly was, was the most efficient guard in the country running the most efficient and deadliest offense in the country while being a major contributor to the most efficient defense in the country. No one seriously looked at Johnson and Allen and said they dished more assists so they were a better, or that Plum and Mitchell scored more than double the points so they were clearly better.

No one in this thread is screaming that Catching should have been dropped for Nneka or Candace or _____. She is clearly not quite the player she was, but she is a consummate USA teammate who brings both leadership and sacrifice to every team she plays on. She is, like Bird on her way out the door, but they both still bring qualities to the team that cannot be replaced by younger less experienced players.

 

[Blueconn]

Tina Thompson Verified account ‏@IamTinaThompson 28s29 seconds ago

My face when I found out Candace Parker isn't on the USA Team! Smh...unbelievable how 1 person can diminish decades of work! #teamCP

Here we go : "...1 person..."

Thompson may be completely wrong that "1 person" kept CP from Rio. She may simply be angry and momentarily inclined to put the blame on "1 person" that she suspects, dislikes, or has some issue with.

Or she knows, or thinks she knows, something that merited her post. That being the case, it would be unlikely that she would point to "1 person" without expecting a whirlwind of inquiry to identify that person. Committee member ? Player ? Someone on team staff ? A coach ? Or someone technically unconnected to USA WBB ? Who knows ?

The donnybrook has begun.

 

[stwainfan]

Seven women have won the WNBA's MVP award over the past eight years, one of them twice. She's the same person who has the league's highest career player efficiency rating (PER) among those currently active in the WNBA: 26.77. And only two players, both retired, are ahead of her all time in that statistic.

She led the United States in rebounds and blocked shots in the 2012 Olympics, and was tied as the team's third-leading scorer. Last year, she sat out the first part of the WNBA season to rest, and her team was 3-14 in that time. With her, the team went 11-6 and grabbed a playoff spot.
Omitting Parker is a bad call by USA Basketball

 

[iri10]

There might be good reasons for these decisions but it definitely looks like it's much easier to make the team if you went to UConn. And if you went to a rival of UConn, it's much harder.

I agree with your overall assessment of the optics. I will point out, however, that they chose to keep Catchings on the team, who came from the same rival team as Parker. It would probably have been less shocking to the public if they had left Catchings (in the twilight of her career) off the team in exchange for Parker...though I don't think I would have made that choice. It's why this feels like a team fit issue to me more than anything.

"Team fit" is a blanket term in this case, covering roster balance and the way the players gel with the other players...and with the coaching staff. That last aspect sounds pretty insidious, but really it's a case of "damned if you do, damned if you don't" - a really good player who doesn't buy in to what the coach is selling can be a serious problem for team chemistry.

 

[bags27]

Video | The Geno Auriemma Show: Olympics

This is the interview where Geno discusses Stewie's chances of making the Olympics (gets specific around 4:45) and the cat-got-the-canary smile at the very end when asked how much control he has over the selection process.

 

[LesMis89]

Coaches/Managers of professional teams should have considerable input into whose on the team. They are the ones responsible for winning. They should be given the team they think they can best coach, to the best of the GM/Selection Committee/etc.'s ability.

I'm not addressing anything specifically re why a mega-talent like Parker is not on the team. I have no idea.

 

[CocoHusky]

The last part of the sentence I neglected to put out was "...for this Olympic team." Unless some extenuating circumstances come out not related to her basketball, the fact that she was left off the team makes my statement self-evident*.

Her rank among the world's basketball talents, in which I basically agree with your assessment, is a separate discussion. I think the committee and/or Geno went for perceived fit over talent for Parker. Will that prove to be the correct choice? It's debatable, yeah. But I still feel more concerned about the lack of young guards than the lack of Parker.

*: Edit: my opinion also assumes that the roster is confirmed as listed - still not quite official yet, is it?

It is not self evident when you have Geno saying Parker was one of the most outstanding participants in the last mini camp just a few months ago.

 

[UcMiami]

Coaches/Managers of professional teams should have considerable input into whose on the team. They are the ones responsible for winning. They should be given the team they think they can best coach, to the best of the GM/Selection Committee/etc.'s ability.

I'm not addressing anything specifically re why a mega-talent like Parker is not on the team. I have no idea.

I agree, and usually where the discretion of the committee comes to the forefront and they are known to overrule even strong preferences of the coaches is with the last one or two players on a team - the coaches/managers being solely focused on the 'here and now' and the committee taking a longer range view to future development. For example Lobo was 'forced' onto Tara back in 1996 and she didn't like it, and she was probably not really ready for it, but she likely would have been a mainstay going forward had medical issues not curtailed her career. Sue in 2002 and 2004 contributed almost nothing to the team, but was clearly seen as the next PG by that stage - Van might very well have preferred someone else who could have contributed more. Stewart is the latest in that progression (though one suspects Geno is not complaining.)

 

[DaddyChoc]

Sure reads that way. Honestly, the optics on this are not good.

Taurasi, Moore, and Charles are no-doubt picks. But Stewart has no pro experience and Bird has been a statistically below average player for a couple years now. At those same positions, you have the most visible Tenn. player (Parker) and the most visible ND player (Diggins) missing out. Sure, Diggins is coming off knee surgery, but they didn't take her for Worlds right after she was named 1st team All-WNBA.

There might be good reasons for these decisions but it definitely looks like it's much easier to make the team if you went to UConn. And if you went to a rival of UConn, it's much harder.

I agree

 

[HardHatGuy#2]

I would put Candace Parker's chances of winning the WNBA MVP this year now close to 85%. When you have one of the top 5 players in the world playing with something to prove, watch out.

85%?!?! I'll take those odds, any day; you offering Parker vs. the field?

 

[CajunHusky]

Just off the top of my head ...... and pure conjecture......

Parker missed almost half of the WNBA season last year to rest .... she missed February practice session playing overseas..... and the selection committee is 100% WNBA people. (Sure Geno has input, but he doesn't have a vote).

 

[CocoHusky]

Just off the top of my head . and pure conjecture.

Parker missed almost half of the WNBA season last year to rest .... she missed February practice session playing overseas..... and the selection committee is 100% WNBA people. (Sure Geno has input, but he doesn't have a vote).

Maybe the WNBA people thought Parker was just a bit too much a prima donna and other people were working harder and more team players.

Uhm! Did you forget that DT took off a whole season from the WNBA. Where is this CP Prima Donna persona coming from?