OT: US Open

[storrsroars]

I love Baseball.

I played in college. I was then an agent.

I subscribe to Baseball websites and some of my favorite memories are staying up with my dad for late games and the trade deadline (hate hate hate the 4pm deadline we have now).

Point is I’m not the casual fan like i was for those other sports.

That said I agree with you. Baseballs marketing needs work.

Who is the face of the game?

Trout is the best player but how many casual fans could point him out on the street?

Everyone knows who Lebron is. Who Brady and Rodgers are. And those latter 2 weak freaking helmets.

But thanks to the amazing technology of replay and questec and that Ilk, Baseball lacks the blatant favoritism towards certain players that NBA and nfl continue to insult the worlds intelligence by denying they exist. That alone makes Baseball superior.

Baseball makes for better arguments because of all the advanced metrics crap that's out there. You want to tout your guy's superiority via OPS? I'm coming at you with wxOBA to prove he's just lucky and due a regression!

I liked hoops into my 20s - was a huge ABA and Dr J fan at the start of when the NBA became a circus. Then I stopped caring once it became a total circus with the Rodman and AI era. I can appreciate what LeBron and Curry et.al. can do. I just don't care. I found other things to do with my time and I'm not going back.

With the NFL, it had less to do with the play on the field than the culture and the mess that became football broadcasting and all the fantasy crap (and I played fantasy for a decade). Give me the old guys every day. Can't stand the shouting over each other, the esoteric breakdowns of meaningless crap, the Gruden-esque obfuscation of what should be pretty simple crap and the whole "warrior" b.s. mentality. It's a damned sport. It used to be fun. I risked significant injury playing it. It's now a chore to sit through. It's really amazing how much you can done on Sundays once you stop caring about the NFL.

That said, I'll waste a whole Saturday watching football if the right slate of games is on.

 

[storrsroars]

Baseball has an anachronistic (read 'fascist') social media highlights policy.

Fans don't engage without social media anymore, and the lack of ability to comment, critique, meme, and mash up highlights really hurts the sports marketability.

Weird... I'm regularly on a Pirates forum where all sorts of images are posted right after a play happens. Sometimes even with Michael Bay sfx!

 

[the Q]

Baseball makes for better arguments because of all the advanced metrics crap that's out there. You want to tout your guy's superiority via OPS? I'm coming at you with wxOBA to prove he's just lucky and due a regression!

I liked hoops into my 20s - was a huge ABA and Dr J fan at the start of when the NBA became a circus. Then I stopped caring once it became a total circus with the Rodman and AI era. I can appreciate what LeBron and Curry et.al. can do. I just don't care. I found other things to do with my time and I'm not going back.

With the NFL, it had less to do with the play on the field than the culture and the mess that became football broadcasting and all the fantasy crap (and I played fantasy for a decade). Give me the old guys every day. Can't stand the shouting over each other, the esoteric breakdowns of meaningless crap, the Gruden-esque obfuscation of what should be pretty simple crap and the whole "warrior" b.s. mentality. It's a damned sport. It used to be fun. I risked significant injury playing it. It's now a chore to sit through. It's really amazing how much you can done on Sundays once you stop caring about the NFL.

That said, I'll waste a whole Saturday watching football if the right slate of games is on.

Google Image Result for https://media.giphy.com/media/l1ughbsd9qXz2s9SE/giphy.gif

 

[tzznandrew]

And, of course, we get the racist caricature...

Interesting differences between the real appearance of the young lady and the cartoon. I wonder why...

 

[storrsroars]

Google Image Result for https://media.giphy.com/media/l1ughbsd9qXz2s9SE/giphy.gif

I'm not much of a Will Ferrell fan. So maybe not.

 

[storrsroars]

Interesting differences between the real appearance of the young lady and the cartoon. I wonder why...

If I were Osaka, I'd tell her to GTF off me. Serena ruined Osaka's moment during the match, then again during the award ceremony.

Sure ain't Nadal vs Federer.

 

[the Q]

I'm not much of a Will Ferrell fan. So maybe not.

Lol.

It’s just a gif.

I do prefer old school Ferrell though

 

[intlzncster]

Weird... I'm regularly on a Pirates forum where all sorts of images are posted right after a play happens. Sometimes even with Michael Bay sfx!

Really hard to police all forums. I'm talking Twitter, insta Facebook, big blogs etc

 

[Stainmaster]

Baseball has an anachronistic (read 'fascist') social media highlights policy.

Fans don't engage without social media anymore, and the lack of ability to comment, critique, meme, and mash up highlights really hurts the sports marketability.

There's a bit of a grassroots movement towards this in certain circles of Baseball Twitter. Cespedes Family BBQ -- a must-follow IMO -- is one such account that represents the best and most effective way to market baseball to the Snapchat generation, so to speak. Their content is presented using language that's intimately familiar to any young person who's active online; there's lots of meme-ing, Weird Twitter-style in-jokes, and they have a nose for the zanier sides of the game (which piques the interest of non-diehard fans). MLB Advance Media actually brought them on board a year ago, so the brass is at least cognizant that this is their only way forward. But they could be doing much more, and they should be creating a much vaster network of similar content producers.

 

[huskyrob1]

You are wrong. It is an easy search, first of two descriptions below from a final, way more extreme and the penalty was a point vs a game. Link is to general verbal abuse not necessarily in majors or finals but certainly ample evidence that abuse by males is held to different standard.

"Five-time major champion Martina Hingis held a 6-4, 2-0 lead on legend Steffi Graf in the 1999 French Open final when she disputed a call and became angry when she thought the umpire checked the wrong mark. Hingis walked over to Graf’s side of the net, kept complaining and refused to play until talking to a tournament referee. That move backfired too – Hingis was assessed a point penalty – and the meltdown was on. Graf came back with ease, winning her 22nd and final Grand Slam title before retiring one month later. Hingis would never win another.

From the US Open (not final, but 4th round of same tourney):
"With all of New York on his side, the irascible, 39-year-old Connors was at another make-or-break moment in his storybook run at the 1991 Open. Trailing by a set, the birthday boy hit an overhead that was called out by the chair, bringing a set point for Aaron Krickstein that could have given the youngster a two set lead. Knowing he had the full support of the crowd, Connors set in on the chair umpire, delivering a bullying verbal beatdown intended to win points with an already-rabid crowd. Connors won the next three points to even the match, went off again on the umpire later in the match when his back was against the wall and, of course, beat Krickstein in a match that’s become a replay staple during U.S. Open rain delays for a quarter-century."

The Worst Tantrums of All Time in Men's Tennis

I saw that match, had courtside seats. Jimmy Connors was the greatest comeback player tennis ever had. I wish I had $500 for every match Connors was down two sets and came back to win in five. Connors knew how to win the crowd, and he never threatened to jam the handle of his racket down the Umpires throat or to just kill him out right, like Serena did to that woman umpire in 2011.

 

[Stainmaster]

@intlzncster more of the above: Cut4 (@Cut4) | Twitter

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Interesting differences between the real appearance of the young lady and the cartoon. I wonder why...

Well, the Aussie cartoonist appears to have pictured the respectable young lady of Haitian and Japanese parents somewhat calm and collected. And even after soundly winning the 2018 US Open championship, despite someone else's actions the young lady managed to remain reasonably together.

As for the 37 year old, purported adult who lost it emotionally while getting her butt kicked by the young lady, one part arguable racist caricature by an Aussie cartoonist. And, one part post-temper tantrum meager damage control.

 

[superjohn]

Well, the Aussie cartoonist appears to have pictured the respectable young lady of Haitian and Japanese parents somewhat calm and collected. And even after soundly winning the 2018 US Open championship, despite someone else's actions the young lady managed to remain reasonably together.

As for the 37 year old, purported adult who lost it emotionally while getting her butt kicked by the young lady, one part arguable racist caricature by an Aussie cartoonist. And, one part post-temper tantrum meager damage control.

The racist cartoonist depicted Osaka as a blonde haired white woman and Serena as a Sambo style gorilla.

 

[tzznandrew]

Well, the Aussie cartoonist appears to have pictured the respectable young lady of Haitian and Japanese parents somewhat calm and collected. And even after soundly winning the 2018 US Open championship, despite someone else's actions the young lady managed to remain reasonably together.

As for the 37 year old, purported adult who lost it emotionally while getting her butt kicked by the young lady, one part arguable racist caricature by an Aussie cartoonist. And, one part post-temper tantrum meager damage control.

Wow. You have a remarkable ability to ignore, or outright unwillingness to acknowledge, the racist history of the depiction of people of color that is obvious to anyone aware of their history.

I think Serena's actions were uncalled for, though I think there's greater context. That doesn't mean I can't acknowledge the way race places a role in people's reaction to her. Or, just narrowing it down, to this particular cartoon.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Wow.

Oh wow, as if we're both not aware of the depiction's possible historic implications in the States. Or, that one of us is unaware of the Aussie's arguable caricature and possible interpretations.

Highly likely, one of us has directly witnessed and experienced far more versions and relative levels of acceptance of actual racism in markedly more nations globally. Consequently, the context legitimate racism plays in Japan and other Pacific nations for people of African genetic heritage or other individuals with darker skin tones is understood. For example, Osaka's Haitian father, her maternal family's response to her mother's husband, or in Oz itself. A missed Aussie irony in the cartoon.

Clearly, you can carry on with whatever implied portrayal you so choose. And possible sexism or weak parent-ism arguments aside, we can continue agreeing the 37 year old, purported adult's actions were and remain indefensible.

 

[Dogdeacon]

I saw that match, had courtside seats. Jimmy Connors was the greatest comeback player tennis ever had. I wish I had $500 for every match Connors was down two sets and came back to win in five. Connors knew how to win the crowd, and he never threatened to jam the handle of his racket down the Umpires throat or to just kill him out right, like Serena did to that woman umpire in 2011.

Referencing back to 2011 is a false equivalency to today's discussion, but I understand that it is relevant to Serena's body of work and for some cemented her character.

Nonetheless, the question of the day is did Connors say worse things (back then or ever) than Serena did on Saturday to get her penalties? Was Connors penalized at all?

Also I think its worth noting that even those most critical of Serena constantly point out that she does this when she is obviously losing and has no chance, arguing that its at best self-sabotage and more likely scapegoating quitter behavior to avoid responsibility for a loss. I saw the exact opposite in Serena's post-match behavior on Saturday so in this instance I don't buy that.

In contrast Connors literally used the outburst to CHANGE the momentum of the match and impacted outcomes via petulant behavior. Maybe that's what Serena was trying to do, but I don't know that its ever worked for her or any woman. People are mad at Serena for undermining Osaka's win (which it did), but bottom line it also all but handed her the championship and a check for 3.8MM. I ain't mad at Dook for calling a bumbling Trajan Langdan 'take em' play. Again quite different that Connors & McEnroe definitely unnerved their opponents and often swung outcomes in their favor via tirades, outbursts, tantrums or whatever you want to call it.

 

[Dogdeacon]

Oh wow, as if we're both not aware of the depiction's possible historic implications in the States. Or, that one of us is unaware of the Aussie's arguable caricature and possible interpretations.

Highly likely, one of us has directly witnessed and experienced far more versions and relative levels of acceptance of actual racism in markedly more nations globally. Consequently, the context legitimate racism plays in Japan and other Pacific nations for people of African genetic heritage or other individuals with darker skin tones is understood. For example, Osaka's Haitian father, her maternal family's response to her mother's husband, or in Oz itself. A missed Aussie irony in the cartoon.

Clearly, you can carry on with whatever implied portrayal you so choose. And possible sexism or weak parent-ism arguments aside, we can continue agreeing the 37 year old, purported adult's actions were and remain indefensible.

What is 'context legitimate racism'?!
I think you just argued you've seen lots of racism, so you're qualified to see this as accepted racism in Australia and you've also diagnosed racism in Osaka's family.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

What is 'context legitimate racism'?!
I think you just argued you've seen lots of racism, so you're qualified to see this as accepted racism in Australia and you've also diagnosed racism in Osaka's family.

actual, accepted As for Osaka's family, no diagnosis. Related media reports, yes. Awareness of how non-Japanese, people of other races, mixed race individuals, etc are treated in Japan; yes, very aware. And your experience of any kind in Japan or elsewhere in Austrolasia? None?

 

[Dogdeacon]

actual, accepted As for Osaka's family, no diagnosis. Related media reports, yes. Awareness of how non-Japanese, people of other races, mixed race individuals, etc are treated in Japan; yes, very aware. And your experience of any kind in Japan or elsewhere in Austrolasia? None?

Congratulations !

 

[tzznandrew]

actual, accepted As for Osaka's family, no diagnosis. Related media reports, yes. Awareness of how non-Japanese, people of other races, mixed race individuals, etc are treated in Japan; yes, very aware. And your experience of any kind in Japan or elsewhere in Austrolasia? None?

It's funny the assumptions you make about me.

Leaving those aside, and leaving aside the depiction of Osaka, racism in the Western world is racism in the Western world, right? That would be called racist if it appeared in France. Take Banania for instance.

So I don't know why it being in Australia suddenly means that the image would not be playing into the same historical situation. I mean, here's an article here from 2015 of a black Australian complaining about how cluelessly racist white Australians are: Stereotyping of Africans is everywhere, but Australians are particularly clueless | Rebka Bayou

On Osaka, I'm sure she's experienced some pretty terrible things knowing what I know about Japanese ideas of race. But that doesn't at all negate the image and the problems of the image. Frankly, in the context of the conversation, it's a non sequitor.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

It's funny the assumptions you make about me.

And, you of my perspective of the Aussie's cartoon and your minimal knowledge yet implied misperceptions of my own favorable experiences with friends, co-workers, relatives, and others of various backgrounds, genetics, etc. Carry on!

On the other hand, you actually got it regarding racism among a few too many descendants of early arriving white Aussie's regarding people of African background or other darker skin hues. Or, even toward Aussie's earliest immigrants, the indigenous. As others pointed out previously, such realities remain comparably more acceptable in Oz versus the States, much of western Europe, etc.

 

[tzznandrew]

And, you of my perspective of the Aussie's cartoon and your minimal knowledge yet implied misperceptions of my own favorable experiences with friends, co-workers, relatives, and others of various backgrounds, genetics, etc. Carry on!

????

I don't follow. The cartoon is obviously racially tinged. Australia has a problem with this the same as the US with regards to this.

I don't know what your personal background has to do with this, or your "favorable experiences with friends, co-workers, relatives, and others of various backgrounds, genetics" has to do with this. It all feels like weird deflection to me.

 

[storrsroars]

There's a bit of a grassroots movement towards this in certain circles of Baseball Twitter. Cespedes Family BBQ -- a must-follow IMO -- is one such account that represents the best and most effective way to market baseball to the Snapchat generation, so to speak. Their content is presented using language that's intimately familiar to any young person who's active online; there's lots of meme-ing, Weird Twitter-style in-jokes, and they have a nose for the zanier sides of the game (which piques the interest of non-diehard fans). MLB Advance Media actually brought them on board a year ago, so the brass is at least cognizant that this is their only way forward. But they could be doing much more, and they should be creating a much vaster network of similar content producers.

My favorite Cespedes Family BBQ post of all-time. It never gets old: The Most Interesting Reliever In the World.

 

[mauconnfan]

If I were Osaka, I'd tell her to GTF off me. Serena ruined Osaka's moment during the match, then again during the award ceremony.

Sure ain't Nadal vs Federer.

^^^^ This^^^^

She was always hard to like now the new whining opportunities and this debacle makes it twice as bad.

 

[intlzncster]

Referencing back to 2011 is a false equivalency to today's discussion, but I understand that it is relevant to Serena's body of work and for some cemented her character.

Nonetheless, the question of the day is did Connors say worse things (back then or ever) than Serena did on Saturday to get her penalties? Was Connors penalized at all?

Also I think its worth noting that even those most critical of Serena constantly point out that she does this when she is obviously losing and has no chance, arguing that its at best self-sabotage and more likely scapegoating quitter behavior to avoid responsibility for a loss. I saw the exact opposite in Serena's post-match behavior on Saturday so in this instance I don't buy that.

In contrast Connors literally used the outburst to CHANGE the momentum of the match and impacted outcomes via petulant behavior. Maybe that's what Serena was trying to do, but I don't know that its ever worked for her or any woman. People are mad at Serena for undermining Osaka's win (which it did), but bottom line it also all but handed her the championship and a check for 3.8MM. I ain't mad at Dook for calling a bumbling Trajan Langdan 'take em' play. Again quite different that Connors & McEnroe definitely unnerved their opponents and often swung outcomes in their favor via tirades, outbursts, tantrums or whatever you want to call it.

Connors/McEnroe comparisons don't really hold water imo. They played in a different time. Can you imagine their act with today's social media/highlight-centric culture? No chance it would last/continue the same way.

 

[huskyrob1]

^^^^ This^^^^

She was always hard to like now the new whining opportunities and this debacle makes it twice as bad.

 

[the Q]

He’s not wrong.

 

[uconndoit]

 

[temery]

No bias. None.

Report: Men penalized significantly more than women in tennis

 

[Dogdeacon]

It’s subjective and IF men swear 10 X as much of course they are penalized more. The bias exists in that we all loved & revere McEnroe, Connors & Nastase but name one beloved female loudmouth?

I’ve no idea how much either sex swears or abuses officials on court these days. It could be they swear equally but based on, hmm I don’t know everything else in the world, I’m guessing men swear more.

And I just know that one official has a hair trigger & made himself part of the story when there were better ways to officiate.