OT- Peyton

[Scoe]

It is what it is, Peyton just isn't the same guy in the playoffs, and not just him but his teams he has played on him are just soft. He tightens up when things don't go his way, he is used to scoring 30-40 points a game in the playoffs defenses are better and have you scouted, the weather conditions are worse. For some reason teams that put up huge stats just never seem to do well in the playoffs, because things become too easy, and you don't face any adversity then when you get smacked in the mouth against a physical D how do you respond when things don't go your way. Peyton hasn't even looked like regular season Peyton yet, father time is a cruel thing in sports in the NFL its as quick as lightning.

 

[amory]

It is what it is, Peyton just isn't the same guy in the playoffs, and not just him but his teams he has played on him are just soft. He tightens up when things don't go his way, he is used to scoring 30-40 points a game in the playoffs defenses are better and have you scouted, the weather conditions are worse. For some reason teams that put up huge stats just never seem to do well in the playoffs, because things become too easy, and you don't face any adversity then when you get smacked in the mouth against a physical D how do you respond when things don't go your way. Peyton hasn't even looked like regular season Peyton yet, father time is a cruel thing in sports in the NFL its as quick as lightning.

Today wasn't just a case of "Playoff Peyton" though. From the first snap he just looked like a relic out there. He's out of gas.

 

[Jerry1714]

9 one and dones, 8 of them as a favorite. Guy is a shell of himself in the playoffs, to me that will be his lasting legacy.

 

[amory]

9 one and dones, 8 of them as a favorite. Guy is a shell of himself in the playoffs, to me that will be his lasting legacy.

Impossible to ignore, that's for sure, not sure it's fair to call it his lasting legacy though. Peyton at least got a ring, and when he was at his best he was a surgeon on the field. A real joy to watch. But in my mind he needed at least 2 rings to even be considered for the "greatest of all time" conversation. I firmly believe there's a clutch gene that as an athlete you either have or you don't. Peyton just doesn't have it.

 

[noeynox]

Impossible to ignore, that's for sure, not sure it's fair to call it his lasting legacy though. Peyton at least got a ring, and when he was at his best he was a surgeon on the field. A real joy to watch. But in my mind he needed at least 2 rings to even be considered for the "greatest of all time" conversation. I firmly believe there's a clutch gene that as an athlete you either have or you don't. Peyton just doesn't have it.

Funny thing is, his younger brother, who is not as talented clearyly seems to HAVE IT. Brady has it. It's early but I think Russell Wilson has it.

 

[Scoe]

Today wasn't just a case of "Playoff Peyton" though. From the first snap he just looked like a relic out there. He's out of gas.

Yes when I saw the game against the Bengals on Monday night something definitely didn't look right with Peyton. You can play very well at an old age and hit father time the next year. Brett Favre had an amazing season his first year with the Vikings then came back and wasn't the same, it happens.

 

[Scoe]

Welker looks like he's done, and Emmanuel Sanders will be getting some dough this offseason, a bad team will probably overpay for him.

 

[OkaForPrez]

I want Peyton to retire just so he can get in front of a camera on Sunday's. The guy is hilarious.

 

[Robertelamin]

And the 11-13 includes the Super Bowl run where he beat the Rex Grossman led Bears. Take out that year and it's worse.

Take out all the playoff wins and he is 0-13. Yikes! Can't get much worse than that!

 

[Danzz]

Peyton is done and I think he knows it. It isn't just his arm, I think the fire is gone. I don't put too much on number of Super Bowl victories because football is a team game and Peyton had an outstanding career.
Denver has a bunch of free agents who may not return and I think that will factor in his decision to retire.

 

[Deepster]

Take out all the playoff wins and he is 0-13. Yikes! Can't get much worse than that!

Do you really want me to outline his playoff failures in greater detail? I surely can and it's not pretty. He's a paper tiger.

 

[Cheeky]

I don't put too much on number of Super Bowl victories because football is a team game and Peyton had an outstanding career.

Of course, the problem with this logic is that you arrive at the "outstanding career" conclusion without the "team game" concept, right?
That is, you look at his regular season stats, and you think, "wow, this guy is great." But then you look at his abysmal post season choke record and you say, "we can ignore that, it's a team game."

What you've essentially done is credit him individually with his regular season performance and blame his team for his post season performance.

Can't have it both ways.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

Funny thing is, his younger brother, who is not as talented clearyly seems to HAVE IT. Brady has it. It's early but I think Russell Wilson has it.

Can we please stop this? Manning's rings have much more to do with his consistently dominant offensive lines, defenses, and running games than they did with this mythical "it factor". As a Texans fan, I have watched and hated the Colts for a long time and he did what he did in spite of the team around him for far more of the time. Football is not a one-man game. Teams do not win and lose solely because of the QB's "it factor".

 

[Jerry1714]

Can we please stop this? Manning's rings have much more to do with his consistently dominant offensive lines, defenses, and running games than they did with this mythical "it factor". As a Texans fan, I have watched and hated the Colts for a long time and he did what he did in spite of the team around him for far more of the time. Football is not a one-man game. Teams do not win and lose solely because of the QB's "it factor".

Um no, the Giants were LAST in the league in rushing in their last Superbowl year and had the 27th ranked defense. Eli threw 9 TDs and 1 pick in the playoffs and 107 QBR.

But sure Eli won thanks to his "consistently dominant offensive lines, defenses, and running games"

I know this is basketball board, but jeez, try a little harder.

 

[UConn990411]

Can we please stop this? Manning's rings have much more to do with his consistently dominant offensive lines, defenses, and running games than they did with this mythical "it factor". As a Texans fan, I have watched and hated the Colts for a long time and he did what he did in spite of the team around him for far more of the time. Football is not a one-man game. Teams do not win and lose solely because of the QB's "it factor".

He definitely wasn't the only problem those Colts teams had, but he was certainly part of it. The guy just isn't a very good postseason QB.

I don't like basing arguments off one or two stats, but it's impossible to ignore the whole nine one and dones, eight one and dones at home thing. That's a remarkable stat for all the wrong reasons.

 

[noeynox]

If you don't think some players have an innate ability to step up in pressure situations while others wilt under pressure I'm not sure what you're watching. Look at Cam Newton vs Russell Wilson this weekend.

I'm a Pats fan, both super bowls against the Giants brady walked off that field having given his team the lead late in the gAME. Both times Eli led them back for the win. Once shaking off a sure sack to complete the pass to Tyree. I had dreams about it. Eli is clutch.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

If you don't think some players have an innate ability to step up in pressure situations while others wilt under pressure I'm not sure what you're watching. Look at Cam Newton vs Russell Wilson this weekend.

I'm a Pats fan, both super bowls against the Giants brady walked off that field having given his team the lead late in the gAME. Both times Eli led them back for the win. Once shaking off a sure sack to complete the pass to Tyree. I had dreams about it. Eli is clutch.

Russell Wilson is a far superior QB to Cam Newton. It has nothing to do with "it factor", just talent.

 

[noeynox]

If you say so. Can Newton is like the prototype QB. 6' 6", with perfect throwing mechanics, and probably runs in the 4.5, range. You want to say Wilson thinks the game better or processes better I agree, but he's. 5'11". Not too many guys like that running NFL teams.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

Um no, the Giants were LAST in the league in rushing in their last Superbowl year and had the 27th ranked defense. Eli threw 9 TDs and 1 pick in the playoffs and 107 QBR.

But sure Eli won thanks to his "consistently dominant offensive lines, defenses, and running games"

I know this is basketball board, but jeez, try a little harder.

In '07 they had the 7th ranked D and 4th ranked rushing attack. In the 2011 post season they averaged 117 rushing yards per game and gave up 14 points per game.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

If you say so. Can Newton is like the prototype QB. 6' 6", with perfect throwing mechanics, and probably runs in the 4.5, range. You want to say Wilson thinks the game better or processes better I agree, but he's. 5'11". Not too many guys like that running NFL teams.

There's so many things wrong with this argument, I don't even know where to start... I'm not talking physical ability, I'm talking talent. Two vastly different things.

 

[Jerry1714]

In '07 they had the 7th ranked D and 4th ranked rushing attack. In the 2011 post season they averaged 117 rushing yards per game and gave up 14 points per game.

So now we are just using post season stats, ok, that 117 yards was 6th best out of 12 teams in the post season, they were 4th in passing. Eli lead 8 game winning drives that year, 2 in the playoffs.

You can keep trying to spin the numbers anyway you want, but you could not be more wrong about 2011.

2007 the running game and defense was much better then 2011 (however they were 6th in rushing that postseason out of 12), and carried the team more, even though Eli threw only 1 pick all postseason. Oh and New England rushed for more yards a game in 2007 playoffs than the Giants, but I am sure you wont make the same argument for them.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

So now we are just using post season stats, ok, that 117 yards was 6th best out of 12 teams in the post season, they were 4th in passing. Eli lead 8 game winning drives that year, 2 in the playoffs.

You can keep trying to spin the numbers anyway you want, but you could not be more wrong about 2011.

2007 the running game and defense was much better then 2011 (however they were 6th in rushing that postseason out of 12), and carried the team more, even though Eli threw only 1 pick all postseason. Oh and New England rushed for more yards a game in 2007 playoffs than the Giants, but I am sure you wont make the same argument for them.

I'm not saying he's Trent Dilfer but the "it factor" argument is totally overblown, not just for him, but most QBs. You implied that his running game and defense were not good in 2011 but that just wasn't true during the playoffs.

 

[CallMeBruce]

I'm as big a Giants fan as you're going to find, but any argument that tries to say that Eli Manning is better than Peyton is misguided.

 

[Devland]

If you don't think some players have an innate ability to step up in pressure situations while others wilt under pressure I'm not sure what you're watching. Look at Cam Newton vs Russell Wilson this weekend.

I'm a Pats fan, both super bowls against the Giants brady walked off that field having given his team the lead late in the gAME. Both times Eli led them back for the win. Once shaking off a sure sack to complete the pass to Tyree. I had dreams about it. Eli is clutch.

Eli also had 2 balls that should have been picked on that drive. Most times there is a fine line between hero and goat.

 

[Jerry1714]

I'm as big a Giants fan as you're going to find, but any argument that tries to say that Eli Manning is better than Peyton is misguided.

I do not think anyone is saying that, but as a Giants fan I am more than happy with Eli.