OT: Pats-Colts | Page 22 | The Boneyard

OT: Pats-Colts

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upstater said:
It is quite possible that he both deflated 11 Patriots balls and inflated 12 Luck balls. Glazer has it on authority that this 16 year old perp also didn't wash his hands. Stay tuned, more to come from this bathroom caper, more ballbags and leaks.
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My understanding is he went to the bathroom to drop the Browns off at the Super Bowl.
 
Word is this was a solo restroom so if the ball boy hypothetically went in with two bags of balls one with the Pat's balls and one with the Colt's balls, is 90 seconds really enough time or room to pull out one ball at a time deflate to an exact psi level grab the next out of the bag and so forth? What if this was just an ironic coincidence of the guy just needing to use the restroom on the way to the field. Either way there is no way this is solved for weeks.
 
upstater said:
Frankly, I'm shockd that no one has accused the Patriots of cheating for deliberately giving the referees underinflated balls.
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Actually, I said that on quite a few occasions last Friday Afternoon (Page 14). I don't think it's cheating, per se. I think its gamesmanship like rubbing out the back line of the batters box. It is done with the understanding that both QBs do what they do. I am also of the opinion that the NFL and the rest of the active QBs around the league are none too happy with Jim Irsay/John Harbaugh, whoever is responsible for the original leak.

To paraphrase, I said I would not be surprised if Brady submitted underinflated footballs or footballs near the low end of the pressure spectrum in hopes they slip by, just as Aaron Rodger insinuated he hopes the refs don't deflate his submitted overinflated footballs. I proposed that the control breakdown happened in the officials' locker room and the officials were exonerated too quickly.

It got compared to 9/11 being an inside job, where there is not even a remote similarity...
 
Husky25 said:
Actually, I said that on quite a few occasions last Friday Afternoon (Page 14). I don't think it's cheating, per se. I think its gamesmanship like rubbing out the back line of the batters box. It is done with the understanding that both QBs do what they do. I am also of the opinion that the NFL and the rest of the active QBs around the league are none too happy with Jim Irsay/John Harbaugh, whoever is responsible for the original leak.

To paraphrase, I said I would not be surprised if Brady submitted underinflated footballs or footballs near the low end of the pressure spectrum in hopes they slip by, just as Aaron Rodger insinuated he hopes the refs don't deflate his submitted overinflated footballs. I proposed that the control breakdown happened in the officials' locker room and the officials were exonerated too quickly.

It got compared to 9/11 being an inside job, where there is not even a remote similarity...
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Not sure about the gamesmanship one. That's the best argument of all honestly though. Is there a rule about how high the grass has to be in MLB if the team can bunt or if their infield is old? Is there a rule as to how much water you can put around the bases for a base stealer? I know there's a rule for the weight of the ball, the others I'm not sure. To me those are gamemanship. Heck the Sox have a bunch of groundball hitters and they get a few high hoppers over the infield because they pound down in front of the plate - probably mostly when they are against a sinker baller right? And hell, that's smart!
 
mauconnfan said:
Not sure about the gamesmanship one. That's the best argument of all honestly though. Is there a rule about how high the grass has to be in MLB if the team can bunt or if their infield is old? Is there a rule as to how much water you can put around the bases for a base stealer? I know there's a rule for the weight of the ball, the others I'm not sure. To me those are gamemanship. Heck the Sox have a bunch of groundball hitters and they get a few high hoppers over the infield because they pound down in front of the plate - probably mostly when they are against a sinker baller right? And hell, that's smart!
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Making contact with the baseball with a foot outside the batters box is an automatic out. So the lead-off hitter on the visiting team rubs out the back line to give him an extra 4 inches. The ump knows he does it, the catcher knows, and the pitcher knows, but because there is no line, the ump can't definitively make the call. It happens every game, but there is a gentlemen's agreement because if one team is called on pushing the envelope none of them can push the envelope.
 
upstater said:
Who said it didn't?

Were the laws of physics somehow absent on the Colts side? A physics free zone?

NBC reported the Patriots balls at 11.5 PSI. Not all the balls. One of them was at 10.5 PSI. It happened to be the one the Colts equipment guy turned over to the NFL.

By the way, the main guy that broke this story last Monday, Glauber of Newsday, has an article out detailing why Glazer of Fox is full of it on all his reports.
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Now that's interesting. The only ball that was 2 psi down was in the possession of the Colts staff. Well conspiracy theorists? What say you to that? Where are tha cameras documenting that ball?

Won't it be ironic if the Colts end up being sanctioned?
 
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There is a link in another of the 73 threads about Deflate---- that the refs may not have stuck a pin in every one of the balls.

If it comes out that the refs did not do a thorough job in their "inspection," did Brady still cheat or is it gamesmanship? If an overinflated Green Bay ball makes it past the officials, did Rodgers cheat or is the onus of that control failure is on the officials and it's gamesmanship? If the onus is on the officials, is a foul a foul even if they don't blow their whistle or is the lineman supposed to fess up and turn himself in for holding?

After all, isn't the reason officials exist in virtually every athletic competition (or otherwise) is because those in completion are looking for ways to bend the rules without notice?
 
Big game of poker going on now; but, who's bluffing and who has a full hours. Kraft basically called the NFL out; but, if the NFL can come-up with a full house, i.e. a Pats staff member coming forward and/or video taped evidence, the Pats are screwed not for deflating the balls; but, for lying and then trying to cover it up (again).
 
superjohn said:
The fact that the Colts footballs were properly inflated and the Pats weren't...
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I'm just asking... do we know the Colts football were OK? Were they checked as well?
 
Mr. Conehead said:
Big game of poker going on now; but, who's bluffing and who has a full hours. Kraft basically called the NFL out; but, if the NFL can come-up with a full house, i.e. a Pats staff member coming forward and/or video taped evidence, the Pats are screwed not for deflating the balls; but, for lying and then trying to cover it up (again).
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I think you have it backwards.

I think the NFL leaking that the Officials "confirmed" the pre-game pressure effectively called the Patriots bluff with their own (I don't believe the refs actually checked the pressure). Problem is that the Patriots had the cards, came back over the top, and put the NFL on the defensive. The NFL is looking for the full house on the River, but the card they need has already been dealt and mucked.
 
I think this still has a ways to go to play out. If it turns out that the 11 balls were at 11.5, then this whole thing is a non-issue, as that is withing the delta for the air temp change.

Regarding the ball boy in the bathroom, 90 seconds is absolutely enough to deflate 12 balls to where you want them. Check out this device . . . http://www.anthem-sports.com/Tachik...term=A94-105&gclid=CMD-hbeZtcMCFSRo7AodqToAvw
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Stick it in, hit release valve until you drop 1 or 2 psi, pull out. You'd have to average about 1 ball every 6 seconds. No problem at all.

Particularly if you've done a lot of them. ;)
 
Cheeky said:
I think this still has a ways to go to play out. If it turns out that the 11 balls were at 11.5, then this whole thing is a non-issue, as that is withing the delta for the air temp change.

Regarding the ball boy in the bathroom, 90 seconds is absolutely enough to deflate 12 balls to where you want them. Check out this device . . . http://www.anthem-sports.com/Tachik...term=A94-105&gclid=CMD-hbeZtcMCFSRo7AodqToAvw
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Stick it in, hit release valve until you drop 1 or 2 psi, pull out. You'd have to average about 1 ball every 6 seconds. No problem at all.

Particularly if you've done a lot of them. ;)
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So with 90 seconds he has to enter and close the door. 3 sec

Task........................Task Time....Running Time

1. Enter close the door.. 3 seconds.......3 seconds

2. Open sack...................2 seconds.......5 seconds

3a. Remove ball #1..........2 seconds.......7 seconds (one handed since you'd be holding gauge in the other hand)
3b. Locate hole................1 second.........8 seconds (one handed since you'd be holding gauge in the other hand)
3c. Insert gauge...............1 second.........9 seconds
3d. Drain ball..................2 seconds.......11 seconds
3e. Remove gauge...........1 second.........12 seconds
3f. Set ball on the floor....1 second........13 seconds (can't put it back in bag since you need to keep track of which balls are done)

4. Do balls 2-12...............88 seconds..101 seconds

Pick up balls, put in sack..12 seconds..113 seconds

Exit Bathroom................. 3 seconds....116 seconds

That's about as fast as I can imagine it taking place if you had a very well trained guy doing it and nothing went wrong. In all likelihood it would take far longer.
 
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Mr. Conehead said:
Big game of poker going on now; but, who's bluffing and who has a full hours. Kraft basically called the NFL out; but, if the NFL can come-up with a full house, i.e. a Pats staff member coming forward and/or video taped evidence, the Pats are screwed not for deflating the balls; but, for lying and then trying to cover it up (again).
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Again?
 
CL82 said:
“We took 12 brand-new authentic NFL footballs and exposed them to the different elements they would have experienced throughout the game,” said Thomas Healy, founder of HeadSmart Labs, in a press release. “Out of the 12 footballs we tested, we found that, on average, footballs dropped 1.8 psi when being exposed to dropping temperatures and wet conditions.”

But, but that's impossible. I mean so many posters here have said that the conditions didn't matter....and, and, and um Belichick is a cheater, so um, so he must have cheated, because, well because that's what I want to believe.
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Heh. Never argue with the laws of physics. Einstein wins every time
 
David 76 said:
Which is far different than innocence. Because you can't explain with the same temperature, same gauges, same process, the Colt's Balls responded differently than the Pats.
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Except, nobody knows that. The Colts balls were never tested. Nor do we know, even if they WERE tested, what pressure they were originally inflated to. In the case of the Patriots, considering Brady admitted he liked the balls on the low end, we can assume they would have only inflated them to the lower limit - 12.5 psig. Who knows what the Colts did. And nobody checked them after the fact, either.
 
upstater said:
Again?
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Basically, who is right? Kraft is now staying that Belichick, Brady and the Pats are innocent and the NFL owes them an apology.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/patrio...ck-mistreated-infaklte-gate/story?id=28502439

Or, Fox Sports reporting that the NFL has a Pats staffer underreview and it has video tape of said staffer moving he balls in between the referee review and the start of the game.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story...cker-room-attendant-deflategate-investigation

If the NFL does have a smoking gun so to speak, it would prove that someone within the Pats organization did this and then tried to cover it-up. The act of covering-up the move and lying about it will be more severally treated by the NFL than the action of deflating he balls themselves.
 
Mr. Conehead said:
Basically, who is right? Kraft is now staying that Belichick, Brady and the Pats are innocent and the NFL owes them an apology.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/patrio...ck-mistreated-infaklte-gate/story?id=28502439

Or, Fox Sports reporting that the NFL has a Pats staffer underreview and it has video tape of said staffer moving he balls in between the referee review and the start of the game.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story...cker-room-attendant-deflategate-investigation

If the NFL does have a smoking gun so to speak, it would prove that someone within the Pats organization did this and then tried to cover it-up. The act of covering-up the move and lying about it will be more severally treated by the NFL than the action of deflating he balls themselves.
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covering-up = rich ball boy ;)
 
Mr. Conehead said:
Basically, who is right? Kraft is now staying that Belichick, Brady and the Pats are innocent and the NFL owes them an apology.

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/patrio...ck-mistreated-infaklte-gate/story?id=28502439

Or, Fox Sports reporting that the NFL has a Pats staffer underreview and it has video tape of said staffer moving he balls in between the referee review and the start of the game.

http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story...cker-room-attendant-deflategate-investigation

If the NFL does have a smoking gun so to speak, it would prove that someone within the Pats organization did this and then tried to cover it-up. The act of covering-up the move and lying about it will be more severally treated by the NFL than the action of deflating he balls themselves.
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The reason the kid has the balls is that the refs gave him the balls because he is the NFL's sideline attendant. He gets the balls right before the game each week. Not only did he have the Patriots balls, he also had the Colts balls. He also took a leak. 90 seconds. Some people here spent the day deflating and inflating balls and trying to deflate them in record time. Others realized this story was the story of someone taking a leak. Still others realized that the writer of the Fox story has been debunked and made fun of by several others around sports media (see Glauber of Newsday).
 
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mauconnfan said:
covering-up = rich ball boy ;)
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Wow... I never thought you would actually take it this far. Kid takes a leak, and suddenly he deflated 11 balls. I love how Mr. Conehead makes it sound as though he's a staffer who secretly took the balls away from the refs. In reality, he's the NFL's sideline attendant who handles the balls during the game. He had the Colts balls too. 90 seconds.
 
upstater said:
Wow... I never thought you would actually take it this far. Kid takes a leak, and suddenly he deflated 11 balls. I love how Mr. Conehead makes it sound as though he's a staffer who secretly took the balls away from the refs. In reality, he's the NFL's sideline attendant who handles the balls during the game. He had the Colts balls too. 90 seconds.
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I'm not but having a blast with you on this one ups. ;)
 
Boston College did a study today timing 129 16-year olds taking a leak. They tossed off the results of 14 of the kids as they went from the leak to self-pleasure which added time. They also had to omit the times of the kids who had draw string pants because they had knots to deal with.

So, of the 102 kids who were timed the average was 88 seconds. Amazing that their results are in line with the ballboy bathroom visit.

www.eagleleaks.net
 
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Dove said:
Boston College did a study today timing 129 16-year olds taking a leak. They tossed off the results of 14 of the kids as they went from the leak to self-pleasure which added time. They also had to omit the times of the kids who had draw string pants because they had knots to deal with.

So, of the 102 kids who were timed the average was 88 seconds. Amazing that their results are in line with the ballboy bathroom visit.

www.eagleleaks.net
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At Disney On Ice this weekend, I saw an adult who dropped his pants to his ankles in order to take a leak.
 
8893 said:
Another interesting statistical anomaly, per boston.com:

http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...ssible-rate/LCgrlUR9qgxDsIgcal9dUI/story.html
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People like to torture stats, don't they? While the author admits that Welker and LaFell fumbled MORE for the Patriots than their other teams, he uses the wrong stat to measure this. He is looking at fumbles recovered. What he should use is just plain fumbles.

Plus, he has such a small sample to do this with. For instance, he says Blount fumbled more with the Steelers.

Uh, Blount carried the ball 65 times with the Steelers. 1 fumble.
For the Patriots, he carried the ball 60 times. 0 fumbles.

Does this seem like a significant stat for you?

Not to mention the fact that officially, Blount ran the ball 150 times last year, and fumbled the ball 3 times. Which is a very very high rate, much higher rate than in any of his years at Tampa Bay.

So what's the difference? The writer is measuring fumbles recovered, and not fumbles. If he takes recoveries out of the equation, then it will show that Blount fumbles MORE with the Patriots.
 
Dove said:
Boston College did a study today timing 129 16-year olds taking a leak. They tossed off the results of 14 of the kids as they went from the leak to self-pleasure which added time. They also had to omit the times of the kids who had draw string pants because they had knots to deal with.

So, of the 102 kids who were timed the average was 88 seconds. Amazing that their results are in line with the ballboy bathroom visit.

www.eagleleaks.net
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This keeps getting more and more absurd, but at least now the national media is off it and its just haters v Pats loyalists. Analyzing the time to deflate balls is insane. Has anyone looked at the kids behavior post-bathroom trip and when he went again? Estimated the size of his bladder, liquid intake and determined a likelihood of pee-ing vs football tampering? Is he a coffee drinker? Maybe he was wearing an adult diaper to perpetrate this crime like that crazy astronaut lady from a few years back?
 
Dogdeacon said:
This keeps getting more and more absurd, but at least now the national media is off it and its just haters v Pats loyalists. Analyzing the time to deflate balls is insane. Has anyone looked at the kids behavior post-bathroom trip and when he went again? Estimated the size of his bladder, liquid intake and determined a likelihood of pee-ing vs football tampering? Is he a coffee drinker? Maybe he was wearing an adult diaper to perpetrate this crime like that crazy astronaut lady from a few years back?
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Yes, yes they have in another thread. One guy measured the time it took him to pee based upon different meals and hydration levels. He felt that the longest it should take for this guy to pee was 27.85 seconds. He presumes that the kid didn't wash his hands, based upon his observation of 206 men in a public restroom. He said that he would have gotten a larger sample size but the police made him leave.
 
Devland said:
According to this report the ball may have never been measured with a gauge before the game.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2015/01/...ee-inspection-just-under-allowable-psi-level/
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I wondered about this when the league's description of the circumstances did not say that each ball was checked with a pressure gauge prior to the game and measured "x' psi. This has got to be the most inept 'sting' ever. I strongly suspect that someone ends up getting fired over it. Probably that former Jet guy. He's going to end up like 'pig vomit' character in the Howard Stern movie, on the street and mumbling how he hates Belichick.
 
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