OT: Mizzou black football players taking a stand

[noeynox]

Well, things really are different down south. Football rules the roost. And the AD is more powerful than the president.

Holy sheep shat. I don't think any of us saw that coming. Can he bounce back from this career wise you think?

 

[Carl Spackler]

Carl, the thing about swastika made out of * wasn't primarily the * part, although that is not cool to force someone to clean that up. It was the swastika which, apart from a prince harry gaffe form of privileged ignorance that's clearly not the case here, is used as intimidation and a way of saying "you and your kind are not welcome here."

And what exactly do you mean by "destroy the university"?

I know very well what the symbol means. The time when the symbol was truly intimidating, is long over. To the educated, and really strong people - it's a sign of weakness and ignorance.

As for 'destroy the university' - once again, I'm using strong words, but sensitivity is not high on my list for about 6 months now. I've had a bit of a change in the way things were going for me based on events out of my control - and my work is what it is - but I digress.

I'm in the habit, of when it's time to communicate, not to tippy toe around things.

Chin Diesel brought up an interesting set of questions, that problems like are happening in a community like a university campus can lead to. It's a situation that can tear apart a university community from the inside, if it escalates in a divisive fashion, rather than the community coming together.

This seems pretty clear to me.

 

[Stainmaster]

I know very well what the symbol means. The time when the symbol was truly intimidating, is long over. To the educated, and really strong people - it's a sign of weakness and ignorance.

Carl, no disrespect but you sound like someone who's never been in a position to ever be threatened by the symbol. Therefore, it's not as real to you.

 

[Jax Husky]

The president has stepped down.. Now that all race relations issues are completely resolved in Missouri, those players can get back to playing the sport that gives them a free education, housing, food, and medical coverage.


The issues were a crap swastika, drawn by an unknown person (probably dumb drunk cracker) and a supposed incident of someone being called the N-word by at truck driving by off-campus (who knows if they were even students). Ridiculous.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Carl, no disrespect but you sound like someone who's never been in a position to ever be threatened by the symbol. Therefore, it's not as real to you.

You are correct, in that I was born here - in the U.S.A.

 

[upstater]

Holy sheep shat. I don't think any of us saw that coming. Can he bounce back from this career wise you think?

He's a businessman. IBM, etc. This played a part in it, you can be sure.

 

[Stainmaster]

You are correct, in that I was born here - in the U.S.A.

Being threatened by a swastika has nothing to do with where you were born. It has to do with one's background (race, ethnicity, whatever you want to call it). You can't blame people for having a visceral reaction to it when there are still groups that display the symbol with the hopes of committing violence in its name. Due to my own background, seeing a swastika will always conjure up fear, as I'm sure seeing a noose would for a black individual.

 

[noeynox]

We had an incident at a job I worked at once. Someone came in and found a zip lock bag with shat in it in their desk. It was a big to do, state police came interviewed everybody. Nothing ever came of it because really how much investigating can be done on a bag of sheet. Obviously no one admitted. There were cameras but they showed nothing. We got the usual zero tolerance memos and will prosecute to the fullest jargon.

I wonder if in this case the perpetrators had been identified and the president failed to address it? In the work case, the rumor was the person did it themselves. Knowing the individual, I highly they would do that. Crazy stuff.

 

[noeynox]

He's a businessman. IBM, etc. This played a part in it, you can be sure.

You mean the resignation? As in he will do okay for himself?

 

[huskymedic]

Dave_Matter11:59am via Twitter Web Client
Mizzou players confirm Saturday's game vs. BYU is on. Team will practice Tuesday. (Monday is normally an off day)

 

[Nostical]

The issues were a crap swastika, drawn by an unknown person (probably dumb drunk cracker) and a supposed incident of someone being called the N-word by at truck driving by off-campus (who knows if they were even students). Ridiculous.

This is the way change happens. Would it surprise you to learn that some of that crap (in various forms) has happened at other SEC schools? I can't say, but if I was a minority feeling marginalized at a university, I now see the way out. You need a passionate committed leader to raise the issue publicly (like Jonathan Butler's hunger strike) and then get the football team and coaches to back up the call for change. I don't remember one media story on this issue until the football team went public. That's how powerful their leverage is.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Being threatened by a swastika has nothing to do with where you were born. It has to do with one's background (race, ethnicity, whatever you want to call it). You can't blame people for having a visceral reaction to it when there are still groups that display the symbol with the hopes of committing violence in its name. Due to my own background, seeing a swastika will always conjure up fear, as I'm sure seeing a noose would for a black individual.

Dude - you're entitled to your opinion, and I'm not going to crap on it. (pun intended). You have no idea what my experiences are or my family. Be careful the kind of judgements you make about people. We all need to be careful of that. Symbols by themselves, are nothing to be feared - IMO - disgust is an appropriate, experienced and educated response to some kinds of symbols for sure, but it's all relative really. A cartoon picture of Mohammed is enough to incite some people to kill.

It's the people that would label themselves with symbols, and the context in which they do it culturally, and what they're capable of physically, that are to be feared, identified and dealt with appropriately.

This is definitely cesspool stuff now. I won't contribute further, no matter how hard you try to make me.

PHHHT. (sticking my tongue out sound)

 

[superjohn]

I know very well what the symbol means. The time when the symbol was truly intimidating, is long over. To the educated, and really strong people - it's a sign of weakness and ignorance.

As for 'destroy the university' - once again, I'm using strong words, but sensitivity is not high on my list for about 6 months now. I've had a bit of a change in the way things were going for me based on events out of my control - and my work is what it is - but I digress.

I'm in the habit, of when it's time to communicate, not to tippy toe around things.

Chin Diesel brought up an interesting set of questions, that problems like are happening in a community like a university campus can lead to. It's a situation that can tear apart a university community from the inside, if it escalates in a divisive fashion, rather than the community coming together.

This seems pretty clear to me.

The swastika is used by white supremecists all over the word to intimidate and strike fear in minority groups. It's amazing how in this day and age you go to professional soccer games in Europe and you could see swastikas, guys putting up Hitler salutes and guys wearing ape costumes throwing bananas at black players. You say you know the swastika very well, then you would know it is used to intimidate and terrorize the minority groups they target.[/QUOTE]

 

[superjohn]

You are correct, in that I was born here - in the U.S.A.

What a bizarre response.

 

[Jax Husky]

This is the way change happens. Would it surprise you to learn that some of that crap (in various forms) has happened at other SEC schools? I can't say, but if I was a minority feeling marginalized at a university, I now see the way out. You need a passionate committed leader to raise the issue publicly (like Jonathan Butler's hunger strike) and then get the football team and coaches to back up the call for change. I don't remember one media story on this issue until the football team went public. That's how powerful their leverage is.

Meh, I guess so. I just didn't see how the demands made by this group (especially the part about making the President admit his white privilege) were going to resolve anything.

The issues cannot go unaddressed, but what are they supposed to do with no culprits, witnesses, or other info to go after?

If this would have been over unfair admission rates, inequality in how scholarships and aid are given, inequality amongst teacher pay, I guess I would agree more with the stance, but the issues that have been relayed don't add up to making the President resign.

 

[ZooCougar]

Meh, I guess so. I just didn't see how the demands made by this group (especially the part about making the President admit his white privilege) were going to resolve anything.

The issues cannot go unaddressed, but what are they supposed to do with no culprits, witnesses, or other info to go after?

If this would have been over unfair admission rates, inequality in how scholarships and aid are given, inequality amongst teacher pay, I guess I would agree more with the stance, but the issues that have been relayed don't add up to making the President resign.

I wish I had read their other absurd demands before posting. Good grief.

Next time a Mizzou football player beats someone up in Columbia, I am sure the players will hold themselves to their own lofty standards.

That movie Idiocracy is prophetic.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Call me crazy, but isn't it fairly easy to get some DNA or other biometric data from dookie?

It's somewhat difficult to smear someone else's crap on a wall.

 

[Carl Spackler]

The swastika is used by white supremecists all over the word to intimidate and strike fear in minority groups. It's amazing how in this day and age you go to professional soccer games in Europe and you could see swastikas, guys putting up Hitler salutes and guys wearing ape costumes throwing bananas at black players. You say you know the swastika very well, then you would know it is used to intimidate and terrorize the minority groups they target.

[/QUOTE]

Is racial bigotry something new? Do jackoffs that would do such things need the swastika and old black and white videos of Hitler to emulate to be racist ?

All I said is that the time when the swastika symbol really meant something terrible is long over. The fact that somebody would draw a swastika in , or anything else? That's going to make somebody scared? not me. Makes me disgusted, and interested in finding whoever did it, and punishing them, and hopefully educating them at what a frigging jerk they are being.

In none of this mess have I suggest that there is not a racial problem on the Missouri campus, nor have I suggested that any such problem is insignificant. All I've said, is that the leadership at the university failed at a very easy, low hanging fruit thing, that could have been used very effectively to deal with the greater problems having to do with racial tensions.

There was a time when lots and lots of people wearing those swastika symbols wouldn't just make gestures, insults and throw bananas at people. In fact it was scarier, because they wouldn't say anything, they'd just walk into your house by force and drag you out and kill you, if they didn't torture you, or work you to death first.

I'm going to be accused very shortly again, of being a racist and insensitive to the black community again I'm sure.

And I'm really out on this subject. I responded to you, because we've had decent discussion in the past.

 

[Chin Diesel]

I wish I had read their other absurd demands before posting. Good grief.

Next time a Mizzou football player beats someone up in Columbia, I am sure the players will hold themselves to their own lofty standards.

That movie Idiocracy is prophetic.

In Anthropology/Ecology raw output of offspring is considered a form of "fitness" of an organism. Basically the more offspring you produce, the greater the chance one of those offspring's can cause changes.

 

[ZooCougar]

In Anthropology/Ecology raw output of offspring is considered a form of "fitness" of an organism. Basically the more offspring you produce, the greater the chance one of those offspring's can cause changes.

It has Electrolytes!

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Being threatened by a swastika has nothing to do with where you were born. It has to do with one's background (race, ethnicity, whatever you want to call it). Due to my own background, seeing a swastika will always conjure up fear, as I'm sure seeing a noose would for a black individual.

Imagine, as an underinformed Yank, arriving in Asia several years back and observing swastikas on many buildings. Initially, my quiet reaction was, WTF?

After a few hours, days or so, I realized there must be something to this crap. After openly exhibiting my historic and religious ignorance, I asked a helpful local colleague about what appeared to be swatiskas (albeit not positioned the same as Hitler's psychologically warped hazenkreuz). Hence, I learned The Seal on Buddha's Heart symbol came about only 15 centuries or so before the Nazi symbol.

Alas, this purportedly old (middle aged, AARP qualified, yet fighting it) white guy still learns lessons with an open mind. Luckily, I grew up with friends and neighbors of a variety of skin pigmentation, religious influences, ethnic backgrounds (albeit mostly Paddies and Wops ), etc.

With the passage of time and potentially some rather tough lessons learned, imagine the possibilities for an uber immature troll's mind to grow and to mature. Nope, not Stairmaster who at least in this thread exhibited an open mind and maturity apparently beyond his years. Tip of the cap to stretch.

 

[superjohn]

Is racial bigotry something new? Do jackoffs that would do such things need the swastika and old black and white videos of Hitler to emulate to be racist ?

All I said is that the time when the swastika symbol really meant something terrible is long over. The fact that somebody would draw a swastika in , or anything else? That's going to make somebody scared? not me. Makes me disgusted, and interested in finding whoever did it, and punishing them, and hopefully educating them at what a frigging jerk they are being.

In none of this mess have I suggest that there is not a racial problem on the Missouri campus, nor have I suggested that any such problem is insignificant. All I've said, is that the leadership at the university failed at a very easy, low hanging fruit thing, that could have been used very effectively to deal with the greater problems having to do with racial tensions.

There was a time when lots and lots of people wearing those swastika symbols wouldn't just make gestures, insults and throw bananas at people. In fact it was scarier, because they wouldn't say anything, they'd just walk into your house by force and drag you out and kill you, if they didn't torture you, or work you to death first.

I'm going to be accused very shortly again, of being a racist and insensitive to the black community again I'm sure.

And I'm really out on this subject. I responded to you, because we've had decent discussion in the past.[/QUOTE]
Symbols will always be used to intimidate minority groups, just because you don't fear something doesn't mean others won't. If a group of men show up on a black person's lawn wearing white hoods or swastikas I promise you it will strike fear in that person. I find it very strange that you think the time a swastika meant something is long over, it will always mean something just as burning crosses and white hoods will always mean something, those symbols and imagery mean a tremendous amount and always will. I would at least think you would be able to recognize and empathize with why these symbols would strike fear in minority groups.

 

[upstater]

You mean the resignation? As in he will do okay for himself?

Yes, that's his background

 

[upstater]

Meh, I guess so. I just didn't see how the demands made by this group (especially the part about making the President admit his white privilege) were going to resolve anything.

The issues cannot go unaddressed, but what are they supposed to do with no culprits, witnesses, or other info to go after?

If this would have been over unfair admission rates, inequality in how scholarships and aid are given, inequality amongst teacher pay, I guess I would agree more with the stance, but the issues that have been relayed don't add up to making the President resign.

I said this once, I'll say it again: the group's demands were about highly specific policy changes such as required diversity training. The requests were made in 2014. By late 2015, this Pres. hadn't budged an inch.

While demanding his resignation seems extreme, you have to wonder why this guy sat on his butt on stuff that long preceded Michael Brown.

 

[superjohn]

I hung out at a small college football tailgate at Northwestern this weekend. Most people would think in a culturally diverse enclave like Evanston Illinois you wouldn't see or hear much racism but I heard a friend's family member refer to Derrick Rose as a "Junkyard Shine" and the N word was used many times. Racism is hidden more these days but you will still certainly find people freely expressing their racism any chance they get.