OT: Giants

[8893]

Huh, where did I mention the eyes? I said nothing about that in my post.

It's not eye for an eye out there.

You do understand the phrase you used, right? The Code of Hammurabi? I thought it was ironic given Norman's admitted history of attempting to gouge another player's eyes out. I understand that you want to ignore his history, but I think it's an important part of the culture that exists in the league. A culture where we laugh off as "pregame ritual" sending a thug with a baseball bat over to threaten and taunt the other team's star player; where we tolerate post-tackle body slams and repeated head punches before deciding to call a penalty. Where hands routinely grab and twist face masks with the intent to snap necks.

I make the distinction as anything that can result in serious off the field repercussions, eg impaired cognitive function or paralysis. Have you not paid attention to the CTE issue out there today? It's the single biggest health related issue in professional sports, particularly in football. There are billion dollar lawsuits involved.

What Beckham did can result in a minor concussion yes, but it can be far worse than that, all the way to death even--obviously very rare (hemorrhage or broken neck). But that is why I said you are rolling the dice, because you just don't know. No knee injury results in that.

Can you predict w any certaincy what will happen when someone gets hit in the head? Because I cannot. They've changed the rules of the game because it is such a huge and important issue. But it doesn't apparently seem to be a big deal to you.

Beckham's transgression was compounded because he blindsided Norman, who therefore was unable to brace himself or prepare for contact. Completely helpless. Additionally, it was to the side of his head, on his temple, the most vulnerable part of the head when it comes to injury,

Again, what he did not REMOTELY 'part of the game' or because 'football is a violent sport'. That's a ridiculous and ignorant excuse with this particular situation. Mind boggling that you think it is.

Edit: and I don't care about the personal fouls, what either did before or after, nor do I think Beckham is 'evil' or what have you. But minimizing a blindside cheap shot to the head is BS.

I thought I was pretty clear, but let me be clearer: I don't think what Beckham did is part of the game and I didn't minimize it. That's why I said he should have been ejected on the spot and that the refs are to blame for not ejecting him.

Where we differ is that I do care about the history, and I don't want to hear Norman complaining about the danger to himself. He brought it on because what he does is not "part of the game," either. It's crap. He should have been penalized much earlier than he was and it never would have gotten that far. He goes beyond the pale in an already dangerous sport. I saw him throw countless cheap shots, and I don't want to hear him crying, much less people like you crying for him.

There's a lot of responsibility to go around, starting with Beckham, obviously. Note, he's the only one getting punished. You seem happy enough to leave it at that, and I think it bears examining the context and the other people who bear some responsibility, too, if people are going to keep vilifying the kid as though this happened in the vacuum where you want to keep it.

 

[mauconnfan]

I like Ron Rivera but stating "I guess we will stop the bats pre-game now.." and then saying after all it is the "No Fun League" is BS. I just need to know where bats belong on a football field, it's puzzling. I guess we don't know for sure if they used the bats against other opponents prior to the Giants and OBJ but I'd be curious to find out.

 

[intlzncster]

I like Ron Rivera but stating "I guess we will stop the bats pre-game now.." and then saying after all it is the "No Fun League" is BS. I just need to know where bats belong on a football field, it's puzzling. I guess we don't know for sure if they used the bats against other opponents prior to the Giants and OBJ but I'd be curious to find out.

They did have the bats out for other opponents reportedly. Note, I did not see it. Apparently it was for a teammate who has been lost for the season. No idea how the connection between the bats and that guy is made though.

 

[Edward Sargent]

I like Ron Rivera but stating "I guess we will stop the bats pre-game now.." and then saying after all it is the "No Fun League" is BS. I just need to know where bats belong on a football field, it's puzzling. I guess we don't know for sure if they used the bats against other opponents prior to the Giants and OBJ but I'd be curious to find out.

Next time we play we bring guns and lots of them.

 

[intlzncster]

Next time we play we bring guns and lots of them.

 

[Edward Sargent]

Now thats what I'mm taling about. Strap 'em on and lets play ball

 

[The X Man]

All is forgiven. Suspension overturned




Lawrence Tynes Verified account ‏@lt4kicks
BREAKING NEWS- Odell Beckham Jr. 1 game suspension has been overturned. Beckham Jr. available for Sunday Night vs Vikings

 

[intlzncster]

All is forgiven. Suspension overturned

Hahah, if true, the NFL showing that it truly cares about the head injury thing. Amazing.

 

[The X Man]

Hahah, if true, the NFL showing that it truly cares about the head injury thing. Amazing.

Apparently Lawrence Tynes likes trolling. No one else is reporting it so I don't think it's true

 

[intlzncster]

Apparently Lawrence Tynes likes trolling. No one else is reporting it so I don't think it's true

Glad I included the "if true" qualifier. hahah

NFL probably fines Tynes for this. /s x2

 

[8893]

Not happy about the result, but it is warranted and I like Beckham's response:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...l-beckham-jr-loses-appeal-one-game-suspension

The thug stuff with the bat and the threats is troubling, as is Norman's continued fantasy that he is some kind of choirboy here. It will be interesting to see if his fines are upheld on appeal.

At this point I hope Washington wins on Saturday night so Sunday's game is entirely irrelevant. If so, I hope the Giants sit Eli and all the rest of their starters. Let the NFL enjoy the snoozefest ratings of an exhibition game in prime time.

 

[mauconnfan]

Not happy about the result, but it is warranted and I like Beckham's response:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/1...l-beckham-jr-loses-appeal-one-game-suspension

The thug stuff with the bat and the threats is troubling, as is Norman's continued fantasy that he is some kind of choirboy here. It will be interesting to see if his fines are upheld on appeal.

At this point I hope Washington wins on Saturday night so Sunday's game is entirely irrelevant. If so, I hope the Giants sit Eli and all the rest of their starters. Let the NFL enjoy the snoozefest ratings of an exhibition game in prime time.

One can only hope he grows up from here and really does understand the visibility he carries with being the best at his position. I know based on the aftermath, he has looked like a better guy than the punk in Carolina that believes he did ok.

 

[minidarren]

I couldn't find any response from Norman which isn't surprising since he doesn't feel as though he did anything wrong. But this is OBJ's response.

My Statement - Odell Beckham Jr.
http://www.odellbeckhamjr13.com/blogs/blog/82655430-my-statement

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Some of the Giants fans who climb over each other to jump on their soap box when a certain team from New England is in the news sound flat out hilarious in this thread.

 

[mauconnfan]

Some of the Giants fans who climb over each other to jump on their soap box when a certain team from New England is in the news sound flat out hilarious in this thread.

Only difference is they seem to all admit he did something wrong that embarrassed himself, the Giants and the NFL. Pretty sure we never heard that side from the Pats fans but hey. that's just me Crack. Makes you wonder which group of fans are more hilarious huh

 

[UConn990411]

Only difference is they seem to all admit he did something wrong that embarrassed himself, the Giants and the NFL. Pretty sure we never heard that side from the Pats fans but hey. that's just me Crack. Makes you wonder which group of fans are more hilarious huh

Plenty NE fans did. upstater posts twice as much in those threads as all other Pats fans combined, which skews the perception.

 

[8893]

Only difference is they seem to all admit he did something wrong that embarrassed himself, the Giants and the NFL. Pretty sure we never heard that side from the Pats fans but hey. that's just me Crack. Makes you wonder which group of fans are more hilarious huh

I don't like or agree with @BigErnMcCracken 's reply either, Mau, but in this case I think we need to defer to the recognized ejection expert.

 

[mauconnfan]

I don't like or agree with @BigErnMcCracken 's reply either, Mau, but in this case I think we need to defer to the recognized ejection expert.

Crack I do apologize, you know ejection better than anyone. My bad, continue on please! Good catch 8893

 

[intlzncster]

I don't like or agree with @BigErnMcCracken 's reply either, Mau, but in this case I think we need to defer to the recognized ejection expert.

I'm only liking your post because it was funny, not because of the "I don't like or agree with BigErns reply either" part.

For what it's worth, Norman should absolutely be fined and deserved it. But if you guys think the bats thing is a big deal, you are out of your minds. If I'm a player on the other side of that, I'm laughing at those idiots. At worst, ignoring it as silliness. But to feel "threatened"? The most laughable thing I've heard all week....except for when I read BigErn's 'run out' post again.

 

[intlzncster]

Only difference is they seem to all admit he did something wrong that embarrassed himself, the Giants and the NFL. Pretty sure we never heard that side from the Pats fans but hey. that's just me Crack. Makes you wonder which group of fans are more hilarious huh

You pretty much think all NE fans are exactly like upstater. You guys also have an annoying tendency to ignore facts.

 

[mauconnfan]

You pretty much think all NE fans are exactly like upstater. You guys also have an annoying tendency to ignore facts.

I thought the whole fan base was upstater it's not?

By the way intlz, ignore this!

 

[intlzncster]

I thought the whole fan base was upstater it's not?

I'll grant you, by the post-to-fandom ratio, it might appear that way.

 

[8893]

But if you guys think the bats thing is a big deal, you are out of your minds. If I'm a player on the other side of that, I'm laughing at those idiots. At worst, ignoring it as silliness. But to feel "threatened"? The most laughable thing I've heard all week....except for when I read BigErn's 'run out' post again.

I probably would have agreed with you when I first heard about it, but seeing the videos and hearing the eyewitness accounts--which match what you see in the videos--changed my mind. It's not a pro wrestling routine, because in this sport the goal is actually to hit the other guy for real. It's a thug in street clothes carrying a bat, calling out "Odell" specifically and repeatedly, as he crosses at least ten yards into the Giants warm-up area, walking straight up to Beckham, refusing to shake his hand, and threatening that Beckham is not going to be able play--ever again. They had to break them up and the thug was escorted back by the ref. The same thug was swinging the bat and pointing it at Beckham when they came out on to the field, and he was consulting with Norman throughout. Apparently the thug also attended LSU, where Beckham went.

Then the game started, and Norman had free reign to body slam, face mask and punch Beckham at will for the first quarter before the refs even blew the whistle. Pretty reasonable to feel threatened and unprotected at that point imo, and it's clear that Beckham became increasingly unhinged as a result.

You can laugh at it all you want, but it seems like a pretty well-executed game plan to me, and it worked to perfection. They made an explicit threat and they carried through on it. I sure wish he had ignored it, and I'm sure he does, too; but I certainly can't say that I would have.

I'm sure you're tougher than both of us though.

 

[Rico444]

I probably would have agreed with you when I first heard about it, but seeing the videos and hearing the eyewitness accounts--which match what you see in the videos--changed my mind. It's not a pro wrestling routine, because in this sport the goal is actually to hit the other guy for real. It's a thug in street clothes carrying a bat, calling out "Odell" specifically and repeatedly, as he crosses at least ten yards into the Giants warm-up area, walking straight up to Beckham, refusing to shake his hand, and threatening that Beckham is not going to be able play--ever again. They had to break them up and the thug was escorted back by the ref. The same thug was swinging the bat and pointing it at Beckham when they came out on to the field, and he was consulting with Norman throughout. Apparently the thug also attended LSU, where Beckham went.

Then the game started, and Norman had free reign to body slam, face mask and punch Beckham at will for the first quarter before the refs even blew the whistle. Pretty reasonable to feel threatened and unprotected at that point imo, and it's clear that Beckham became increasingly unhinged as a result.

You can laugh at it all you want, but it seems like a pretty well-executed game plan to me, and it worked to perfection. They made an explicit threat and they carried through on it. I sure wish he had ignored it, and I'm sure he does, too; but I certainly can't say that I would have.

I'm sure you're tougher than both of us though.

Poor Odell; he was just fighting for his life I guess!

 

[intlzncster]

It's not a pro wrestling routine, because in this sport the goal is actually to hit the other guy for real. It's a thug in street clothes carrying a bat, calling out "Odell" specifically and repeatedly, as he crosses at least ten yards into the Giants warm-up area, walking straight up to Beckham, refusing to shake his hand, and threatening that Beckham is not going to be able play--ever again. They had to break them up and the thug was escorted back by the ref. The same thug was swinging the bat and pointing it at Beckham when they came out on to the field

Look, is it acceptable behavior pregame? No, of course not. It's stupid really. But I make a firm distinction between 'threats' (which to me amounts to nothing more than over the top trash talk in football), and what happens when the whistle blows. Were the Panthers carrying bats onto the line of scrimmage once the whistle blew? Did Odell fear he would get clubbed when the game started? If not, then that part is moot.

Then the game started, and Norman had free reign to body slam, face mask and punch Beckham at will for the first quarter before the refs even blew the whistle. Pretty reasonable to feel threatened and unprotected at that point imo, and it's clear that Beckham became increasingly unhinged as a result.

You can laugh at it all you want, but it seems like a pretty well-executed game plan to me, and it worked to perfection. They made an explicit threat and they carried through on it. I sure wish he had ignored it, and I'm sure he does, too;

Guys threaten the opposition every single game. Every game. At all levels. A big part of football is ignoring that, or giving the 'threateners' well timed legal hits. As a defender, you WANT the opposition to feel threatened. You want them to be scared to come across the middle, fearing for their lives. Football is not a nice game. As you said, it was "a pretty well-executed game plan to me, and it worked to perfection."

I am totally on board with threatening Beckham, because he's proven to be soft mentally. He's easy to unhinge. He'll see that before every game now. Until he proves he can overcome it. At this point, I would take an unnecessary roughness penalty or two on him early in the game, just to see if I could knock him off his game (not something that would get me tossed - eg. a blind head shot). That's gamesmanship in football. Happens all the time.

It's clear we are going to disagree on this, but that's how I feel about it.

I'm sure you're tougher than both of us though.

Huh, never would have claimed that, but I maybe so?