OT - Buying a House | Page 6 | The Boneyard

OT - Buying a House

You even skipped the 5-6% you lose in the sale.

Essentially like many businesses people spend way too much time worrying about the expense side and not the revenue side.

You are much better off investing your time and efforts to grow your top line rather than minimizing expenses.

If you are young, you are much better off spending your time investing in your career than mowing your lawn or raking leaves.

Live in a condo and throw yourself into your job - the top line growth is virtually unlimited - what you can save mowing your own lawn is pennies.

Yeah, I wasn't trying to do a full analysis, just hammer home the idea that a primary residence is not an investment. Buy because it fits your lifestyle and only if you have all the rest of your financial house in order.
 
Live in a condo and throw yourself into your job - the top line growth is virtually unlimited . . .
I did this for a few years. Worked 70 hours a week at a firm where partners made north of a million a year. After a few years I started to equate "throw yourself into your job" with "throw your very limited time on the planet into the toilet chasing money."
Eventually moved to a place much less cultured than CT. I'm sure many here would look down their noses at it.
But my time is much more my own than it ever was, and I find that I've grown to value that so much more than what gobs of money used to buy me.
Not saying you're wrong - I respect that there are limitless paths from which to choose.
Just saying that mowing your own grass, while not paying well, won't kill you 10 years sooner because of stress-induced heart failure either.
 
If you are looking for mortgage financing I work for a great bank (not a big national bank) in the Newington area and we have some really neat mortgage financing plans that include built-in improvement financing (if you are looking for a bit of a fixer-upper or just plain regular improvements) for purchases PM me if you want to discuss
Good Luck

@gtcam agreed to buy a house in Newington from my family, please PM. Interested to hear your terms
 
I lived in Manchester for 11 months in one of the Mills back in 1995 for 22 months. Ditched the lease early, with penalty, to GTFUDGEOUT.
Thought the place was a hole. Went there on a whim because it was rated highly in CT magazine and was between UConn and Hartford, where we studied and worked, respectively.
The day I wanted out was when I walked into a convenience store near the Mills and there were adult videos, with explicit cover scenes, by the front door on ready display.
That was the place where I bought my first handgun and started carrying it. Thought the schools were poor.
Long time ago and we really didn't spend much time out and about, so, granted, limited exposure, but I'd strongly recommend against - PM me if you want more details that would get this post deleted.
You could buy hardcore videos and handguns at your local convenience store? That place sounds amazing.
 
Middletown.

Central location (duh) with easy highway access. Not as expensive as Farmington, Southington, Glastonbury, etc. Solid Main Street with good restaurants and bars. Plenty of young people and good gym options.
 
I did this for a few years. Worked 70 hours a week at a firm where partners made north of a million a year. After a few years I started to equate "throw yourself into your job" with "throw your very limited time on the planet into the toilet chasing money."
Eventually moved to a place much less cultured than CT. I'm sure many here would look down their noses at it.
But my time is much more my own than it ever was, and I find that I've grown to value that so much more than what gobs of money used to buy me.
Not saying you're wrong - I respect that there are limitless paths from which to choose.
Just saying that mowing your own grass, while not paying well, won't kill you 10 years sooner because of stress-induced heart failure either.

Whatever floats one’s boat. Was just talking to the income statement aspect of home ownership.

You might note the direct relationship between wealth and life expectency though if you really want to do the math.
 
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Sometimes it's about whether you can stand other people. I have never enjoyed having strangers above, below, and to the side of me in an apartment building. I agree the days of just buying any property and watching it double (or more) in value over time seems to have ended in CT.

Rented the top floor of a 3 family in the early 80's. Being non smokers the smoke rising and coming in our windows was one thing. The couple in the middle floor had a baby and we got to listen to the fight that happened when the husband wanted action from the wife when she was not ready. All out screaming and crying. We bought a fixer upper.
 
Be patient. House buying has a way of working itself out.
Good luck!
 
Yeah, I wasn't trying to do a full analysis, just hammer home the idea that a primary residence is not an investment. Buy because it fits your lifestyle and only if you have all the rest of your financial house in order.

I will say that in 2013 I paid through the nose for a 1100-sq ft 2BR in a co-op in Brooklyn and it's gone up in value almost 40%. We have put some work into it but it's been the most lucrative investment I've ever made.

Of course NYC real estate is its own animal (our next apartment will be disgustingly priced) and I know CT home values have had a different fate.
 
So it sounds like go the condo route for ease of renting after moving out...

Or buy a multi family home. And stay away from single family homes that are aggressively priced or are in bad towns.
 
A while back I posted I often did "mostly pro bono" work and he busted my butt for the "mostly" part.
Slight correction but your "mostly pro Bono "declaration was commentary on a specific client ( Amish iirc), not as a whole.

That's why it was humorous.
 
Rented the top floor of a 3 family in the early 80's. Being non smokers the smoke rising and coming in our windows was one thing. The couple in the middle floor had a baby and we got to listen to the fight that happened when the husband wanted action from the wife when she was not ready. All out screaming and crying. We bought a fixer upper.
Other people suck.
 
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I lived in Manchester for 11 months in one of the Mills back in 1995 for 22 months. Ditched the lease early, with penalty, to GTFUDGEOUT.
Thought the place was a hole. Went there on a whim because it was rated highly in CT magazine and was between UConn and Hartford, where we studied and worked, respectively.
The day I wanted out was when I walked into a convenience store near the Mills and there were adult videos, with explicit cover scenes, by the front door on ready display.
That was the place where I bought my first handgun and started carrying it. Thought the schools were poor.
Long time ago and we really didn't spend much time out and about, so, granted, limited exposure, but I'd strongly recommend against - PM me if you want more details that would get this post deleted.

How long ago was this? It's changed a lot in the last 3-5 years I'd say
 
Yeah, I wasn't trying to do a full analysis, just hammer home the idea that a primary residence is not an investment. Buy because it fits your lifestyle and only if you have all the rest of your financial house in order.

Someone subs to /r/financialindependence
 
Nope I work in Essex.

I can throw a rock and hit that stupid Thomas the tank engine from my office.

it was running last weekend. Got caught in traffic again. What a beat down.
This is all I could think of last Sunday when friends were suggesting that we do a dinner train ride some time.
 
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Well CTBasketball I'm sure you were able absorb 7 pages of information that cleared everything up. Now go out there and get your house, multi family house, condo or rental in Southington, Wolcott, Plainville, West Hartford, Newington, Middletown, East Hampton, Farmington or Rocky Hill. Just stay away from Bristol and Meriden (except the good part near Wallingford)! Good luck!
 
Slight correction but your "mostly pro Bono "declaration was commentary on a specific client ( Amish iirc), not as a whole. That's why it was humorous.
Um. I thought it was allegedly humorous because pro bono means free and when I wrote "mostly pro bono" it's like writing "a little bit pregnant."
@8893 can you settle this?
 
I bought my first house last year. I like the house, love the location and there are things about home ownership that are nice but I'd rent an apartment forever if I could.

I'm sure I'll feel differently when I'm not making any mortgage payments someday but I would not recommend someone in their 20s buy a house unless they've already started a family and really need the space. The financial benefit (if there even is any) will not be close to great enough in my opinion and physical mobility is important for potential future career moves.
 
Well CTBasketball I'm sure you were able absorb 7 pages of information that cleared everything up. Now go out there and get your house, multi family house, condo or rental in Southington, Wolcott, Plainville, West Hartford, Newington, Middletown, East Hampton, Farmington or Rocky Hill. Just stay away from Bristol and Meriden (except the good part near Wallingford)! Good luck!

I think we have adequately equipped him to make a sound financial/lifestyle decison.
 
I own my house, have flipped a couple and have a couple of rental properties. I like buying real estate, but I live near a biggish city with a super strong housing and rental market. I would never buy a house in any of the towns you listed with the expectation of making it a financial instrument. You get whacked by the real estate agent for 6% when you sell it and they way the towns steal the value out of your house by raising taxes is a very real threat. The state budget has been squeezing municipal aid and it is likely going to make the real estate taxes worse.

When I buy rental properties it is tough to find properties in good shape that can attract quality renters and break even when putting 25% down. Personally these are long term plays for retirement annuities. The concept of just renting it out when you leave can be more difficult than you think. You also have to leave your down payment in the property so you’ll need a fresh batch of cash for the new house.

Buy a house cause you want to own something and make it your own and enjoy it. Buying a house in suburban CT because you think you’re throwing your money away on rent could backfire. At 250 your probably only putting 3600/year in principal payments at most. If you’re there for 5 years and the property appreciates at 2%/year you’re barely outpacing the agent fee when you sell. Put in a couple of oh shhhh projects and there is no real appreciation. The end result is that you are gambling 18k ish in principal pay down over 5 years in a good scenario. If the market turns or the taxes get jacked or something else happens, you have to choose between living in your starter home for 15 years or losing your down payment and renting again to get a different spot.

I totally get the desire to break the cycle of renting, but CT market has been a tough place for real estate. Needs to be a 10 year play and a lifestyle decision. My two cents.
 
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Um. I thought it was allegedly humorous because pro bono means free and when I wrote "mostly pro bono" it's like writing "a little bit pregnant."
@8893 can you settle this?

Right but you said your work for that client was " mostly pro Bono"

Which means not pro Bono lol.

On the other hand if you have some clients pro Bono and some not, That makes sense and good on ya mate.
 
I own my house, have flipped a couple and have a couple of rental properties. I like buying real estate, but I live near a biggish city with a super strong housing and rental market. I would never buy a house in any of the towns you listed with the expectation of making it a financial instrument. You get whacked by the real estate agent for 6% when you sell it and they way the towns steal the value out of your house by raising taxes is a very real threat. The state budget has been squeezing municipal aid and it is likely going to make the real estate taxes worse.

When I buy rental properties it is tough to find properties in good shape that can attract quality renters and break even when putting 25% down. Personally these are long term plays for retirement annuities. The concept of just renting it out when you leave can be more difficult than you think. You also have to leave your down payment in the property so you’ll need a fresh batch of cash for the new house.

Buy a house cause you want to own something and make it your own and enjoy it. Buying a house in suburban CT because you think you’re throwing your money away on rent could backfire. At 250 your probably only putting 3600/year in principal payments at most. If you’re there for 5 years and the property appreciates at 2%/year you’re barely outpacing the agent fee when you sell. Put in a couple of oh shhhh projects and there is no real appreciation. The end result is that you are gambling 18k ish in principal pay down over 5 years in a good scenario. If the market turns or the taxes get jacked or something else happens, you have to choose between living in your starter home for 15 years or losing your down payment and renting again to get a different spot.

I totally get the desire to break the cycle of renting, but CT market has been a tough place for real estate. Needs to be a 10 year play and a lifestyle decision. My two cents.

Well @MattMang23 turned out in the end someone boiled it down to one legible post.
 
Right but you said your work for that client was " mostly pro Bono"

Which means not pro Bono lol.

On the other hand if you have some clients pro Bono and some not, That makes sense and good on ya mate.

FrankIvy works mostly proboner
 
Um. I thought it was allegedly humorous because pro bono means free and when I wrote "mostly pro bono" it's like writing "a little bit pregnant."
@8893 can you settle this?
Right but you said your work for that client was " mostly pro Bono"

Which means not pro Bono lol.

On the other hand if you have some clients pro Bono and some not, That makes sense and good on ya mate.
It was funny to me because “mostly pro bono” is a phrase that would tick the ears of most lawyers like “virtually” does, i.e., it means “not.”

The fact that they were Amish was just a nice bonus.

But, yes, good on ya for whatever pro bono or modest means services you provide. In all seriousness, modest means services is one of the areas of greatest need in terms of legal services, which is why many states are enacting Civil Gideon programs.
 
This is an increasingly accepted view. Similar to what I posted earlier. My parents house appreciated 1000% in 30 years, it was worth 10x what they paid. It was an investment that paid for every car they ever owned and expensive college educations for two kids plus a good chunk of their retirement. I've been in my current house for 15 years and it is worth about 5% more than I paid for it. It is the biggest difference in financial terms between baby boomers and everyone else. Unless your area becomes the next hot market, your primary home is not going to be a good investment in terms of return. It may end up being cheaper than renting if you are there long enough but not if you are moving. Put it this way, the interest on a 300k mortgage at 4% is $515K over 30 years. Your rent would need to be triple your mortgage payment if you exclude appreciation. If you include appreciation of 3%/yr, after 30 years your house will be "worth" 728K - the 515K you paid in interest nets 213K or $591/month in rent equivalent after 30 years. Is your rent going to be $600 more than your mortgage P&I + taxes + PMI + maintenance?

Hard to see on a starter home and even worse for one you plan to spend 5 years in. Homes just aren't the investments they once were.

Build your emergency fund, fund your retirement accounts as much as possible, for the love of God take full advantage of your companies 401K match.

Meet or beat the 50/30/20 rule; Spend no more than 50% of your earnings on stuff you need (housing/food/transportation), 30% on stuff you want (everything else), and 20% on your savings/retirement fund. The last number is the most important if you ever want to be financially independent.
I'm certainly not a financial adviser and I have no idea about the conditions in CT, but I'm really surprised that your house has only appreciated 5% in 15 years. I know there was the bubble burst in that time but I thought most places had increased significantly since the bottom. I was fortunate that I got my home in 2010 and it's appreciated 80% since then. Even if I go back to the price it sold at in 2006 before the bubble, it's still up 30% since then. Add in the tax benefits of interest and property tax (which may be more limited in 2018) and the fact that when you sell, most or all of the profit isn't taxed and I can't see a reason not to buy a house if you can afford it.

My advice for a 25 year old person with the means to buy a house:
1) Get rid of all debt - particularly credit card debt. There's no reason to pay double digit interest on money you don't have. Low interest car or student loan debt is more tolerable but you still want to get rid of it as fast a possible. Pay off the higher interest debt first while maintaining the lower interest debt. Eat raman, get rid of as much of luxury things you can live without, put on a sweatshirt and turn down the heat and pay off as much debt as you can. You have your 40s and beyond to be comfortable.
2) As to the 50/30/20 rule, there's no reason to spend 30% on things you want at that age - lower it. Your late 20s early 30s will still be amazing without spending 30%.
3) Don't get married or have kids until you can afford it. You're going to live longer than you parents and way longer than your grandparents. 40 plus years with a spouse is more than enough - wait until you're 35 or so. Your kids will be out of the house when your 60-65 - that's good enough.
4) Go ahead and live with someone who can do 1) and 2) above until you're ready to have kids and can afford it.
5) If you can do 1) and 2) go ahead and buy a house as soon as you can. Buy the worst house you can afford and can fix up in the best neighborhood you can find. If you are handy, you can create at ton of equity/worth in a fixer - particularly if you don't have kids to deal with. Know your limits. It's stupid expensive to find contractors for things you can't handle.
6) Sell your first house in 2 to 5 years depending on market conditions. If you can get 250k in profit, it's not taxable. That profit is in your pocket tax free.
7) Take the profit and equity and buy the next worst house you can fix in the best neighborhood you can find. You have 5 years this time because you can only take the free tax from profit once every 5 years.
8) Rinse repeat buy, fix, sell every 5 years until you have enough money to buy the house you want to spend the rest of your life in. You can turn about 5 houses over between 25 and 47 or so. If you get married in that time frame, you take 500k in profit without taxes. If you do it right, by your late 40s, you can buy a great house with no mortgage.
9) Make sure you never get emotionally attached to a house so that you can't do the 5 year turn over. It's all a means to an end.

Good luck!
 
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