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Non-Key Tweets

Chin Diesel said:
I've stayed solid believing in B1G and SEC becoming the two dominant conferences and absorbing the other conferences under their umbrella. All being funded or aligned with FOX or ESPN.

These two groups need content and even if the remaining teams aren't pure equals, they provide options for one group and remove those options from the other group.

So, if ESPN wants UConn to build its roster, UConn will slot somewhere in the ESPN grouping. Which also means UConn is removed from FOX groupings.

I think it more likely FOX absorbs the Big East under the B1G umbrella. Football can stay independent but will have its schedule dominates by other FOX aligned schools.
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That is an interesting theory, that I actually find somewhat plausible. Could FOX and ESPN wind up in a low-key bidding war for the Big East? Maybe. While that wouldn’t get it P2 money, or even P5 money, it might end up being worth a few million per school more
 
CL82 said:
That is an interesting theory, that I actually find somewhat plausible. Could FOX and ESPN wind up in a low-key bidding war for the Big East? Maybe. While that wouldn’t get it P2 money, or even P5 money, it might end up being worth a few million per school more
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I just think there will be less crossover games between ESPN and FOX properties.
At a certain point quantity becomes a quality when it's a zero sum game of you either get a university for its sports or you don have any access to it for programming.
 


Greg Flugaur@flugempire · 2h
By end of the series I believe that many will understand why Notre Dame, if they were ever going to say yes to Big Ten, it would happen in next 80 day window.

We believe the Irish will act when their leverage with Big Ten is most high…just like USC.

Within the next 80 days.
 
Chin Diesel said:
I just think there will be less crossover games between ESPN and FOX properties.
At a certain point quantity becomes a quality when it's a zero sum game of you either get a university for its sports or you don have any access to it for programming.
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www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

SBJ Media: New Big Ten bids coming this week

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

It's being reported that ESPN is still in negotiations for a slice of the B1G pie.

If they do get some B1G games, they will do everything they can to make sure any B1G games they own is against another ESPN owned school If it's not a B1G conference game. ESPN is going to want that game played against SEC or ACC schools.

By potentially bringing ESPN to the party, the B1G throws some cold water on the SEC vs B1G race to supremacy. Sure, they will compete against each other in many ways but, having a mutual partner can help ease a lot of tensions as these 2 conferences figure how to move forward. With the way they've positioned themselves, they actually need each other if the goal is a breakaway.
 
bobbyinaz said:
www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

SBJ Media: New Big Ten bids coming this week

www.sportsbusinessjournal.com www.sportsbusinessjournal.com

It's being reported that ESPN is still in negotiations for a slice of the B1G pie.

If they do get some B1G games, they will do everything they can to make sure any B1G games they own is against another ESPN owned school If it's not a B1G conference game. ESPN is going to want that game played against SEC or ACC schools.

By potentially bringing ESPN to the party, the B1G throws some cold water on the SEC vs B1G race to supremacy. Sure, they will compete against each other in many ways but, having a mutual partner can help ease a lot of tensions as these 2 conferences figure how to move forward. With the way they've positioned themselves, they actually need each other if the goal is a breakaway.
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I guess I just don’t see this as a competition between Fox and ESPN. It’s more like a partnership. While The Mouse will push the SEC for profit, there needs to be more than 16-24 teams in the P5. With the yearly payouts hinted at over $1 billion each for the Big10 and SEC, there’s no way either will be willing to pony up over $2 billion for the games. This whole idea doesn’t work unless you have 32-48 teams in the mix. With Fox and ESPN splitting the main costs, it becomes more manageable. Fox bringing in ESPN and others also lessens the financial burden.

Think of it, the only 2 schools they truly would be fighting over is UNC and ND. The rest can easily be divided into how ever many they want. Put 40-48 schools in the P5 and you have a more interesting grouping than something smaller. My guess is they aren’t going to hold up any deal to break away for UNC (If ND goes anywhere, it will be ACC or Big10).
 
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dayooper said:
I guess I just don’t see this as a competition between Fox and ESPN. It’s more like a partnership. While The Mouse will push the SEC for profit, there needs to be more than 16-24 teams in the P5. With the yearly payouts hinted at over $1 billion each for the Big10 and SEC, there’s no way either will be willing to pony up over $2 billion for the games. This whole idea doesn’t work unless you have 32-48 teams in the mix. With Fox and ESPN splitting the main costs, it becomes more manageable. Fox bringing in ESPN and others also lessens the financial burden.

Think of it, the only 2 schools they truly would be fighting over is UNC and ND. The rest can easily be divided into how ever many they want. Put 40-48 schools in the P5 and you have a more interesting grouping than something smaller. My guess is they aren’t going to hold up any deal to break away for UNC (If ND goes anywhere, it will be ACC or Big10).
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Let's call it a strategic partnership where each side wants 51%.

Yes, they kinda need to play nice while dividing the spoils of the kill but they both want the prime cuts and not the scraps.
 
college football fan@Genetics56 · 47m
Sharing some other data points from what I was provided..the top 15, in the eyes of the Big Ten, for the most financially stable universities across the country are: MI, OSU, TX, Stanford, UCLA, A&M, FL, PSU, WA, MSU, WI, Duke, MN, USC, Cal

college football fan@Genetics56 · 45m
In the eyes of the Big Ten, the schools they view as financially risky: Missouri, AL, Clemson, Miss, WVU, Kansas State, Baylor, Oregon, Texas Tech, Oklahoma, ARkansas, Miss. State, Oklahoma State, TCU

college football fan@Genetics56 · 40m
In the eyes of the Big Ten, how they view financial sustainability for each Pac school's athletic department (in order from best to worst): Stanford, UCLA, Washington, USC, Cal, Arizona State, Arizona, Utah, Colorado, OSU, WA ST, Oregon. Big Ten measures this against endownments

college football fan@Genetics56 · 29m
Fans can get upset about the data if they want to, but that isn't going to change what the data shows. I have the data. Oregon's AD finances when measured against endowments has them last in the eyes of the Big Ten. If you can't handle the data, then you are free to block

college football fan@Genetics56 · 19m
Yep. FWIW...for Kansas, they are ranked #1 in the Big 12 for financial sustainability in the eyes of the Big Ten. I don't know the rest of the Big 12 rankings though since I don't have that data...only Kansas data for Big 12.

Chilly@ChillyinAz_ · 15m
Replying to @Genetics56
What is the correlation tho, you can’t use endowments for athletics?

college football fan@Genetics56 · 5m
They are looking for health....AD revenue vs expense vs funds that come from the schools vs donations and then against endowments. Stanford scores a 100%.
 
Chin Diesel said:
Let's call it a strategic partnership where each side wants 51%.

Yes, they kinda need to play nice while dividing the spoils of the kill but they both want the prime cuts and not the scraps.
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Again, IMO, there only a few schools that are acceptable to both SEC and Big10. ND, UNC and maybe UVA (I don’t see the SEC really wanting UVA unless it’s a requirement for UNC). Otherwise, the schools split up pretty evenly.
 
college football fan@Genetics56 · 32m
The Big Ten TV deal is expected to be anywhere from $1.25B to $1.4B per year. The difference is due to streaming...if it is included or not. If Notre Dame joins the Big Ten and Stanford isn't a partner, then they will not add anyone else until the ACC schools become available.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 33m
The expectation is and nothing is signed, is still 3 networks.

Chris Buchignani@buchignani · 26m
By which you mean Fox, CBS, and NBC, or Disney back in the mix at the expense of one of the latter two?

college football fan@Genetics56 · 22m
ESPN is still in it...so 2 of ESPN, CBS, NBC.
 
dayooper said:
Again, IMO, there only a few schools that are acceptable to both SEC and Big10. ND, UNC and maybe UVA (I don’t see the SEC really wanting UVA unless it’s a requirement for UNC). Otherwise, the schools split up pretty evenly.
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B1G and SEC will be umbrella organizations for a larger pool of schools. These other schools won't be in the B1G or SeC and won't get money but will form alliances to.fill out the football, basketball and other sports' schedule.
 
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CL82 said:
If ESPN renegotiates the contract, the damn well better add us.
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It really galls me to read the Louisville AD say this when no one gave a damn about what happened to UConn:

“I think that they understand that the ACC has to be extremely healthy for college athletics to be successful,” Heird said of ESPN. “And so I think they do feel an obligation to make sure that transpires. Not every decision — it’s hard to believe — is based on the bottom line. At some point, we’re going to need more than the SEC and the Big Ten, 32 teams, to make college athletics viable.”
 
Even if ESPN revises the contract, the ACC will still be so far in the review mirror of the B1G and SEC that all the teams in the ACC with a possible out will still want out ASAP.
 
jostar1 said:
It really galls me to read the Louisville AD say this when no one gave a damn about what happened to UConn:

“I think that they understand that the ACC has to be extremely healthy for college athletics to be successful,” Heird said of ESPN. “And so I think they do feel an obligation to make sure that transpires. Not every decision — it’s hard to believe — is based on the bottom line. At some point, we’re going to need more than the SEC and the Big Ten, 32 teams, to make college athletics viable.”
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If I was Louisville’s AD I’d be saying the same thing. They are staring down being in Metro Conference 2.0 should UNC grow a pair and look to get out.
 
Rufus said:
Even if ESPN revises the contract, the ACC will still be so far in the review mirror of the B1G and SEC that all the teams in the ACC with a possible out will still want out ASAP.
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Exactly. ESPN is a business, and their parent company is hemorrhaging money right now. I can’t see them saying we better get The ACC on par financially with The SEC.

There is no ROI to be made paying the likes of Pitt, BC, Syracuse, and WF 75+ million a year just to keep UNC away from Fox. It probably makes more sense to funnel a couple of valuable properties into The SEC, let FOX grab a few, and then pay the leftovers AAC money.
 
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Ldandy said:
Exactly. ESPN is a business, and their parent company is hemorrhaging money right now. I can’t see them saying we better get The ACC on par financially with The SEC.

There is no ROI to be made paying the likes of Pitt, BC, Syracuse, and WF 75+ million a year just to keep UNC away from Fox. It probably makes more sense to funnel a couple of valuable properties into The SEC, let FOX grab a few, and then pay the leftovers AAC money.
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I'd be happy to see UConn in a league with the ACC leftovers. Pull in the Big East Teams for Basketball.
 
NowInStorrs said:
I think they did something like that once before..
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You’re really going to suggest a situation where UConn found itself with Tulane, Tulsa, and East Carolina is basically the same to ending up with Duke Cuse Pitt and a Virginia team?
 
college football fan@Genetics56 · 3h
Oregon media value is estimated to be around $40M. Notre dame is estimated to be around $200M. Stanford is estimated to be around $65M.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 3h
In a little bit I'll be posting some detailed information about Stanford and why they are the best institutional fit to go with Notre Dame.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford has the largest endownment ($41.9B). They are the only Pac 12 member that is in the Ivy Plus network. In fiscal year 2021, the endowment disbursed $1.33 billion. I share that because it matters to the Big Ten....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
The Big Ten wants to make sure a university is financially sustainable and have the donor level to sustain top level academic research and education. In 2020, the Big Ten did $11.5B in research expenditure. Stanford would bring an additional $1.2B.cont.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford would do the 3rd most research based on the data. When you do over a billion dollars in research a year, the Big Ten's academic alliance can save a univeristy millions of dollars a year through the Purchasing Consortium....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Because of the ability to The BTAA supporting students to share courses across universities, all Big Ten universities would be able to better compete for students that attend Ivy schools....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
when you combine research expenditure of Stanford, the Big Ten would go over the $12B mark annually, doubling the research expenditiure of the Ivy League.cont.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
When you combine USC, UCLA, & Stanford, you are adding $3.5B in annual research expenditure to the Big Ten, putting the annual total over $14B in anuall research expenditure...cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
USC, UCLA, Stanford and Notre Dame would bring roughly $4B of new money into the Big Ten. I know that isn't shared among all universities, but as a whole, that is a massive increase, improving student body experiences and collaboration even more...cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
that is one of many reseasons the Big Ten goes into a lot of detail when vetting a new member and why, after Notre Dame + Stanford, it's going to get extremely difficult to add anyone else after that....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
The general public will see this as sports money, but the Big Ten will view it as a $4B acquistion.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
How can Kevin Warren go to University Presidents of the Big Ten and tell them "Oregon did $90M FYI21 for research expenditure" vs over $1B in Stanford. Kevin is not stupid, he knows the Oregon numbers would be an immediate vote rejection, IMO.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
There are many issues with Oregon - low student enrollment, low research expenditure, small tv market/population, bad admission rates, football value doesn't pay for itself as a Big Ten member (not enough added value). Kevin can't take that to vote vs Stanford.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford - massive research expenditure, large population, top tv market, 4% admit rate, elite academic/research, massive endownment and theres a lot more. Stanford vs Oregon = Kevin has no choice, really, it's too obvious.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
$1.25B/16 (being conservative) + BTN + College football playoff + basketball, etc. My best educated guess on what the money would be per school for the new TV contract is about $105M per school and goes up from there every year.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
Just a little FYI when talking about schools who could get admitted into the Big Ten. Every Big Ten university is ranked in the top 89 in the 2021 Academic Ranking of World Universities (ARWU) - National Rank and world rank none of them below 300.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
People wonder why Arizona State gets mentioned with the Big Ten ...this is why...global ranking is 101-150. Higher than PSU, Indiana, MSU.
 
CAtlantic said:
college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
Just a little FYI when talking about schools who could get admitted into the Big Ten. Every Big Ten university is ranked in the top 89 in the 2021 Academic Ranking of World Universities (ARWU) - National Rank and world rank none of them below 300.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
People wonder why Arizona State gets mentioned with the Big Ten ...this is why...global ranking is 101-150. Higher than PSU, Indiana, MSU.
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Just to put it on the record, UConn is in the 201-300 range in the ARWU, along with Nebraska and Kansas.
 
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storrsroars said:
Just to put it on the record, UConn is in the 201-300 range in the ARWU, along with Nebraska and Kansas.
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The Shanghai, QS, Times Higher Ed. or USN&WR rankings all have limitations and flaws. The idea that Big 10 presidents individually look at one of those seems very unlikely. In my opinion, college football fan@Genetics56 is talking out his butt.

We do know they care about AAU, except for Notre Dame. We also know they care about research expenditures.

 
CAtlantic said:
college football fan@Genetics56 · 3h
Oregon media value is estimated to be around $40M. Notre dame is estimated to be around $200M. Stanford is estimated to be around $65M.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 3h
In a little bit I'll be posting some detailed information about Stanford and why they are the best institutional fit to go with Notre Dame.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford has the largest endownment ($41.9B). They are the only Pac 12 member that is in the Ivy Plus network. In fiscal year 2021, the endowment disbursed $1.33 billion. I share that because it matters to the Big Ten....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
The Big Ten wants to make sure a university is financially sustainable and have the donor level to sustain top level academic research and education. In 2020, the Big Ten did $11.5B in research expenditure. Stanford would bring an additional $1.2B.cont.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford would do the 3rd most research based on the data. When you do over a billion dollars in research a year, the Big Ten's academic alliance can save a univeristy millions of dollars a year through the Purchasing Consortium....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Because of the ability to The BTAA supporting students to share courses across universities, all Big Ten universities would be able to better compete for students that attend Ivy schools....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
when you combine research expenditure of Stanford, the Big Ten would go over the $12B mark annually, doubling the research expenditiure of the Ivy League.cont.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
When you combine USC, UCLA, & Stanford, you are adding $3.5B in annual research expenditure to the Big Ten, putting the annual total over $14B in anuall research expenditure...cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
USC, UCLA, Stanford and Notre Dame would bring roughly $4B of new money into the Big Ten. I know that isn't shared among all universities, but as a whole, that is a massive increase, improving student body experiences and collaboration even more...cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
that is one of many reseasons the Big Ten goes into a lot of detail when vetting a new member and why, after Notre Dame + Stanford, it's going to get extremely difficult to add anyone else after that....cont

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
The general public will see this as sports money, but the Big Ten will view it as a $4B acquistion.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
How can Kevin Warren go to University Presidents of the Big Ten and tell them "Oregon did $90M FYI21 for research expenditure" vs over $1B in Stanford. Kevin is not stupid, he knows the Oregon numbers would be an immediate vote rejection, IMO.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
There are many issues with Oregon - low student enrollment, low research expenditure, small tv market/population, bad admission rates, football value doesn't pay for itself as a Big Ten member (not enough added value). Kevin can't take that to vote vs Stanford.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 2h
Stanford - massive research expenditure, large population, top tv market, 4% admit rate, elite academic/research, massive endownment and theres a lot more. Stanford vs Oregon = Kevin has no choice, really, it's too obvious.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
$1.25B/16 (being conservative) + BTN + College football playoff + basketball, etc. My best educated guess on what the money would be per school for the new TV contract is about $105M per school and goes up from there every year.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
Just a little FYI when talking about schools who could get admitted into the Big Ten. Every Big Ten university is ranked in the top 89 in the 2021 Academic Ranking of World Universities (ARWU) - National Rank and world rank none of them below 300.

college football fan@Genetics56 · 1h
People wonder why Arizona State gets mentioned with the Big Ten ...this is why...global ranking is 101-150. Higher than PSU, Indiana, MSU.
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I've long advocated Stanford as next choice for B1G after they added USC/UCLA. Stanford really is one those few private schools outside the Ivies who really brings the $$$ and supports olympic sports. Add in Stanford being in a huge market and Stanford being a private school (Outside of the reach of Gov Newsom and regents) and I think it's a slam dunk add. USC+UCLA+Stanford > All other California universities combined for athletics and TV.

Same reason why I think Georgia Tech is way more valuable than Miami if B1G or SEC want to poach the ACC. Especially for the B1G if they want to get in to the southern markets. I'm actually surprised GT's endowment is only around $2.5B. Thought they'd be at least $5B.
 
storrsroars said:
Just to put it on the record, UConn is in the 201-300 range in the ARWU, along with Nebraska and Kansas.
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"All top 89 and none below 300." I guess I'm reading that wrong. I noticed UCONN is in the same bracket as Georgetown.
 
Urcea said:
You’re really going to suggest a situation where UConn found itself with Tulane, Tulsa, and East Carolina is basically the same to ending up with Duke Cuse Pitt and a Virginia team?
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No. I'm suggesting that your plan of the leftover ACC teams plus the Big East teams for basketball looks a lot like the old Big East. That didn't work out long term.
 
NowInStorrs said:
No. I'm suggesting that your plan of the leftover ACC teams plus the Big East teams for basketball looks a lot like the old Big East. That didn't work out long term.
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It was I that suggested that. I'd love to see UConn in a league with Pitt, Syracuse, BC, Wake and the other leftovers from the ACC. That would be much better than the AAC.
 
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