More trouble in ACC paradise?

[CTFAN4LIFE]

Well that would be one way for the SEC to get back to the title game...

True, but I think it's more likely they will be in the B1G.

 

[Rdkid]

Miami - “Thanks FSU and Clemson for doing the work on this arrangement - and OBE programs for not being deserving of a cut”

 

[JwittersPAC]

True, but I think it's more likely they will be in the B1G.

I agree. I see it more likely Miami joins BIG. Similar school as USC. This also gives BIG access to Florida with this move. I also think BIG would be interested in FSU as well.

 

[CL82]

Miami - “Thanks FSU and Clemson for doing the work on this arrangement - and OBE programs for not being deserving of a cut”

The UNC president effectively said that the same thing right after the settlement. Basically USF and Clemson spent all the time and money necessary to clean up the ACC GOR. UNC knows it will be the beneficiary of that

 

[Rufus]

I also agree with Miami to the B1G. The SEC has no reason to add Miami. There are several schools ahead of Miami that would better benefit the SEC.

Meanwhile, Miami provides more value to the B1G. (So does Florida State).

North Carolina and Virginia provide the most value to the SEC. (Those schools also provide value to the B1G, but I think the SEC gets them).

 

[Kolumbo]

I also agree with Miami to the B1G. The SEC has no reason to add Miami. There are several schools ahead of Miami that would better benefit the SEC.

Meanwhile, Miami provides more value to the B1G. (So does Florida State).

North Carolina and Virginia provide the most value to the SEC. (Those schools also provide value to the B1G, but I think the SEC gets them).

Whelp, the SEC had 5 teams in the CFP and the ACC had one. Which conference made it to the CFP finals

 

[DFW HOYA]

SEC: UNC, UVa.
Big Ten: Cal, Stanford, Miami and....
(I know people talk UNC, Virginia, Duke, etc., but Georgia Tech checks some AAU boxes too.)
Big 12: As many as they want out of NC State, VT, GTech, Pitt, or Louisville
Leftovers: Wake, SMU, Pitt, Syracuse, BC

 

[JwittersPAC]

SEC: UNC, UVa.
Big Ten: Cal, Stanford, Miami and....
(I know people talk UNC, Virginia, Duke, etc., but Georgia Tech checks some AAU boxes too.)
Big 12: As many as they want out of NC State, VT, GTech, Pitt, or Louisville
Leftovers: Wake, SMU, Pitt, Syracuse, BC

So you have FSU and Clemson going to the Big12?

 

[ZooCougar]

SEC: UNC, UVa.
Big Ten: Cal, Stanford, Miami and....
(I know people talk UNC, Virginia, Duke, etc., but Georgia Tech checks some AAU boxes too.)
Big 12: As many as they want out of NC State, VT, GTech, Pitt, or Louisville
Leftovers: Wake, SMU, Pitt, Syracuse, BC

I am getting the feeling that the P4 are beginning to see the folly in these oversize conferences. So I would actually increase the odds that the ACC holds together.

I could be wrong.

Also Nobody is leaving for the Big 12.

 

[Fishy]

SEC: UNC, UVa.
Big Ten: Cal, Stanford, Miami and....
(I know people talk UNC, Virginia, Duke, etc., but Georgia Tech checks some AAU boxes too.)
Big 12: As many as they want out of NC State, VT, GTech, Pitt, or Louisville
Leftovers: Wake, SMU, Pitt, Syracuse, BC

The Big 12 isn’t poaching anyone.

And all of the movement theories might be undercut by financial reality….someone is going to have to agree to pay, say, UNC $50M a year more than they are paying them now. Or, if you’re ESPN, do you really want Virginia at $80M in the SEC when you have them now for half that? Probably not.

I don’t see where the appetite for that is going to come from a system that’s already tapping out.

 

[JwittersPAC]

The Big 12 isn’t poaching anyone.

And all of the movement theories might be undercut by financial reality….someone is going to have to agree to pay, say, UNC $50M a year more than they are paying them now. Or, if you’re ESPN, do you really want Virginia at $80M in the SEC when you have them now for half that? Probably not.

I don’t see where the appetite for that is going to come from a system that’s already tapping out.

Depends if you are ESPN and take the top 4 teams that are almost 50% of the TV ratings of the ACC and just let ACC implode and not renew the ACC contract then ESPN would save a significant amount of money. Example there is very limited interest in seeing BC, Wake Forest, and Duke play football. Attendance and TV ratings verify this.

 

[Fishy]

I am getting the feeling that the P4 are beginning to see the folly in these oversize conferences. So I would actually increase the odds that the ACC holds together.

I could be wrong.

Also Nobody is leaving for the Big 12.

Bingo.

The model is already straining.

 

[baggerbob]

I am getting the feeling that the P4 are beginning to see the folly in these oversize conferences. So I would actually increase the odds that the ACC holds together.

I could be wrong.

Also Nobody is leaving for the Big 12.

Look as more cable companies lose consumers, and espn, and fox have to find new outlets for money the likelihood of giving
out greater amounts of money for new contracts will drop. And paying more to move pieces around isn't going to happen.

 

[CL82]

The Big 12 isn’t poaching anyone.

And all of the movement theories might be undercut by financial reality….someone is going to have to agree to pay, say, UNC $50M a year more than they are paying them now. Or, if you’re ESPN, do you really want Virginia at $80M in the SEC when you have them now for half that? Probably not.

I don’t see where the appetite for that is going to come from a system that’s already tapping out.

ESPN might (and likely would) be willing to pay a school a premium if it meant that it would, as a consequence of their departure, pay the remaining (nonproductive) schools in the conference a substantial reduction such that it's overall cost for product was reduced. This same approach was the underpinning of its financing the Big East raids.

Faced with a potential PAC-12-ing of the ACC, the strongest of the weak sisters left in the conference might (and likely would) find the big 12 more attractive.

Yes, the system is "tapping out", but the consolidation of the existing conference system is a part of that process. What you see as an extension of the existing system, I see as its death throes.

 

[Fishy]

ESPN might (and likely would) be willing to pay a school a premium if it meant that it would, as a consequence of their departure, pay the remaining (nonproductive) schools in the conference a substantial reduction such that it's overall cost for product was reduced. This same approach was the underpinning of its financing the Big East raids.

Faced with a potential PAC-12-ing of the ACC, the strongest of the weak sisters left in the conference might (and likely would) find the big 12 more attractive.

Yes, the system is "tapping out", but the consolidation of the existing conference system is a part of that process. What you see as an extension of the existing system, I see as its death throes.

The Big East situation is not analogous and it was not a consideration for ESPN. ESPN offered the Big East a generous extension and got turned down for its trouble. We need to stop making up stories about what happened.

Far different situation for the ACC. The ACC is essentially owned by ESPN and ESPN is in the business of broadcasting sports content…difficult to do if you act like a wishcasting message board poster and sabotage one of your own media properties.

Unlike the Big East who was out of contract and probably not better than ESPN’s fifth or sixth best option amongst conferences at the time, the ACC actually matters to them.

 

[Chuck]

Bingo.

The model is already straining.

I don't disagree with you and ZooCougar. I'm still surprised when I look at basketball standings and see how big the P4 conferences are. I can't see them getting bigger.

So what's our move? The Big East has not hurt our cash cows. I'm assuming that if we don't get a P4 invite, we stick with the Big East. I can't imaging making a move like UMass and joining a G5 with all of our sports.

But what happens to football if we stay in the Big East? We've been fine the last few years and we're clearly spending (and losing) a lot of money trying to look good to a P4. If that dream ends, does UConn: i) stay independent; ii) find a lower level G5 to take our football team; iii) drop back to FCS; or iv) drop football which saves us money and allows us to shift the Title IX budgeting around? I like and root for UConn football, but option ii-iv seem more prudent than i.

 

[Exit 4]

What needs to happen is for the state to open the check book and buy its ACC seat like SMU

 

[Fishy]

Duke is playing a conference game tonight with an 11 pm EST tip off.

It’s not really material to the conversation but it’s a) funny and b) another sign that the ACC really, really had no idea what it was doing in expansion.

 

[CL82]

The Big East situation is not analogous and it was not a consideration for ESPN. ESPN offered the Big East a generous extension and got turned down for its trouble. We need to stop making up stories about what happened

If by "generous" you mean the lowest offer of all the "BCS" Conferences, then you are correct. Although it certainly reasonable for the big east to think, it wasn't particularly generous when it was going to make it the weakest of all its peers. Those are the facts and I could not agree more that we "need to stop making up stories about what happened."

ESPN gave a low ball offer which the big east turned down and then ESPN funded the disembowelment of the big east. Essentially, it was like the protection rackets. "you got yourself a nice conference here. It would be a shame if something was to happen to it."

Far different situation for the ACC. The ACC is essentially owned by ESPN and ESPN is in the business of broadcasting sports content…difficult to do if you act like a wishcasting message board poster and sabotage one of your own media properties.

Absolutely agree! Well, except of course that it's a tried and true model that's been successful for them in the past. I mean, why would they go back to a strategy that worked? Nobody does that.

Here's the thing, the content isn't going anywhere. If moving the productive pieces to a different conference and paying them what they're worth means that they can still keep the rest of their inventory at a lower total cost, it makes perfect sense to do it.

Unlike the Big East who was out of contract and probably not better than ESPN’s fifth or sixth best option amongst conferences at the time, the ACC actually matters to them.

Lol, the big east was "out of contract" because ESPN lowballed them. Which is exactly what they would be in a position to do to an ACC leftover conference. Fully agree with you that the big east was the "5th or sixth best option" since there were only six BCS automatic qualifier conferences. The other "5th or sixth best option" was the ACC. By cutting the big east and moving schools to the ACC ESPN consolidated the 6 BCS AQ conferences into the five power conferences. The Pac 12 has been eliminated to make it 4 power conferences. By 2036, and probably before, it will only be three power conferences

 

[ElGuapo]

Semi-related, I just did my yearly dance with Xfinity last week to cry poor on their rate increase and was offered a locked price of the same l was paying for 5 years.
And that was after last year’s $30 reduction they gave me when I did my yearly pushback.

The cable companies know what’s coming as do these networks being discussed here.

 

[jostar1]

What needs to happen is for the state to open the check book and buy its ACC seat like SMU

There is not enough support for UConn football in the state for that to happen. Especially while the Big East still exists. The politicians would tell UConn to stay in the Big East and drop football.

 

[Exit 4]

There is not enough support for UConn football in the state for that to happen. Especially while the Big East still exists. The politicians would tell UConn to stay in the Big East and drop football.

Hopefully these fools can see what is happening to the BE right in front of us in 2026. The BB resources gap and inevitable decline is here.

Meanwhile love it or not, pretty much every P4 school has elevated their academic profile the past 20 years and future proofed themselves against the pending demographic cliff. UConn knows this to be the case based on their own BB success.

Its time to step up. There is virtually no other economic development more effective for this state than to get into that club.

But I won't panic about this until around 2028/2030 when the final CRA moves will likely come together.

 

[jostar1]

What needs to happen is for the state to open the check book and buy its ACC seat like SMU

Speaking of SMU, here is an article about how SMU plotted to get into the ACC. It reminds me of how TCU got into the Big 12: forward thinking, a plan, determination and never giving up. It's a long article, but here are a few key paragraphs. What comes across is the sense of urgency. It makes me wonder what UConn does.

"David B. Miller always does things big. He is, after all, a 6-foot-8 former SMU basketball player. He won a SWC championship as a senior in 1972. He became a billionaire through an oil and gas company he co-founded, which he followed by founding a private equity company. He has been an SMU board of trustees member for 16 years and the board’s chair for the last two. He has donated more than $100 million to the university through the business school and other areas. His name is on the basketball court.

SMU is a small private school (around 7,100 undergraduates last year) with a wealthy and proud alumni base. So when Miller and Hart gathered a handful of other millionaire and billionaire alumni to explain how much a power conference move could cost, there wasn’t a hesitation to chip in.

Leaders saw the Big 12, Pac-12 and ACC as possible new homes, and they knew this might be their last chance to pitch the school’s value proposition centered around academics, athletics and access to Dallas. Pretty quickly, SMU sensed that the Big 12 wasn’t very interested.

The school hired former college administrator Oliver Luck (who had assisted the Big 12 in its round of expansion that brought in Houston, Cincinnati, UCF and BYU) as their own consultant and began a three-pronged plan of attack. Hart, Turner, Miller, Luck and a media consultant put together a dashboard of information on schools in the conferences they had targeted: presidents, board chairs, athletic directors, who made the key athletics decisions, how often to contact each person, how to pitch them, which schools would be key votes. They learned how each school worked and how best to make their case.

Hart took the ADs. Turner took the presidents. Miller took the board chairs. Luck facilitated many of the connections, especially for Miller. It helped to have a billionaire. If someone wanted to meet, Miller would jump on his personal plane and visit them the next day. “It’s better than a phone call,” Miller said.

SMU kept raising its offer of how many years it would forgo ACC TV revenue, to seven and then nine.

An ACC straw poll had the three schools one vote short of expansion, as Clemson, Florida State, North Carolina and NC State were against the move. SMU officials knew NC State was the best chance for a flip. Miller called up NC State’s board chair, Ed Weisiger, and pitched him again.

“At another time, I’ll tell you how we got North Carolina State to flip,” Miller teased. “That’s a whole other story.”

How SMU got into the ACC, a three-year sprint to end a three-decade return to the big time

SMU's ACC move is an unprecedented college sports investment from people who have a lot to spend.

www.nytimes.com

 

[uconnyankee]

Depends if you are ESPN and take the top 4 teams that are almost 50% of the TV ratings of the ACC and just let ACC implode and not renew the ACC contract then ESPN would save a significant amount of money. Example there is very limited interest in seeing BC, Wake Forest, and Duke play football. Attendance and TV ratings verify this.

100%.
The moves have always been to flesh out value and leave the ‘laggards’ behind.

Consolidate the money to the schools that bring value.

 

[CL82]

The school hired former college administrator Oliver Luck (who had assisted the Big 12 in its round of expansion that brought in Houston, Cincinnati, UCF and BYU) as their own consultant and began a three-pronged plan of attack. Hart, Turner, Miller, Luck and a media consultant put together a dashboard of information on schools in the conferences they had targeted: presidents, board chairs, athletic directors, who made the key athletics decisions, how often to contact each person, how to pitch them, which schools would be key votes. They learned how each school worked and how best to make their case

Seems like a more intelligent in targeted attack than having piña coladas.

Which gives me a chance to blow the dust off of this:

The Pina Colada Song (UConn version)*

I am tired of our conference, I mean it does kind of suck.
But I don't see a way out, without a whole lotta luck.
How did we get here, when were really hot?
I thought back on how Louisville got the last P5 spot:

Warde had Pina Coladas, while watching girl's basketball.
He did not do any lobbying which is what caused us to fall.
If you like being in a real conference, with teams that you've known for years,
Don't trust the fan of the donuts or you'll end up in tears.

Now I don't blame Suzy, I know it sounds kind of mean,
But I expect that a "rock star" would have known the routine.
Nothing is given, to those who sit back and wait.
And when you think where the blame lies, it's not up for debate...

Warde had Pina Coladas, while watching girl's basketball.
He should have been working, but he was dropping the ball.
So now we're stuck playing Tulsa and likely will be for years.
We trusted the fan of the donuts and it ended in tears.

* Written during the dark days of our membership in the AAC.