OT: - More gripes about WCBB referees | Page 4 | The Boneyard

OT: More gripes about WCBB referees

Status
Not open for further replies.
During the off-season, the NCAA has to have some serious meetings with referees. ALL the referees have to be on the same page. When the NCAA and the referees come to an agreement on what IS a foul, and what is NOT a foul, then more has to be done.
Explanatory videos and detailed info must be sent to all team coaches. If the coaches comply with these new rules, and fully teach them to their players, we should see improvement.
The coaches who do not drill these new rules into their teams will suffer.
If several of their players foul out early in the game, they will eventually abide by the changes which have been made.
 
It was awful. The bad refereeing probably didn't affect the result, but it affected - among other things - the enjoyment of the game, the flow of the game, and the actual details of who scored and who fouled out.
 
Bjbod said:
bustingbrackets.com

Referee defends controversial Caitlin Clark technical foul

Officials addressed a Caitlin Clark technical foul that was handed out late in the national championship game and seemed to swing the results.
bustingbrackets.com bustingbrackets.com

This is pathetic: referee citing the rule book as to why Clark was whistled for technical.
Where's the reference to the rules when it comes to a coach staying on the court the entire game.

NCAA will look the other way.
Expand ...
To make a call like that in those circumstances and in that moment showed an astonishing lack of judgment.

In addition to being an absurd, ridiculous call, however, I don`t see how the referee`s supposed justification of the call makes any sense either under the rule that she has cited.

The rule as quoted requires that the player be "attempting to gain an advantage" by interfering with the ball after a goal or failing to give it to the referee immediately after a blown whistle.

Seems to me that one could only be "attempting to gain an advantage" in a live ball situation - and we have all seen this numerous times, players trying to give their defense a chance to set up usually, and occasionally a delay of game warning is given but it is extremely rare in even that context that a technical is called.

But here, it was a DEAD BALL situation. A foul had been called, and free throws were coming as a result of the foul. There was no conceivable "attempt to gain an advantage" here. As a practical matter, the ball appeared to have gone to a baseline photographer and was promptly returned to the court in any event. But again, what "advantage" could have possibly been gained even if it bounced around for a couple of more seconds?

I am admittedly not familiar with the nuances of the rule and maybe there is a referee or two on the Boneyard who can weigh in on this. But based upon the rule as she has described it in writing, it does not justify what she did. No advantage gained. If she thinks it does justify it, she is worse than I thought.
 
toadfoot said:
Iowa lost for multiple reasons:
1. Officiating was as bad as it could be.
2. Clark is a great player (a healthy Paige is better) but she tried to do too much single handily, made a number of poor decisions and failed to get her teammates involved.
3. Iowa just is not a good defensive team.
4. A couple of LSU players had the greatest performance of their careers and likely will never come close to that again.
Expand ...
I don't really agree with #2. Her passes are phenomenal and she had - if I heard correctly - 7 assists. I might agree she made some bad decisions, but having seen her a number of times this year, there is no location on the floor where she is not open.
 
Aluminny69 said:
Apparently, the names of the three Referees is a well guarded secret. The announcers never mentioned their names. I can't find their names in any box score. I challenge anyone to find out who they were.
Expand ...
Aluminy69- - - The refs listed in the box score on the NCAA site are:
Lisa Jones
Pualani Spurlock-Welsh
Michol Murray

With the NCAA's biggest game of the year they pick 3 refs no one ever heard of!
How do you not pick your BEST refs for the biggest game? Even tho they ALL stink you have refs that have 10+ years experience to chose from!
 
ballerfan said:
I would like to respectfully respond. Fouls make a difference. LSU had to play the second quarter with three starters on the bench.

I didn’t care who won the game. Actually I wanted both teams to lose, but that’s not possible in basketball. So I just sat back and enjoyed the offense of both teams, 50% from the floor for both and 65% and 47% from the three. Millions of TV viewers got to see amazing basketball, showing that WCBB is fun and worth watching.

I agree that the officiating was awful, but (not speaking about you, wyo) I find the « my team was cheated » or « my team lost because of the refs » to be tiring. Iowa lost. LSU played better. It was fun to watch two great teams.

I’m going to think about the UConn men’s game tomorrow and the women’s comeback next year. Bonne nuit, tout le monde.
Expand ...
ballerfan said:
I would like to respectfully respond. Fouls make a difference. LSU had to play the second quarter with three starters on the bench.

I didn’t care who won the game. Actually I wanted both teams to lose, but that’s not possible in basketball. So I just sat back and enjoyed the offense of both teams, 50% from the floor for both and 65% and 47% from the three. Millions of TV viewers got to see amazing basketball, showing that WCBB is fun and worth watching.

I agree that the officiating was awful, but (not speaking about you, wyo) I find the « my team was cheated » or « my team lost because of the refs » to be tiring. Iowa lost. LSU played better. It was fun to watch two great teams.

I’m going to think about the UConn men’s game tomorrow and the women’s comeback next year. Bonne nuit, tout le monde.
Expand ...
Hi ballerfan!
I’m not saying the “team was cheated or lost because of…”, I don’t think that as that would be playing the “if” game. I am merely stating that the level of play might very well have been different.
I cannot predict the outcome of any games based off of “if’s”, but I stand by my statement that “Fouls make a difference in game play—both mentally and physically. If you know you could be on the bench with the slightest action, your style and methodology of game play is stifled.”

Looking forward to the men’s game tomorrow, too! Go UCONN!
 
.-.
If Reese had made a brief gesture towards Clark, I wouldn't have thought much about it. But chasing her around the court for ten or fifteen seconds is way over the line. I also doubt that she cares much about her fellow SEC players at South Carolina. And picking her as MOP over Morris or Carson (or even Clark?!) was a poor choice.
 
RSHERMVIKES said:
Aluminy69- - - The refs listed in the box score on the NCAA site are:
Lisa Jones
Pualani Spurlock-Welsh
Michol Murray

With the NCAA's biggest game of the year they pick 3 refs no one ever heard of!
How do you not pick your BEST refs for the biggest game? Even tho they ALL stink you have refs that have 10+ years experience to chose from!
Expand ...
Spurlock-Welsh did several Connecticut games this year, I'm fairly sure. her name is familiar to me, though not the other two.
 
Like everyone else I would have enjoyed watching battle between LSU and Iowa instead of a battle among the refs for airtime. The refs assigned to the semis did their jobs well. So why weren’t any of them rewarded and assigned to the final? At a minimum, a strong crew chief should have been assigned to reign in the other refs. Apparently there is wide gap (I’m picturing the Grand Canyon here) between the top six floor referees and numbers seven thru nine, or the criteria for referee selection is in need of vast improvement. Why did they save their worst for last?
 
South Florida's coach Jose Fernandez was interviewed about the officiating. He claims that the problem has always been that referees for each conference are represented & they all call games differently. He & several coaches have been lobbying the committee for years to get all conferences to call games the same way. But the stubborn, egotistical officiating coordinators for each conference refuse to change their style.
That might be why the refs weren't advised during halftime to let them play. They were following instructions from their coordinators who probably encouraged them to continue their barrage of whistles.
 
fomalhaut said:
Spurlock-Welsh did several Connecticut games this year, I'm fairly sure. her name is familiar to me, though not the other two.
Expand ...
Yes, Spurlock- Welsh called the UCONN/ South Carolina game this season. She contributed to 43 fouls called in that game.
 
BBallF said:
Maybe if her defense wasn't to just beat Clark up it might have been a different game. The officials were weak, uncertain, and diffident and Mulkey got away with more fouls than are countable by her players on Clark. Shows you why you need a flopping rule in womens basketball. Mulkey has perfected it.
Expand ...
I agree about the flopping, note the "staged" IMO of the Coach's Review, by Kim M.,
on the play by Cinzano. That Player played the hit to her (which did happen, but.)
and Kim Mimicked the same motions on the sidelines... clearly a planned reaction!! Oh Well..
 
.-.
If in a baseball game the coach ran onto the field without a time out and he wasn't thrown out, there would be an uproar (i.e. at times, its seemed that Kim spent more time on the court than in the coaching box). If the umpire changed the strike zone dramatically, it would be on every sports show. Hopefully the growth in TV attendance will motivate the powers at be to work towards inforcement of a more consistent set of women's basketball rules. Shouldn't be one of the top discussion points.
 
Zarathustra said:
Caitlin does her form of showboating to the IOWA fans in the stands. Angel
is the "in your face" type. Angel's use of her tiara is also VERY INTERESTING! IMO
Expand ...
This isn't much better

 
.-.
Most, if not all coaches, step on the court from time to time. Mulkey and Shaka Smart are probably the two that I've noticed that do it a lot, and push the envelope more than others. Being on the court, along with KM's histrionics (taking off and throwing jacket) have been allowed for a long time. So what can be done? If the officials don't give her a warning, and then a technical, the behavior will never change, unless perhaps there's a collision between an opposing player and the coach.

I didn't pay attention to who was reffing the semis, however, wondering if the more "experienced" refs were doing the SC/Iowa game? We'll never know, but imagine if the final was SC/LSU? Woo boy.

My dad, who is not a college hoop fan, texted me during the game yesterday and asked what I thought of the officiating. I said "it @#$%^&* sucks." Also said it set women officials back ten years. I get it, women's tourney, celebration of women, yada yada, however, assuming there needs to be 4 officials for the final 3 games, were there really 12 women refs qualified to officiate this level of play?

This is a bit similar to the conversations in WBB regarding women coaches - yes, players want to see role models, someone that looks like them, however if the pipeline isn't robust enough, then teams end up with coaches that aren't quite ready yet and it's bad for the game.
 
Tonyc said:
We need more consistency in calling games. I watched plenty of WCBB games this season as well as almost every NCAA tourney game. The game today proved that the refs need to work on a few things. Some of the calls were worse then terrible and its not just this game. Most of the games are called differently every time. Lets get it right and lets be consistent in all games.
Expand ...
When the NCAA decided they were going to assign the games to an all-female crew you knew something was going to happen. I watched a ton of women's basketball, and I don't recall an all-female crew. Now I'm not saying that there aren't good female officials, there are and some very good ones, but none of the good ones were at the Final Four.
 
HopJim said:
If in a baseball game the coach ran onto the field without a time out and he wasn't thrown out, there would be an uproar (i.e. at times, its seemed that Kim spent more time on the court than in the coaching box). If the umpire changed the strike zone dramatically, it would be on every sports show. Hopefully the growth in TV attendance will motivate the powers at be to work towards inforcement of a more consistent set of women's basketball rules. Shouldn't be one of the top discussion points.
Expand ...
The officials need to set an example out of her early next season for this. You can't have a coach out on the floor when the opposing team is running their offense.
 
JJTB said:
Interesting that Clark was called twice for fouls she got away with all year…warding off defender with left arm. Of all days to tighten that up!
Expand ...
She was being mugged on every possession just like Lou was for most of the year. It's not basketball. If those restraint of movement fouls were called it would have been a different game. The refs were terrible and Mulkey took full advantage of it. She was 15 feet onto the Court at one point during play and nothing.
 
.-.
RSHERMVIKES said:
Aluminy69- - - The refs listed in the box score on the NCAA site are:
Lisa Jones
Pualani Spurlock-Welsh
Michol Murray

With the NCAA's biggest game of the year they pick 3 refs no one ever heard of!
How do you not pick your BEST refs for the biggest game? Even tho they ALL stink you have refs that have 10+ years experience to chose from!
Expand ...
RSHERMVIKES, Lisa Jones (crew chief of yesterday's championship game) has been working Final Fours since 2008 (12 overall, with 11 on the court and once as the back-up). Yesterday was her fourth championship (2026, 2012, and 2010 being the others).
Jones primarily does PAC-12 games, which might be why she is not familiar to many.

That said, terrible, terrible officiating last night. We shall see if the NCAA does anything during the off-season to minimize the possibility of such a debacle from ever happening again.
 
The 3 refs had their own game plan and they did it well. During the 1st half they made sure that the best players on both team had 2 fouls to make sure their bias did not show. Take nothing away from Carson her 1st half was amazing. But shooting teams are never out of it and when Iowa made their run here was the difference. Reese was allowed to play physical but Cizano was taken out of the game because of playing physical.
 
maple said:
It’s not like Iowa was renowned for their defense coming into the game.
Expand ...
That's true but you are helpless when you can't foul. You don't do anything then. Clark's defense sagged after her second BS foul.
 
BBallF said:
That's true but you are helpless when you can't foul. You don't do anything then. Clark's defense sagged after her second BS foul.
Expand ...
And LSU had three starters sitting on the bench in the first half as well. Both teams were plagued by fouls. It’s not like Iowa was at a significant disadvantage.
 
.-.
Status
Not open for further replies.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,207
Messages
4,556,885
Members
10,442
Latest member
Virginiafan


Top Bottom