More fuel to the fire (re: Griner)

[Icebear]

I don't like the word "sexuality" when discussing being gay because it makes it sound as if being gay is only about sex. Coming out is about being honest and open. How many of you have ever had to go through your life having to calculate every conversation to make sure that you didn't reveal that you were straight. Try going through a day where you can't say "my wife," "my husband," "my girlfriend," "my boyfriend."

You never hear a straight person's "sexuality" used as a phrase to describe them as being straight.

Depends on your work. I deal with the sexuality of straights and gays quite frequently.

You are absolutely right about the freedom that can be experienced in being honest and open. Sadly, there are those who are, also, attacked, harassed and demeaned for attempting to live out that integrity. The pressure on gays who are not out is tremendous. It is one reason that broader acceptance can not come soon enough. No one should have to live in fear for a slip of the tongue revealing who they are.

 

[Icebear]

See now I didn't get that. I saw the booster talking to her girlfriend saying how can make this a good place for her. I think the a lot of animus is assumed...it must have been that way...but I don't see any concrete evidence in BG's statements.

I am confident that have been rough spots for Brittney along the way. For all her enormous talent and ability, I would not trade places with her as I'm sure she has had a very tough road in a society where non-conformity draws scorn. Still, that part of her life is behind her and her future is bright.

One person/booster is not a resolution of animus in a broader community context. I am, also, not going on a single article but the accumulation of comments and material over the past three weeks.

 

[WestHartHusk]

Suggesting BG keep her orientation on the down-low is hardly comparable to the aggresively anti-gay atmosphere fostered by Rene Portland. Such a suggestion of ANY comparable linkage is over the iop vis Kim Mulkey.

Have you ever been asked to keep your sexual orientation on the down-low?

 

[BoatShow]

The more stuff that comes out about her the more she feels like a tragic character like the Hulk or something. I really wish her success and a happy life.

 

[FairView]

Can I become a UCONN fan?

The quote from Griner's dad is very disturbing. I am having a very difficult time liking Mulkey at the moment.

Unfortunately, like Baylor, we have standards – different, but standards nonetheless. Perhaps the Irish would like another fan?

 

[RS9999X]

Keeping sexuality on the down low? Be serious. Business professionalism often requires suitable attire and sticking to the business at hand. No race, religion, or politics or office affairs or using the internet for . Teachers routinely get fired for working as bikini models etc.

 

[DaddyChoc]

We are only getting Griner's side because Mulkey refused to comment. This order makes me sad for BG and I wish she had chosen a program where she would have been more comfortable.

then we would've never had you on the BY gloating about Baylor for the whole 12'-13' season

 

[reno tony]

I believe a University, group of people, club or organization has the right to choose how they want to represent themselves and who they want to represent them. The problem I have with Mulkey is she didn't want Griner to represent Baylor.... she wanted Griner's body but not her spirit to represent Baylor. The Boneyard has been pretty tame compared to some of the other blogs when it came to Griner. I always thought it was just idiots mumbling out loud.

I don't have a problem with Baylor's policy.... that is their right. But for Mulkey to recruit someone who is gay, flies in the face of that policy and maybe that is why she is so mum about Griner.

I have liked Griner because of some articles about her and some interviews she has done and I like her even more now. Reading the article has given me some things to ponder. It sounds like she has her head on squarely and will be just fine with her black lesbian self.

 

[reno tony]

Baylor suspending students appearing in Playboy. Threatened with expulsion if they persist in violating Baylor's moral code publically and evangelizing sin.

BYU has kicked players off football and basketball teams for drinking alcohol and having sex. The school has a code of conduct they take seriously. Some have even been expelled for having sex.

Makes me wonder what they will do with Mulkey for recruiting Griner.

 

[UcMiami]

What? Can they possibly be that stupid?

Yes they can - just like all the athletes who get recruited to BYU. The visit goes off as an orgy of sex and booze, the recruit asks what about this policy - the students and coaches say, no big deal as long as it happens off campus/you don't do it on the dean's desk/whatever. And then when the ink is dry on the LOI the truth comes out. BYU it appears has 'spies' and snitches looking for rules violations, but surprisingly 90% of the students getting 'caught' are black and/or non-mormons.

 

[UcMiami]

BYU has kicked players off football and basketball teams for drinking alcohol and having sex. The school has a code of conduct they take seriously. Some have even been expelled for having sex.

Makes me wonder what they will do with Mulkey for recruiting Griner.

According to an interesting article posted elsewhere re BYU they jave some serious issues about how they administer their honor code discipline.
http://deadspin.com/5791461/the-truth-about-race-religion-and-the-honor-code-at-byu
I find that quite troubling and not something to proud of.

 

[UcMiami]

Do you think all this DRAMA is a good way to promote one self and their career?

How awful could it have been for the four years she endured Kim Mulkey? Victim only goes so far 'til it becomes pathetic.

I am replying to your post specifically but there are a number of posts that question her 'sticking it out' for 4 years in one way or another. My response is ...
I guess you have never been close to or around a codependent or abused spouse. It can take years/decades for someone to break free and some only achieve it in death. BG would appear to be a prime candidate from an emotional and outside support perspective to suffer from at least some of the characteristics of 'codependency'. It is not pretty, certainly not heroic, but also not 'pathetic.'

 

[pinotbear]

I am not one to always assume that if person #1 holds position "A", and if person #2 holds position "B", then the truth must lie halfway in between. There is truth, and there is right & wrong, and sometimes one person's position is accurate and anothers' position is horse manure.

Having said that, I do think that the most accurate assessment of the whole BG/Kim/Baylor brou-ha-ha likely lies somewhere in between the viewpoint that BG was completely taken advantage of/borderline abused and the viewpoint that BG/mom & dad knew damn well what they were getting into, and could have ended it anytime they wanted.

I do not doubt that BG had a very uncomfortable adolescence, and that Baylor preferred that her sexuality be a non-issue. I do not doubt that Baylor took as much advantage as they could have of BG's basketball ability (whether or not KM developed it to its optimal potential is a whole 'nother series of threads.)

But, based on BG's actions on the court, tweeting at halftime, etc., I don't think BG was the easiest player to deal with from a coaching standpoint either. The teens and early twenties are a rebellious/defiant/experimental age for almost everyone - add in BG's life experience where physical intimidation was her most useful tool, and that her sexuality/size/appearance led her to be more defensive/combative within her family and without, well...KM & Baylor weren't exactly dealing with the stereotype "coach's kid" who is eminently coachable and almost instinctive about the game and teamwork.

And, let's not forget all the bagggage that comes with being the #1 high school prospect in the country, where almost nobody tells you anything but how good you are and how badly schools want you. That swells heads - player's, family, and friends. Then, add in the DFW coaching aspect..well, let's just say that nobody got completely screwed in BG's going to Baylor. Everybody got something - BG, KM, Baylor, the AAU coach, BG's folks - out of the deal.

Basicly, I think that nobody can claim too much of the moral high ground in this one - everyone involved accepted some degree of comprimise (sp?) to get something they wanted.

 

[meyers7]

Do you think all this DRAMA is a good way to promote one self and their career?

How awful could it have been for the four years she endured Kim Mulkey? Victim only goes so far 'til it becomes pathetic.

Yea it's not there yet, but I agree it could get there.

 

[easttexastrash]

then we would've never had you on the BY gloating about Baylor for the whole 12'-13' season

Hey, but I stayed around and took my lumps...

 

[meyers7]

I find it very believable that they could be that ignorant, especially considering the timeline. Griner committed to Baylor as a sophomore. Her father did not accept her as a lesbian until after she began attending Baylor. Why would he research Baylor's policies on homosexuality to any great degree? And I wouldn't expect them to have general knowledge about Baylor policies. In their perception Baylor was probably primarily a Texas school that played DI sports in the Big 12, not a religious institution.

If think her father's comments are reflective of a lot of families going through the recruiting process who are making decisions about colleges based on various limited information. These parents and family members never went to college themselves so they have nothing in their own experience to draw from. In many cases haven't traveled very far in their lives and have a more limited knowledge base from which to draw on. At least at this point the family members still don't have computers and internet access sitting at home to research. They have what the college coaches are telling them, what their high school and AAU coaches tell them, what some brochures tell them, and maybe a dog and pony show of a campus visit.

Ok probably more ignorant than stupid, same result though.

 

[easttexastrash]

I think a good point was made. BG's family was not too interested in talking about being gay so they buried their heads in the sand. However, if BG asked Mulkey if being gay was going to be an issue that Mulkey had an obligation to discuss the Code of Coundcut right then and there. There was no grey area for Mulkey and BG trusted that this would not be an issue.

And let's be clear, the issue started when BG sent a tweet to her girlfriend and was asked to delete the tweet. It wasn't as if she was asking to call a press conference to announce that she was gay, she sent a tweet. To say that she wanted to discuss her sexuality makes it sound like she was going to go into a press conference and talk about specific sexual acts and positions she enjoyed.

If a straight player sent a tweet to her boyfriend would she be discussing her "sexuality" by merely send a tweet?

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

For me, the buck stops with University Professors who are responsible for setting the tone and rule regarding University values...surely the isolation of any minority should be front and center for such attention...if not, the buildings of the place are a prison, not a safe harbor of education and acceptance. I can assure you that literally hundreds, indeed thousands, of Profs in our University systems proudly agree with me on this.

The situation at Baylor goes far beyond coaches and players.

 

[meyers7]

well, let's just say that nobody got completely screwed in BG's going to Baylor. Everybody got something - BG, KM, Baylor, the AAU coach, BG's folks - out of the deal.

Basicly, I think that nobody can claim too much of the moral high ground in this one - everyone involved accepted some degree of comprimise (sp?) to get something they wanted.

Very well put.

 

[CL82]

One person/booster is not a resolution of animus in a broader community context. I am, also, not going on a single article but the accumulation of comments and material over the past three weeks.

Ice, I've only read a couple of articles, so maybe I'm not privy to the incidents that you are referencing. From what I've seen, her teammates knew and accepted her sexuality, her coaches knew and accepted it, the boosters knew and accepted it. What else happened?

I fully agree that if Brittney asked if this was an issue, was told no not at all, and then was harassed about it, then there's an big issue here. I just haven't seen anything that indicates that that actually happened.

 

[CL82]

I think a good point was made. BG's family was not too interested in talking about being gay so they buried their heads in the sand. However, if BG asked Mulkey if being gay was going to be an issue that Mulkey had an obligation to discuss the Code of Coundcut right then and there. There was no grey area for Mulkey and BG trusted that this would not be an issue.

And let's be clear, the issue started when BG sent a tweet to her girlfriend and was asked to delete the tweet. It wasn't as if she was asking to call a press conference to announce that she was gay, she sent a tweet. To say that she wanted to discuss her sexuality makes it sound like she was going to go into a press conference and talk about specific sexual acts and positions she enjoyed.

If a straight player sent a tweet to her boyfriend would she be discussing her "sexuality" by merely send a tweet?

Depends on the content doesn't it? I believe UConn has social media rules, probably to avoid this kind of issue.

 

[reno tony]

According to an interesting article posted elsewhere re BYU they jave some serious issues about how they administer their honor code discipline.
http://deadspin.com/5791461/the-truth-about-race-religion-and-the-honor-code-at-byu
I find that quite troubling and not something to proud of.

BYU like other religion based schools have some difficult issues to deal with concerning their staff and students actions. Where they draw the line is a tough decision I'm glad I don't have to make. The Deadspin article, like so many of theirs, was all about racism and less about the honor code. It is unfortunate that the article wasn't by MSNNews or some less race oriented on-line magazine. When I read their articles, it seems to dull the effect because everything is about the white racists. It is unfortunate because when they do have a legitimate point, it blends in with all the other cry-wolf stories and carries less weight than it should. Thanks for the article, it did prompt me to read about five others.

 

[DobbsRover2]

The story is a swirl of many issues involving to a certain extent hypocrisy and accommodation as players, family and school staff all try to work their way through a tough situation bounded by old strictures and new realities.

After getting through some initial feelings of outrage, I still think that the Griner\Baylor story is still one of progress and at least some hope. Changes do not happen overnight (and in this case the far right is very glad of that), but over time there appears to be some good movement toward more openness and communication, even if part of that has to happen post graduation for the players. Battling through hidebound beliefs and old prejudices takes a lot of battles and small victories to get to a fairer and more just society. Long ago a very conservative Baylor developed a stringent set of moral codes for its students that puts homosexuality on the same basis as sex abuse and incest (and unless you are a moral twit please don't feed the crap about that it's okay to be gay unless you act gay), and the university is not going to immediately ditch that code though it appears to be taking very gradual steps to open up and distance itself a bit from the strictures. Some would hope for far faster changes by Baylor, but in the meantime the Bear's somewhat begrudgingly donning the helm as "America's new lesbian school for women's BB players" is a step in the right direction.

 

[RS9999X]

Griner was abused at Baylor?

How Pathetic.

When Griner says she was abused I'll believe it. I can imagine the ESPN article if one of you liking or claiming she was abused wrote it. BG's entire 4 years turned to torment and abuse and trauma. Griner's on court aggression is part of that trauma and entirely excusable, etc.

Yes she should sue for reparations and distress and trauma. Why don't some of you file a lawsuit on her behalf. Obviously the poor tormented loser is too dumb to do it on her own behalf.

For shame. Griner was able to handle her "tragic sexuality" like an adult. That's the real lesson here.

 

[DobbsRover2]

Griner was abused at Baylor?

For shame. Griner was able to handle her "tragic sexuality" like an adult. That's the real lesson here.

Wow, this appears to be your own reference to Griner's situation since it does not appear in any story, and the term is used more in relation to vampires or suicide cases.

That she was able to handle like an adult her gay life style under some pressure at Baylor is certainly something to congratulate her for, even if it involved a certain amount of "keeping things under cover" and playing along with hypocritical conduct and antiquated rules. What is not commendable is to have moral shills labeling gay conduct as "tragic" on sports forums, though I have to say the bile does gets spewed pretty frequently on them. If you don't approve of gay conduct, that's your choice, but tossing out the labels shows the void in your own soul.