Men's CBB corruption thread

[oldude]

Sounds like Coach 2 can be fired for cause. Pitino's lawyer will find it difficult to collect the $44 million he claims is owed to his client.

 

[Hoopz]

Can someone explain to me why Pitino seems to be is the only head coach being fired, while the HCs of all the other named schools are barely even being mentioned?

Pitino is directly linked as a participant in the scandal. Other coaches involved are assistants so far. He is ‘Coach 2’ in the documents.

Source: Pitino is 'Coach-2' in federal complaint

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

You missed one of my points. Duke's coach has never been associated with cheating because the NCAA chose to look away. You see where I wrote about Quinn Snyder? He was an assistant at Duke and noticed cheating going on and so he did the same things when he was the head coach at Missouri U. He admitted it and the NCAA did not investigate. Why? Because Duke is one of their big money makers.

That never happened. Literally never happened. Quin was in trouble for what he chose to do as the head coach Missouri. I can tell you, Coach K would NEVER have tolerated what Quin did. I was at Duke from 1997 until 2000, during the last few years of Quin's tenure as an assistant coach. I also lived in the same small apartment building as three basketball players, all upperclassmen (side note...of the three, one of them did not have a car, the second drove an old, beatup pickup truck that belonged to his parents, and the third drove an older model jeep).

Anecdote
I can tell you this. Duke takes compliance VERY seriously. One of my closest friends is a HUGE donor to Duke - he and his wife gave the naming rights for one of the assistant coaches' offices. Years ago, they were hosting a Duke alumni event at which time a then- current Duke basketball player attended (he was in town).

At the event, the Duke basketball player did NOT eat or drink. When my friend and his wife asked if something was wrong, he said he could not do so, because it might be considered an improper benefit. My friend called the Duke compliance office, which confirmed what the player said.

So may friend and his wife asked if they could give the player player bottled water. The Duke compliance office said no. My friend asked if the player could give money for the bottled water ($1.75 or whatever). Duke compliance said there was no independent way to verify that the full amount would be paid to make sure it did not constitute an impermissible benefit.

Finally, Duke compliance consented to allow the player to have unfiltered tap water at my friend's home (again, where the event was). As some of you may know, tap water in Arizona is....to put it mildly, awful (it has a lot of chlorine and dissolved materials in it; I always have my Brita ready to go).

It is a relatively small example, but it highlights and demonstrates the importance with which Duke takes compliance.

As for Duke being one of the big money makers, remember that the NCAA went after Kansas and Kentucky in the late 1980s, UCLA in the 1990s, etc. Those are part of the blueblood programs/legendary programs.

 

[Husky1964]

A posting on the Men's board threw out the claim that Asia Durr received $$ to attend Louisville. May have been flippant. No one responded.

 

[augustaTC]

Oldude gave a good explanation. Louisville has taken the initiative so far. A smart move on their part before the NCAA brings down the hammer. I'll give their interm president credit for moving quickly on this.

As to sanctions by Emmert and the NCAA as to programs and players, don't expect anything any time soon. They don't dare open their mouths at this point.

Beginning with UConn, virtually every university where Emmert worked has had a scandal he was associated with - he's just a master of moving on before the hits the fan and deflecting responsibility elsewhere. Would make a great used car salesman.

 

[donalddoowop]

That never happened. Literally never happened. Quin was in trouble for what he chose to do as the head coach Missouri. I can tell you, Coach K would NEVER have tolerated what Quin did. I was at Duke from 1997 until 2000, during the last few years of Quin's tenure as an assistant coach. I also lived in the same small apartment building as three basketball players, all upperclassmen (side note...of the three, one of them did not have a car, the second drove an old, beatup pickup truck that belonged to his parents, and the third drove an older model jeep).

Anecdote
I can tell you this. Duke takes compliance VERY seriously. One of my closest friends is a HUGE donor to Duke - he and his wife gave the naming rights for one of the assistant coaches' offices. Years ago, they were hosting a Duke alumni event at which time a then- current Duke basketball player attended (he was in town).

At the event, the Duke basketball player did NOT eat or drink. When my friend and his wife asked if something was wrong, he said he could not do so, because it might be considered an improper benefit. My friend called the Duke compliance office, which confirmed what the player said.

So may friend and his wife asked if they could give the player player bottled water. The Duke compliance office said no. My friend asked if the player could give money for the bottled water ($1.75 or whatever). Duke compliance said there was no independent way to verify that the full amount would be paid to make sure it did not constitute an impermissible benefit.

Finally, Duke compliance consented to allow the player to have unfiltered tap water at my friend's home (again, where the event was). As some of you may know, tap water in Arizona is....to put it mildly, awful (it has a lot of chlorine and dissolved materials in it; I always have my Brita ready to go).

It is a relatively small example, but it highlights and demonstrates the importance with which Duke takes compliance.

As for Duke being one of the big money makers, remember that the NCAA went after Kansas and Kentucky in the late 1980s, UCLA in the 1990s, etc. Those are part of the blueblood programs/legendary programs.

I don't know what happened at Duke while Snyder was there. I am saying what Snyder told the media in St. Louis and Columbia. I would think he would know better than you do because he observed it. You Duke fans think Coach K and Duke can do no wrong. You are speaking of one instance. I don't know why Snyder would say that about Duke if it did not happen while he was there. In the 1990's UCLA was no longer the BIG name it once was. I already spoke of what happened with Kentucky and that happened only after an envelope filled with cash was discovered and the NCAA had no choice but to punish Kentucky. Kentucky and Kansas went through went some lean years and that is when the NCAA went after them. They were not the money makers they had been. Think what you want to think but I was following some of this stuff since the 1960's and I know what was reported by the media.

 

[huskymedic]

Has the University of Miami been implicated in this particular scandal? I see Louisville (not named specifically), Oklahoma State, Auburn, Arizona and USC & South Carolina via previous employment of OSU assistant coach. Keep in mind that Miami is a private university.

Here are the implications for Miami (aka University-7) from the FBI’s bribery probe

 

[Charliebball]

 

[Charliebball]

 

[Charliebball]

Rick Pitino couldn't talk his way out of this scandal

 

[eebmg]

Does the FBI really have a better record than Geno? Are there stats to back this up?

 

[HoopsFan21]

Does the FBI really have a better record than Geno? Are there stats to back this up?

Technically it's not the FBI that would have the record, it would be the U.S. attorneys, and I would think winning 87% of their cases would be pretty high.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Rick Pitino couldn't talk his way out of this scandal

Yeah, but he's still trying. Oh, that yammering is necessary to his pursuit of $44 million in severance, which is necessary to his taking 22 million not to name names. What is necessary to all this occurring: no federal indictment. This could happen. He has always been the master of greasy, slippery escape from his perpetual cheating. Of course, there is that trist on a table he got nailed ... er, bad choice of words ... caught on.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

“I would say pretty much everyone knows it goes on,” Vital said. “It’s just one of those things — who’s gonna get caught, or who’s gonna get called out on it? But you can go back pretty much to when AAU first started or college basketball first started — if you’re good enough, people are gonna pay to get you. That’s how I look at it. I think it’s just an unfortunate situation."

UConn players, coaches react to scandal that’s rocked college basketball world

 

[flncfan]

Muffet said it’s cheating going on in the women’s game too and if you google Geno’s name the article pops up. Why? Most likely jealously. Anyways I feel the real cheating in Women’s Basketball is happening at Texas because of the whole Charli Collier situation. Her statement sounded a bit fishy to me. Karen Aston and Tina Thompson are up to no good over there. That’s why Geno recommended SMU to hire Travis Mays (Geno knows he’s a good person) before that program gets caught.

 

[eebmg]

Yeah, but he's still trying. Oh, that yammering is necessary to his pursuit of $44 million in severance, which is necessary to his taking 22 million not to name names. What is necessary to all this occurring: no federal indictment. This could happen. He has always been the master of greasy, slippery escape from his perpetual cheating. Of course, there is that trist on a table he got nailed ... er, bad choice of words ... caught on.

Call me naive but I think the scandal stops at Pitino. They got rid of the AD and why would he involve anyone higher up the food chain in these schemes (The president?) and no one else cares (or should care) if he names others that are complicit. I do not see where he has any leverage to get any of that money.

 

[CocoHusky]

Call me naive but I think the scandal stops at Pitino. They got rid of the AD and why would he involve anyone higher up the food chain in these schemes (The president?) and no one else cares (or should care) if he names others that are complicit. I do not see where he has any leverage to get any of that money.

There was an ESPN report that stated that both Bobby Petrino and "likely" Pitino had stipulations in their contracts that the buyout amount would change drastically contingent on Tom Jurich remaining the AD.

 

[CocoHusky]

Muffet said it’s cheating going on in the women’s game too and if you google Geno’s name the article pops up. Why? Most likely jealously. Anyways I feel the real cheating in Women’s Basketball is happening at Texas because of the whole Charli Collier situation. Her statement sounded a bit fishy to me. Karen Aston and Tina Thompson are up to no good over there. That’s why Geno recommended SMU to hire Travis Mays (Geno knows he’s a good person) before that program gets caught.

Your are right, sounds very fishy that Karen and Tina are up to no good at Texas and Geno recommends Travis for SMU.

 

[dwalks93]

It is a relatively small example, but it highlights and demonstrates the importance with which Duke takes compliance.

As for Duke being one of the big money makers, remember that the NCAA went after Kansas and Kentucky in the late 1980s, UCLA in the 1990s, etc. Those are part of the blueblood programs/legendary programs.

Just stop now....

Its already been proven Louisville and Miami were paying 6 figure money for 5* players. The kind of players who are one and done material for the NBA. The kind of players Duke stocks its roster with every year.

Duke/Kentucky/Kansas have become the main purveyors of the 5* one and done players. Do you think a 5* top 10 ten player passes up $150,000 offer from Louisville to go to Duke for nothing? Now multiply that by the 4 or 5 potential one and done players Duke recruits every year. This is a "bird in hand" generation and none of the 5* kids are planning on graduating. Before this is said and done a lot of schools are going to get dragged into it. Particularly the school who have consistently drawn the "can't miss" one and done pro players.

No one wants to believe their school is involved. But when the whole system is corrupt, its either join it or lose on the court. I'd be very careful about proclaiming my schools innocence. As a UConn fan I am concerned....if I was a Duke fan I'd be even more so.

 

[CocoHusky]

In the 1990's UCLA was no longer the BIG name it once was.

In 1995 UCLA won's it's eleventh National Championship the first since 1974-75 season. UCLA very much a big Name in the 1990's and no one has ever been the "BIG" name UCLA once was.

 

[CocoHusky]

Do you think a 5* top 10 ten player passes up $150,000 offer from Louisville to go to Duke for nothing?

I do not believe that Duke is out their offering money to recruits the same way that Louisville has been doing.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

'Roughly 30 years ago, Sonny Vaccaro, Nike’s first great peddler of high school and college basketball influence — he’d later bring his expertise to Adidas — said, “It’s a cesspool, and we start the process.”

http://nypost.com/2017/09/28/too-mu..._content=20170929&mpweb=755-4636263-719293442

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Call me naive but I think the scandal stops at Pitino. They got rid of the AD and why would he involve anyone higher up the food chain in these schemes (The president?) and no one else cares (or should care) if he names others that are complicit. I do not see where he has any leverage to get any of that money.

Hope you are right.

 

[CocoHusky]

I am saying what Snyder told the media in St. Louis and Columbia. I would think he would know better than you do because he observed it. You Duke fans think Coach K and Duke can do no wrong. I don't know why Snyder would say that about Duke if it did not happen while he was there. Think what you want to think but I was following some of this stuff since the 1960's and I know what was reported by the media.

Quin was at Missouri from 1999-2006, Something reported to the media in that time frame is probably a few google clicks away. What was it that Quin said?
If your theory is that Quin saw recruiting violations at Duke learned from them and replicated them at Missouri, I'm not buying it. Quinn was also an assistant coach in the NBA before he was an assistant at Duke.

 

[dwalks93]

I do not believe that Duke is out their offering money to recruits the same way that Louisville has been doing.

You are certainly entitled to your beliefs...perhaps it is correct. But I'd say the best opinions are formed by the facts we know.

What we know is the money being paid to the UL players was not coming directly from Louisville but from Adidas. This is because Adidas wanted the marketing for its brand and it benefited Adidas to have its brand worn by the best players on the biggest stages at the premier programs.

It also states in the FBI affidavit, during a recorded conversation with Adidas executives, a University of Miami recruit's payment offer was being raised since an "unnamed" apparel competitor was coming in at a higher offer. This unnamed apparel company is likely Nike which is also supported by the FBI subpoena issued on Nike AAU the following day.

What are Nike's biggest college brands in men's basketball? What programs would Nike most like to have wear their apparel? What players are most likely to go to the NBA and wear Nike products at the next level? Why would Nike hurt itself by paying players to go to schools that weren't its best marketing options?

Bottom line...nothing indicates this was a pure Louisville issue. This is starting to sound more like an industry practice involving multiple shoe companies. The better question is which programs have benefited the most under the current system.