McGraw on Loyd

[triaddukefan]

She just lost her best chance for another championship in the near future. Things may change in a few years if Geno retires, or the P5 succeeds in marginalizing UConn in scheduling.

What about 2017 ?

 

[JS]

I didn't like the "we didn't have a chance to talk her out of it". Maybe a poor choice of words. That sounds too much like being more concerned about losing Loyd then what may be best for her or make her happiest.

When I heard that I thought: "She's thinking about Reimer" -- where they did have the chance to talk Taya through whatever caused her briefly to leave the team.

 

[MilfordHusky]

To break the news an hour after the final is pretty harsh. I feel like each of them may end up wishing they had handled it differently.

I agree with your second sentence, but circumstances dictated the timing. I can see Jewell not wanting to tell the coaches or players while they were still competing in the tourney, and she had to declare for the draft only a day or two after the title game.

I was shocked at Muffett's statements. They make me wonder about her communication with the players. It's NOT a bad decision for Jewell. It may not be the best decision, but it's her choice and there are several positives to it.

Yes, I'd say that Jewell was the best player in ND history, edging Skylar. Brianna Turner may surpass her, though.

 

[j66kicker]

I suspect some of Muffet's bitterness comes from embarrassment that she was not more in tune with her star player. Between this and the Reimer episode earlier in the year it would appear Muffet doesn't have the pulse of her key players, nor is she apparently a trusted career mentor in the way that the great men's coaches are in the current 'one and done' era.

 

[j66kicker]

When it will look like a bad decision is if Loyd falls below the third pick.

I don't see any chance of that happening. She is money. Who are 3 players in the draft better than Loyd?

 

[Jronp]

It's clear now why she left! When a coach responds like that, it's an indication how the relationship was between the two. Say what you want...that was classless!

 

[MilfordHusky]

I don't see any chance of that happening. She is money. Who are 3 players in the draft better than Loyd?

I think Jewell will be 1, 2, or 3. Next year, she would have been 2 at best.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

I personally don't agree with the comments The Muffett made in this interview, especially the "didn't have a chance to talk Jewell out of it paraphrase)!" I think the whole timing issue was a factor. Jewell had to declare by the next day to be eligible for the draft so she would have to tell ND that night after the UCONN game! Where I think Jewell made her biggest mistake was going to the coaching staff earlier and saying I know I could leave early because I'm 22 but I've decided to stay! Then to turn around and say I'm declaring for the WNBA Draft tomorrow! The same result but not the betrayal angle of NO then YES!
Jewell will get the $50,000 from the WNBA and she'll get in the $200,000 to $250,000 range maybe more from a foreign team! This is why I say Morgan Tuck will stay for her RS year she would not command that type of money off of 2 possible years! For Morgan there is NO reason to leave!
And really people isn't there a holier than thou attitude here? If Stewie or MoJeff were in the 22 year old situation that Jewell is in and either/or both of them declared for the WNBA Draft THE BONEYARD would be ablaze with, "How could she/they, do that?" "Don't they have any loyalty to Geno, the staff and their team mates?" The large majority of BYers would go insane against them! We have people insulting a player after a dismal performance, let alone to leave early for the pros!
I do agree I think this Jewell Loyd story is a bad move all the way around, but that's the way things work in 2015!

 

[Bigpetunia]

I do not concur with many of my fellow Boneyarders here....I think that Muffett sounded neither bitter nor whiny. I think she sounded exactly the same way I sounded when I first heard this news....shocked! I imagine that she remains shocked, as do I. I think that what she did have to say sounded pretty well-reasoned. The fact is that the financial inducements for any young woman to sacrifice her Senior year of eligibility and her college diploma rather than wait a mere 365 days are insufficient to justify the decision; and any right-minded coach, one who also serves as a kind of personal adviser and counselor to his or her players, would want an opportunity to try to dissuade a 21 year-old kid from making a decision she might later regret...I certainly would. This is in no way analogous to the EDD decision to depart early. Elena was simply a homesick child. This is manifestly an ill-advised and impetuous thing for Jewell to have done...just like a lot of ill-advised and impetuous ideas that I contemplated at that age!

 

[hoophuskee]

She definitely seems bitter. Can't blame her though--tough pill to swallow an hour after the NCAA Championship game after Loyd said she was returning. Maybe she turned away some talented recruits that she would have offered had she known Loyd was leaving, or maybe she felt that Loyd didn't give it her all the last part of the season. Really tough for McGraw considering that Loyd previously told her she would be returning, and Notre Dame was projected to have arguably their best team of all time next year with Loyd as the centerpiece.

I've posted this a couple of places--I still am in the camp that this could potentially benefit Notre Dame down the road. Even with Loyd, UCONN is still the overwhelming favorite to win a title next year. Once Jefferson/Stewart graduate, the door opens for other teams. Notre Dame has a full year to get used to life without Loyd and should come out guns blazing in 2016-17 with all of their top players returning. Even without Jewell, they are still a Final Four team next year and have two really good recruiting classes lined up.

There is no way this is a blessing. They are going to be a brutal team to beat two years from now whether she stayed or not.

 

[Cuango]

I do not concur with many of my fellow Boneyarders here....I think that Muffett sounded neither bitter nor whiny. I think she sounded exactly the same way I sounded when I first heard this news....shocked! I imagine that she remains shocked, as do I. I think that what she did have to say sounded pretty well-reasoned. The fact is that the financial inducements for any young woman to sacrifice her Senior year of eligibility and her college diploma rather than wait a mere 365 days are insufficient to justify the decision; and any right-minded coach, one who also serves as a kind of personal adviser and counselor to his or her players, would want an opportunity to try to dissuade a 21 year-old kid from making a decision she might later regret...I certainly would. This is in no way analogous to the EDD decision to depart early. Elena was simply a homesick child. This is manifestly an ill-advised and impetuous thing for Jewell to have done...just like a lot of ill-advised and impetuous ideas that I contemplated at that age!

I also think that the board as a whole is being way too harsh on Muffet. While I am not a Muffet fan, I think she has every right to be upset that Jewell blindsided her with something that she had been told (by Jewell herself), was settled,ie, she was staying! Furthermore, I am also surprised that most here believe Loyd's decision to be the right one. I do not! I think Loyd may have been angry at some comments by Muffet that she (Loyd) may have felt were tantamount to being thrown under the bus for not performing better in the NC game. I remember thinking as I read Muffet's comments, that she should have phrased them a little differently, as they could easily be construed as critical toward Loyd. Obviously, I may be completely wrong about this but I do believe those comments by Muffet may have been the straw that broke the camels back. Finally, while I disagree with the majority opinion that Muffet is being out of line in being upset and critical of Loyd's decision, I completely agree with those who said it was a mistake to air those comments in public. A high profile coach like McGraw should have better control over herself than what we have seen,and heard for the past two years!

 

[rford53]

Traditionally coaches have accompanied players to the WNBA draft. It will be telling if Muffet is or isn't at Mohegan Sun Thursday night.

 

[ladybears4eva]

Lol muffed out. She is out of touch and reactionary towards her players.
There should've been more conversations about this draft possibility prior to this year, initiated by the coaching staff. It's not notre dames choice, but rather the individual players by deadline.

Muffet should not comment on players decision to become professionals, but rather support them unconditionally.

 

[HuskyNan]

Sorry, but I remember when EDD left UConn in the middle of the night, two days after arriving on campus.. No warning. When Geno was interviewed, he also seemed confused, possibly bitter. Many UConn fans were bitter at the time, a few still are. It's a very similar situation. I would cut Muffett some slack.

ETA: Well, based on this article, I guess I misremembered. This is how Geno handled the EDD situation:

Nation's top recruit Delle Donne withdraws from UConn

Could not find any article from closer to when she left.

That was actually one of Geno's shining moments. Immediately after Elena left, Geno said she went home to "take care of some things" and that "it happens all the time", probably meaning that kids get cold feet and need to resettle. When it was clear that Elena would be leaving, Geno immediately waived any restrictions on her transferring and wished her well, publicly and privately. Both Elena and her dad Ernie were effusive in their praise and appreciation to Geno and UConn for being supportive and understanding.

I have no comment on Muffet because 1. just because I might handle it differently doesn't mean it was wrong and 2. we don't have the context of this interview - was she chased down and hounded for a comment? One poster above had a good point - Muffet might have passed on recruiting someone that plays the same position as Jewel and now she's SOL. Geno got quite testy when Liz Sherwood left UConn for the same reason. And all of this took place just days after ND lost the NC game, one that looked to be surprisingly within reach with 5 minutes left in the game. Heck, I'd be testy, too.

 

[trisailin]

I seem to remember just a couple weeks ago statements by both Muffet and the school that Lloyd was staying. Apparently there HAD been conversations with some sort of assurances.
For all of the people casting stones, how would you react if you were lied to at worst or completely misled?
NONE of us know what really happened.

 

[TDiNozzo]

I can't make a judgement about McGraw's interview. Your listening to answers to many questions pieced together, from a few reporters, (more than one mike there) without hearing what was asked. A question could have been asked about "talking her out of her decision"...so she answers "talking her out of her decision".

If she thinks it's wrong for women's basketball, why not try to change her mind? So no, she didn't have a chance to talk her out of it. McGraw just came in second again, missing a coaches big prize, probably missed out on a nice paycheck, and gets more bad news, at a time when a good sitdown chat wasn't likely..

 

[Deadrody]

Jewel made a bad decision for Muffet, the article doesn't mention that. The young lady can always go back for her degree. The window to make good money as a WBB player is even smaller than that for a MBB player.

Good decision for Jewel that could have gone either way. Bad decision for Muffet no matter how you slice it.

Eh. That reasoning makes a lot of sense for the men that leave early because they can make millions so PAYING to go back to college is not really a concern. Lloyd just gave up a full ride. Considering she won't make a ton of money in the WNBA, that full ride is no small potatoes.

 

[Rb335]

I think that this situation is far different than EDD mainly in the fact that she never suited up for the team and was also joining a team featuring two NPOY talents. I think of it this way:

If ND had come surging back and stole the championship this year, and stewie (hypothetically eligible) decided to walk away and enter the draft in a blindside, Geno would have been bitter. I think the situation is different when you have formed a three year relationship, presumably longer with recruiting, and this person has given so much to the program. Muffet is sure to be thankful for the contributions Jewell made, but is definitely disappointed. I think it also hurts to know that your chances of an elusive championship essentially decreased dramatically. If Stewart were to have done the same, our chances next year would be far less.

Its difficult to predict how people handle situations and everyone does so differently. Not to defend Muffet, but this is a tough situation for any coach and I really think she is looking at Jewell from a maternal perspective.

My personal opinion, I'm disappointed to see her go because she brings a lot of excitement to the college level, but I'm really excited to see her playing in the league, especially with players like Taurasi and Parker taking some time off.

 

[tonehill68]

It's clear now why she left! When a coach responds like that, it's an indication how the relationship was between the two. Say what you want...that was classless!

I think she feels like she was cheated out of talking to Loyd about her decision. She mentioned that She found out Loyd made her decision a couple of weeks ago and was blindsided with her decision as opposed to talking with her, which makes sense. Although I won't shed atear for the ND program, I understand why Muffett would feel and sound like she did in that interview.

 

[mrmojack]

I think Muffet really thought she had a chance to dethrone Uconn next year with
Jewel. They have 3 nice guards coming in next year. Maybe Jewel didn't want to
finish the way Skylar Diggins did. Getting beat by the same team 3 yrs in a row
really sucks. She will sign on with Rock Nation and make some cash like Skylar
did. Whats wrong with that. A coach can up and leave a program when ever they
see more $ but a student athlete has to stay an endure a new coaching staff and style
that they didn't sign on for. That's life I guess.

 

[huskeynut]

I'm not upset with Muffet's responses in the pieced together video. Her best player blind sided her. Muffet's reaction/ words are normal and to be expected.

As to Loyd, I wish her well and hope she returns to ND to finish her degree.

 

[wire chief]

I don't get the problem of the "hour after the final". The season is over, and now the coach and team have months to regroup
for the next season knowing what they know. Emphasizing the "low" salary in the WNBA is so misleading, when it covers a small part of the whole year, with other opportunities thereafter. That she is the same age as those finishing their senior year may have been a factor
for her also. It seems like hubris to predict her dire future.

 

[uconnfan68]

What about 2017 ?

She would have had to replace Loyd then. Not an easy task.

 

[OldAlum]

While I understand Muffet's feelings, I think it was a mistake to express them publicly the way that she did. A simple "No, I didn't know and wish she had discussed it with me first. I'm not sure it is the right move for her but I wish her well and thank her for all she has done for ND" would have put her and the program in a better light.

If I were a recruit, I would be a bit concerned about the atmosphere at ND after hearing about one player leaving the team for a while and another ending her ND career without apparently feeling comfortable enough to talk to the coaching staff.

 

[msf22b]

I suspect some of Muffet's bitterness comes from embarrassment that she was not more in tune with her star player. Between this and the Reimer episode earlier in the year it would appear Muffet doesn't have the pulse of her key players, nor is she apparently a trusted career mentor in the way that the great men's coaches are in the current 'one and done' era.

I agree.

Although being completely sympathetic and non-judgemental about her remarks (in the other thread),
there is surely some disconnect between the staff and the team now that two star players have opted to leave during the same season (one changed her mind).
Or is it possible that campus life there is not quite as bucolic as it is cranked up to be.

I haven't seen many reactions from former teammates…Achonwa seemed understanding, Devereaux Peters most surely not.

 

[Waquoit]

Muffet was so mouthy about being classy last year, one would think she would have taken the classy road here. Loyd owes her nothing.

 

[Jeff H]

It's easy to understand how Muffet feels, but as a high school coach who has good players either transfer to another school or just decide not to play, I just think ther's nothing to do, but wish them well and move on. I have never tried to talk them into changing their mind or made them feel bad about leaving. That being said the stakes are different and I don't have reporters chasing me around for comments.

 

[UcMiami]

Well - I'll just relate something from my father - he had the option to complete his college degree in 3 years and took it. For as long as I can remember he said it was the worst decision he made in his life. He did go on to post grad degrees, but he really felt he had short changed himself (and he wasn't on scholarship but paying the bill himself.) That attitude regarding the value of education is something ingrained in people who work at universities and at all levels of teaching from kindergarten on. Men's coaches in MBB and FB, with the requirement to win at all costs to maintain employment, have become inured to that because for their stars, if they have them for two years in BB and 3 years in FB they consider it a victory (and if they actual attend classes and complete course work!) Women's coaches have not had to deal with that pressure to succeed to the same degree, nor with the attrition rate that has become a fact of life on the men's side.

And if you want Geno's feelings on education - DT was banned from returning to Uconn for practice or to hang out until she completed her course work and got her degree. I have no idea of what Geno's public reaction would be if a player left after only three years, but I am pretty sure his private reaction would be unprintable. I suspect his public reaction would be, like most of his public statements, pretty brutally honest.

Add into the equation a meeting 3 weeks or a month prior to the NC game in which the opposite choice was reportedly stated, the then public statements based on that meeting made by both Muffet and an ND administration figure, and being a little less than pleased in public statements is not surprising.

This really is not men's sports - the $ is not the same, and the academic integrity of women's athletes tends to be higher than for men. And all women's athletes except the absolute top end face the requirement of earning a living for 30+/- years at the end of their playing careers. And success in the college game is no guarantee of success in the pros - there have been a number of fizzled careers of high draft picks. Every year a new crop of talent becomes available and jobs are not that plentiful in any sport. And completing a year of college while playing 12 months a year to earn that $200+K salary leaves little time for the coursework.

People forget that the men's players that leave used to be referred to as 'hardship' cases (not sure if that language is still in the rules.) If Jewel's decision is truly a 'hardship' case, then I have no problem with it. but unless the hardship appeared in the last 4 weeks, the earlier 'reported' meeting seems disingenuous.

And I have no problem with Muffet's reaction - I do not remember what CViv's reaction was when her player left a year early, but don't think it was laughs and giggles. As I recall she was pretty annoyed. This was not a press release that can be carefully worded and sanitized, this was a live mike in an informal setting and off the cuff. And it may not have been PC, but it was honest.

 

[HGN]

I think it was disappointment from both sides.....Jewell making the decision 1-hour after the NC loss ; and Muffet simply because of the loss of a key player. Both were hurt and disappointed. People say things when they are hurting. I would have liked to have seen her stay and complete her Degree and play another year but its her decision and I hope she is making a good one.

I wish her the Best.

 

[Striper69]

When it will look like a bad decision is if Loyd falls below the third pick.

Don't worry about that...

not that it makes any difference in the WNBA.