Maya, DT, Sue, Tina, et al and regret! | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Maya, DT, Sue, Tina, et al and regret!

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CocoHusky

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It was 23.5, I thought it said 25, but close enough! A mere 1.5 doesn't make that big of a difference. Why all the combinations? Should have been just KF, right? MJ, needs no help.
You are killing me and not Reppin Philly very well.
In those FF games Skylar and Kelly were Sophomores and Juniors. Although they were both starters neither was THE WOMAN! Novasel & Mallory of ND drew much concern as did someone else hopefully you
have heard off-Maya Moore?
 
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You are killing me and not Reppin Philly very well.
In those FF games Skylar and Kelly were Sophomores and Juniors. Although they were both starters neither was THE WOMAN! Novasel & Mallory of ND drew much concern as did someone else hopefully you
have heard off-Maya Moore?
Skylar and Kelly as Sophomores and Juniors were damn good players, so, I don't see your point. I think scoring 28 points in the FF, as a SOPHOMORE, means you ARE THE woman. See BS in video replay you so graciously posted. KF, played a much better game than MJ but MJ's defense on SD was better, regardless of the amount of minutes. Kelly couldn't stop SD from getting by her. MJ's man to man defense, on SD, in this game was better, imho. KF played a much better game. She blocked shots, rebounded the ball, got steals and was totally disruptive, OK. Leave the reppin to the children. Besides, I watch all major sports, except the NBA and MLB, unless Philly is in the playoffs. Which is rare these days. Plus, until now I've spent a lot of time out of the country. Now that I am retired, from one of my jobs, I'll spend more time watching UCONN games, I will even try to attend a few.
 

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Stewie had the ultimate supporting cast. Without Mo and Tuck, we don't win 4.
I remember Mo's defense of Diggins in the tournament, took her completely out of the game. Mo also put the clamps on Jewel, when it counted. Morgan, with her steady play, was invaluable to our success. Stewie is the Greatest but she also had the GREATEST supporting cast in NCAA history.

Ding - Ding - Ding - Ding!!! Bingo! you hit the nail on the head. As great as Stewie is, she could not have done it alone. Stewie had not 1, but 2 All-Americans backing her play.

That's why Their USA team got beat last summer. The other girls on the team deferred to Mo and her, but they couldn't pull it off. All of the greats down through the years had a Robin/Tonto: Michael had Scottie, Magic had Kareem, Russell had K.C. Jones and Sam Jones, Bird had Robert Parish and Kevin McHale and Kobi had Shaq, or Shaq had Kobi depending on which one of them is talking. In her 4 years at UConn, as great as she was, I never saw Stewie pass to herself.
 
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Ding - Ding - Ding - Ding!!! Bingo! you hit the nail on the head. As great as Stewie is, she could not have done it alone. Stewie had not 1, but 2 All-Americans backing her play.

That's why Their USA team got beat last summer. The other girls on the team deferred to Mo and her, but they couldn't pull it off. All of the greats down through the years had a Robin/Tonto: Michael had Scottie, Magic had Kareem, Russell had K.C. Jones and Sam Jones, Bird had Robert Parish and Kevin McHale and Kobi had Shaq, or Shaq had Kobi depending on which one of them is talking. In her 4 years at UConn, as great as she was, I never saw Stewie pass to herself.
Stewie, MJ and MT are the greatest trio in NCAA history, throw in KLS and KN and you have the greatest team of all time!
 

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Some people act as if Barbara Turner and Ann Strother were not good players. Mind you one was 5 star and the other a 4 star. And Moore and other girl were great rebounders. So D also had a good supporting cast as well. Greater than Maya had in her senior year.

Please get it right and stop belittling the others or the players who were just considered role models with D. They were better than many are alleging.

Ann S. was a great sharp shooter from the 3. Jessica Moore bang the boards like a beast. And the rest Etc. And that's all DT needed. She did the rest. But she didn't do it alone.

Maya had 5 freahmans. Hayes was lost in space.

Stewie came in with great players...Good for her because winning 4 in a row took just that.
Weren't Strother, Barb Turner and Jessica Moore mostly Freshmen and Sophomores? When D led them to two championships? I still say those two years were one of the most remarkable feats in history. You normally need at least two superstars to win a championship, and at minimum a veteran team with a mega star. And I also think Maya, faced the toughest task, with freshmen /soph p Gd and post. Steph wasn't close to being Steph yet. No depth and Lorin Dixon off the bench as our only option. Maya had to defend the paint on defense when Steph was in foul trouble or needed rest during games. Tif did comme and go in spurts. And it's tougher for Maya as a Non guard, to control and guarantee a win on both ends of the court. Especially on offense with out the ball in her hands. She wasn't the best at totally creating her own shot all the time either. But her talent and determination and work ethic could not be out done. Stewie just has even more physical gifts than Maya- size length, wingspan. She Really does totally dominate on both ends of the court . Calm & cool in the biggest situations- starting w freshmen year NCAA Tmt. But let's face it, she walked into a juggernaut of a team that just needed her to improve and mature by the end of her freshmen year. No one had the full four years of all the pieces of a great team each year- more than this graduating class. That doesn't diminish their accomplishments- just a fact. They certainly made the most of it!!!
 

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Geno-ista - Jessica came in with Diana, but red-shirted one year (true red-shirt, no injury or illness.) Barb (7 starts), Ann, Willnett, and Nicole were all freshman in 2003 but only Nicole and Ann started, and Nicole tore her ACL in the tenth game, and was replaced by Maria another classmate of DTs. The other starter spot went between Ashley Battle, another player who arrived for the 2000-01 season, but was injured in the seventh game that year (shoulder/arm I believe) and red-shirted, and Morgan Valley yet another classmate of DTs.

DT's 2000 recruiting class was Diana (37), Jessica (38), Maria (29), Morgan (18), and Ashley (13) - 2003 starts in () as third year players in the program - two of whom were red-shirts and graduated in 2005 not 2004 - there were no seniors as the 2000 recruit Kennitra Johnson had transferred out. It was an academic junior dominated team with a strong freshman class and two sophomores (Ashley Valley and Stacey Marron a walk on.) And of course the following year it was 4th year players and sophomores.

We all talk about TASSK and the Moriah/Morgan/Stewart classes as being the 'greatest' recruiting classes in Uconn history, but maybe we should also recognize that 2000 recruiting class of 5 as pretty darned special! Combined they won 15 NCs with seven starts in NC games. And Moore (10) and Battle (6) had pretty long WNBA careers to complement DT's - Morgan's career was derailed with injuries and she is now coaching, and Maria was a great college PG who got training camp looks in the WNBA but professionally could not hide her physical limitations - we could nickname it JAMMD
 
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Weren't Strother, Barb Turner and Jessica Moore mostly Freshmen and Sophomores? When D led them to two championships? I still say those two years were one of the most remarkable feats in history. You normally need at least two superstars to win a championship, and at minimum a veteran team with a mega star. And I also think Maya, faced the toughest task, with freshmen /soph p Gd and post. Steph wasn't close to being Steph yet. No depth and Lorin Dixon off the bench as our only option. Maya had to defend the paint on defense when Steph was in foul trouble or needed rest during games. Tif did comme and go in spurts. And it's tougher for Maya as a Non guard, to control and guarantee a win on both ends of the court. Especially on offense with out the ball in her hands. She wasn't the best at totally creating her own shot all the time either. But her talent and determination and work ethic could not be out done. Stewie just has even more physical gifts than Maya- size length, wingspan. She Really does totally dominate on both ends of the court . Calm & cool in the biggest situations- starting w freshmen year NCAA Tmt. But let's face it, she walked into a juggernaut of a team that just needed her to improve and mature by the end of her freshmen year. No one had the full four years of all the pieces of a great team each year- more than this graduating class. That doesn't diminish their accomplishments- just a fact. They certainly made the most of it!!!


If I am correct I COULD OF SWORN Turner and Ann S. were both sophomores that year. Someone said Jessica was a freshman But I don't think so. I need to see the facts to be sure though....Does anyone have those facts?

Yea Maya had 5 freshmans who were up and down. And only two of them started. Hayes was the only other solid player offensively. And sometimes she took vacations at the vital moments as she did in that final 4 game.

And yet they made it to the Final 4. Moore had 37 points that game. She did all she could do with no help from Hayes. Bria did her best to help. Dolson well, she was freshman, She tried. They all tried. But the offense wasn't there collectively.
 
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2003-04 Women's Basketball Roster


NO. NAME YR. POSITION HT HOMETOWN/HIGH SCHOOL
2 Ashley Valley Jr. G 5-9 Colchester, VT/Rice Memorial
3 Diana Taurasi Sr. G/F 6-0 Chino, CA/Don Lugo
5 Maria Conlon Sr. G 5-9 Derby, CT/Seymour
12 Stacey Marron Jr. G 5-9 Albuquerque, NM/La Cueva
20 Morgan Valley Sr. G 6-0 Colchester, VT/Rice Memorial
21 Nicole Wolff So. G 6-0 Walpole, MA/Walpole
22 Ashley Battle^ Jr. F 6-0 Pittsburgh, PA/The Linsly School
23 Willnett Crockett So. F/C 6-2 Harbor City, CA/Narbonne
31 Jessica Moore^ Jr. C 6-3 Palmer, AK/Colony
33 Barbara Turner So. F/G 6-0 Cleveland, OH/East Technical
43 Ann Strother So. G 6-2 Castle Rock, CO/Highlands Ranch
 
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Barbare Turner and Ann S. Both were there from 2002-2006. Both were sophomores when D was a senior. D came in from 2000-2004 with Maria Colon who was also a senior with Morgan Valley.

Colon also was a decent shooter.

Jessica Moore 2000-2005, redshirt or not she was a great rebounder and good player on the boards and scored during D's senior year along with another good rebounder Ashely Battles, a Junior.
 

UcMiami

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2000-01 recruits: DT. Ashley Battle (medical red shirt after 7 games), Jessica Moore (red-shirt), Morgan Valley, Maria Conlon
2001-02 recruits: Ashley Valley, Stacey Marron (walk-on)
2002-03 recruits: Ann Strother, Nicole Wolff, Barbara Turner, Willnett Crockett
2003-04 recruits: Liz Sherwood, Kiana Robinson - both left the program before the start of the next season.

For the 2002-03 season both Battle and Moore were listed as RSo because eligibility wise they were both in their 2nd year though they had been with the program for 2 full years already. (Same as Morgan Tuck being listed this year as an RJr though she is a senior academically.)

TASSK arrived for the 1998-1999 season - the following year there was only one recruit - Kennitra Johnson who left the team after two years (prior to the 2001-02 season)

RAMMD arrived for 2000-01 season - the following year there was only one recruit Ashley Valley and one walk-on Stacey Marron

Following the blockbuster class of BWAN for the 2002-03 season (and I believe they were the #1 rated class that year) there were only two recruits - Kiana Robinson and a very late signing of Liz Sherwood ( a signing that I believe Geno deeply regretted and taught him not to sign players in desperation when first choices committed elsewhere.)

The pattern of very small classes signing following block buster classes has continued
2009-10 - Faris following a class of Doty, Hayes, Buck, EDD, McCormack (Transfer) (JTECH)
20013-14 - Chong following a class of Jefferson, Tuck, and Stewart (MBM)

Interestingly - 2016-17 is not a small class following Samuelson, Collier, and Boykin - though it consists of only one very highly rated player.
 

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Stewie, MJ and MT are the greatest trio in NCAA history, throw in KLS and KN and you have the greatest team of all time!
Renee, Maya, and Tina may be the best trio. Maya and Tina may be the best in the world at their respective positions.
 
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Renee, Maya, and Tina may be the best trio. Maya and Tina may be the best in the world at their respective positions.
IMHO, Mo is better than Renee. I hate to say it, but Stewie is better than Maya as a college player. Stewie can do more than Maya, she can post you up, she has a deadly mid range jumper that is practically unblockable. She shoots the 3, at a very high percentage. She can drive by you, shoot over you. She passes very well. She can hurt you on the defensive end also. She is the all time blocked shots leader in UCONN history. You can't teach height. 6'4", with a 7'1" wingspan. Highly mobile. Morgan versus Tina is a tough one. Morgan is a better passer by far, she has more range on her jumper. I'll give Tina the edge on defense. Give me Morgan based on the fact that when she's on the floor the offense is just a thing of beauty, her movement without the ball, her passing ability, the way she sets screens then pops out for a three. I think this year was the best looking offensive flow that I have ever seen, including last year.
 

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Renee, Maya, and Tina may be the best trio. Maya and Tina may be the best in the world at their respective positions.
I agree, but they were from three separate classes and so we only saw them together for two years and only one championship.

Phillyconn - Love Morgan, and she is a little more versatile than Tina, but Tina is one of the best centers of all time with range to the top of the key by her senior year, power and speed from the free-throw line in. She certainly had fewer assist, but a lot of that was because when she got the ball she scored - with a career shooting percentage of .610!
Renee was a more prolific scorer and a very good floor general, but yeah Moriah is one of the best all time PGs
Maya/Stewart - debate rages but whichever side you come down on the margin is paper thin.
It really comes down to the greatest ever PG and a very good forward vs. the greatest ever center and a very good PG/Combo guard - pick 'em
 
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I agree, but they were from three separate classes and so we only saw them together for two years and only one championship.

Phillyconn - Love Morgan, and she is a little more versatile than Tina, but Tina is one of the best centers of all time with range to the top of the key by her senior year, power and speed from the free-throw line in. She certainly had fewer assist, but a lot of that was because when she got the ball she scored - with a career shooting percentage of .610!
Renee was a more prolific scorer and a very good floor general, but yeah Moriah is one of the best all time PGs
Maya/Stewart - debate rages but whichever side you come down on the margin is paper thin.
It really comes down to the greatest ever PG and a very good forward vs. the greatest ever center and a very good PG/Combo guard - pick 'em
I agree On Tina, she is the greatest ever center, by the time she was a Jr. and Sr.
Morgan was tough from the time she stepped on the campus, it seems like. Although, it's tough to argue against a career Fg % of 61%, yikes! As far as Stewie vs Maya, it is very close, however, BS, has more ways to beat you offensively. I think BS defense is slightly better than MM because of her shot blocking abilities. For those who think MM is better, make your case, I'm listening. What does she do better than BS?
 
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Said before will say again, we, UConn fans, are blessed beyond reasonability. Who else in WCBB can have a debate raging on over the merits of one group of NC players vs, a second group vs a third group and in many instances it comes down to opinion and not clear and undeniable facts. We have POY, DPOY, NC's and on and on. What a terriblee burden to carry.
 
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I only watched the first half, so far. Mo played 7 minutes. She guarded SD. KF guarded KM. In those 7 minutes, SD did not score or have an assist. I remember one play, after MJ went out, where KF was guarding SD. SD shook KF, made an easy pass under the basket for an assist. SD was totally off her game that first half.
I will watch the second half.
I am a crazy MJ fan, she is the greatest. But I must say that in that 2013 FF game, SD totally outplayed the brash freshman, going by her on several occasions, stealing the ball from her, and making her foul. MJ did get some revenge by poking SD in the eye. Of course MJ had not yet become the great MO.
 

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I agree On Tina, she is the greatest ever center, by the time she was a Jr. and Sr.
Morgan was tough from the time she stepped on the campus, it seems like. Although, it's tough to argue against a career Fg % of 61%, yikes! As far as Stewie vs Maya, it is very close, however, BS, has more ways to beat you offensively. I think BS defense is slightly better than MM because of her shot blocking abilities. For those who think MM is better, make your case, I'm listening. What does she do better than BS?
Shoot the three, scoring, assists, steals, shooting percentage, rebounding. :cool: You asked!
I tend to agree with you, but I really can see the arguments from both sides, as I can for DT being the best.
It really is an impossible debate between those three - each can be argued with conviction, and it just comes down to personal preference.

I liked Geno's answer - there has never been someone who has performed as well as Stewart in the NCAA tournament - 23 games of brilliance 4 NCs, 4 MOPs. Collegiate player...?, Tournament Player - Breanna.
 
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I am a crazy MJ fan, she is the greatest. But I must say that in that 2013 FF game, SD totally outplayed the brash freshman, going by her on several occasions, stealing the ball from her, and making her foul. MJ did get some revenge by poking SD in the eye. Of course MJ had not yet become the great MO.
She did not score, while MJ, as a freshman was guarding her. I think she had an assist. When MJ was in the game, Geno put her on SD. Yes, SD stole the ball from MJ, she also had 3 blocks. But on the offensive side out the ball, you can see the total frustration and despair in her face. It started in the first half and grew as the game went on. As a senior, SD went out with a whimper and MJ had a lot to do with that. I almost felt sorry for SD, I had never seen her look like that before. Same with KM and JL. JL said "I'm outa here, no Mo, no Mo, I'm going pro, I can't take no Mo".
 
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Shoot the three, scoring, assists, steals, shooting percentage, rebounding. :cool: You asked!
I tend to agree with you, but I really can see the arguments from both sides, as I can for DT being the best.
It really is an impossible debate between those three - each can be argued with conviction, and it just comes down to personal preference.

I liked Geno's answer - there has never been someone who has performed as well as Stewart in the NCAA tournament - 23 games of brilliance 4 NCs, 4 MOPs. Collegiate player...?, Tournament Player - Breanna.
Who can score in the post like Breana? Who, of the big three plays the best defense?
I think if your going to make a case for anyone of the three, tell me what they do that's better than the others. I think what BS does better is score in the post. She has more ways to beat you than the others. A lot of that has to do with length but it is what it is. She takes bigs out to the three, she posts up smaller players, close out on her and she can drive right by you and finish at the rim. You can't stop her.
 
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She did not score, while MJ, as a freshman was guarding her. I think she had an assist. When MJ was in the game, Geno put her on SD. Yes, SD stole the ball from MJ, she also had 3 blocks. But on the offensive side out the ball, you can see the total frustration and despair in her face. It started in the first half and grew as the game went on. As a senior, SD went out with a whimper and MJ had a lot to do with that. I almost felt sorry for SD, I had never seen her look like that before. Same with KM and JL. JL said "I'm outa here, no Mo, no Mo, I'm going pro, I can't take no Mo".

Ha ha ha haaaa (No Mo?) lol, ah man I am losing it over here in laughter. Ahhhhhh!!!
 

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Who can score in the post like Breana? Who, of the big three plays the best defense?
I think if your going to make a case for anyone of the three, tell me what they do that's better than the others. I think what BS does better is score in the post. She has more ways to beat you than the others. A lot of that has to do with length but it is what it is. She takes bigs out to the three, she posts up smaller players, close out on her and she can drive right by you and finish at the rim. You can't stop her.
Not arguing with you, because I do believe Stewart to be the best ever, but statistically, even discounting freshman year Moore was a better scorer from three and more proficient with greater accuracy, she was better driving to the basket and shooting off screens, and she was very good posting up. She was stronger and finished better through contact. Defensively, she was a better fundamental defender and definitely a better defender on the perimeter, though she didn't have Stewarts height nor length, and she was more disruptive in passing lanes. She was a better passer with a higher assist/TO ratio.
DT was the best passer and was the best floor leader of the three - we debate between Moriah and Sue for the best PG in Uconn history, but DT really belongs in that debate as well, although she was really a combo guard. The fact that she had basically the same number of assists as Moriah while scoring 600 more points is pretty amazing and for a guard her rebounding and her blocking of shots jumps out. She is #11 in blocked shots for her career with 147.
[Stewart was a supreme help defender, as a 1 on 1 defender she was not as great - very good but not great.]
Again - they are all three great, and we have had a number of threads with people making solid arguments for each of the three - and they are solid arguments. Emphasize one aspect of the game and you can proclaim any one of them GOAT, they were all three magnificent. The comparisons are endless and the conclusions inconclusive because it is a team game against different competition and with different teammates. Too much of the game is not open to statistical analysis and the statistics available are too dependent on factors beyond the control of any individual player. Play with a teammate shooting 60% and your assists go up, play against poor defensive teams and your own shooting percent rises, play against poor offensive teams with less talented players and your defensive statistics rise.
 
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She did not score, while MJ, as a freshman was guarding her. I think she had an assist. When MJ was in the game, Geno put her on SD. Yes, SD stole the ball from MJ, she also had 3 blocks. But on the offensive side out the ball, you can see the total frustration and despair in her face. It started in the first half and grew as the game went on. As a senior, SD went out with a whimper and MJ had a lot to do with that. I almost felt sorry for SD, I had never seen her look like that before. Same with KM and JL. JL said "I'm outa here, no Mo, no Mo, I'm going pro, I can't take no Mo".
SD's despair had to do with what the UConn team was doing to her team. All of the ND players were in despair. Mo's contribution in that game was minimal. If she had been as great as you say, she would have played 20 or 30 minutes rather than about ten. But I consider Mo, pound for pound and inch for inch, the best basketball player wcbb has ever seen. Kelly was a great defender, but no one has the lateral quickness of Mo, and the anticipation, judgment, and speed to go with it. Add her pull-up jumper, 3pt ability, and her skill finishing at the hoop to that and we have a player the likes of which will not be seen for quite a while.
 
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Not arguing with you, because I do believe Stewart to be the best ever, but statistically, even discounting freshman year Moore was a better scorer from three and more proficient with greater accuracy, she was better driving to the basket and shooting off screens, and she was very good posting up. She was stronger and finished better through contact. Defensively, she was a better fundamental defender and definitely a better defender on the perimeter, though she didn't have Stewarts height nor length, and she was more disruptive in passing lanes. She was a better passer with a higher assist/TO ratio.
DT was the best passer and was the best floor leader of the three - we debate between Moriah and Sue for the best PG in Uconn history, but DT really belongs in that debate as well, although she was really a combo guard. The fact that she had basically the same number of assists as Moriah while scoring 600 more points is pretty amazing and for a guard her rebounding and her blocking of shots jumps out. She is #11 in blocked shots for her career with 147.
[Stewart was a supreme help defender, as a 1 on 1 defender she was not as great - very good but not great.]
Again - they are all three great, and we have had a number of threads with people making solid arguments for each of the three - and they are solid arguments. Emphasize one aspect of the game and you can proclaim any one of them GOAT, they were all three magnificent. The comparisons are endless and the conclusions inconclusive because it is a team game against different competition and with different teammates. Too much of the game is not open to statistical analysis and the statistics available are too dependent on factors beyond the control of any individual player. Play with a teammate shooting 60% and your assists go up, play against poor defensive teams and your own shooting percent rises, play against poor offensive teams with less talented players and your defensive statistics rise.
Excellent Post! Can't argue much about what you stated. If Maya is better defensively than Stewie, that's saying a lot. I would put DT in the best pg conversation, if, we were only talking offense. MJ's defense is what puts her on top imho. I must state that I have never ever seen a better flowing offense than this years team. I think this years team was the most potent offense in history. KLS, became a force, then with Kia contributing, we were unstoppable.
 
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