Marquette Postgame Thread

[j66kicker]

What an absurd and inappropriate comment. There are, to my knowledge, approximately 330 D1 basketball programs. Let’s be conservative and say each team has ten players on average. That’s 3,300 young women playing college basketball at the highest group level. Are you suggesting that all others outside the top 100 (or 97th percentile of players) are comparable to rec leagues?

I look forward to your response.

What I’m saying is if you can’t regularly recruit top 100 players or better, then there’s no chance you’re going to be a contender for the NC - ever. All the (non-UConn) NBE schools are in this condition. There isn’t the slightest possibility of any of them going deep into the tournament. Not so on the men’s side, so maybe there’s hope.

Sorry if my “intermural league” terminology is a little harsh, but it accurately reflects my level of interest in watching St. John’s vs Georgetown, for instance. I borrowed it from Diana Taurasi, who called the WNBA a “summer rec league.”

 

[Waquoit]

Sorry if my “rec league” terminology is a little harsh, but it accurately reflects my level of interest in watching St. John’s vs Georgetown, for instance. I borrowed it from Diana Taurasi, who called the WNBA a “summer rec league.”

I'm not sure you can quote Diana out of context for your shade. IIRC, she called the WNBA a “summer rec league” because of the pay not the talent.

 

[j66kicker]

I'm not sure you can quote Diana out of context for your shade. IIRC, she called the WNBA a “summer rec league” because of the pay not the talent.

You’re right - my bad (and the WNBA DOES have good health insurance!).

Regarding the talent, How many NBE grads are on WNBA rosters?

 

[Waquoit]

Regarding the talent, How many NBE grads are on WNBA rosters?

The Big East was one of the top leagues before the breakup, now that UConn is back I bet league improvement is already happening.

 

[RedStickHusky]

None in basketball. But some other coaches have done pretty well:

• John McDonnell, Arkansas, Track & Field & Cross Country - 40 national championships
• Pat Henry, TX A&M/LSU, Track & Field - 35 national championships
• Anson Dorrance, UNC, Women’s Soccer - 21 national championships
• Dick Gould, Stanford, Men’s Tennis - 17 national championships
• Ted Banks, UTEP, Track & Field & Cross Country - 17 national championships
• Dave Williams, Houston, Men’s Golf - 16 national championships
• Dan Gable, Iowa, Wrestling - 15 national championships

I know a little about Gable (got him to sign a pair of tigers for me at a clinic once)... Maybe some of the others on that list weren't as tough as Geno on playing time. I have my doubts though.

 

[browns]

Here we go again, reminding me how many championships GA has won. Thank you for that, I almost forgot!

I am aware that GA doesn't have to tell us anything. But, he has certainly been a lot more specific with regard to the failings of other players so maybe he could tell us specifically why AG does not play more. What are these awful things that she does that should make us think that she needs to sit at the end of the bench???

Yes, of course there may be things I don't see that she isn't doing well. But what I do see and is so obvious is the impact she makes immediately. In addition, we often score at a higher rate when she in. She makes huge plays in a very short amount of time. She gave us a huge lift in the second quarter against Marquette and then as her reward sat most of the second half.

You say she is not very good offensively. I'd say she has limitations offensively but so do all players on the team not named PB. But that does not mean she can't play. How about her offensive rebounding or getting out on the break or ability to finish...Does that not count in your world for ability on offense?

At one point CW was shooting 22% from three. I think AG could probably do that as well. Most players have limitations or are one-dimensional offensively but are so great at other things, that they still play meaningful minutes. You can say that most of the year, certain other players have not been very good offensively either.

The point is, that no matter what short-comings AG has, she makes a positive impact every time she is in the game and that cannot be denied. An alien from out of space could see this. If she played more, she might develop better chemistry with the other players.

I will say that the emergence of AE has cut into AG's playing time since GA wants to have the high low game with her and Liv and you need the other three on the perimeter with the threat of the 3 to open that up for AE to operate underneath. Too bad we are back to not being able to hit the three again, and in that type of offense, we will have low scoring output. AG could and would remedy that with her relentless offensive rebounding ability.

9 minutes is not enough...IMHO

Very good rebounder but can't shoot ,ball handle or pass

 

[MD#12Fan]

Well said MD, but you do know that to question GA is sacrilegious. Now you will be inundated with replies of how many NC and games he has won......

I've been reading this board for over 20 years and used to be a contributed a long time ago. The most irritating thing about this board is when posters don't know what to say, so they resort to reminding you how many games and championships GA has won and therefore YOU must be wrong in questioning anything he does!

If we don't question things, then we don't have a reasonable board...more like a 'GA fan love fest' board.

I am thrilled to have GA as our coach by the way! Just in case others aren't sure....

Thanks for the feedback!
I think fans can bow to the GA shrine and still question things. I think you might agree.
In fact, something that really fascinates me is the dichotomy between the strength of a program (macro) and what the leader does in the micro. Sometimes I try to think what a young Geno would do in certain instances.

 

[jazz]

Not at all were you argumentative. We argued respectively with one another. As I said you're an excellent poster and fan. We just have a completely different pov on how we see the game and players. Anyhow - just as you imply here - you aren't suggesting everything you stated is about our differences - per below not everything I'm stating below is all about our differences. Just using examples/perspective as you've used.

To start with - I'm not sure why you're giving me 1 and 2 but as a counter I'll say that I think posters vastly overrate speed and athleticism over fundamentals and skill. Both are important. But there is a pov as to how the game has changed recently as a result of speed and athleticism - imo that's flawed.

Further, I think posters vastly underrate experience and listen to hype (see all the posts that believed Saylor should get minutes before it was projected that Anna would be out for as long as she has).

I’m a fan of skill and fundamentals. It's why I was upset with all the 3's Liv and Aubrey were taking in the Tenn. game. I wanted them yanked immediately like Calhoun used to do. While Geno didn't yank them- long term he did what I thought in back of my mind – which was that we don’t see them hoist up the same number of 3's they did in that game. I guess I can say same things you are saying about "being right" too, right? Matter of fact we can say one of Liv's most important plays of the season was the outside shot that she turned down in the SC game and passed it back to Paige. So I can be right too.

The point is though is that I have a preference of how I want the game to be played just as you do,. But what we want to see has no consequences. And if we're at the opposite ends of the spectrum as to what we want to see or style we believe UCONN should play - then we have to believe the other is leading us down to a path that will eventually close the gap much faster than it has.

Also, IMO many of us want to pretend we are a coach and our projection of the style and where the program and game are is the only correct projection. Thus we nit-pick. For example some that deem that this program has failed - because in their view only championships matter. Others want to see more bench and think Geno is way wrong. Others want to see a player because they are enamored with that style she plays etc.

For me- I just think a sense of perspective gets lost though. UCONN is not in a top conference. Their campus is not so elite vs many of the P5’s. The education rating of the school is not top 5 I believe. What they are doing is amazing/sensational. And imo a lot has to do with the style Geno employs. And I don’t have to believe that Geno is God to think this way.

I wasn't sure where we different in the past, so I just enumerated where which of my opinions seems to draw the most criticism assuming you might have been one of them. My apologies if not. My memory isn't what it used to be and it never was that great to begin with!

 

[jazz]

Thanks for the feedback!
I think fans can bow to the GA shrine and still question things. I think you might agree.
In fact, something that really fascinates me is the dichotomy between the strength of a program (macro) and what the leader does in the micro. Sometimes I try to think what a young Geno would do in certain instances.

Young GA would lose his mind if he was coaching today! well said MD!

 

[jazz]

Very good rebounder but can't shoot ,ball handle or pass

not true again!

She is a very good ball handler. Her passing is adequate for a big. Her shooting is suspect for sure. Are you sure you are watching the games???

Well, maybe Meatloaf had it all wrong because maybe one out of three aint bad afterall. On second thought, naw.....

 

[jazz]

That clip resonates because Iverson never got better, his teams never got better and he never won. He lost as an Olympic player for crying out loud. I wish Magic Johnson thought practice was a joke. He never would have developed that baby hook shot.

Yeah I thought AI was a punk for doing that.

Practice does matter. You need to give it your all, all the time. Loafing in practice is different than being a bad practice player.

 

[jazz]

I'm trying to find the other coaches with 11 national titles...

Don't think you will....

But do you really think Pat was a better coach than GA when she had loads more titles than him?

 

[RedStickHusky]

If AG had the handle to create shots off the dribble she'd be getting a lot more minutes. This is not bashing... She's a great off rebounder, a put back machine, and a strong physical defender whose style would lend itself to foul trouble over extended periods. She's not a ball handler and not a creator of shots for others. Still an important role player going forward. You may consider it blind "worshipping at the temple of Geno" to think he knows what he's doing. I consider it unimaginable hubris to think that he (and CD, and Jamelle, and Shea) don't know what they're doing.

 

[RedStickHusky]

Don't think you will....

But do you really think Pat was a better coach than GA when she had loads more titles than him?

No, nor do I think her methods (re playing time and motivation) were significantly different from his. Your quote was that other coaches get the same results with different methods.

 

[jazz]

No, nor do I think her methods (re playing time and motivation) were significantly different from his. Your quote was that other coaches get the same results with different methods.

well other coaches can win games and motivate players but not necessarily win 11 titles. GA is the total package because he can out-recruit anybody. Recruiting kids to come to Storrs is not easy. Easier now maybe than it used to be but then there are less kids that will take to GA's strict rules as well.

Now are there other coaches that could win 11 titles with GA's players...hmmm maybe a couple I can think of.

 

[Bills Fan]

Unbelievable how far this thread has gotten off the track from its title (heading)! I used to pick and chose which threads I wanted to read based on the title, now ya jus nver no!

 

[RedStickHusky]

well other coaches can win games and motivate players but not necessarily win 11 titles. GA is the total package because he can out-recruit anybody. Recruiting kids to come to Storrs is not easy. Easier now maybe than it used to be but then there are less kids that will take to GA's strict rules as well.

Now are there other coaches that could win 11 titles with GA's players...hmmm maybe a couple I can think of.

He gets his fair share of top recruits, not all. Better question is does Geno win off his recruiting or does he recruit off his winning? I'd argue the later.

 

[jazz]

He gets his fair share of top recruits, not all. Better question is does Geno win off his recruiting or does he recruit off his winning? I'd argue the later.

Can't win without recruits but you can recruit without winning as he did in the beginning....

could argue chicken and the egg though.

 

[jazz]

Unbelievable how far this thread has gotten off the track from its title (heading)! I used to pick and chose which threads I wanted to read based on the title, now ya jus nver no!

guilty as charged. my apologies for my part in the digression.

 

[eebmg]

Now are there other coaches that could win 11 titles with GA's players...hmmm maybe a couple I can think of.

They may win under other coaches but I am sure it would not look the same.

 

[freshler40]

I agree. Both were open , hesitated and passed.

Totally agree, we need more shooting or driving threats, look what AK did to us by faking a shot and driving to the hoop. AG is a fine disruptive defensive player that gets her hands on a lot of balls. She can also drive if on the baseline like Williams. If Liv gets into foul trouble, AG is a great option to help inside.

 

[MD#12Fan]

He gets his fair share of top recruits, not all. Better question is does Geno win off his recruiting or does he recruit off his winning? I'd argue the later.

Come on, be objective! We all love Geno! He's an all-time great- Wooden, Lombardi, Belichick, Noll, Coach K....
Why do I have to argue against an idol?
He's won 9 of his 11 NC's with the 3 best players ever to play WBB (post Cheryl Miller, Ann Meyers- pro basketball was non existent then). D, Stewie, and Maya. But it's more than NC's. It's the consistency and the program's excellence that is such a separator from his peers. All due respect, I want/need Geno to win one (or more) when he's not expected to. Wooden did it, Coach K did it. (Knock on wood) This year would be such a crowning achievement.

 

[RedStickHusky]

Come on, be objective! We all love Geno! He's an all-time great- Wooden, Lombardi, Belichick, Noll, Coach K....
Why do I have to argue against an idol?
He's won 9 of his 11 NC's with the 3 best players ever to play WBB (post Cheryl Miller, Ann Meyers- pro basketball was non existent then). D, Stewie, and Maya. But it's more than NC's. It's the consistency and the program's excellence that is such a separator from his peers. All due respect, I want/need Geno to win one (or more) when he's not expected to. Wooden did it, Coach K did it. (Knock on wood) This year would be such a crowning achievement.

It took him 10 years to get his first, building with local recruits. Kerry Bascom, Rebecca Lobo... Flood gates opened with TASSK in '98. He built it and then they came.

 

[MD#12Fan]

It took him 10 years to get his first, building with local recruits. Kerry Bascom, Rebecca Lobo... Flood gates opened with TASSK in '98. He built it and then they came.

Took Wooden a long time too. Similar trajectories.
IMO maybe his greatest legacy, even more than NC's, is that the young people feel that they will become the best they can be by coming to UConn with Geno. I loved the recent piece by Pheesa about choosing UConn.
I want him to climb up into his attic and pull out some of his tricks to help this year's team climb the mountain. I'm not talking about his continuity offense or any other traditional stuff. I mean the kitchen sink. We see from afar that these 7 will respond to whatever is put before them. FC defenses, zones, different sets on O, run a play off the opening tap, side OB plays, you name it. No last second heartbreakers! We got this!

 

[jazz]

Come on, be objective! We all love Geno! He's an all-time great- Wooden, Lombardi, Belichick, Noll, Coach K....
Why do I have to argue against an idol?
He's won 9 of his 11 NC's with the 3 best players ever to play WBB (post Cheryl Miller, Ann Meyers- pro basketball was non existent then). D, Stewie, and Maya. But it's more than NC's. It's the consistency and the program's excellence that is such a separator from his peers. All due respect, I want/need Geno to win one (or more) when he's not expected to. Wooden did it, Coach K did it. (Knock on wood) This year would be such a crowning achievement.

You got some 'b***s' to say that MD. I can't agree more though... I thought he might have been able to pull out the ones we lost by the last second shots in the semis to ND and Miss State. We had some really good/great teams those years. I was hoping coaching would get us there.

But we still have 11 and hopefully one this year. But I think he needs to do get more out of certain players like AG, Liv and CW to get us there. If those three play well in their roles, we got a great chance.

 

[HuskyNan]

I guess we’re done discussing the game