Kudos for Bobby

[mauconnfan]

The Yankees didn't have their top 3 starters suck and didn't have their best player from last year miss half the year only to return and suck (Ellsbury). The list of injured players and/or underperformers would encompass virtually the entire team. Bobby had his issues but I don't see how you can translate them into having a serious impact on their W/L record this year.

No you're right they didn't suck but how does that matter? Instead CC missed multiple starts and their prized trade for Pineda didn't work out to well did it? And if Ellsbury is your best player you're in trouble anyway.......career year for sure and will not be replicated.....always hurt and throws like a sissy (can't believe Jeter didn't try to score on Tex's fly the other night he can't get it to home from 200 feet)..........Yanks had as many injuries but Cashman had a better bench and was prepared, your rookie not so good although some played well early, they are minor leaguers for a reason. Good news is you got rid of some baggage and now there's more to go I believe........

Now go have a hot dog at fenway......oh sorry it's closed again!!

 

[Deepster]

Are you saying that if the Mets had just a "good" manager in 1999 and 2000 they would have won back to back world series? I would think Bobby taking those teams to the NLCS and WS were pretty good achievements.

I see how well they've done since he's been gone, so maybe you're right.

Are you saying he's anything more than a "good" manager?

Seeing how well he's done this year with your team, maybe you're right.

 

[ZenConn]

Interesting that Epstein isn't even mentioned in 5 page Red Sox thread.

 

[Dove]

He gone!

 

[tzznandrew]

He gone!

Least shocking development in a while.

 

[Dogdeacon]

All the Boston fanboys bought into his wink and a smile in the early spring.

I think this is inaccurate. Some Sox fans talked themselves into Valentine, majority took a wait-and-see or show me approach, plenty were deadset against and a scarce few were in favor or thought it was a great move.

Then, before they broke from spring training (April 1 or so) Bobby announced he'd do a weekly radio show with Michael Kay in New York. From that moment which was before he even got here, he lost Boston more and more every day.

Lastly either the guy is a jerk and needs to be ridden out of town on a rail OR he's a wonderful manager and person and how dare we cast aspertions on him. Its schadenfreude enough that Bobby V's tenure and the Red Sox season was the worst possible scenario.

 

[Danzz]

The Sox have bigger problems than a manager. They gave away one of the best middle of the lineup hitters in baseball to get rid of Beckett and Crawford. The problem with that is that the middle of the Sox lineup was already weak when Ortiz and Middlebrooks went down. Once Gonzalez was traded the #3 hitter was Ross at times.; not exactly what you need to score runs when the starters are giving up runs. Whatever you think of Gonzalez there is no player available to replace his bat at 1B. They had a bunch of 1B but traded all of them away.
This team is in shambles and unless they sign some players or some of the current players (especially pitchers) have a comeback season they will be fighting to get out of the cellar next year.The playoffs aren't even a long shot.
They are weak at the corners on offense: Middlebrooks, Loney, Nava/Kalish, Ross. You are looking at about 50-60 HRs from this group when you need about 85+. This on a team that plays in Fenway with a pitching staff that gives up runs in bunches.
Dubront is a #5 starter but on his team he will be #3 behind Bucholtz and Lester. Even if a pitcher like Miller starts and goes .500, they are much weaker than NY, TB, and Baltimore.
I admit to being old school. I like power on the corners and defense up the middle. I could live with Inglesias at shortstop but not with this team.
A new manager isn't going to change any of this.

 

[Dove]

I think this is inaccurate. Some Sox fans talked themselves into Valentine, majority took a wait-and-see or show me approach, plenty were deadset against and a scarce few were in favor or thought it was a great move.

Then, before they broke from spring training (April 1 or so) Bobby announced he'd do a weekly radio show with Michael Kay in New York. From that moment which was before he even got here, he lost Boston more and more every day.

Lastly either the guy is a jerk and needs to be ridden out of town on a rail OR he's a wonderful manager and person and how dare we cast aspertions on him. Its schadenfreude enough that Bobby V's tenure and the Red Sox season was the worst possible scenario.

My brother in law is a life long fan and when BV was named manager he was contemplating a new favorite team. HATED the hire.

 

[Waquoit]

All the Boston fanboys bought into his wink and a smile in the early spring and can't wait for him to be on the next Fung Wah out of town the second the 27th out gets rung up tonight.

It's called rooting for your team. You are hoping for the best. I remember you being the biggest Omar Minaya booster around and he was awful. And I'm not seeing the Fung Wah here. The general consensus seems to be he had to go but the situation isn't his fault.

 

[Waquoit]

Interesting that Epstein isn't even mentioned in 5 page Red Sox thread.

Because he won 2 World Series. It's the owners, not him. He didn't want Crawford.

 

[Deepster]

It's called rooting for your team. You are hoping for the best. I remember you being the biggest Omar Minaya booster around and he was awful. And I'm not seeing the Fung Wah here. The general consensus seems to be he had to go but the situation isn't his fault.

I didn't turn on Minaya. I still think that, in the shape he took that team over, he did a good job of making them compete again.

And, FYI, Epstein really didn't "win" the 2 WS titles. Duquette did more for those than he did.

 

[8893]

It's called rooting for your team. You are hoping for the best.

Where is Whaquit and what have you done to him?

 

[60'sfan]

I didn't turn on Minaya. I still think that, in the shape he took that team over, he did a good job of making them compete again.

And, FYI, Epstein really didn't "win" the 2 WS titles. Duquette did more for those than he did.

I can't argue that Duquette had assembled a pretty good team before Theo showed up. In fact, Theo was not even the first or second choice as GM. But he did contribute a lot to the World Series and we Sox fans will always appreciate that. He brought in Keith Foulke and Curt Schilling before that season began and when Nomar began to be a problem, he engineering a great trade in which the Sox picked up Orlando Cabrera and Doug Mientkiewicz for Nomar and someone named Matt Murton. He also picked up Dave Roberts for Henri Stanley (remember him). Without those players, we could have waited a few more years for our first World Championship.

For sure Theo lost his way in the last few years but many of his bad choices became bad in retrospect.

 

[Deadrody]

I can't argue that Duquette had assembled a pretty good team before Theo showed up. In fact, Theo was not even the first or second choice as GM. But he did contribute a lot to the World Series and we Sox fans will always appreciate that. He brought in Keith Foulke and Curt Schilling before that season began and when Nomar began to be a problem, he engineering a great trade in which the Sox picked up Orlando Cabrera and Doug Mientkiewicz for Nomar and someone named Matt Murton. He also picked up Dave Roberts for Henri Stanley (remember him). Without those players, we could have waited a few more years for our first World Championship.

For sure Theo lost his way in the last few years but many of his bad choices became bad in retrospect.

I think you may be omitting a few guys. How about Ortiz, Millar, Mueller, Arroyo, and perhaps most importantly, Francona. Some of them he put in place in 2003, but the difference in the roster between when Theo was hired in 2002 and when they won the series in 2004 is pretty sizable.

Certainly Duquette is responsible for two of the biggest players on the team - Ramirez and Martinez, but outside of them, there wasn't all that much indispensable on the 2002 roster except Varitek, Lowe, and Damon. I'd say the guys listed above, brought in by Theo outweigh these 5 already in place over many years by Duquette.

 

[Waquoit]

And, FYI, Epstein really didn't "win" the 2 WS titles. Duquette did more for those than he did.

Nah, that's just denial. The Nomar trade was the key. That took balls and it paid off.