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That's about the only thing I agree with you @Stairmaster

The "Calhoun's players" argument doesn't hold much weight, especially given the fact that the kids we won with were either inconsistent or total non factors under Calhoun.

If you want to say that Napier carried that team, I buy that. However, Ollie was the coach he developed under.
 
ConnHuskBask said:
If you want to say that Napier carried that team, I buy that. However, Ollie was the coach he developed under.
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And guard development is the one thing that has remained constant throughout Ollie's tenure, both in the honeymoon period (2012-14) and the more disappointing stretch (2014-present).

When Napier and Boatright graduated, they were completely different players than they were when they came in, in terms of shooting, facilitation, defense, and leadership. The progress Jalen made this year is a good sign that he could be on a similar trajectory. Hell, I even think Vital grew a ton over the course of this year. I hope the people who want KO gone consider the importance of outstanding guard play in building teams who can be successful both throughout seasons and in the tourney. I get a lot of crap for suggesting that it will be tougher than people think to find a significant upgrade to KO in general, but it's tough to deny that whoever comes next will be a huge step backwards in terms of working with guards.
 
Stairmaster said:
And guard development is the one thing that has remained constant throughout Ollie's tenure, both in the honeymoon period (2012-14) and the more disappointing stretch (2014-present).

When Napier and Boatright graduated, they were completely different players than they were when they came in, in terms of shooting, facilitation, defense, and leadership. The progress Jalen made this year is a good sign that he could be on a similar trajectory. Hell, I even think Vital grew a ton over the course of this year. I hope the people who want KO gone consider the importance of outstanding guard play in building teams who can be successful both throughout seasons and in the tourney. I get a lot of crap for suggesting that it will be tougher than people think to find a significant upgrade to KO in general, but it's tough to deny that whoever comes next will be a huge step backwards in terms of working with guards.
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This is where we disagree. Who on the Boneyard is saying he should be fired right now? That and the idea you keep hammering that some people don't want him to succeed is patently false.

Napier was a phenomenal college basketball and Boat became very good under the guidance of Ollie. Ollie also did a tremendous job recruiting Adams and bringing him into the program.

Purvis was more or less the same player from Day 1 as when he graduated and the jury is still out on Vital though he undoubtedly improved towards the end of the season.

I think it's just hyperbole to say that someone who comes in would have a "huge step backwards" in guard development. We had an all time Husky in Napier (who was two years Calhoun and two years Ollie) and then a good Husky in Boat and then not much else. It's a stretch to talk in such conclusive terms without much history to support it.
 
Who on the Boneyard is saying he should be fired right now? That and the idea you keep hammering that some people don't want him to succeed is patently false.
People read things in different ways - I read quite a few who would like to see KO gone and there are some who don't want to see him succeed. You just have to see it
 
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Tenspro2002 said:
You almost make my point for me. It's not just about rankings.

JC recruited the right guys -- tough, good teammates, willing to work and buy in. KO brought out a lot of these traits in those guys, developed them and coached them to a championship.

But KO hasn't shown, with the exception of Adams and Vital, so far, that he can regularly land the right players, in terms of toughness, BBIQ, and skill. Some of those qualities are captured in rankings, some aren't. Yes, he was hamstrung by sanctions in his first few years, but that excuse doesn't fly anymore.
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Given the number of kids who left, like Oriakhi and Roscoe, etc., it's just as easy to say there were kids who were recruited that were not good teammates (I don't believe that but it is fair to say since they left, just as Enoch etc. did).
 
ConnHuskBask said:
This is where we disagree. Who on the Boneyard is saying he should be fired right now? That and the idea you keep hammering that some people don't want him to succeed is patently false.

Napier was a phenomenal college basketball and Boat became very good under the guidance of Ollie. Ollie also did a tremendous job recruiting Adams and bringing him into the program.

Purvis was more or less the same player from Day 1 as when he graduated and the jury is still out on Vital though he undoubtedly improved towards the end of the season.

I think it's just hyperbole to say that someone who comes in would have a "huge step backwards" in guard development. We had an all time Husky in Napier (who was two years Calhoun and two years Ollie) and then a good Husky in Boat and then not much else. It's a stretch to talk in such conclusive terms without much history to support it.
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I think it's carry-over from spending too much time in the Cesspool. Not much going on there besides strawmen, hyperbole, and hyperbolic strawmen.
 
Rocktheworld said:
I think it's carry-over from spending too much time in the Cesspool. Not much going on there besides strawmen, hyperbole, and hyperbolic strawmen.
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Claiming that people want Ollie fired isn't a strawman. Quite a few people have explicitly stated as such. I can get you folks links if you'd like.
 
Stairmaster said:
Claiming that people want Ollie fired isn't a strawman. Quite a few people have explicitly stated as such. I can get you folks links if you'd like.
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Was a half-joke, and I mostly agree with your sentiments regarding KO and where many on the forum stand with him. Really not interested in arguing about it so I'll just leave it with I definitely think the whole "hoping they fail so you can continue to blame KO" thing was unnecessary. And I don't recall anyone calling for his job NOW. At worst he is in very hot water.
 
I know all about the Ignore feature.

But I think we are approaching the need for a Hanging app. If RUSS56 keeps floating the same thread in 11 different ways ... we need resistance.

Put me in this box: Kevin Ollie deserves the chance- and years (2017-2018 ain't make or break) to reboot UConn MBB. New coaches (Check) Players with less than full commitment leave (Check) Calhoun Auriemma RayRay Rip etc rally (certain to happen)

You can't just yell fire in a theater. KO is a talented youthful coach. He does need to get better ... but cut the Crap as to what YOU demand. This UConn culture can be FF again from this AAC.
 
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gtcam said:
Who on the Boneyard is saying he should be fired right now? That and the idea you keep hammering that some people don't want him to succeed is patently false.
People read things in different ways - I read quite a few who would like to see KO gone and there are some who don't want to see him succeed. You just have to see it
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Lmao
 
Stairmaster said:
Claiming that people want Ollie fired isn't a strawman. Quite a few people have explicitly stated as such. I can get you folks links if you'd like.
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It is a strawman when you respond to someone to the effect of "people like you have said you want KO fired".

Most people, like @BUConn10 and @superjohn , who have expressed opinions similar to mine have done so like "if we don't see [improvement/record/recruiting success] by [some number of years in the future], we should consider other options". Painting anyone who has reservations about our coach with the same brush as extremists or outright trolls does a disservice to both you and us.
 
These kids and their dads know better than a guy who played elite level college ball, spent 10+ years in the NBA on nothing more than knowing what the NBA wants from it's players, and has a national championship ring at a school where just about every kid over the last 25 year who played out his eligibility had a chance to play for a Final Four berth with a mess of them earning a living playing basketball?

I think this years squad will miss having Jackson and Durham on the floor, but let them do something with their lives before taking their side against a guy who knows basketball. Maybe we should only recruit players with active moms as opposed to active dads. We seem to do better with those players.
 
lange10 said:
Lol. I can't wait til Durham is an absolute stud 2-3 years down the line
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then he may be the first UConn transfer we'd ever regret losing after he left

nothing I saw made me think "stud"
 
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gtcam said:
Who on the Boneyard is saying he should be fired right now? That and the idea you keep hammering that some people don't want him to succeed is patently false.
People read things in different ways - I read quite a few who would like to see KO gone and there are some who don't want to see him succeed. You just have to see it
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That's idiotic. You really think people that actively spend time on a UConn fan forum are rooting against a beloved former player, that's now the Head Coach to somehow win arguments on a message board?

You sure you can read?

Also if someone can point out or find one quote that says KO should be fired as of now, I'd love to see it.
 
willie99 said:
then he may be the first UConn transfer we'd ever regret losing after he left

nothing I saw made me think "stud"
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In fairness, it sucked when Roscoe left and ultimately went on to putting up huge rebound numbers for UNLV.

Not a regret I guess per se, just unfortunate.
 
ConnHuskBask said:
That's idiotic. You really think people that actively spend time on a UConn fan forum are rooting against a beloved former player, that's now the Head Coach to somehow win arguments on a message board?

You sure you can read?

Also if someone can point out or find one quote that says KO should be fired as of now, I'd love to see it.
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Wichita St. to AAC Next Year (Officially Official)
"If we were a real program, he would be gone by now."

Just one quote from a few days ago, found with minimal research, there are probably more.
 
businesslawyer said:
And yet, I can't remember to put the garbage out between when my wife yells it to me as I walk out of the kitchen and when I get to the garage.
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You must have a fridge in your garage.
 
Stairmaster said:
Wichita St. to AAC Next Year (Officially Official)
"If we were a real program, he would be gone by now."

Just one quote from a few days ago, found with minimal research, there are probably more.
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So a few fringe posters represent everyone who has concerns about the program?

Not to go all Cesspool, but that's basically the equivalent of conservatives saying "Democrats want to take away your guns" because a few radical far-left people have said they want to ban guns.
 
ConnHuskBask said:
In fairness, it sucked when Roscoe left and ultimately went on to putting up huge rebound numbers for UNLV.

Not a regret I guess per se, just unfortunate.
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I concur, but Roscoe left because he didn't want to be a 4, and he was one of the nation's leading rebounders because he was a four

and we wouldn't change a thing about the next two seasons :)
 
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Wearing your own jersey to a darty is an UNREAL move, especially for Enoch who has publicly announced his transfer
 
KSC94 said:
Wearing your own jersey to a darty is an UNREAL move, especially for Enoch who has publicly announced his transfer
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Enoch, Vance and Durham were just chilling with the squad which was kinda surprising. I guess there is no real beef if they are still cool with each other
 
BleedHuskyBlu said:
Enoch, Vance and Durham were just chilling with the squad which was kinda surprising. I guess there is no real beef if they are still cool with each other
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That's basketball today. Everybody is buddy buddy with everybody. They all follow each other on Twitter and play AAU together growing up. The angst against opponents has dropped significantly at all levels so it's probably not a big deal they're no longer teammates anymore
 
SubbaBub said:
These kids and their dads know better than a guy who played elite level college ball, spent 10+ years in the NBA on nothing more than knowing what the NBA wants from it's players, and has a national championship ring at a school where just about every kid over the last 25 year who played out his eligibility had a chance to play for a Final Four berth with a mess of them earning a living playing basketball?

I think this years squad will miss having Jackson and Durham on the floor, but let them do something with their lives before taking their side against a guy who knows basketball. Maybe we should only recruit players with active moms as opposed to active dads. We seem to do better with those players.
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The point is this isn't about playing basketball... it's about coaching and developing talent. If a player or parent doesn't believe their kid is going to develop playing at UConn it isn't insane to think... We'll get better with time because Ollie will become a better coach.
 
TRest said:
There are people here who wave the 2014 season around like a magic talisman that negates any of KO's flaws. He may not be the long term answer.
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I'd say that almost nobody does this talisman thing, but I do see a number of people making such an exaggerated claim, and I'm pretty confident that there are also posters whose motivation is more likely to agitate to the detriment of the program than anything else. In a large middle ground, there is a wide variety of emotional expression that acknowledges that it's been an unsettled time since 2011 and pretty trying in the past month, notwithstanding the joy of 2014's National Championship.
 
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