It's ASJHA! | Page 4 | The Boneyard

It's ASJHA!

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alexrgct said:
Just to add to this, the rift between Pat and Geno wasn't really about how Geno recruited so much as that he was successful doing so. The "how" part was just a convenient straw man. When UConn and Tennessee first played, the LVs had Marciniak, a high school NPOY from Pennsylvania, and in the next year's recruiting class a girl from CTK named Chamique Holdsclaw. It rapidly became difficult for Pat to get those kinds of players from those states of Geno wanted them. So Geno had the northeast, Pat had the Deep South, and everywhere else was a battleground. But when Geno got Maya out of Atlanta, that really changed the power dynamic in WCBB. And that's when Pat was done. She might not be able to stop UConn, but she wasn't going to help by playing that annual game. I can't prove this obviously, but I am firmly convinced this is at the bottom of it.
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Interesting and very possibly that is exactly what happened. But it's also very unlikely that we will ever know whether or not it's true.
 
Goodies07 said:
Dupree was on the initial list of finalists. But the final 12-member Olympic team is listed here
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Now, I see my confusion - I was speaking of Ms. Parker, and others were speaking of Ms. Dupree. I had my Candice and Candace (or some spelling thereof) mixed up. Thank you.
 
alexrgct said:
Just to add to this, the rift between Pat and Geno wasn't really about how Geno recruited so much as that he was successful doing so. The "how" part was just a convenient straw man. When UConn and Tennessee first played, the LVs had Marciniak, a high school NPOY from Pennsylvania, and in the next year's recruiting class a girl from CTK named Chamique Holdsclaw. It rapidly became difficult for Pat to get those kinds of players from those states of Geno wanted them. So Geno had the northeast, Pat had the Deep South, and everywhere else was a battleground. But when Geno got Maya out of Atlanta, that really changed the power dynamic in WCBB. And that's when Pat was done. She might not be able to stop UConn, but she wasn't going to help by playing that annual game. I can't prove this obviously, but I am firmly convinced this is at the bottom of it.
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Alex - I think you are on the right track. When GA recruited Maya out of Georgia, PHS was beside herself, and that started the fury that drove her to the NCAA. Something wrong must have happened for her not to be able to have her pick of the litter in the South. Also, she was 9-13 in head to head vs. CT, and I don't think could bear the prospect of being 9-17. TN likes to say they do things the right and honest way, so they chose to just quit, drop out and be quiet about it.
 
Isn't it 7 going for the Gold? Isn't Sveta on the Russian team? I'd rather see Team USA win, but...
 
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UConnCat said:
Maybe Summitt will come clean in her memoirs. There's an announcement today that Summitt is teaming up with her favorite ghostwriter Sally Jenkins to write her memoirs. http://espn.go.com/womens-college-b...t-summitt-tennessee-volunteers-working-memoir
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Well, if Summitt actually does with this book what she implies with her quotes, it will be quite a read. But the quotes could just be PR hype so I won't get excited about it for now. I've never read any of her books, or for that matter anything by Jenkins, so I have no experience to base an expectation on.

But I do believe this: as far as the Pat/Geno rift, and the truth about that is concerned, the ball is in her court. It's hard for me to believe that Geno would do anything at this point to harm her reputation, even if it means leaving things as they are. After all, the only group that seems to still believe the worst about Geno and UConn is a small group of folks to whom facts are irrelevant, and he could care less about them.
 
alexrgct said:
The Texas programs aren't doing it like they could be. Baylor got Alexis Prince, but that's one of they few examples. Seemed like the feeling was, well we're winning with Texas kids, so let's keeping focusing almost exclusively on that.

Geno branched out immediately and kept pushing. The Deep South was a tough nut to crack, but that didn't keep him and CD from trying and trying until they had success. Even in 2012, UConn is getting its first Texas kid. That's the relentlessness that's unique.
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Immediately? He started in 1985. Tammy Arnold was class of 96.

TAMU & Baylor are both relatively new to the national scene. And TX is so incredibly rich in talent it's much different than anywhere else.
 
alexrgct said:
Just to add to this, the rift between Pat and Geno wasn't really about how Geno recruited so much as that he was successful doing so. The "how" part was just a convenient straw man. When UConn and Tennessee first played, the LVs had Marciniak, a high school NPOY from Pennsylvania, and in the next year's recruiting class a girl from CTK named Chamique Holdsclaw. It rapidly became difficult for Pat to get those kinds of players from those states of Geno wanted them. So Geno had the northeast, Pat had the Deep South, and everywhere else was a battleground. But when Geno got Maya out of Atlanta, that really changed the power dynamic in WCBB. And that's when Pat was done. She might not be able to stop UConn, but she wasn't going to help by playing that annual game. I can't prove this obviously, but I am firmly convinced this is at the bottom of it.
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Never heard this, and don't see what evidence there is to support it.

There were not that many players where UConn & Tenn directly competed against each other, and arguably Geno's success in IN-OH years before Maya was just as much of a threat to TN as the South.
 
It's already been said, but I have to say again:

Great news!
Congratulations, ASJHA!!!


Felt good all morning
 
Bayareahusky said:
Giovanni - I agree with you..... they are obsessed over there about us, while still maintaining that they are the penultimate in WCBB to the exclusion of all comers. Their jealousy is intense.... and for this particular chapter of TN talk, the Olympic picks are blatant bias, and Geno is the puppeteer behind the scenes lending all the influence. It borders on the amusing to witness.
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as there are 5 threads about tennessee right now on this board's front page......:rolleyes:
 
tnvolfan65 said:
as there are 5 threads about tennessee right now on this board's front page......:rolleyes:
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And one incredibly long thread that you are a part of generally bashing Geno, UConn and the choice for the Olympic team.
 
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tnvolfan65 said:
as there are 5 threads about tennessee right now on this board's front page......:rolleyes:
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your point? Pat just retired, you named a new HC, your team is poised to struggle mightily next year, and the Olympic team was just announced, where instead of congratulating Ms. Jones, most on your board melted down and got hysterical over it.

i'd say the obsession being referred to has more to do with the lunacy over there and less to do with the amount of threads. If Geno retired, UCONN named a new HC, and we were poised to drop out of the top 10 in addition to probably be 3rd or 4th in our conference, I imagine there would be quite a few threads on that as well.

the stark contrasts of the boards in tone and content is obvious and illuminating.
 
tnvolfan65 said:
as there are 5 threads about tennessee right now on this board's front page......:rolleyes:
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The number of threads says much less than difference in the tone of the threads on each board.
 
doggydaddy said:
And one incredibly long thread that you are a part of generally bashing Geno, UConn and the choice for the Olympic team.
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What part of this am I "bashing" anyone?

According to Geno, it was a coincidence that half the team is from Uconn.

Jones concurred, saying they've been out of school for 10 years. Yet in her 10 years out of college, she's played on a total one major international team (also coached by Geno.) From that tournament she averaged a whopping 5 points per game to rank second to last above Jayne Appel and 2.3 boards to only top Bird's 2.1 and Whalen's 2.2 (those were the 2 point guards).

If they wanted a backup power forward, one player Jones beat out would have been Candice Dupree. In the same tournament, Dupree outperformed Jones in the following categories:

9.2-5.1 ppg
6.0-2.3 rpg
75-58 fg%
83-67 ft%
10-6 assists
3-10 turnovers
3-2 blocks

Geno said Jones was chosen for her ability to defend in the paint and score. The following stat must have made the difference:

Over the course of the tournament Jones had 6 steals, but Dupree only had 5. :/
 
tnvolfan65 said:
What part of this am I "bashing" anyone?

According to Geno, it was a coincidence that half the team is from Uconn.

Jones concurred, saying they've been out of school for 10 years. Yet in her 10 years out of college, she's played on a total one major international team (also coached by Geno.) From that tournament she averaged a whopping 5 points per game to rank second to last above Jayne Appel and 2.3 boards to only top Bird's 2.1 and Whalen's 2.2 (those were the 2 point guards).

If they wanted a backup power forward, one player Jones beat out would have been Candice Dupree. In the same tournament, Dupree outperformed Jones in the following categories:

9.2-5.1 ppg
6.0-2.3 rpg
75-58 fg%
83-67 ft%
10-6 assists
3-10 turnovers
3-2 blocks

Geno said Jones was chosen for her ability to defend in the paint and score. The following stat must have made the difference:

Over the course of the tournament Jones had 6 steals, but Dupree only had 5. :/
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I said the thread was bashing, not specifically you. But since you were nice enough to bring your post over, your sarcastic tone about the AJ's defense is close enough.

Really, you have no leg to stand on here, defending that thread. It's pretty disgusting, including one more post trashing Maya Moore's mother. Unreal.
 
You can't argue with stats. Obviously there was some sarcasm, because clearly Dupree outperformed Jones.

From last season in the league:

DUPREE
PPG 14.6
RPG 8.2
APG 1.8
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.7
FG% 0.548
FT% 0.852
3P% 0.167
MPG 31.6

JONES
PPG 13.3
RPG 6.4
APG 1.9
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.5
FG% 0.444
FT% 0.711
3P% 0.300
MPG 28.6


For their career:

Dupree-15.4 PPG, 7.5 RPG, 49% FG, 1.8 APG, 1 BPG, 1 SPG
Jones-11.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 45 FG%, 1.7 APG, .6 BPG, .6 SPG
 
tnvolfan65 said:
You can't argue with stats. Obviously there was some sarcasm, because clearly Dupree outperformed Jones.

From last season in the league:

DUPREE
PPG 14.6
RPG 8.2
APG 1.8
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.7
FG% 0.548
FT% 0.852
3P% 0.167
MPG 31.6

JONES
PPG 13.3
RPG 6.4
APG 1.9
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.5
FG% 0.444
FT% 0.711
3P% 0.300
MPG 28.6


For their career:

Dupree-15.4 PPG, 7.5 RPG, 49% FG, 1.8 APG, 1 BPG, 1 SPG
Jones-11.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 45 FG%, 1.7 APG, .6 BPG, .6 SPG
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So when adjusted for MMG their stats are almost identical. Add to that that defensive play is vastly more than just steals your argument for the preference to Dupree is pretty vacant. Plus using raw statistics completely ignores what each was asked to do for their teams.
 
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tnvolfan65 said:
You can't argue with stats. Obviously there was some sarcasm, because clearly Dupree outperformed Jones.

From last season in the league:

DUPREE
PPG 14.6
RPG 8.2
APG 1.8
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.7
FG% 0.548
FT% 0.852
3P% 0.167
MPG 31.6

JONES
PPG 13.3
RPG 6.4
APG 1.9
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.5
FG% 0.444
FT% 0.711
3P% 0.300
MPG 28.6


For their career:

Dupree-15.4 PPG, 7.5 RPG, 49% FG, 1.8 APG, 1 BPG, 1 SPG
Jones-11.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 45 FG%, 1.7 APG, .6 BPG, .6 SPG
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SO, now WNBA stats decide who should be on the Olympic team?

Dupree would have been a fine choice. Why are you here?
 
and so you assume that because their stats are virtually identical last year that Dupree was the clear choice? oh come on - you must be kidding. and btw, you fail to note that Dupree averaged 3 minutes per game more than Jones. when you extrapolate the numbers for an entire game, then are practically even (18.6 PPG / 8.9 RPG for Jones vs. 18.4 PPG / 9.4 RPG for Dupree).

add to that Jones is 6'3", Dupree is 6'2". Add to that Jones is about 20-25 pounds heavier and able to defend bigger players better than Dupree. add to that Jones' mid-range game which is better than Dupree's. it's really a no brainer.

Dupree, Brunson, Pondexter would all have been great choices. but the choice was Jones. instead of congratulating her, your board had a meltdown. your snide sarcasm aside, it's pretty amusing actually.
 
tnvolfan65 said:
You can't argue with stats. Obviously there was some sarcasm, because clearly Dupree outperformed Jones.

From last season in the league:

DUPREE
PPG 14.6
RPG 8.2
APG 1.8
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.7
FG% 0.548
FT% 0.852
3P% 0.167
MPG 31.6

JONES
PPG 13.3
RPG 6.4
APG 1.9
SPG 0.6
BPG 0.5
FG% 0.444
FT% 0.711
3P% 0.300
MPG 28.6


For their career:

Dupree-15.4 PPG, 7.5 RPG, 49% FG, 1.8 APG, 1 BPG, 1 SPG
Jones-11.3 PPG, 4.8 RPG, 45 FG%, 1.7 APG, .6 BPG, .6 SPG
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But doesn't your board always argue that you should discount comparing stats with Phoenix Mercury players (e.g., Taurasi) because of the style of play and number of possessions? And are you seriously arguing that selection for a USA team should be based on the differential you've just presented? Wow. Asjha played in the post with the best rebounder in the WNBA for the past 2 seasons so I wouldn't expect her to have rebound stats like Dupree who is expected to be the top rebounder for her team. And referring to your post from the other board, do you really think that Dupree defends like Jones? I know of no one who would make that argument.

Dupree was a starter for USA Basketball in the World Championships and played more minutes than Asjha. But don't think for one minute that USA Basketball doesn't remember how Dupree played in the gold medal game against the Czech Republic. She started and played the first few minutes and hardly played after that. She's a very fine player, but her WC numbers were put up against the weaker competition.

And what's with this obsession over individual stats? The point is to put the best team on the court, not the best 12 players. Do you know what the Committee was looking for in the 12th player after Griner declined? Is it possible that the Committee believed it had enough post scoring and was looking for a player who could defend the post better than Dupree? Is it possible that based on her outstanding play in the 2012 European championships (MVP) that Jones is a player they can count on to show up when the most in on the line?
 
Ericsandiego - great comments. Tnvolfan65 - good to have you over here.... it is nice to get some spirited conversation. Again, congratulations Asjha Jones on being selected to Team USA.
 
Bayareahusky said:
Ericsandiego - great comments. Tnvolfan65 - good to have you over here.... it is nice to get some spirited conversation. Again, congratulations Asjha Jones on being selected to Team USA.
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who are you? i swear we must be related lol...;)
 
Hah! UConn grad from '82, now living in your state. We're kindred spirits, I will settle for that!
 
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doggydaddy said:
SO, now WNBA stats decide who should be on the Olympic team?
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What have you done for me lately? How about Euroleague stats?

Jones
17.9 ppg
9.0 rpg
0.9 apg
0.3 bpg
1.0 spg

Brunson
15.5 ppg
9.2 rpg
0.9 apg
0.2 bpg
1.2 apg

Dupree
14.1 ppg
6.2 rpg
0.9 apg
0.3 bpg
1.2 spg
 
ericsandiego said:
and so you assume that because their stats are virtually identical last year that Dupree was the clear choice?
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Aside from the fact that Dupree shot over 10 percent better from the field, I suppose you could argue "their stats are virtually identical." But then there's the vast difference in performance between the two at the Worlds. Congrats to Asjha, but this is pretty clearly a pick made for Geno.
 
UConnCat said:
Is it possible that the Committee believed it had enough post scoring and was looking for a player who could defend the post better than Dupree?
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Four-time All-Defensive selection Rebekkah Brunson would have been a far better choice in that case.
 
UConnCat said:
Asjha played in the post with the best rebounder in the WNBA for the past 2 seasons so I wouldn't expect her to have rebound stats like Dupree who is expected to be the top rebounder for her team.
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This is a poor argument. Asjha has always been a mediocre rebounder for a starter at her position. In fact, Asjha's rebound percentage (which accounts for pace) in 2011 was her highest as a full-time starter in the WNBA.
 
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