Is UConn Facing a Structural Problem? | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Is UConn Facing a Structural Problem?

RSTuthill said:
7. It is a little frustrating to think that UConn would be in the B12 now if they had stayed in the AAC and won a BB nattie.
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If everything else stayed the same but Connecticut stayed in the ACC, I doubt we would have gotten into the big 12. People seem to think that there is some secret magic bullet that gets us into a P4 conference. Maybe there is, but I have to believe sucking less at football wouldn't hurt our chances. If we did stay in the American, we certainly wouldn't have won a national championship because he members of the team have said that being in the Big East was attractive to them.

So we would've been in a situation where we wouldn't have the success of a recent Natty, we would still suck in football, and we'd be in a watered down version of the already miserable AAC with the vast majority of our content tucked away on ESPN plus.

Personally, I'm glad we left.
 
CL82 said:
If everything else stayed the same but Connecticut stayed in the ACC, I doubt we would have gotten into the big 12. People seem to think that there is some secret magic bullet that gets us into a P4 conference. Maybe there is, but I have to believe sucking less at football wouldn't hurt our chances. If we did stay in the American, we certainly wouldn't have won a national championship because he members of the team have said that being in the Big East was attractive to them.

So we would've been in a situation where we wouldn't have the success of a recent Natty, we would still suck in football, and we'd be in a watered down version of the already miserable AAC with the vast majority of our content tucked away on ESPN plus.

Personally, I'm glad we left.
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I don’t know if leaving was right or wrong but I think being in a conference at least showed recruits that we were committed to football. Whether you agree with joining the big east or not, going independent in FB certainly did not show commitment to the sport. I think it really makes recruiting harder.

And again, the AAC was not perfect by the farthest stretch and traveling to Tulsa isn’t a great selling point but I also think independence really hurts us.
 
Skies2018 said:
I don’t know if leaving was right or wrong but I think being in a conference at least showed recruits that we were committed to football. Whether you agree with joining the big east or not, going independent in FB certainly did not show commitment to the sport. I think it really makes recruiting harder.

And again, the AAC was not perfect by the farthest stretch and traveling to Tulsa isn’t a great selling point but I also think independence really hurts us.
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Has there been a drop off in talent since we left the American? Current results not with standing, I felt like Mora had kicked it up a notch.

There's a lot of things that go into our football team not being very good, but the biggest thing is not conference affiliation, it is three singularly bad hires in a row. That'll kill a program regardless of conference affiliation.
 
CL82 said:
Has there been a drop off in talent since we left the American? Current results not with standing, I felt like Mora had kicked it up a notch.

There's a lot of things that go into our football team not being very good, but the biggest thing is not conference affiliation, it is three singularly bad hires in a row. That'll kill a program regardless of conference affiliation.
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I think those are all fair points. However all things being equal, I think Mora in the AAC has a better shot at improving the program than Mora as an independent.

And here’s why I think that: there’s nothing to play for right now really. We’re clearly never going to the playoffs - much like every other G5 and most P4 teams - so we have to have other things to play for. Random bowl games I guess count but that’s not really enough. What did Hurley do this year? Cut outs of the preseason tourneys, BE championship, BE regular season, NCAA championship. Now it’s not one to one with FB but you can do something similar with the regular season, conference championship, tied-in bowl game. Right now these kids are playing for nothing. Just a random slate of games each year with the hope of maybe some random bowl. I don’t think that’s very motivating to recruits or current players.
 
pj said:
Good point about NIL as a signal of commitment. Also, the football team taking a year off for Covid, and the marching band skipping a football game due to a few sick musicians. There are too many people around the athletic department with higher priorities than football. Maybe Mora and Benedict are working to change that, but even if they succeed, it will take time to persuade the typical "southern P4 school" that UConn has the level of commitment needed for competitiveness.
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Who funds the NIL? Its not the University of Connecticut. Its the boosters. Don't blame the university. I'm sure Benedict would love to embrace his southern roots and want for the football team to succeed to get people going and to get the NIL flowing. This is where it is on the "fans". Now, I wish i had 700 million or big advertising budgets to throw on players. I don't. I am a meek research scientist. Either way NIL comes from the fans and so the commitment has to come from the fans and not the university.

If we want to go this way. Who is the first people to quit? It isn't the football players. Its the fans. "We" suck and frankly a lot of this board has been so full of quitter noise and you don't think maybe that doesn't feed back?

Some of us have known for 20+ years that players and families read this stuff here all the time. For the record, hello lovely people :wave: and I appreciate your (families of players) continued restraint in not posting. But that being said, given how fast everybody buries things around here of course people get discouraged.

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IF we assume most of the team is the same it comes down to leadership and it comes down to off-season conference disappointment. I only say that because I've seen what happens in hockey when the leaders amongst the players or amongst the coaches aren't there... first place becomes 8th real quick (I think of a specific Boston U team from early 2000s). I think last year people lead, not so sure this go around. Hopefully the mentality can turn around because I still don't really believe this team is so much different than last year.
 
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Patman said:
Who funds the NIL? Its not the University of Connecticut. Its the boosters. Don't blame the university. I'm sure Benedict would love to embrace his southern roots and want for the football team to succeed to get people going and to get the NIL flowing. This is where it is on the "fans". Now, I wish i had 700 million or big advertising budgets to throw on players. I don't. I am a meek research scientist. Either way NIL comes from the fans and so the commitment has to come from the fans and not the university.

If we want to go this way. Who is the first people to quit? It isn't the football players. Its the fans. "We" suck and frankly a lot of this board has been so full of quitter noise and you don't think maybe that doesn't feed back?

Some of us have known for 20+ years that players and families read this stuff here all the time. For the record, hello lovely people :wave: and I appreciate your (families of players) continued restraint in not posting. But that being said, given how fast everybody buries things around here of course people get discouraged.

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IF we assume most of the team is the same it comes down to leadership and it comes down to off-season conference disappointment. I only say that because I've seen what happens in hockey when the leaders amongst the players or amongst the coaches aren't there... first place becomes 8th real quick (I think of a specific Boston U team from early 2000s). I think last year people lead, not so sure this go around. Hopefully the mentality can turn around because I still don't really believe this team is so much different than last year.
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It's precisely because I support the players and coaches that I'd like to see greater commitment from the athletic department, administration, band leadership, boosters, etc.

That said, the players are here 4-5 years at most, and coaches a similar duration. It will take more time than that to build the football program to the level we'd like to see. It has to be a long-term commitment.
 
RSTuthill said:
Looking at UConn from the perspective of a southern P4 school, nothing captures UConn more than the fact that it has a woman on their basketball team pulling down million dollar NIL contracts while the football players are getting next to nothing. To them, that pretty much says it all. "Those people are just different."
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For what little she has played the last couple of years good for her
 
I think both the one good diaco year and last year we overachieved. Won turnover battles, got timely big plays and found ways to squeak out games. But that’s hard to do every year, eventually you need to upgrade the talent. We seem to have missed on a lot of transfers and moras high school recruiting remains to be seen.

That’s why we can’t let this snowball though. This season will be a letdown based on preseason expectations but there’s a huge difference between rallying to win 4 or 5 games and going 2-10. Can’t afford to lose the commits we have now or to hurt ourselves more on the recruiting trail.

Coaching…continuing to pick the wrong oc is a consistent trend. Having more to spend would be helpful but it’s also not impossible to get a guy regardless
 
When Mora arrived, his focus was on putting together a staff. Is anyone aware of what it was that drew him to Charlton? There were some amazing OC’s at FCS schools that would have been far better choices.
And heres a name from a past list that was tested for a week here and made a difference:

Best Offensive Coordinators in College Football​

Noel Mazzone, UCLA: The Bruins have posted one of the best offenses in the Pac-12 over the past few years.

Mora (and Benedict) need to get rid of Charlton, and bring in Mazzone. Mora could likely convince his friend to come. “It’s existential.“
 
Being in the AAC would not help us. We have recruited a bit better since being Indy. Even Edsall, who always made excuses, said Indy was seemingly more attractive to recruits. We have a coaching problem, primarily on offense. If Rhett Lashlee, Noel Mazzone, Rob Ambrose or even John Dunn were our OC, we’d probably be at least 2-2. We’ve got to make a dramatic change at OC. There’s guys out there that can do the job that we can get. Ambrose for sure, and there’s many others. I’d love to get Mazzone back.
 
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No structure without culture. I still think HCJM will get us there*.

*need one of us to win Powerball or come upon some serious scratch.....
 
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Skies2018 said:
I think those are all fair points. However all things being equal, I think Mora in the AAC has a better shot at improving the program than Mora as an independent.
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Yeah, I don't see it.


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I mean, not that we can really up our nose anyone right now, but it's hard to see how being a part of this group enhances our perception.
 
Can we go a day without some version of a "Should we shut down the program" thread? And we may need to start a new board for those that think the AAC would be the best home for UConn athletics. That level of stupid may be contagious.

I haven't gone through the math, but this may be one of the better seasons for G5 wins over P5 teams. Somehow some of these other schools have figured out a way to bring in transfers and compete. Mora blew it in the offseason, and blew it in training camp, that much is clear. It isn't much more complicated than that.
 
RSTuthill said:
You need the table from 2 or 3 years ago. That's when the germane data were being generated. Right?
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Not really. When people say we'd be better off in the American, that's what they're talking about, whether they realize it or not.
 
RSTuthill said:
You need the table from 2 or 3 years ago. That's when the germane data were being generated. Right?
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I am done trying to convince people that the NIL and Transfer Portal is spreading talent around rather than concentrating it. You think juniors and seniors want to transfer from a place where they are starting to a place where they won't see the field. I am not going to argue with that logic.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
I am done trying to convince people that the NIL and Transfer Portal is spreading talent around rather than concentrating it. You think juniors and seniors want to transfer from a place where they are starting to a place where they won't see the field. I am not going to argue with that logic.
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This might be the one thing I agree with you on.
 
it’s not even worth trying to diagnose of the issues. It’s the program that has no consequences until there is a full fledged all out conflagration. We have no standards of excellence or expectations at any level. We half ash everything
 
CL82 said:
Not really. When people say we'd be better off in the American, that's what they're talking about, whether they realize it or not.
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Not the American of today. The American all the way up until UConn got the B12 invite.
 
RSTuthill said:
Not the American of today. The American all the way up until UConn got the B12 invite.
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Accept why do you believe that we would have gotten a conference bid to the bug 12 if we were 1) a horrifically bad geographic fit; 2) historically bad at football and 3) mediocre at best at men's basketball with declining attendance and I am apathetic fanbase.

I don't see it. So, yes, we'd be stuck in that godforsaken conference today. We are infinitely better off as an independent in football and in the big east in hoops.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
Can we go a day without some version of a "Should we shut down the program" thread? And we may need to start a new board for those that think the AAC would be the best home for UConn athletics. That level of stupid may be contagious.

I haven't gone through the math, but this may be one of the better seasons for G5 wins over P5 teams. Somehow some of these other schools have figured out a way to bring in transfers and compete. Mora blew it in the offseason, and blew it in training camp, that much is clear. It isn't much more complicated than that.
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And if that is the case I am good with that. It is only year 2 of the HCJM era at UConn and the transfer portal is new and something everyone needs to figure out. HCJM and his staff may have whiffed so they better figure it out. I agree the portal should be spreading talent around rather than consolidating it and maybe some of it is luck and some is skill. UConn was able to recruit Roberson from Penn State which is a Top 10 program. Keep at it and they will string together enough good portal moves to make the program successful.
 
Kolumbo said:
And if that is the case I am good with that. It is only year 2 of the HCJM era at UConn and the transfer portal is new and something everyone needs to figure out. HCJM and his staff may have whiffed so they better figure it out. I agree the portal should be spreading talent around rather than consolidating it and maybe some of it is luck and some is skill. UConn was able to recruit Roberson from Penn State which is a Top 10 program. Keep at it and they will string together enough good portal moves to make the program successful.
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All we need is a proven OC who brings in a decent QB or 2. With the portal, that can happen next year.
 
RSTuthill said:
Yeah, we have seen this movie before. A collapse after a 6-7 year. Was it 2016 or 2017? Doesn't matter, it is seared into our collective minds.

What the heck is going on?

Some things have occurred to me that have not been discussed and some that have. In no particular order:

1. It seems almost obvious that player mobility is hurting UConn rather than helping. UConn as a lower level independent, is being used as a training ground and they are unable to replace their losses to the portal with equal quality.
2. The psychological effect of not joining a P4 conference when it was built up as almost a sure thing throughout the summer. A resulting WTF attitude by the players after the letdown.
3. Rolling around in the back of my mind has been the thought that if this goes on much longer, HCJM may decide he has had enough of a no-win situation and just ask to be released from his contract. Guessing not the end of this season, but by the end of next season it would become a real possibility if this continues.
4. Like recruiting players, recruiting coaches is really tough at UConn. I am a little more tolerant of less than optimum coaching than most. But are we suffering from this? Hard to imagine that HCJM did not get first rate coaches, but UConn's football status may have affected quality. I am not qualified to judge, the comments here by others notwithstanding.
5. If HCJM did exit, who might UConn get? Almost certainly a successul FCS coach I would guess. Who else would come? Wou;d Bob Chesney up the road be a good match? I doubt UConn could beat Holy Cross right now.
6. Is the lack of bigtime NIL the problem? Feels like the players' expectations might have been higher and they are just mailing it in. Thoughts?
7. It is a little frustrating to think that UConn would be in the B12 now if they had stayed in the AAC and won a BB nattie. Of course the BB fans would argue that the nattie would not have happened had they stayed in the AAC. Personally I think that Hurley could have done it in the AAC, but that and a second mortgage will get you on the subway these days.
8. Also rolling around the back of my head is the factoid that the last UConn HC whose team started the season 0-4 got fired the next Tuesday ... nine days after his team came within 3 points of Michigan. [Sorry, this may not be quite correct, but the point stands.] That is not happening this year, but the situation does look very unfavorable.
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I think #3 is definitely in the cards, especially if the school doesn’t give Mora the money it takes to hire a respected and competent FBS OC and DC. If that happens it will show a lack of will on the part of the BOT and the school president. Goodbye FBS
 
BlueandOG said:
The structural problem relates to coaching hires. We have missed at almost every opportunity to improve coaching since PP was hired. I think Mora was a great choice and think he can get the job done; however, he has to find an offensive coordinator and a defensive coordinator to implement his vision for the team. Without them, there is only so much he can do.
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I am not sure I agree. Isn't the single most important task of a head coach in this era picking the right coordinators? If he's failed miserably at it, how good a coach is he really? And it's not money. There is no reason we shouldn't have well above average G-5 coaches based on what we spend.
 
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