I'm More Convinced Than Ever: UConn & UVA to the B1G

[Matrim55]

Good points. For all we know, internet streaming services could be more lucrative than TV networks...

ESPN just paid 4x the actual current value of live streaming rights for MLS games, while paying (along with Fox) something close to actual value for broadcast rights.

They jumped on it and considered it a bargain because of 1) Demographic drift and technological shift, and 2) Google is two years away from jumping into the fray and paying for live sports webcasts. Once that second part happens, the bidding wars begin.

 

[kyleslamb]

UNC will have to make a choice: either remain as the lynchpin in a weakened ACC or accept an invitation to the SEC. There is no way Delany attempts to pull them into the B1G, at least not until the middle third of the century. UNC would be an even tougher nut than Virginia. They are far more deep south. The culture shock alone would give both the Tar Heels and the B1G more than reason to reject each other. Plus, what would be Delany's incentive to take on the SEC in its own backyard? Isn't a two-region conference enough of a challenge? Does he really need to attempt a three-region strategy when his current brand requires some re-burnishing? In my opinion, North Carolina is a bridge too far.

The SEC on the other hand needs two teams to get to 16 and two states to full-fill its destiny: North Carolina and Virginia. A North Carolina university and the other Virginia school fit nicely. Would the SEC prefer UNC to NC State? I don't know but if I held an executive position in Chapel Hill I'd sure be trying to find out.

So, I think the B1G ignores UNC now because the risk of failure is just too troubling: risk of not executing in the northeast and risk of failure in the southeast.

I apologize if this has been asked/answered already but I'm just making my way through this thread for the first time.

Let me ask you this: how would a division of Georgia Tech, Virginia, Maryland, Rutgers, UConn, Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan and Michigan State really be much different for UNC than what they face now? I don't see how that would be viewed as a culture shock, to be honest. They're already playing up and down the east coast. Those locations wouldn't really be much of a shock. They're already playing at Pitt, BC, Syracuse, etc.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I apologize if this has been asked/answered already but I'm just making my way through this thread for the first time.

Let me ask you this: how would a division of Georgia Tech, Virginia, Maryland, Rutgers, UConn, Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan and Michigan State really be much different for UNC than what they face now? I don't see how that would be viewed as a culture shock, to be honest. They're already playing up and down the east coast. Those locations wouldn't really be much of a shock. They're already playing at Pitt, BC, Syracuse, etc.

How? In the ACC, UNC is sits on the throne. In the B1G, there are dual thrones, one for Michigan and one for Ohio St who will not share with UNC. As for culture, all of the Northeast and Midwest transplants to the RTP area have no problem with the B1G; but, for the rest, the Civil War is still on and they remember that Michigan Ohio and the rest of the Northeast are full of those damn Yankees.

 

[kyleslamb]

How? In the ACC, UNC is sits on the throne. In the B1G, there are dual thrones, one for Michigan and one for Ohio St who will not share with UNC. As for culture, all of the Northeast and Midwest transplants to the RTP area have no problem with the B1G; but, for the rest, the Civil War is still on and they remember that Michigan Ohio and the rest of the Northeast are full of those damn Yankees.

North Carolina isn't like the deep south. You get that kind of prevailing attitude in Mississippi, Alabama, Southern Georgia and South Carolina, but North Carolina is far more progressive. It's really nothing like some of those other states down here.

UNC already is in with a lot of schools up and down the mid-atlantic and northeast corridor. Going to the Big Ten really wouldn't be much different. And trust me, UNC is just as snobbish about their academics and reputation as the other Big Ten schools. They really aren't a fish out of water if you were to group them in an eastern division with the other newer Big Ten schools/candidates and OSU/Michigan.

 

[Ldandy]

I have to disagree with Kyle. A good portion of UNC's identity is wrapped up in being Southern. While academics at the university might favor inclusion in The B1G, their administration likely realizes that their alumni and legion of T-shirt fans would lose their * at the idea of being a part of a Northern carpetbagger conference. I think for Carolina supporters it would be ACC preservation 1st, followed by joining the SEC with UVA(not happening) or Duke second. I agree with posters here who believe that The B1G should not expand South of VA. That said if they did, Duke w/it's legion of NE supporters or Ga Tech with it's focus on engineering would both likely mesh better with the current conference.

 

[whaler11]

North Carolina like Texas is not leaving a league they own.

Oh they are going to go to Iowa in November or Wisconsin in February without their own referees? Sure thing.

 

[SouthronCross]

How? In the ACC, UNC is sits on the throne. In the B1G, there are dual thrones, one for Michigan and one for Ohio St who will not share with UNC. As for culture, all of the Northeast and Midwest transplants to the RTP area have no problem with the B1G; but, for the rest, the Civil War is still on and they remember that Michigan Ohio and the rest of the Northeast are full of those damn Yankees.

So, you use a stereotype about some Southerners, which, in turn, shows one indicative of some northerners. Nice.

Some of us UNC fans couldn't possibly prefer the SEC, simply because we feel it is more of a good geographical fit than the B1G?

 

[kyleslamb]

North Carolina like Texas is not leaving a league they own.

Oh they are going to go to Iowa in November or Wisconsin in February without their own referees? Sure thing.

They're not going to stay in a league just because they 'own' it if that league is inferior. They have too much pride for that. Of course, they'd like to stay in the ACC as long as it's viable. And they'll do that. But if Virginia, Florida State, etc. start leaving, then they are going to go too.

If/when that ever happens, it comes down to competing in the cutthroat SEC which does not care about academics or going to a league it views as its academic peers and like-minded institutions. The fans probably do largely prefer the SEC, which will be considered. However, the administration and a lot of the board of regents of the system at-large view the Big Ten as a much more suitable option.

The Iowa/Wisconsin examples aren't very relevant. In an Eastern Big Ten division, UNC wouldn't be playing in those types of places but once every 3-4 years, and most of the time would end up playing in September or October. They wouldn't be so narrow minded that having to play one football game in the upper Midwest every half a decade would be a reason to avoid what they may consider their best option.

 

[SouthronCross]

I have to disagree with Kyle. A good portion of UNC's identity is wrapped up in being Southern. While academics at the university might favor inclusion in The B1G, their administration likely realizes that their alumni and legion of T-shirt fans would lose their * at the idea of being a part of a Northern carpetbagger conference. I think for Carolina supporters it would be ACC preservation 1st, followed by joining the SEC with UVA(not happening) or Duke second. I agree with posters here who believe that The B1G should not expand South of VA. That said if they did, Duke w/it's legion of NE supporters or Ga Tech with it's focus on engineering would both likely mesh better with the current conference.

Yes, being a Southern school IS very important to Carolina. Yes, the administration and faculty would very much prefer the B1G. Some very influential alumni, and fans, would be, too.

It would for sure be a huge battle for UNC's future.

And, as much as the admin and faculty would grumble, the athletic department would do exactly what the money people tells it to do. If that is B1G, it will be B1G. If its SEC, it will be SEC.

 

[SouthronCross]

North Carolina like Texas is not leaving a league they own.

Oh they are going to go to Iowa in November or Wisconsin in February without their own referees? Sure thing.

Please. ANY team who has had the huge success on the court has gotten the benefit of the calls in times past. Including UConn.

 

[whaler11]

They're not going to stay in a league just because they 'own' it if that league is inferior. They have too much pride for that. Of course, they'd like to stay in the ACC as long as it's viable. And they'll do that. But if Virginia, Florida State, etc. start leaving, then they are going to go too.

If/when that ever happens, it comes down to competing in the cutthroat SEC which does not care about academics or going to a league it views as its academic peers and like-minded institutions. The fans probably do largely prefer the SEC, which will be considered. However, the administration and a lot of the board of regents of the system at-large view the Big Ten as a much more suitable option.

The Iowa/Wisconsin examples aren't very relevant. In an Eastern Big Ten division, UNC wouldn't be playing in those types of places but once every 3-4 years, and most of the time would end up playing in September or October. They wouldn't be so narrow minded that having to play one football game in the upper Midwest every half a decade would be a reason to avoid what they may consider their best option.

So North Carolina wouldn't play Wisconsin in basketball... except every 4 years

Honestly you don't get UNC and the ACC.. they could have walked away pre GOR but instead held their nose at Louisville and signed.

If you think Virginia is leaving before UNC you get your news from Boneyard fever dreams.

 

[whaler11]

Please. ANY team who has had the huge success on the court hasgotten the benefit of the calls in times past. Including UConn.

Don't take it personally. If I were a UNC fan I'd never want to leave the ACC.

If UConn got Carolina's whistle in the Big East... John Cahill and Tim Higgins hated Calhoun. UConn overcame the officials, they never got the Duke/Carolina advantage.

Let's put it this way... UNC came to Rentschler once and managed to win the game on a safety for holding in the endzone called by Ron Cherry.

Texas, UNC, Michigan... there is nothing as valuable as being the Alpha Dog in a league.

 

[SouthronCross]

They're not going to stay in a league just because they 'own' it if that league is inferior. They have too much pride for that. Of course, they'd like to stay in the ACC as long as it's viable. And they'll do that. But if Virginia, Florida State, etc. start leaving, then they are going to go too.

JMHO, but, neither UNC nor UVA would be the first to leave. FSU would, push some to shove.

If/when that ever happens, it comes down to competing in the cutthroat SEC which does not care about academics or going to a league it views as its academic peers and like-minded institutions. The fans probably do largely prefer the SEC, which will be considered. However, the administration and a lot of the board of regents of the system at-large view the Big Ten as a much more suitable option.

UNC will go wherever the big money people tell them to go. If they say SEC, then, the admininstrationa and BOGs will fall in line.

The Iowa/Wisconsin examples aren't very relevant. In an Eastern Big Ten division, UNC wouldn't be playing in those types of places but once every 3-4 years, and most of the time would end up playing in September or October. They wouldn't be so narrow minded that having to play one football game in the upper Midwest every half a decade would be a reason to avoid what they may consider their best option.

Playing in the upper midwest late in the season will be of no issue, IMHO. Like you say, it will be what the money people decide is the best option.

 

[SouthronCross]

Don't take it personally. If I were a UNC fan I'd never want to leave the ACC.

If UConn got Carolina's whistle in the Big East... John Cahill and Tim Higgins hated Calhoun. UConn overcame the officials, they never got the Duke/Carolina advantage.

Let's put it this way... UNC came to Rentschler once and managed to win the game on a safety for holding in the endzone called by Ron Cherry.

Texas, UNC, Michigan... there is nothing as valuable as being the Alpha Dog in a league.

I didn't take it personally. No worries.

About refs...UConn had their nemesis in Cahill and Higgins. Carolina had theirs in Lenny Wirtz and 'Dick Papparo. While we did not have the total issue you all might have, believe me, you all got the benefit of the doubt on calls in the past, too.

Ron Cherry...LOL. We call folks getting the shaft from him being 'Ron Cherry-ed.'

Our days as alpha dog are over. If that were still the case, UConn would be in the ACC right now. VPI and BC would not be.

 

[whaler11]

I didn't take it personally. No worries.

About refs...UConn had their nemesis in Cahill and Higgins. Carolina had theirs in Lenny Wirtz and Papparo. While we did not have the total issue you all might have, believe me, you all got thebenefit of the doubt on calls in the past, too.

Ron Cherry...LOL. We call folks getting the shaft from him being 'Ron Cherry-ed.'

Our days as alpha dog are over. If that were still the case, UConn would be in the ACC right now. VPI and BC would not be.

Please Carolina still runs the ACC. They threw FSU a bone - but once they did the Noles got back in line.

Anyone who wants to wager even money on Carolina not being in the ACC a decade from now - I'm happy to take it with a 10k limit.

 

[billybud]

I don't think that the Carolina crew have the stranglehold that they once did....more members and more votes have diluted their tobacco road cabal vote. There are now challenging factions.

UNC is not the gorilla that Texas still is in the Big 12...nor carry the weight of OSU and Michigan in the B1G.

 

[RMoore1999]

Please Carolina still runs the ACC. They threw FSU a bone - but once they did the Noles got back in line.

Anyone who wants to wager even money on Carolina not being in the ACC a decade from now - I'm happy to take it with a 10k limit.

Up to $10K, eh? Its Saturday night, so I assume you're into the good stuff pretty well by now.

 

[whaler11]

Up to $10K, eh? Its Saturday night, so I assume you're into the good stuff pretty well by now.

I wish. Carolina remaning in the ACC is an absolute guarantee.

Queen Elizabeth is more likely to leave England.

Jeter is more likely to accept a deadline trade to Oakland.

 

[huskyrob1]

Question: In your scenario where "the SEC and the B1G will carve up the ACC" what to do with the elephant in the room a.k.a. UNC? The Tarheels are the lynchpin of the ACC & have been rumored in many threads as pairing with UVa to the B1G. How to separate the links of UVa-V.Tech & UNC-NC State? Not trying to throw a bucket of water on your enthusiasm, just a reality check.

First of all I think UCONN is a bigger elephant, second of all I don't think Delaney would touch UNC with what has gone on down there lately........


http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...y-of-north-carolina-ncaa-infractions/1625329/

 

[whaler11]

First of all I think UCONN is a bigger elephant, second of all I don't think Delaney would touch UNC with what has gone on down there lately...


http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...y-of-north-carolina-ncaa-infractions/1625329/

If Delany added Carolina to the Big 10 he'd rent the Canyon of Heroes and ride a float naked to celebrate.

 

[SouthronCross]

Please Carolina still runs the ACC. They threw FSU a bone - but once they did the Noles got back in line.

LOL...if you believe that, nothing else I can tell you will change your mind.

Anyone who wants to wager even money on Carolina not being in the ACC a decade from now - I'm happy to take it with a 10k limit.

Nobody knows what D-I athletics will look like a decade from now.

 

[SouthronCross]

I don't think that the Carolina crew have the stranglehold that they once did....more members and more votes have diluted their tobacco road cabal vote. There are now challenging factions.

UNC is not the gorilla that Texas still is in the Big 12...nor carry the weight of OSU and Michigan in the B1G.

Thats been point all along. When the first expansion passed, THAT effectively ended UNC's stranglehold.

 

[whaler11]

Nobody knows what D-I athletics will look like a decade from now.

Yet I know UNC will be in the ACC....

 

[Fishy]

If UNC ever left the ACC, all freaking hell would break loose - if they ever wanted to join the Big Ten or SEC or, hell, the Big 12, it would take a phone call.

Any perceived leverage that Florida State or Clemson or any of the new additions think they have is a mirage. They have no options, but to make sure UNC is happy and that they don't ever want to bail out and take a friend or three with them.

 

[NotreDameJoe]

Lol. UNC goes to the SEC if the former quits. Do you remember where the SECn is based out of?

 

[Fishy]

The SEC Network is based in Charlotte because a) ESPN owns it and b) that's where ESPN Regional is located.

Unfortunately, Joe, I think we can conclusively say that you don't bring anything to the board and as such, I think we can release you from your obligations here.

I recommend a West Virginia board.

 

[kyleslamb]

I recommend a West Virginia board.

That's just cruel no matter who you are lol

 

[huskyrob1]

If Delany added Carolina to the Big 10 he'd rent the Canyon of Heroes and ride a float naked to celebrate.

I don't know why someone would be refer to UNC as the "elephant in the room", in basketball I think Roy has lost his touch and is thinking of retiring and in football just last year they were blown out by East Carolina, lost to South Carolina, lost to Georgia Tech, and lost to a couple others including that perennial football power Duke. Not to mention the world of they are in with the NCAA investigations, the Chancellors resignation because of it, graduate students taking tests for athletes, a professors class that gave "A's" to athletes and as it turns out the classes never took place. The only elephant in the room is one big one that's about to take a gigantic dump on Chapel Hill. Delaney would invite Wisc-Green Bay before UNC.

I mean the football program has had it's problems over the years, yeah Mack Brown was okay, but they have not really had any national respect in football since Carl Snavely and the guy after him, but that was ages ago.

 

[Ldandy]

I don't know why someone would be refer to UNC as the "elephant in the room", in basketball I think Roy has lost his touch and is thinking of retiring and in football just last year they were blown out by East Carolina, lost to South Carolina, lost to Georgia Tech, and lost to a couple others including that perennial football power Duke. Not to mention the world of they are in with the NCAA investigations, the Chancellors resignation because of it, graduate students taking tests for athletes, a professors class that gave "A's" to athletes and as it turns out the classes never took place. The only elephant in the room is one big one that's about to take a gigantic dump on Chapel Hill. Delaney would invite Wisc-Green Bay before UNC.

I mean the football program has had it's problems over the years, yeah Mack Brown was okay, but they have not really had any national respect in football since Carl Snavely and the guy after him, but that was ages ago.

All of what you state above is true, yet despite that they could join The B1G or SEC tomorrow. UNC is a name brand in college athletics, and located in a state not currently under the control of either conference. Realistically they belong in The ACC or SEC, but if Delany could get them he would take them. Personally I think they are a bad fit for the conference, but in this day an age fit has nothing to do with it.

 

[uconndogs]

I don't know why someone would be refer to UNC as the "elephant in the room", in basketball I think Roy has lost his touch and is thinking of retiring and in football just last year they were blown out by East Carolina, lost to South Carolina, lost to Georgia Tech, and lost to a couple others including that perennial football power Duke. Not to mention the world of they are in with the NCAA investigations, the Chancellors resignation because of it, graduate students taking tests for athletes, a professors class that gave "A's" to athletes and as it turns out the classes never took place. The only elephant in the room is one big one that's about to take a gigantic dump on Chapel Hill. Delaney would invite Wisc-Green Bay before UNC.

I mean the football program has had it's problems over the years, yeah Mack Brown was okay, but they have not really had any national respect in football since Carl Snavely and the guy after him, but that was ages ago.

I can only conclude that some folks are absolutely incapable of understanding that CR has next to nothing to do with athletic performance. You would think Rutgers' invite to the B1G would be a 2x4 to the side of the head on this issue, but apparently not........