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Quinipiac is another great example for an arena.
Hockey East move is official.
- Thread starter Carl Spackler
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Quinipiac is another great example for an arena.
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UConn9604
Does anyone know if there are publicly available minutes and/or vote totals on the decision to admit us to Hockey East?
I would love to see what Gene DeFilippo had to say on the matter -- my guess is that he either abstained or just kept his mouth shut and had someone else vote "yea."
I would love to see what Gene DeFilippo had to say on the matter -- my guess is that he either abstained or just kept his mouth shut and had someone else vote "yea."
zls44
Your #icebus Tour Director
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just because she didn't say we're going to be upgrading our arena in that press conference doesn't mean it won't happen, or that it's not in the plans. either way we just got invited to Hockey East, can we give it a week before we start the bellyaching? I'm starting to think that even if we were invited to the B1G tomorrow for all sports somebody would have to bitch about something
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APR of 981
UCFBfan
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When do we get to start offering scholarships? I know w don't start HE play until 2014 but do we get scholarships next season? Or is it that once we start HE play the scholarships magically appear? Just curious because we're going to need to get better players and while I don't expect us to be competitive for awhile, it would help the transition if we were to get scholarships or some scholarships next year and start bringing in higher level talent so we're in a better position come 2014.
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I read in one report, not sure which paper, that UCONN had assured Hockey East that it will upgrade or replace Freitas as part of this move. They have concetual plans to expand the facility to about 4500 seats already. For what its worth, a college hockey arena like Alford at Maine or even theQuinnipiac rink is way better than a combo deal like BC has, I think. there is also no reason in the world why it wouldn't make sense to have an arena where Freitas is located. With the baseball, softball and soccer stadia all there and a fairly good parking area, it is a pretty logical spot. to me you want this sport to have its own identity.
The plan, as per the Stafford report released by the Courant, would be to phase in six scholarships per year, starting with the 2012-13 (i.e. the upcoming) hockey season, so we would have some players on scholarship next year, yes.
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Alfond, from a strict facilities standpoint, is not better than Conte. It's quite old, there are a lot of very obstructed view seats, the visitor section is directly below the student balcony that isn't fully enclosed on the bottom, so you can easily get drinks spilled on your head that get kicked down through the breaks in the metal bleachers. That said, from every other perspective, it's better. Give me a choice of where to see a game, and 99 times out of 100 I'll pick Alfond. If Conte was a hockey-only facility, it would be better for their team (not like they need it), though it is aging a bit despite recent upgrades.
The best overall facilities in the conference are BU and Lowell, with UNH and BC a notch below, then most everybody else clustered into a pool of average rinks. Merrimack has by far the worst, even despite their recent "renovations" - their capacity is a woeful 2,485. UConn would need to at least be in the level above MC, preferably in the 4-5K range, with a dedicated non-shared facility, proper strength and conditioning facilities, etc., and most of all ON CAMPUS!
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I'm talking about atmosphere, not facilities. Alford is always (or at least when I've been there) rocking. By comparison Conte is really too big and its a morgue. Again going by my experience. I have to say 4-5000 seats is probably about right for any college arena.
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Oh yeah, then you're completely right. Conte, outside of a BU game or if someone really, really huge is in town, is mostly a morgue. Alfond is the toughest road environment in the league, and has been consistently since Walter Brown at BU closed. The student balcony is so low that if the people in the first row held out a rake (it's Orono...) they could touch the top of the glass.
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It was in both today's N.H. Register & Waterbury Republican articles. From the Register: "Non-league games would still be played at the on-campus Freitas ice Forum, which Manual has said the school plans to renovate or replace."
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I hope it will be rebuilt... I would love to see a new arena in Hartford and see a triple header action between Hall-Conrad (or Manchester-East Catholic), the CT Whale - Bridgeport Sound Tigers and QU-UConn. Just think of what Hartford would be!! High School hockey is great in CT.
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Why not try to get 14K for hockey?? Let not sell hockey in CT short. I think we can be successful 4 years after join the HE. Youth hockey in CT is strong so in HS hockey. Jr Hockey is great too. I would love to see a new arena built on the campus. I would love to see EO Smith hockey team use it, and I'd love to see a QMHL team in CT using the arena, too. I believe this UConn to the HE move might help Connecticut get back the Whalers!!
Just think of what CT with strong HS hockey, Jr. Hockey, Yale, QU and UConn hockey, the Danbury Whalers, Bridgeport Sound Tigers, (dream) (New Haven) CT Whale (played at QU's arena) and the Hartford Whalers (again dreaming - relocated from Carolina!
). It would help the state!!
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Why not try to get 14K for hockey?? Let not sell hockey in CT short. I think we can be successful 4 years after join the HE. Youth hockey in CT is strong so in HS hockey. Jr Hockey is great too. I would love to see a new arena built on the campus. I would love to see EO Smith hockey team use it, and I'd love to see a QMHL team in CT using the arena, too. I believe this UConn to the HE move might help Connecticut get back the Whalers!!
Just think of what CT with strong HS hockey, Jr. Hockey, Yale, QU and UConn hockey, the Danbury Whalers, Bridgeport Sound Tigers, (dream) (New Haven) CT Whale (played at QU's arena) and the Hartford Whalers (again dreaming - relocated from Carolina!
There are a lot of hockey games so you have games in the middle of the week. You have to look at what Providence, BU and BC are drawing to make comparisons.
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There's a 0% chance you'll get 14K for hockey. No one gets 14K for hockey at home anywhere in college.Why not try to get 14K for hockey?? Let not sell hockey in CT short. I think we can be successful 4 years after join the HE. Youth hockey in CT is strong so in HS hockey. Jr Hockey is great too. I would love to see a new arena built on the campus. I would love to see EO Smith hockey team use it, and I'd love to see a QMHL team in CT using the arena, too. I believe this UConn to the HE move might help Connecticut get back the Whalers!!
Just think of what CT with strong HS hockey, Jr. Hockey, Yale, QU and UConn hockey, the Danbury Whalers, Bridgeport Sound Tigers, (dream) (New Haven) CT Whale (played at QU's arena) and the Hartford Whalers (again dreaming - relocated from Carolina!
FfldCntyFan
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BU is a very large school, in a huge city with quite a history (in the mid 70's they were nearly a full step above Harvard and a couple of steps above BC, Northeastern and any non Beanpot New England hockey school.
I imagine that they have already reached any reasonable ceiling for fan support. Expecting anything above what they draw would be completely unrealistic. Hoping to reach a considerable percentage of their attendance should be the goal (with the understanding that it will take some time).
I imagine that they have already reached any reasonable ceiling for fan support. Expecting anything above what they draw would be completely unrealistic. Hoping to reach a considerable percentage of their attendance should be the goal (with the understanding that it will take some time).
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There are very few mid-week games during the season, the vast majority are Fri/Sat. UMass is a good meter for UConn's attendance. Granted, ~50% of the UMass crowd is free tickets given to students, but they're able to draw large numbers and sometimes come close to completely filling Mullins for BU and BC games, for a program that's largely a middle to bottom of the pack HE team. If UConn was averaging 3-4K for home games five seasons from now, that would be a major success.
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Mod... Can we add Hockey to Baseball and Soccer Forum?
http://blog.collegehockeynews.com/2012/06/20-current-or-future-hockey-east-players-drafted/
We aren't in Kansas anymore Toto....
http://blog.collegehockeynews.com/2012/06/20-current-or-future-hockey-east-players-drafted/
We aren't in Kansas anymore Toto....
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Anyone looking for a dedicated college hockey forum, I cautiously advise you to join the snake pit that is the USCHO forums, board.uscho.com. If you like the BC fans over at their board, you'll love their hockey fans. It's a fun time usually, and there's plenty of discussion on UConn going on right now.
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i think you're selling the market short. i agree 14k would be a bit much, since the Whalers didn't average that very often, but i would consider a HE UConn a bigger draw than the CT Whale and they've averaged 4-5k in attendance so i would expect UConn to do at least about as well, with a considerably higher ceiling. Most fans in CT are divided between NY and Boston lines, which hurt the Whalers in attendance but UConn's always been able to attract both and i don't see why hockey would be any different. personally my prediction would be that in ten years we're averaging around 7-8k per game, possibly selling out the Civic Center occasionally for a big game.
personally i have a hard time believing we wouldn't draw at least about well as the CTWhale i think a 4k on campus stadium would not be sufficient in the long term. i think just the fact that there are no weekday games would make it a slam dunk bigger draw than the Whale. who wants to schlep to the CC on a wednesday night to watch AHL?
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Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Gampel was originally built with capacity of 8800 because the powers that be felt that UConn would not support basketball on campus & to cut corners. It was expanded later to over 10,000 after ticket demand soared in the Calhoun era. The RENT was only built at 40K capacity (albeit with expansion capability to 55K) because the pols were afraid of the 1-A football experiment blowing up in their faces after the Patriot-Kraft debacle. (Remember that pre-kraft, the original Adriens Landing blueprints were for a 55K domed stadium to house UConn football & men's & women's hoops). All I'm saying is if you're going to biold an on-campus facility, DON'T underestimate fan crowd size. Do it right the first time.
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The difference here is that there isn't a precedence for virtually anyone in the country to draw numbers like that in college hockey, save for a very small number of programs out west, which have exceptionally rich traditions in hockey and are in hockey-crazed areas. Three teams averaged over 8K last year, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and North Dakota. If you look at basketball around 1990 when Gampel was built, how many college basketball teams averaged over 10K? I'd bet the number is significantly larger than three. You can even look at the NCAA tournament as a meter. The regional site last year in St. Paul where the Wild play had BOTH North Dakota and Minnesota playing there against BU and Western Michigan. None of the games drew more than 10K, including the North Dakota-Minnesota Regional Final. This in an arena that can easily sell out 18K for the WCHA conference championship between the same teams. Attendance is very flukey in hockey.
The difference is the sport as a whole has proven to not draw these numbers of fans consistently, not the specific programs. Can it theoretically happen? Sure, but it's not like basketball or football. It would most definitely not be failing to learn from history if they build a 5K arena on campus, it would be in line with every other newly built facility in the country, especially ND and their gigantic sports following.
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Not to mention that bigger isn't always better. Lynah (Cornell) is a fearsome place to play, but its capacity is just a touch shy of 4400. Michigan, for all of its position as one of the "HUGE" hockey schools, plays in its old barn that they've reduced in size twice in the last thirty years (although they did add a few hundred seats in the last renovation, bringing it up to 6600 or so). If you need further proof of how sustainable a high demand ticket can be over a long period of time, ask the Red Sox if they think their fan base has abandoned them because it's impossible to get a ticket to the Yankees series.
I *think* that if UConn does everything right on our end (read: everything not dependent on the hockey team's success), our upper ceiling for home attendance is about 4-5K or so. Our likely upper ceiling is probably closer to 3K. Anything over 5K, and you're asking too much for a team that doesn't have fifty years of accumulated success and demand.
I *think* that if UConn does everything right on our end (read: everything not dependent on the hockey team's success), our upper ceiling for home attendance is about 4-5K or so. Our likely upper ceiling is probably closer to 3K. Anything over 5K, and you're asking too much for a team that doesn't have fifty years of accumulated success and demand.
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Remember King Dobbs...up until the 1990s (1995 IIRC), you could watch the games for free. I used to go and watch the team in the 70s and 80s in the open rink. Froze many nights watching them play. Success and demand? how can you create a demand if the games are free? Success, were we trying to be a D1 team in the 70s and 80s? No...
Now, some of us were saying that we can be successful in D1A football when it first came up. Are we successful in it?? Yes...(Big East is not helping, though!)
Which is exactly my point. We, in spite of having a team for fifty years, HAVEN'T been working on it like those teams have. Now, are we starting from nothing? No, there's a "UConn fanbase" in-state that the university can tap into that in building the hockey program. But I think we ought to be realistic about our upper ceiling, when you consider that many of the programs that are considered the best followed and have the most devoted fan base, don't draw 10K for home games. Michigan drew just under 6000. Boston U, just under 5000. Denver, 5300. Even the national champion BC Eagles, 7500. I'm not sanguine our numbers will approach, let alone exceed those, and the grand revelation I'm making here is that the situation is OK. We who follow college hockey don't have the numbers but we're damned devoted.
JaYnYcE
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FfldCntyFan
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Back to my comment on what should be a reasonable expectation, for fan support we need a bit of perspective (using the football stadium example stated above should illustrate my point).
How many major programs have stadiums that hold more than 100k? How many hold more than 90K? 80k?
If we were to accept th posted 40k as the Rent's true capacity (which is a bit of a stretch), there are more than a dozen stadiums with more than double our capacity. Do we really believe that having a stadium that is half (or less) of what most large stadiums hold can be used as evidence that a hockey rink with a capacity in line with what most of the better schools hold will not be large enough?
BU is very close to UConn in total student body (a bit smaller in undergrad & a bit larger in grad IIRC bit the difference is not much), they have quite a bit of history and a large metropolitan area that loves the game to draw from. I personally will be thrilled if the day comes where we have a legitmate fan base at 70%-75% of BU's legitimate fan base. It would be a pleasant surprise (and nothing short of a minor miracle) if we would ever need an on campus rink that can hold more than 6,500 fans. Something that can hold ~5k with the ability to expand by another 1,500 if that ever becomes necessary will be more than sufficient for our ice hockey needs even if we do build a program that can match our men's hoops program.
How many major programs have stadiums that hold more than 100k? How many hold more than 90K? 80k?
If we were to accept th posted 40k as the Rent's true capacity (which is a bit of a stretch), there are more than a dozen stadiums with more than double our capacity. Do we really believe that having a stadium that is half (or less) of what most large stadiums hold can be used as evidence that a hockey rink with a capacity in line with what most of the better schools hold will not be large enough?
BU is very close to UConn in total student body (a bit smaller in undergrad & a bit larger in grad IIRC bit the difference is not much), they have quite a bit of history and a large metropolitan area that loves the game to draw from. I personally will be thrilled if the day comes where we have a legitmate fan base at 70%-75% of BU's legitimate fan base. It would be a pleasant surprise (and nothing short of a minor miracle) if we would ever need an on campus rink that can hold more than 6,500 fans. Something that can hold ~5k with the ability to expand by another 1,500 if that ever becomes necessary will be more than sufficient for our ice hockey needs even if we do build a program that can match our men's hoops program.
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BU and college hockey in general in Boston is a bit of a special case. While BU is huge, 30K plus, the student population is so diverse and a very large percentage of them are not interested in sports in any way shape or form, far more than you'd find at your average State U, I'd venture over 75% couldn't tell you the name of BU's starting goalie. Additionally, while BU draws roughly 5-6K a game, it can't be overlooked that there are three other programs within a two mile radius of BU's arena, BC, who draws 6-7K, NU who gets 2-3, and Harvard who gets the same. Not to mention the multitude of programs within a 25 mile drive of Boston. While that's certainly not an argument that UConn should be able to outdraw BU or BC, it speaks to the nature of college hockey being a niche sport that is wildly successful in some spots, but not others.
And before anyone asks, no, UConn or anyone else is not getting into the Beanpot, ever.
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