Here's a shocker - the TV contract will suck.

[upstater]

I've always been for aligning with the C7 and going independent in football. For football we have 6-7 schools in the bag in terms of scheduling - FCS, UMass, Cincy, 2 of Army/Navy/BYU, MACx2. Try to get a permanent rivalry going with one of BC/SU/RU (RU is my preference because of B1G). That leaves us with trying to find 4 games against BCS schools.

If those are the numbers and ESPN just needs to match, UConn needs to hitch up its olympics with the C7. Tell the NBE we're happy to leave our football there for now.

If they say no, laugh and ask them what choice they have?

They'll say, See ya, and thanks for the $130 million you left behind.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

I think they're pretty giddy that we're in the state that we're in...

Just answer plainly: in your opinion does ESPN have it out for UConn specifically, such that they would spend tens of millions of dollars to cripple the university?

I think that qualifies as an extraordinary claim indeed, and you know what they say about extraordinary claims...

Occam's Razor says UConn is collateral damage, unanticipated, and certainly not intentional.

 

[upstater]

Most atheletic programs are run with money. If UConn plays in this conference the football team will be so in the red, that UConn will face the decision of dropping football or every single olympic sport. Lose, lose.

Or basketball too... when the big ones break off.

The decision to cut loose football is like a man hanging onto a rope that's slicing through the skin on his hands. His hands hurt so much, he decides to save them more pain and so lets go of the rope.

 

[djct1999]

I get that ESPN has a right to protect it's ACC investment - no issues there. But where should they have drawn the line? Their antics through the years have been downright cruel towards UConn. Just a small sampling:

* When UConn hoops won the dual 'ships in '04, ESPN Radio guy Mike Greenberg told a national audience that UConn fans - both men's and womens' - essentially made him want to vomit. Totally uncalled for (Dickie V did come on later to call Greenberg out for it, but the damage was done).
* When the men won again in '11, their website's big headline a couple days later? "Kemba Reads First Book." Why print that about the tourney MOP, so soon after his greatest moment?
* I tried to watch ESPN again about a month or so ago, and there was some innocuous CFB story running - and then out of the blue they inserted about 30 seconds on UConn's lack of Fiesta Bowl ticket sales two years ago. Thankfully, I haven't made that viewing mistake since.

I guess my point is that if Bristol were so distraught at our current plight, why would they have spent the past near-decade running our public perception into the ground? I think they're pretty giddy that we're in the state that we're in...

Greenberg is a company guy who simply says what is scripted. Guy has no backbone or opinion of his own. He epitomizes what Espn is. Seriously, I can only watch 2mins of Mike and Mike before I want to shoot myself.

 

[upstater]

Greenberg is a company guy who simply says what is scripted. Guy has no backbone or opinion of his own. He epitomizes what Espn is. Seriously, I can only watch 2mins of Mike and Mike before I want to shoot myself.

I disagree with this. The guy is so New York centered, he literally hates teams like the Patriots. And then Golic with ND. My god, those two are the biggest homers around.

 

[epark88]

Just answer plainly: in your opinion does ESPN have it out for UConn specifically, such that they would spend tens of millions of dollars to cripple the university?

I think that qualifies as an extraordinary claim indeed, and you know what they say about extraordinary claims...

Occam's Razor says UConn is collateral damage, unanticipated, and certainly not intentional.

Yes...

 

[djct1999]

I disagree with this. The guy is so New York centered, he literally hates teams like the Patriots. And then Golic with ND. My god, those two are the biggest homers around.

he hates the patriots only because his love for the jets is "part of the script". just my opinion, but i find guys like colin cowherd far more amusing and easy to listen to.

 

[Marty Jackson]

am i understanding this right? uconn, cincy, usf, temple and the rest of the crew are worth a total of 23mil all sports?

uconn and cincy are worth about 20 mil each in a power 5 league. uconn, cincy, memphis and temple bball alone are worth 10+ mil. this makes no sense for numbers like that to be thrown around. but yet we keep seeing them. there has to be something not factored in publically to fans that the insider ppl know. i dont know if that uconn/cincy/temple to the acc or what but its something.

for perspective, didn't PBS/CPTV/SNY offer $2M to televise the women's games?
so basically, NBC would pay for the women's program and get men and football as a throw-in.
WOW!!!

 

[Marty Jackson]

The last estimate I saw in print for the C7 was that they were hoping for a 12-year deal at about $3M per team. That doesn't seem out of line to me.

You have a bunch of pretty decent basketball schools and generally, there aren't a lot of awful matchups. (Assuming they invite who they're rumored to.)

I don't even know how you market some of the matchups the Big East will have - UConn and Cincy can only play against each other every so often.

you've become the ultimate pessimist here...
If the C7 can get $3M without fb, I would assume that the NBE could at the least get $3M combined.
There is something very wrong if the BE can't get as much for a TV contract as the C7.
UConn
Memphis
temple
cincy
Houston

vs

Nova
G'town
Marquette
Providence
Seton Hall
St John's
DePaul

There is no comparison. The C7 is a 3-4 bid league at best. The NBE could be 5-6.
If the C7 of $3M per year for BB is the baseline, anything less than $8-9M for UConn is a major disgrace and should result in a different path being taken:
- uneven revenue distribution
- independence/C7/A-10/whatever league will take a 10 time NC
- something nobody is aware of

 

[Marty Jackson]

F$ck y'all

I refuse to believe this McMurphy crap. I'm not saying that the Brand is worth x or y; I just think it makes zero sense for the Product we have & our Demographics contrasted to Rutgers & then the Central NY team. So ... I expect arbitrage. Meaning someone is going to be able to put together a League that will make money through these at a good market price.

ESPN is the Devil.

I think everyone here has been preaching the same thing. between the MwC and Big east teams, you can't cobble a 16 team east/west that would get $10M/year at worst?
ridiculous.

 

[Marty Jackson]

What did you tell us? That ESPN wasn't executing a plan to destroy the Big East? I stopped listening to you after you said that.

For the MOT's on the board, ZLS is a self-hating UConn fan. Blame his mother...

 

[pepband99]

On behalf of everyone here, I'd like to once again thank Mike Aresco for adding Tulane. What a brilliant move by the man who led the last network to embrace HD technology. What a visionary.

Just think. without Tulane, everyone would make $1.9 million a year.

If you're going to be a smarmy pr1ck, at least be right. FOX 480p widescreen. It's not even close.

 

[BFieldHusky]

Maybe an irrelevant question...but after NBC officially offers the deal, ESPN has the right to match. If that happens, would NBC have the ability to raise the offer after? I'm not saying that it would become a major bidding war, but could it possibly add some money to the deal?

 

[zls44]

For the MOT's on the board, ZLS is a self-hating UConn fan. Blame his mother...

Oh I hate myself, but its not because I'm Jewish.

 

[Vuce]

The last estimate I saw in print for the C7 was that they were hoping for a 12-year deal at about $3M per team. That doesn't seem out of line to me.

You have a bunch of pretty decent basketball schools and generally, there aren't a lot of awful matchups. (Assuming they invite who they're rumored to.)

I don't even know how you market some of the matchups the Big East will have - UConn and Cincy can only play against each other every so often.

But, but, but.........they dont play football. How can they be making more than us?

 

[zls44]

Maybe an irrelevant question...but after NBC officially offers the deal, ESPN has the right to match. If that happens, would NBC have the ability to raise the offer after? I'm not saying that it would become a major bidding war, but could it possibly add some money to the deal?

I BELIEVE its the right of final match, not a back and forth. Basically ESPN gets to match the offer, if they wish, and then the Big East decides. The Big East could go back to NBC, but ESPN is basically the home team in a baseball game (last at bats) and gets to match any and all offers.

 

[zls44]

you've become the ultimate pessimist here...
If the C7 can get $3M without fb, I would assume that the NBE could at the least get $3M combined.
There is something very wrong if the BE can't get as much for a TV contract as the C7.
UConn
Memphis
temple
cincy
Houston

vs

Nova
G'town
Marquette
Providence
Seton Hall
St John's
DePaul

There is no comparison. The C7 is a 3-4 bid league at best. The NBE could be 5-6.
If the C7 of $3M per year for BB is the baseline, anything less than $8-9M for UConn is a major disgrace and should result in a different path being taken:
- uneven revenue distribution
- independence/C7/A-10/whatever league will take a 10 time NC
- something nobody is aware of

If you can't see that the C7, especially if/when they add teams like Butler, St Louis, Xavier, VCU is a far better and more desirable TV conference on a basketball basis, then we really have nothing to discuss.

Best case scenario, everything breaks the NBE's way like the MWC, they get four or five bids. C7 should average, that with the ability to get six or seven in a perfect year.

People keep going back to "but DePaul!" So? That's one team. Every conference has one patsy. Seton Hall and Providence are bad, but still better than most of the NBE from an eyeballs and pedigree standpoint.

USF added basketball in the last thirty years. Tulane added basketball back in 1989. UCF was thrown together on a Wednesday in 1978. Don't compare the two.

 

[upstater]

If you can't see that the C7, especially if/when they add teams like Butler, St Louis, Xavier, VCU is a far better and more desirable TV conference on a basketball basis, then we really have nothing to discuss.

Best case scenario, everything breaks the NBE's way like the MWC, they get four or five bids. C7 should average, that with the ability to get six or seven in a perfect year.

People keep going back to "but DePaul!" So? That's one team. Every conference has one patsy. Seton Hall and Providence are bad, but still better than most of the NBE from an eyeballs and pedigree standpoint.

USF added basketball in the last thirty years. Tulane added basketball back in 1989. UCF was thrown together on a Wednesday in 1978. Don't compare the two.

You wildly overrate schools. The schools you think have pedigree don't do anything for the vast, vast, vast majority of American fans. There is a steep dropoff after Villanova.

 

[upstater]

There's a reason why NBC has a lack of content. Outside of the Olympics, they are cheapskates. This is their standard MO.

ESPN is hanging back. That's all they have to do.

Right of first refusal is a killer.

It's like the transition tag in the NFL. Once anothe NFL team knows you're going to wield it, they won't bother bidding up the player.

This is a big problem for the NBE.

 

[UConnDan97]

The bank vaults in the BE offices make this a non-starter. They have over $100 million in there between exit fees and NCAA tourney credits.

They can vote to dissolve the conference and split things up, but why do that when they have more money coming to them from Notre Dame and Louisville, and there are questions as to whether they even need to split exit fee money with the CYO7.

Not to mention the MWC probably has no interest in a school that wants to leave, and a school located on the east coast.

I understand the part where dissolving the conference essentially lets Pitt, Cuse, ND, Rutty, Ville, and C-7 off the hook (unless of course there is a date where they can do it and get Syracuse and Pitt). But keep in mind that by not dissolving the league, it means that the aforementioned money will be split up with SMU, Houston, UCF, Temple*, Memphis, Tulane, ECU, and Navy. Also, it will mean that we will have to pay an exit fee ourselves if and when the situation arises.

The REAL question for me is; If the conference dissolves, who gets the next six years worth of NCAA credits that the Big East has already earned??? (really, that UConn earned!!!) I think that NCAA money has to weigh even more heavily in our minds than anything else due to the size of the payout, and I would love to hear from anyone who knows that answer.

Uggh. Don't get me wrong; I STILL believe that independence is not the right answer, because it is extremely difficult to insure a schedule year to year that is worth a damn (we can't seem to do it WITH a conference!). I'm thinking more of linking up with another conference in the short-term (i.e., MW) or some sort of elaborate alliance like HFD has mentioned (which will almost insure that we never see the BCS again). Lot's of money to juggle right now, and it all depends on who gets it and how much...

 

[upstater]

I understand the part where dissolving the conference essentially lets Pitt, Cuse, ND, Rutty, Ville, and C-7 off the hook (unless of course there is a date where they can do it and get Syracuse and Pitt). But keep in mind that by not dissolving the league, it means that the aforementioned money will be split up with SMU, Houston, UCF, Temple*, Memphis, Tulane, ECU, and Navy. Also, it will mean that we will have to pay an exit fee ourselves if and when the situation arises.

The REAL question for me is; If the conference dissolves, who gets the next six years worth of NCAA credits that the Big East has already earned??? (really, that UConn earned!!!) I think that NCAA money has to weigh even more heavily in our minds than anything else due to the size of the payout, and I would love to hear from anyone who knows that answer.

Uggh. Don't get me wrong; I STILL believe that independence is not the right answer, because it is extremely difficult to insure a schedule year to year that is worth a damn (we can't seem to do it WITH a conference!). I'm thinking more of linking up with another conference in the short-term (i.e., MW) or some sort of elaborate alliance like HFD has mentioned (which will almost insure that we never see the BCS again). Lot's of money to juggle right now, and it all depends on who gets it and how much...

NCAA credits go to the old and new members. Exit fees do not. Exit fees should be split among old members as damages.

Anyone know the answer to this?

 

[UConnDan97]

NCAA credits go to the old and new members. Exit fees do not. Exit fees should be split among old members as damages.

Anyone know the answer to this?

I don't know if there has ever been precedence for a payout to conference members after dissolving a league with this "six year lookout" policy of the NCAA. If there was, hopefully someone will post it. However, I have the sneaking suspicion that Mark Emmert and the nice people at the NCAA office will just say, "Thanks!" and keep it...

 

[upstater]

I don't know if there has ever been precedence for a payout to conference members after dissolving a league with this "six year lookout" policy of the NCAA. If there was, hopefully someone will post it. However, I have the sneaking suspicion that Mark Emmert and the nice people at the NCAA office will just say, "Thanks!" and keep it...

They really can't keep that money. Plus, they'd probably then be involved with litigation with the new schools.

 

[UConnDan97]

They really can't keep that money. Plus, they'd probably then be involved with litigation with the new schools.

Well, maybe they'd be in litigation with the OLD schools, but the new schools would not have a case if the league were dissolved. That would mean that they were not part of the Big East, the entity that was entitled to the payments. It would be like TCU and Boise suing for the money. Still, hopefully somebody understands how that payment gets worked out in the event of a dissolution. What happened to the WAC's money? That might be the "case study" for what would happen to the Big East...

EDIT: I'm not sure that the WAC is dead in olympic sports yet. Perhaps only football:

http://www.wacsports.com/

 

[The Viking]

I thought all I've heard lately is how even a $hitty football game's ratings blows an average to good basketball games' ratings out. If that's the case how can the C-7 get a contract on pace with ours? You can talk all you want about the b-ball part of the conference getting hurt, but we're playing college football.

Maybe I'm overrating what an SMU vs Houston rating would get and it's worth to a network. By the way we are bringing some decent teams into the conference, right? Top 10 no, but let's not act like they are ALL in teh bottom 20% of college football. Even Tulanes recruiting this year was OK..and they're the team that has been talked about like the ugly stepchild in this whole thing.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

Even Tulanes recruiting this year was OK..and they're the team that has been talked about like the ugly stepchild in this whole thing.

It's because they are the ugly stepchild. They suck so bad in basketball and football and have no fans. Not to mention their addition was publicly cited as the final straw that pushed the C7 over the edge.

There's at minimum, 20 teams I would rather be in a conference with than Tulane. By far the most asinine, stupid, knee jerk, moronic, idiotic conference addition in the history of college athletics.

 

[upstater]

I thought all I've heard lately is how even a $hitty football game's ratings blows an average to good basketball games' ratings out. If that's the case how can the C-7 get a contract on pace with ours? You can talk all you want about the b-ball part of the conference getting hurt, but we're playing college football.

Maybe I'm overrating what an SMU vs Houston rating would get and it's worth to a network. By the way we are bringing some decent teams into the conference, right? Top 10 no, but let's not act like they are ALL in teh bottom 20% of college football. Even Tulanes recruiting this year was OK..and they're the team that has been talked about like the ugly stepchild in this whole thing.

Some teams, like UCF, are actually better than the majority of teams that left (BC, Pitt, Cuse, Rutgers). Some are worse: Tulane. It'll be interesting to see how East Carolina and Houston play out. Both have had good success in recent years.

 

[buggsy]

Some teams, like UCF, are actually better than the majority of teams that left (BC, Pitt, Cuse, Rutgers). Some are worse: Tulane. It'll be interesting to see how East Carolina and Houston play out. Both have had good success in recent years.

UCF better than RU? That's funny.

RU has had more winning seasons and been to more bowl games over theast 10 years than UCF has. RU also spanked UCF head to head in the St. Pete's Bowl a few years ago. RU has been rankd more times in the top 20 then UCF, and been in the top 10 twice in that time period. UCF has no appearances in the top 10.

But sure, if it makes you feel better to say UCF is better, have at it.

 

[upstater]

UCF better than RU? That's funny.

RU has had more winning seasons and been to more bowl games over theast 10 years than UCF has. RU also spanked UCF head to head in the St. Pete's Bowl a few years ago. RU has been rankd more times in the top 20 then UCF, and been in the top 10 twice in that time period. UCF has no appearances in the top 10.

But sure, if it makes you feel better to say UCF is better, have at it.

I'm referring to UCF now. UCF is a rising program, they haven't been at it for 100 odd years. Rutgers is higher ranked last year, so they shouldn't be on my list.

But, UCF has some big wins. They beat BC, they beat Georgia in a bowl game, NC State, lost by a FG to Texas.
I'd say they have a decent football program over the last 5 years. Not as good as Rutgers but better than what the BE has lost.

 

[frankthetank]

I thought all I've heard lately is how even a $hitty football game's ratings blows an average to good basketball games' ratings out. If that's the case how can the C-7 get a contract on pace with ours? You can talk all you want about the b-ball part of the conference getting hurt, but we're playing college football.

Maybe I'm overrating what an SMU vs Houston rating would get and it's worth to a network. By the way we are bringing some decent teams into the conference, right? Top 10 no, but let's not act like they are ALL in teh bottom 20% of college football. Even Tulanes recruiting this year was OK..and they're the team that has been talked about like the ugly stepchild in this whole thing.

The single biggest misconception in conference realignment is the notion that football in and of itself is what drives value. That's absolutely incorrect. Brand names are the ones that drive value. Sure, a top level football program is going to be much more valuable than top level basketball program. There's no question about that. However, the mistake is in thinking that a league of low level football brand names would be more valuable than a league of top level basketball brand names. Even if you were to argue that a bad football game gets better ratings than a good basketball game, that only tells you a fraction of the story. A football game is expensive to produce and there are only a limited number of time slots that you can play that game in, while basketball is relatively inexpensive to produce and you can place it in virtually any time slot on any day of the week. Those massive dollar amounts for football are in exchange for the expectation that you are drawing extraordinary ratings that few programs are able to garner these days. If you're not getting extraordinary ratings, though, then your value in football goes down. A 1.0 rating for basketball is much more profitable than a 1.0 rating for football. So, what networks need for football are numbers at the 3.0 level or higher for 1st tier games or else you're not going to get a premium for them.

Beyond that, McMurphy pointed out something VERY important in his Tweets last night: Fox approached the Catholic 7 BEFORE they decided to split off. So, if you think that the C7 is getting overpaid, then you might be correct. However, Fox HAD to overpay them in order to make the decision to split. The C7 wouldn't have split if they were merely going to get the same amount that they would have received in a hybrid. It's pointless to try to compared the value of the C7 offer to the Big East offer because the C7 offer was specifically made big enough as a catalyst to get a group of 7 schools to defect from a league, while the Big East offer is a "normal" run of the mill TV rights offer. As a result, you have a situation where (1) Fox actually effectively paid the Big East to split up, so they're not interested in the "New Big East" and only want the C7 and (2) ESPN's interest in the New Big East has been tepid at best. Regardless of whether you go line-by-line and say the Big East *should* be worth more than the C7, the fact is that there's only one suitor here with NBC... and despite what people might wish, NBC has absolutely zero incentive to bid against itself and bid up the price of the Big East as a charitable measure. It's simple market forces - only one network wants the Big East here, so they're going to get paid as if though only one network wants them and there wasn't a bidding war for the rights.