Has Conference Realignment at Last Reached a Lull?

[Plains&Lakes]

Ok. That to me looks like they selected just about everyone in the AAU and called them peers. I guess in a way they could be. But the ones I mentioned (Michigan, California-Berkley, William & Mary, and North Carolina-Chapel Hill) are who I hear mentioned the most when someone from the UVA administration talks about it. William & Mary mostly because in the same state.

In as much the lesser amount that I know about Virginia, I agree. Put simply, Virginia and Michigan are just great schools. It is interesting that University of Michigan also includes many schools as "Peers" even though their academics are manifestly superior to the much greater part of the group. When one is elite it is the choice of the institution or person of superiority to open or close the doors. Depending on the context and circumstances, either choice can be appropriate. There are a great many schools that are not the equal of Virginia, but Virginia (and the other school) can mutually benefit from. There is nothing wrong with good inter-university relations!

While Virginia, UNC, Duke, GT and many other ACC schools are very likely not going anywhere, it is possible, after a time, that the Big Ten may get an ACC school to pair with UConn if the Big Ten expands. But interestingly, with more time, some non-ACC schools such as Buffalo could "improve their game" enough to get into the Big Ten.

 

[upstater]

One thing that ACC and B1G fans should note about this whole ACCvB1G discussion is that UConn fans are on the outside looking at allthis objectively since we haven't been conference partners with Maryland. We have with Rutgers, and I'm sure that's why so many of us tend to denigrate Rutgers. In fact, UConn fans despise Maryland because of the whole Gary Williams controversy over Rudy Gay, which sullied UConn's name for no good reason at all because Md. fans couldn't accept losing to UConn.

That being said, most of us here recognize that that school has an outstanding recruiting ground for football, an area that is at least as good as Virginia's Norfolk region, and for basketball it has DC and Baltimore. Not to mention the amount of wealthy eyeballs in that region. Objectively, Maryland would be a great add for any conference.

 

[billybud]

One thing that ACC and B1G fans should note about this whole ACCvB1G discussion is that UConn fans are on the outside looking at allthis objectively since we haven't been conference partners with Maryland. We have with Rutgers, and I'm sure that's why so many of us tend to denigrate Rutgers. In fact, UConn fans despise Maryland because of the whole Gary Williams controversy over Rudy Gay, which sullied UConn's name for no good reason at all because Md. fans couldn't accept losing to UConn.

That being said, most of us here recognize that that school has an outstanding recruiting ground for football, an area that is at least as good as Virginia's Norfolk region, and for basketball it has DC and Baltimore. Not to mention the amount of wealthy eyeballs in that region. Objectively, Maryland would be a great add for any conference.

DC/Maryland and New Jersey have both been the source of cherry picked athletes for FSU...and will probably continue to be so. They have some good athletes in the area.

FSU...on Roster:

Ronald Darby...starting DB....Maryland
Sean Maguire...2nd QB...........New Jersey
Kevin Haplea...TE....................New Jersey
Josue Matias....starting OG.....New Jersey
Eddie Goldman...starting DT..Washington DC

 

[06029]

They tried to leave as soon as the exit fee became onerous.

So to be clear about your logic, if MD did not get the B1G invite, they would have left the ACC because of the onerous exit fee?

They left as soon as the we will double your income offer showed up from the B1G. They may have been in preliminary discussions (one of those little things that might pop up in discovery and hurt their case against the ACC) and accelerated it on their end, but I don't think the fee made them leave. I don't even think it could be considered a factor.

 

[Dooley]

Maryland left because of money. That's it. They will almost double their revenue from TV with the move and there is something to be said for long-term B1G security. The ACC and B12 are both conferences that will need to continue to defend itself against the likes of the B1G, SEC or PAC. One of those conferences will be raided at some point, so MD decided not to chance it and they got themselves a seat in the upper elite P5 while it could.

 

[billybud]

Maryland was a destitute former executive standing on a corner with a sign..."will move for money...Can't pay my bills..desperate!"

 

[Calamitous]

That being said, most of us here recognize that that school has an outstanding recruiting ground for football, an area that is at least as good as Virginia's Norfolk region, and for basketball it has DC and Baltimore. Not to mention the amount of wealthy eyeballs in that region. Objectively, Maryland would be a great add for any conference.

No one ever combines Baltimore and DC in their MSA, but those 2 comprise of 8.7 million residents (#4 MSA and not far behind Chicago). If you're familiar with that area, Baltimore and DC merge together and it's difficult to determine which suburb you belong to. UMCP is smack in the middle of both.

There are only three other state flagship/land grant universities (that I can think of) that call metropolitan locations greater 4 million home besides UMCP, and those are Rutgers, Michigan and Berkeley. Michigan is a bit of a stretch, but Ann Arbor is technically listed as part of the Detroit MSA. The B1G has 3 of the 4 that I list.

As a follower of the ACC and my school being a part of it, losing UMCP was a huge blow; athletically, academically, culturally, financially and geographically. Delany kicked Swofford's butt on that one... no doubt.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Maryland was a destitute former executive standing on a corner with a sign..."will move for money...Can't pay my bills..desperate!"

... Who then became a prince one day.

 

[Calamitous]

... Who then became a prince one day.

Good move by UMCP, but not quite a prince. The king and queen are OSU and UM with MSU, UW, PSU as princes. Nebraska and Indiana may be knights and the rest dukes.

 

[billybud]

Oh Maryland will wear fine livery, but be armor polishers for Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan, et al....

Not that I have any dog in this fight at this point, but Maryland will be another Purdue/Indiana in terms of football.

Not that there is anything wrong with that.

They were armor polishers in the ACC with tattered livery.

 

[whaler11]

Maryland was a destitute former executive standing on a corner with a sign..."will move for money...Can't pay my bills..desperate!"

And yet their football schedule is way better than Florida State's. Strange days indeed.

 

[billybud]

Depends on your vantage point...playing Midwestern teams year in and out would not be a better schedule for FSU then playing Miami, Florida, and Clemson....

 

[Calamitous]

And yet their football schedule is way better than Florida State's. Strange days indeed.

Not an FSU fan in the slightest, but FSU's schedule this year is not easy.

 

[whaler11]

Depends on your vantage point...playing Midwestern teams year in and out would not be a better schedule for FSU then playing Miami, Florida, and Clemson....

Take the average Maryland schedule
going forward and the average FSU schedule going forward and let me know which one is better.

 

[whaler11]

Not an FSU fan in the slightest, but FSU's schedule this year is not easy.

Eh. Lot of bark and not much bite. Good OOC names but probably looks better on paper than in reality.

 

[Gampeltiles]

Buffalo to the B1G?

 

[CoastAtlantic]

Maryland left because of money. That's it. They will almost double their revenue from TV with the move and there is something to be said for long-term B1G security. The ACC and B12 are both conferences that will need to continue to defend itself against the likes of the B1G, SEC or PAC. One of those conferences will be raided at some point, so MD decided not to chance it and they got themselves a seat in the upper elite P5 while it could.

Finances were a part of it, yes, but it was just part of the issue. UMCP fans thought the the ACC no longer meant anything to them after schools were added. It is similar to Nebraska fans feeling left out of the Big 8 when it became the Big 12. Sometimes it is just the school feeling it no longer belong. I would use these as cautionary tales for conferences that want to expand. Make sure that your long-time members believe that they have a stake in the conference going forward before adding. The B12 and ACC didn't heed those lessons early on and other conferences took advantage of their vulnerabilities as a result. I hope the ACC learned to value every one of the members so that this won't repeat. It's an open question whether the B1G can integrate UNL, RU and UMCP without alienating the other members or whether the SEC will ease in A&M and Mizzou w/o one or two long-time members getting unhappy.

 

[billybud]

Take the average Maryland schedule
going forward and the average FSU schedule going forward and let me know which one is better.

Better is in the eye of the beerholder.

Not for us FSU fans....Playing So Cal and Oregon every year or Michigan and Ohio State might sound great...but not for our alumni footprint, not for our recruiting footprint.

I would not trade Maryland's schedule for FSU's....Clemson has become a rivalry game, Florida is the enemy that we hate but hold dear and Miami is a historic rivalry.

While playing midwestern teams might make sense for Maryland...it makes no sense for FSU.....just like playing BC and Syracuse makes no sense...and FSU fans find no joy in these games.

I have always stated that the best rivalries usually have an element of proximity to them.

 

[billybud]

While I admit that I cheer against Ohio State (my dad was a Michigan grad and I learned at his knee)...I do note that in their last three games with FSU rival opponents, they lost.

Clemson 2013, Florida 2012, Miami 2011.

 

[whaler11]

Better is in the eye of the beerholder.

Not for us FSU fans....Playing So Cal and Oregon every year or Michigan and Ohio State might sound great...but not for our alumni footprint, not for our recruiting footprint.

I would not trade Maryland's schedule for FSU's....Clemson has become a rivalry game, Florida is the enemy that we hate but hold dear and Miami is a historic rivalry.

While playing midwestern teams might make sense for Maryland...it makes no sense for FSU.....just like playing BC and Syracuse makes no sense...and FSU fans find no joy in these games.

I have always stated that the best rivalries usually have an element of proximity to them.

You are a bit brain dead aren't you? You've done nothing but complain about how bad most of the ACC teams are all through the thread, and now this nonsense.

You and that Virginia idiot didn't start out so bad but now it's just painful trolling.

 

[Calamitous]

Eh. Lot of bark and not much bite. Good OOC names but probably looks better on paper than in reality.

Just for humor's sake... if FSU and OSU swapped places, would either's in-conference schedule be any better? Neither is exactly the SEC, PAC or even the B12. Not sure I buy the "great B1G" football argument as long as UM and PSU aren't powers. Same with the ACC with VT and Miami being down. I think both conferences have been mediocre in football for a long time.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Random thoughts on that:

Purdue has a habit of giving Ohio State fits. Wake Forest would not do the same.

A road game in the Big Ten is always an adventure. A road game against BC, not so much.

Injuries to your line can be masked against an ACC opponent. It will be exploited in the Big Ten.

 

[upstater]

Just for humor's sake... if FSU and OSU swapped places, would either's in-conference schedule be any better? Neither is exactly the SEC, PAC or even the B12. Not sure I buy the "great B1G" football argument as long as UM and PSU aren't powers. Same with the ACC with VT and Miami being down. I think both conferences have been mediocre in football for a long time.

B12? B12 is pretty weak after UT and OU. What are you seeing? Same for Pac12.

The SEC is nice because it has so many powers in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, Texas A&M and sometimes Tennessee and for the first time in a while Missouri.

I would take the play in the B1G over both the Pac12 and the B12.

 

[Pudge]

Finances were a part of it, yes, but it was just part of the issue. UMCP fans thought the the ACC no longer meant anything to them after schools were added. It is similar to Nebraska fans feeling left out of the Big 8 when it became the Big 12. Sometimes it is just the school feeling it no longer belong. I would use these as cautionary tales for conferences that want to expand. Make sure that your long-time members believe that they have a stake in the conference going forward before adding. The B12 and ACC didn't heed those lessons early on and other conferences took advantage of their vulnerabilities as a result. I hope the ACC learned to value every one of the members so that this won't repeat. It's an open question whether the B1G can integrate UNL, RU and UMCP without alienating the other members or whether the SEC will ease in A&M and Mizzou w/o one or two long-time members getting unhappy.

It ain't about fans. That is just stupid.

 

[Calamitous]

Random thoughts on that:

Purdue has a habit of giving Ohio State fits. Wake Forest would not do the same.

A road game in the Big Ten is always an adventure. A road game against BC, not so much.

Injuries to your line can be masked against an ACC opponent. It will be exploited in the Big Ten.

I don't see much more adventure in going to Champaign, Evanston, Bloomington, Minneapolis, West Lafayette, College Park and Piscataway versus going to half the ACC games. And the B1G vs ACC was 2-2 with SU losing both regular season games and Clemson and SU winning their bowl games. A pretty poor sample set to base arguments from.

And I'm sure Purdue gives OSU fits, I don't really follow B1G football that closely. But NCSU gives FSU fits and GT gives Clemson fits. That stuff happens in every conference.

Maybe OSU will look high and mighty this year after they beat Tech in the 2nd game of the season. Too bad OSU can't play Clemson or FSU instead to compare apples to apples.

 

[Calamitous]

B12? B12 is pretty weak after UT and OU. What are you seeing? Same for Pac12.

The SEC is nice because it has so many powers in Florida, Georgia, Alabama, Auburn, LSU, Texas A&M and sometimes Tennessee and for the first time in a while Missouri.

I would take the play in the B1G over both the Pac12 and the B12.

OU, Ok State, TT, Baylor and K State have good football teams. Texas is down a bit. The PAC has Oregon, Stanford, USC and UCLA who all have good football teams, with UW being decent last year (but lost their coach). The ACC and B1G aren't as good as either conference IMO.

 

[upstater]

OU, Ok State, TT, Baylor and K State have good football teams. Texas is down a bit. The PAC has Oregon, Stanford, USC and UCLA who all have good football teams, with UW being decent last year (but lost their coach). The ACC and B1G aren't as good as either conference IMO.

You're wildly overrating teams. TT? How are they good? K State came back after awful seasons Baylor? Lost twice to UConn in last 5 years. Also lost to UCF in bowl. At best, you have a case for OK State, but I see nothing that differentiates them from middling B1G teams.

Pac12 is the same. USC and Oregon, with Stanford surprisingly coming on last 2 or 3 years, but no one believes they can sustain it.

B1G is Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan, Michigan st., Nebraska, Wisconsin. These are 6 teams with huge fanbases and a lot of NFL alums and good winning histories. Texas Tech and Baylors of the world don't hold a candle to these 6.

 

[upstater]

something for our southern friends to think about: http://www.latinpost.com/articles/1...=BHESEsJ_hdgrwWbP8IfIAg&bvm=bv.70810081,d.aWw

 

[billybud]

You are a bit brain dead aren't you? You've done nothing but complain about how bad most of the ACC teams are all through the thread, and now this nonsense.

You and that Virginia idiot didn't start out so bad but now it's just painful trolling.

No...I am not brain dead...I prefer playing regional teams...and I do wish that some ACC Opponents were better....Clemson. Miami, and Florida all have the potential to have good years....as Ohio State can attest.

Few teams are consistently great, year in and out, but the good ones do have nice runs now and again. We do need more performance in football from some ACC programs.

Don't be obtuse and pretend that you don't see my argument....regional opponents=good thing.....non competitive opponents=a bad thing.

 

[whaler11]

I think the Pac 12 is way ahead of the Big 10 right now. Just list the head coaches top to bottom. No question which one is stronger.